Brian Deane on Breakfast

[Grey Blade]

The part that made me sit up was the property scheme in Spain where the properties were being valued at 618,500 euros by Kingsbridge but an independent valuation put them at 290,000 euros. I can see valuations can be a matter of opinion but not that large a margin.

 

[Tickhill Blade]

Wilkson doesn't come out of it all looking very good does he.

Howard Wilkinson in being a twat shocker

 

[Nick Jansky]

The telling part is that the police still categorise the players as victims of crime despite charges not being brought. The problem is that fraud is very hard to prosecute. That is a big reason why HMRC bring so few criminal prosecutions.

 

[Tickhill Blade]

The telling part is that the police still categorise the players as victims of crime despite charges not being brought. The problem is that fraud is very hard to prosecute. That is a big reason why HMRC bring so few criminal prosecutions.

I was thinking that when they were saying that they had a witness to the signatures being forgeries. Presumably this is a difficult thing to actually prove, even with a 'handwriting expert' testifying.

 

[HighfieldBlade]

And as for Deano in tears when remembering how he hid is troubles from his now dead parents....

That's the part that broke me - I was in tears when I saw that scene.

 

[dingledog]

Howard Wilkinson in being a twat shocker

This was the part that really made me cross, he abused their trust and even made money out of their ignorance, lack of knowledge or simply the fact they were footballers. We have a Financial Adviser and he has been brilliant for us, we had to trust him implicitly and understand he was getting a fee for the work, but has years of experience, great references and is fully regulated. What the players did was trust someone who they should have been able to trust, but actually he was making money out of them. it was telling he refused to comment, I always had a bad feeling about him and this confirmed it to me. I have sympathy for the players in so far as their trust was abused. Its a tragedy for Wallace and his family being declared bankrupt, losing everything.

 

[Mad Mick]

They claimed tax relief and it is a reassessment of earlier years. It’s not dissimilar to what is currently happening with R&D tax credits. Roundly abused by “professionals advisors” during a period of minimal or zero HMRC scrutiny (because there was a political will to make the reliefs work) and sold to people, typically via their accountants, as government backed and entirely legitimate. Verbal guarantees that it definitely works (at odds with the caveats in very small print in the engagement letter).

I remember a solicitor once saying to me, "Verbal guarantees are not worth the paper they're not written on"

 

[Bladeloyal]

Pop your money in top banks and building societies ,pay your dues and eventually you have a good nest egg .never trust anyone where large sums of money are involved. .
If things seem to good to be true it's usually the case .

 

[Bladeloyal]

Hopefully the clubs are pointing young rich players in the right direction to banks like coutts and other established financial institutions .not some slimy agent/financial advisor /investor,but we know the score with a lot of footballers they are like sheep follow the latest trend fad and agent.

 

[Tickhill Blade]

Hopefully the clubs are pointing young rich players in the right direction to banks like coutts and other established financial institutions .not some slimy agent/financial advisor /investor,but we know the score with a lot of footballers they are like sheep follow the latest trend fad and agent.

I wonder if todays footballers just get shafted by their agents rather than financial advisors?

 

[Bladeloyal]

I wonder if todays footballers just get shafted by their agents rather than financial advisors?

Some will some won't ,I always think to what roy keen said ,he just had a respected sports lawyer and Roy knew his own worth ,he was the highest earner at mufc without shelling out for a agent.

 

[Edgar Allan Poo]

The one in the lounge or the one in the back bedroom?

Not the lounge, that wouldn't be safe there.

 

[KMC-1889]

It seems to me that the ones no one is blaming are the players agents. They are paid 10-15% + to look after the players interests. No one can realistically expect footballers to fully understand these schemes ( let’s be honest footballers generally are not the sharpest of minds, certainly not the one I know/met), but the agents should be checking that schemes promising massive returns or tax avoidance should be legal and/or safe. They are the ones who introduced the financial advisers and should at the very least be doing due diligence on both the advisers and the schemes they recommend, that is literally their job. IMO they are just as guilty as the dodgy advisers. UTB

My one great hope when there was talk about a football regulator is that it would be someone that finally got hold of agents and their conduct. Absolute leeches.

 

[Yellarbellyblade]

The part that made me sit up was the property scheme in Spain where the properties were being valued at 618,500 euros by Kingsbridge but an independent valuation put them at 290,000 euros. I can see valuations can be a matter of opinion but not that large a margin.

Sounds like Hillsborough

 

[Berkshire Blade]

This was the part that really made me cross, he abused their trust and even made money out of their ignorance, lack of knowledge or simply the fact they were footballers. We have a Financial Adviser and he has been brilliant for us, we had to trust him implicitly and understand he was getting a fee for the work, but has years of experience, great references and is fully regulated. What the players did was trust someone who they should have been able to trust, but actually he was making money out of them. it was telling he refused to comment, I always had a bad feeling about him and this confirmed it to me. I have sympathy for the players in so far as their trust was abused. Its a tragedy for Wallace and his family being declared bankrupt, losing everything.

