John Lundstram

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He has worked incredibly hard to get himself as fit as he is so he's better equipped to do the role he's been asked to fulfil in the team. However, I still think he looks like a fish out of water sometimes trying to get up and down the right rather than his more natural position of sitting deeper and dictating play (i.e. Norwood's role).

It would of course be a shame if he left, especially for free but depending on what he / his representative are asking for, I can see why the club are reluctant to pay over the odds to retain his services. If another club feel he's worth more and he'd prefer to move then thank you and good luck to him.

A very sensible post and I'm glad I'm not the only one who's noticed he sometimes looks like a fish out of water , the Wolves and Newcastle games being notable examples of this .

I also agree that the Norwood role is probably his most natural position but don't believe he would be nearly as good as him in that role . He does not have the same speed of thought or movement as the latter to enable him to get in as many blocks and interceptions , a crucial part of Norwood's game at which he has few equals .
 

I answered that in my first reply and I’ve made it clear I don’t like being critical of the best manager I’ve ever seen at the Lane. I had a bad day yesterday, hence the slightly grumpy comment about Wilder’s interview and the Lunny situation. I am politely trying to close down this discussion without being offensive or rude because, as I said in my reply to another poster, in the bottom of my heart, I think Wilder will sort it out, like he usually does.
Wilder will soon be resigning anyway. According to an interview in the Star, Bob Booker claims he played him at pool in the pub the other evening, and WILDER LOST. We don't want losers at the Lane...
 
That the same type of 7 game spell when Leon grabbed the headlines ???

Incredibly selective memories, some folks 😉.

UTB
Players evolving into something no one saw possible / players scoring 20 goals in a season

apples and oranges
 
Have we heard anything about his new contract yet, has he sign, I know there was talk of it not being straight forward etc??

Or has Rodwell been brought in to take the place, and is Lunny off this window??

Very quiet all round?
 
A very sensible post and I'm glad I'm not the only one who's noticed he sometimes looks like a fish out of water , the Wolves and Newcastle games being notable examples of this .

I also agree that the Norwood role is probably his most natural position but don't believe he would be nearly as good as him in that role . He does not have the same speed of thought or movement as the latter to enable him to get in as many blocks and interceptions , a crucial part of Norwood's game at which he has few equals .

I posted a few weeks ago on here, when the Lunny love-in was going on, that I thought he done extremely well but still goes missing in some games - I also said that I think he'll work out to be a back-up squad player. I just think we need more creativity and attacking threat from midfield, especially down that right hand side. I'm not up to date with all this latest talk about Lunny not having a contract or Wilder not having tied him down to one, but I tell you this...if we are set to lose Lundstram then there's been no better time during his time at our club, to sell him than now. His stock is probably at the highest it's ever going to be. So, no problems if we want to cash in.
 
I posted a few weeks ago on here, when the Lunny love-in was going on, that I thought he done extremely well but still goes missing in some games - I also said that I think he'll work out to be a back-up squad player. I just think we need more creativity and attacking threat from midfield, especially down that right hand side. I'm not up to date with all this latest talk about Lunny not having a contract or Wilder not having tied him down to one, but I tell you this...if we are set to lose Lundstram then there's been no better time during his time at our club, to sell him than now. His stock is probably at the highest it's ever going to be. So, no problems if we want to cash in.


Cerb. He can do his own contract deal elsewhere now if he wishes. No fee at all.
 
Cerb. He can do his own contract deal elsewhere now if he wishes. No fee at all.
Oh right! Didn't realise he's out of contract already. I thought he was out of contract in the summer? In that case...

Quick! Let's blame someone! Alan bloody Knill - it's all his fault!:mad:
 
Oh right! Didn't realise he's out of contract already. I thought he was out of contract in the summer? In that case...

Quick! Let's blame someone! Alan bloody Knill - it's all his fault!:mad:


Cerb. He is but he can negotiate in January.
 
I took it with a pinch of salt at the time but during the pre-amble for the LIverpool game on NBC, they had an 'insider' guy and he was saying that both Lunny and Fleck were pushing for triple wages to stay.
 
Cerb. He can do his own contract deal elsewhere now if he wishes. No fee at all.
Only if moving out of England. You can't pre-contract (well technically you can in Law but its not really worth the paper it's wriiten on) if moving English club to English club*

*For the purpose of this post, English clubs includes those sides in Liverpool and Hull.
 
Only if moving out of England. You can't pre-contract (well technically you can in Law but its not really worth the paper it's wriiten on) if moving English club to English club*

*For the purpose of this post, English clubs includes those sides in Liverpool and Hull.

I think he is permitted to negotiate a deal.

Saving a new club a fee must be worth £10000 a week on his wage on a 3 year contract.
 
I took it with a pinch of salt at the time but during the pre-amble for the LIverpool game on NBC, they had an 'insider' guy and he was saying that both Lunny and Fleck were pushing for triple wages to stay.

Probably about right. Any fucker in this league would offer him a load more. He might be happy here, but if we aren't paying around what others are, they'll start to fuck off.

You'd think that we'd have anticipated this though. I'm sure if we stay up, there'll be a lot of new contracts.
 
Probably about right. Any fucker in this league would offer him a load more. He might be happy here, but if we aren't paying around what others are, they'll start to fuck off.

You'd think that we'd have anticipated this though. I'm sure if we stay up, there'll be a lot of new contracts.
Yeah, the Duffy approach :) Lunny has done OK this season but that's it, not seen enough to say he's a Prem player worth £60K a week yet by any stretch.

As I've said elsewhere, the price of our 'success' will be players moving on unfortunately either through greed or moving to 'better' clubs, or at least clubs that pay more.
 
Probably about right. Any fucker in this league would offer him a load more. He might be happy here, but if we aren't paying around what others are, they'll start to fuck off.

You'd think that we'd have anticipated this though. I'm sure if we stay up, there'll be a lot of new contracts.


All part of the 'growing pains' on our journey.

Wilder has been pro-active with so many players. I think Lundstram has taken him by surprise to a degree with his performances this season and he has lifted his value, maybe not as much as his agent thinks though.

We'll not 'do a Villa' and Lundstram needs to think seriously where he is best placed for long term development. He's still young.

I wonder how good he thinks he is. Interesting.
 
All part of the 'growing pains' on our journey.

Wilder has been pro-active with so many players. I think Lundstram has taken him by surprise to a degree with his performances this season and he has lifted his value, maybe not as much as his agent thinks though.

We'll not 'do a Villa' and Lundstram needs to think seriously where he is best placed for long term development. He's still young.

I wonder how good he thinks he is. Interesting.
To be honest, he's taken us by surprise and for that reason we may have gone a bit over the top on him. It would be interesting to see what neutrals thought about him but I'd be surprised if any other Prem club was prepared to offer him the kind of wages rumoured based on the season as a whole.
 

I took it with a pinch of salt at the time but during the pre-amble for the LIverpool game on NBC, they had an 'insider' guy and he was saying that both Lunny and Fleck were pushing for triple wages to stay.

I've no idea what they are on, but this could be the biggest test of Wilder's management skills yet. Does he cave in to such requests, or does he tell them to go take a run and jump?

He famously said, when he took the job, that (and I quote...) "the days of this club spunkin' money are over". I commented at the time that I thought that was a bit strange, because I've been watching since 1970 and I don't think we could ever be accused of "spunkin' money", quite the opposite! We've been impotent in that department for years and have always wanted a quart out of a pint pot. Anyhow...this suggested to me that Wilder was going to be very tight with the purse strings. (I'm not saying that's altogether a bad thing btw - but that's what I took from it).

The Duffy thing was about money. Maybe Duffy was being greedy? - but whatever your view, the fact is, Duffy wanted more and Wilder wasn't giving in to those demands. So Duffy was off down the road.

The picture I'm building is that Wilder will not be held to ransom over wages. Quite right too! But we have to be competitive at the level we are at. If other, "lesser" Premiership clubs (isn't it nice to be able to describe it like that? :D) are willing and able to triple these guys wages, then we have to decide whether we are going to compete with that, or not? And by compete, I don't necessarily mean "match it", but move closer towards it?

If we are rigid and intransigent we will lose out. If we roll over and have our belly tickled, we will lose out as well. It will be very interesting to see how Wilder and SUFC handle this. Personally I'd push the envelope for the likes of Fleck especially, but not for everyone and probably not for Lundstram.
 