Also we tend to forget how much easier information is to access in the modern era even compared to the mid to late 90s. The average man on the street has far more access to information compared to then

 

[s20Blade]

Just finished watching the show. A few have a highish profile. Plenty don't have particularly high ones. It's pretty remarkable how the cps didn't take some of the cases further as the claims made are pretty eye opening.


I'd love to know in what world rod Wallace is going to earn multi millions in retirement!

And as for Deano in tears when remembering how he hid is troubles from his now dead parents....the no sympathy posts come across as even more heartless

If you are financially set for life and want to gamble that through greed you deserve no sympathy.

 

[BladeByChoice]

I work for HMRC dealing with tax evasion. I can confirm that there are loads of people so blinded by greed that they can't see obvious scams.

please list every tax evasion scheme that you know about and are watching for, so we all know what not to do .

 

[Bladeloyal]

Simple advice don't put your money in tax avoidance schemes ,it usually catches up with you

 

[Berkshire Blade]

If you are financially set for life and want to gamble that through greed you deserve no sympathy.

Not all of them were earning that sort of money. Plenty of players from that era have day jobs now

 

[BladeByChoice]

If you're a footballer you're at a disadvantage when you retire as you don't have another trade. You're not qualified for any job except maybe coaching. The silver lining is that as a pro footballer today you can expect to bank enough during your career to survive on investments. Lose those investments and you're worse-off than a plasterer or teacher. No job, no income and no qualifications.

Trevor Swift, Rotherham United 1970s and friend of the family (my mum worked with his wife) retrained as a butcher after his football career and had a stall on Rotherham market for many years.

When Thatcher closed all the pits in the 90s I retrained to do something else and so did tens of thousands of other miners.

I’m struggling to understand how footballers are any different, its just a job and when you can’t do it any more retrain or take an unskilled job.

 

[Tickhill Blade]

Simple advice don't put your money in tax avoidance schemes ,it usually catches up with you

Apart from pensions, or ISAs, or share save schemes, or salary sacrifice car schemes, or cycle-to-work, or using your annual gift allowance etc etc etc. Bit of a minefield

 

[Bladeloyal]

Apart from pensions, or ISAs, or share save schemes, or salary sacrifice car schemes, or cycle-to-work, or using your annual gift allowance etc etc etc. Bit of minefield

I should have said legitimate,

 

[Youngand70]

Give it a rest. Greed has been around a bit longer than that.

I have no political allegence but she was still a grade one piece of crap.

 

[Davalon]

Would they be making a documentary if those investments had quadrupled their wealth?

Not the point though is it.

What about those people who were advised to transfer out of defined benefit occupational schemes in the late 80's early 90's because personal pension returns were high at the time.

Even people who had reviews 20 odd years ago have still lost tens of thousands if they weren't reinstated.

Would we say the same about them?

 

[Davalon]

I saw a lot of the problem started as a big confidence con, the players trusted these people, they were young and thought they were protecting their futures. Wilkinson appears to know more and players saw the likes of him ‘investing’ which helps the trust part of it all.

Some of those players are somewhere they will never get out of with the tax liabilities, they earn anything to pay it off, but get taxed more then add interest element that is constantly growing. It’ll never end

I know Wilkinson is knocking on now but his no response possibly tells a story

 

[Davalon]

That's the part that broke me - I was in tears when I saw that scene.

Especially someone as genuine and decent as him

 

[Nick Jansky]

Trevor Swift, Rotherham United 1970s and friend of the family (my mum worked with his wife) retrained as a butcher after his football career and had a stall on Rotherham market for many years.

When Thatcher closed all the pits in the 90s I retrained to do something else and so did tens of thousands of other miners.

I’m struggling to understand how footballers are any different, its just a job and when you can’t do it any more retrain or take an unskilled job.

Don’t underestimate the psychological effect of a footballer’s career ending. The divorce rate within 5 years of retiring is eye watering, as is the rate of addiction to something or other. It isn’t like a normal job.

 

[Grey Blade]

Not all of them were earning that sort of money. Plenty of players from that era have day jobs now

During the 1980s I had dealings with a reasonably well known local player (not Sheffield) and he ended up lorry driving. I once asked if he had much say in transfers and he said it was usually a done deal by the time the player found out. It seems agents have much of the power nowadays.

I don't know how much clubs do to advise their players what to do with their money but I hope between them they can find time to give regular advice on planning for the future - they have plenty of time on their hands when they're not training,

To go from a relatively modest background to earning money most of us can only dream of, places them at risk from any dodgy influencer going.

 

[Nick Jansky]

I was thinking that when they were saying that they had a witness to the signatures being forgeries. Presumably this is a difficult thing to actually prove, even with a 'handwriting expert' testifying.

Proving a signature is forged is one thing, proving who forged it is something else.

It wouldn’t necessarily help with the HMRC issue anyway. They invoke the principle of “substance over form”. In other words, even if the documentation wasn’t actually signed at all, the fact that the transactions still actually took place is what counts. The intention and execution were there.

 

[dingledog]

Also we tend to forget how much easier information is to access in the modern era even compared to the mid to late 90s. The average man on the street has far more access to information compared to then

Of course you are correct my friend. But I guess that then begs the question, can they interpret the information and also be sure its genuine? So ultimately it still come down to trust of whoever is interpreting it and advising them.