I think he is permitted to negotiate a deal.

Saving a new club a fee must be worth £10000 a week on his wage on a 3 year contract.
Its in Premier League rules section V. Basically we have until 3rd Saturday in May to offer him a new contract. At this point he can decline and sign pre contact for another club for when his current contract runs out. Different rules for international transfers.
 
I can see legitimate reasons for all of the first team squad to ask for double/triple money at the end of the season, could be painful for us financially.

They've all signed contracts whilst in the Championship with a PL promotion clause in that I'm assuming they were all happy with at the time (as Championship players). If we were floundering around at the bottom of the league and looking like Championship players then I suspect there wouldn't be much dissent in the camp. As we're exceeding expectations and are now playing like a top 10 PL club then it's not out of the way for players to be asking for top 10 PL money.

The assumption here is that we continue to do as we've done and don't drop like a stone.

With Lundstram the cost of getting an adequate replacement is far higher than retaining him on more money, albeit if he gets more then others will (rightly) ask for the same.
 
When CW was talking about spunkin munneh I took it to mean buying loads of bang mediocre journeymen for top transfer fees.
 
There was an interview on the Monday Night Club, with JL.
He said (along the lines) Wilder took him aside on the last game of the Championship, and said "you're not going anywhere, I've got big plans for you next season in the PL"
Or something like that.
Point being I took it that Wilder planned for JL to be in the team right from the end of last season.
 
There were two players I was disappointed that we didn't secure on long contracts last season: Baldock and Lundstram. Fortunately the former got sorted before the start of the season when we were in real danger of losing him. I think we were a wee bit lucky as a club could and probably should have blown us away. The latter will cost us a lot more to retain now as he's effectively put himself in the shop window. Under Wilder we've generally been very astute and pro active in terms of contract offers, but these two are examples of the opposite.
 
I took it with a pinch of salt at the time but during the pre-amble for the LIverpool game on NBC, they had an 'insider' guy and he was saying that both Lunny and Fleck were pushing for triple wages to stay.
The impact of that purely depends on the starting point. Lundstram is at the end of his first contract with us having joined in the summer of 2017. Let's assume we paid him £8k per week in the Championship and his wages went up by 50% on promotion to the Premier League. Tripling that would still only ("only") take him to £35k per week - £1.8m per year, which is the average salary at Brighton who are the third lowest payers in the division.

Fleck is slightly less of an issue as his current deal runs to June 2022 but his performances arguably merit a review as he signed that deal in September 2017.

According to Talksport (so take it with a pinch of salt) our average salary this season is £728k/year or £14k per week which is by some distance the lowest in the division. The figures below are averaged.
  1. Man C £7.0m/yr or £135k/week
  2. Man U £6.1m/yr or £118k/week
  3. Liverpool £5.5m/yr or £107k/week
  4. Arsenal £4.8m/yr or £92k/week
  5. Chelsea £4.8m/yr or £92k/week
  6. Everton £4.1m/yr or £79k/week
  7. Spurs £4.0m/yr or £76k/week
  8. Leicester £3.4m/yr or £64k/week
  9. West Ham £3.0m/yr or £58k/week
  10. Palace £2.9m/yr or £56k/week
  11. Southampton £2.3m/yr or £44k/week
  12. Wolves £2.2m/yr or £42k/week
  13. Newcastle £2.1m/yr or £40k/week
  14. Watford £2.0m/yr or £39k/week
  15. Villa £2.0m/yr or £38k/week
  16. Bournemouth £1.9m/yr or £37k/week
  17. Burnley £1.9m/yr or £37k/week
  18. Brighton £1.8m/yr or £35k/week
  19. Norwich £1.0m/yr or £19k/week
  20. United £0.8m or £14k/week
 
The impact of that purely depends on the starting point. Lundstram is at the end of his first contract with us having joined in the summer of 2017. Let's assume we paid him £8k per week in the Championship and his wages went up by 50% on promotion to the Premier League. Tripling that would still only ("only") take him to £35k per week - £1.8m per year, which is the average salary at Brighton who are the third lowest payers in the division.

Fleck is slightly less of an issue as his current deal runs to June 2022 but his performances arguably merit a review as he signed that deal in September 2017.

According to Talksport (so take it with a pinch of salt) our average salary this season is £728k/year or £14k per week which is by some distance the lowest in the division. The figures below are averaged.
  1. Man C £7.0m/yr or £135k/week
  2. Man U £6.1m/yr or £118k/week
  3. Liverpool £5.5m/yr or £107k/week
  4. Arsenal £4.8m/yr or £92k/week
  5. Chelsea £4.8m/yr or £92k/week
  6. Everton £4.1m/yr or £79k/week
  7. Spurs £4.0m/yr or £76k/week
  8. Leicester £3.4m/yr or £64k/week
  9. West Ham £3.0m/yr or £58k/week
  10. Palace £2.9m/yr or £56k/week
  11. Southampton £2.3m/yr or £44k/week
  12. Wolves £2.2m/yr or £42k/week
  13. Newcastle £2.1m/yr or £40k/week
  14. Watford £2.0m/yr or £39k/week
  15. Villa £2.0m/yr or £38k/week
  16. Bournemouth £1.9m/yr or £37k/week
  17. Burnley £1.9m/yr or £37k/week
  18. Brighton £1.8m/yr or £35k/week
  19. Norwich £1.0m/yr or £19k/week
  20. United £0.8m or £14k/week
Still, you're suggesting we could make Lundstram one of our highest earners, based on 3 months of decent performances. I'd be a bit peeved if I was the likes of Fleck (done for 3 and a half years) and he was on more than me.
 
Still, you're suggesting we could make Lundstram one of our highest earners, based on 3 months of decent performances. I'd be a bit peeved if I was the likes of Fleck (done for 3 and a half years) and he was on more than me.

I'm suggesting that we could triple Lundstram's wages and still have a poorly-paid first team player by Premier League standards. Lundstam is lucky in a way that his performances this season have coincided with him being in the final year of his contract. I very much doubt we'll see any movement on Lundstram's contract until much closer to the end of the season. Wilder won't want to rock the boat by elevating Lundstram into the top earning bracket at United just yet.
 
There were two players I was disappointed that we didn't secure on long contracts last season: Baldock and Lundstram. Fortunately the former got sorted before the start of the season when we were in real danger of losing him. I think we were a wee bit lucky as a club could and probably should have blown us away. The latter will cost us a lot more to retain now as he's effectively put himself in the shop window. Under Wilder we've generally been very astute and pro active in terms of contract offers, but these two are examples of the opposite.
Really? I doubt many blades would have been bothered if JL left last summer..
 
I'm suggesting that we could triple Lundstram's wages and still have a poorly-paid first team player by Premier League standards. Lundstam is lucky in a way that his performances this season have coincided with him being in the final year of his contract. I very much doubt we'll see any movement on Lundstram's contract until much closer to the end of the season. Wilder won't want to rock the boat by elevating Lundstram into the top earning bracket at United just yet.
Agree completely, and to me, he hasn't shown the same form week in week out yet either. OK, we're now in the Prem etc etc but he has been pretty inconspicuous for the last month or so and I don't think he could have complained if he'd been left out at the time he was injured anyway.
 
Agree completely, and to me, he hasn't shown the same form week in week out yet either. OK, we're now in the Prem etc etc but he has been pretty inconspicuous for the last month or so and I don't think he could have complained if he'd been left out at the time he was injured anyway.
To be fair to Lunny, I think he's been carrying an injury for a few weeks now, and that has definitely affected his form. Tufty won't 'mug him off' to use his own expression. I think that a fair deal will be offered (or maybe has been) by Tufty/the club. Whether his agent has irons in other fires for him, who knows. This might be the case of an agent has a big financial interest in Lunny moving on. He won't have earned much from him so far 😂
 
I've no idea what they are on, but this could be the biggest test of Wilder's management skills yet. Does he cave in to such requests, or does he tell them to go take a run and jump?
Could be a bit sticky for CW as he appears to have been rewarded with e few new ‘improved’ contracts for our successes.
 
Could be a bit sticky for CW as he appears to have been rewarded with e few new ‘improved’ contracts for our successes.
I wonder what Tufty's wage is in comparison to the players though. Let's say he's on £1M a year (no idea) and say, Lunny comes in demanding £40K a week, twice what he's on on the back of 1/3 a season of decent performances ?
 

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