We need to wake up

[1danewhitehouse]

Nigel Clough stocked up a squad of lower league players. He also did well in the cups. But he was absolutely slaughtered by a lot of our fans for it. Now, we duck out of the cup early with a reserve team and aim high in terms of who we want to bring in and we’re slaughtered for it. Can’t win with some.

If you don’t ask you don’t get. That being said, it’s important we then have plenty of other avenues to pursue.

I would love to see us snap up the best up and coming talent from League 1 and 2 but the problem is that Prem and championship clubs are really beginning to stockpile these players making it hard for us to get/ keep them.

Last season the likes of Luogno, JET, Gladwin, Holgate, Darikwa, Doyle etc all showed a lot of promise in League 1 but they ended up going to the championship or higher. This season we’ve already seen the likes of Jamie Murphy and Connor Goldson snapped up by Brighton.

There are young players that don’t get snapped up by the higher up teams and are obtainable in League 1 but they tend to be a bit less proven or a bit less spectacular (Mawson, Winnall, Adams, Wallace etc.). They are more of a gamble and some pay off big like Adams but it’s less of a sure thing.

I’d love to see us in for the likes of Byrne, Dack, Bentley, Pierre etc. but I suspect that when they do leave their clubs, they might go higher up the ladder. Simply put, I’m not sure “signing the best of league 1” is any more realistic than singing Prem cast offs. Either way, we’re still behind most of the championship in the queue.

I blame the transfer windows for the level of stockpiling that goes on in the higher divisions these days.

 

[BushBlade]

So we're in for Walcott?

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

Do people not get this?

It's amazing, that reasonably intelligent people, when faced with things football pertinent to their club become gibbering imbeciles. When interviewed a manager can avoid questions, steer the interview in a different direction, even tell out and out porkies if he thinks it will help him get the player(s) he wants at the price he wants.

See the (recent-ish and gruesome) Lies thread for your answer

It went something like:

Adkins is lying about this [can't remember what, exactly - but it might have been transfer related]. If he lies about this, then...he will lie about other things. In fact the man will lie about everything. He will stop at nothing. He's a dangerous nutter.

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

So we're in for Walcott?

You need to wake up.

 

[BushBlade]

You need to wake up.

What? So Adkins was lying again? What's wrong with him? I can't trust anything the man says.

 

[Darthblade]

Bear in mind we finished 5th last season. Mk, Preston & bristol have been swapped for Wigan, millwall & Blackpool (and we'll definitely finish above millwall & blackpool so that's us up to 3rd)

Swap Murphy for Che, add a decent CB in Edgar, throw in SAS and bring in a manager who's done it 3 times. To me, the squad we have now should have no trouble getting promoted.

I fear that you are going to be terribly disappointed in what our ( current ) squad is capable of.

I hope that NA brings in the 4 / 5 players we need to have a chance of realistically competing for automatic promotion, so that we are not having this conversation in 12 months time !!
UTB & FTP

 

[Darthblade]

I think as a club with ambition then we do right to shop in the league above but top flight shopping is trying to punch above our weight. We need to get the mix right more than anything and I think a great deal of what Adkins in looking for in a CB in particular is experience because he knows that we have goals in the team and if he can make that back four solid we are in with a good shout. The experience that Adkins wants can be found above league one but never the less I still think Turner was over ambitious.

I am confident that Adkins will bring in a couple of decent signings anyway. Look at those who have arrived, all of which were Ambitious targets who have brought both quality and experience to the team. If somebody would have said a few months ago that Billy Sharp, Connor Sammon and David Edgar would have been coming in I would have laughed at them. I expect him to deliver more quality now Murphy has gone and the money has been made available.

Where "ambition" is concerned, the Club "talk the talk" however they always fail miserably to "walk the walk" !!

I'm still waiting to see IF I see evidence that we have "ambition", following a good start with the arrival of Adkins. He's here and NOW he needs backing ........

Over to you "ambitious" Board ......
UTB & FTP

 

[finlaytheblade]

And realise that we can not attract premier league players whilst in league 1 and the news today that Michael Turner has gone to the dark side is not surprising. He won't be impressed by a fancy pitch and nice dugouts he only needs to look at that fixture list and his decision will be made. Restrictions mean we can't pay big wages so we need to start looking at out of favour championship players or better still top performing league one players who would be impressed with our facilities and direction.

This league is shite full of nasty horrible grounds and players used to travelling to premier league grounds or good championship grounds just won't swap. All this promise and investment bull shit might work on the fans but players have heard it all before. If we don't sign anymore players by next week we may have a problem, plus the board have some serious questions to answer, I worry we will have an unhappy manager with broken promises.

Sz Stop wasting your time on targets who aren't interested, wake up and go for realistic targets.

Did you go to meet the manager with adkins?.he,s quite well aware of the budget he,s been set and obviously happy with it or he wouldn't have taken the job.We have to trust him he,s experienced at this level he will know getting players to drop from premium to league one is difficult. If players from league one are the answer I would think he would bring them in

 

[Jan Age]

Mediocrity?

Since Warnock I struggle to recall a team as capable of turning a game on its head by bringing someone with something different to offer off the bench. I also struggle to recall a team since with the passion and desire to play for the shirt. We also had our most successful recent period under his leadership. So if Championship Play Off appearances, Automatic Promotion to the PL, FA Cup and League Cup Semi-Final appearance and our season in the PL are what 'mediocre' (as you put) it signings get you.... then yes please lets sign them up now and get us out of this god awful league!

 

[The_Green_Man]

Where "ambition" is concerned, the Club "talk the talk" however they always fail miserably to "walk the walk" !!

I'm still waiting to see IF I see evidence that we have "ambition", following a good start with the arrival of Adkins. He's here and NOW he needs backing ........

Over to you "ambitious" Board ......
UTB & FTP

You think Sharp, Sammon and Edgar come cheap on the wages front? If that ain't ambition I don't know what is.

 

[BushBlade]

You think Sharp, Sammon and Edgar come cheap on the wages front? If that ain't ambition I don't know what is.

Every team could always 'do with two or three'. Even Mourinho's been throwing his toys out of the pram over lack of signings. Whoever we sign, there's always going to be a couple of players that are perceived by the fans as being the weak links. It's been the case for the thirty plus years I've been going to the Lane.
Whatever we do, whatever we spend, it won't be enough unless we get promotion and even if we do, they'll be those who'll say we're going to come straight back down again.

Our whole seasons are now judged solely on getting promoted, it's purely about the destination rather than enjoying the journey. Particularly where social media is concerned. Thank fuck we've got about 20k of supporters who actually enjoy the day out, hope we win but don't hit the Prozac when we don't. And when we do go up, that 20k deserves every bit of joy they get from it, and more.

 

[The_Green_Man]

Every team could always 'do with two or three'. Even Mourinho's been throwing his toys out of the pram over lack of signings. Whoever we sign, there's always going to be a couple of players that are perceived by the fans as being the weak links. It's been the case for the thirty plus years I've been going to the Lane.
Whatever we do, whatever we spend, it won't be enough unless we get promotion and even if we do, they'll be those who'll say we're going to come straight back down again.

Our whole seasons are now judged solely on getting promoted, it's purely about the destination rather than enjoying the journey. Particularly where social media is concerned. Thank fuck we've got about 20k of supporters who actually enjoy the day out, hope we win but don't hit the Prozac when we don't. And when we do go up, that 20k deserves every bit of joy they get from it, and more.

It just bemuses and amuses me at times how people think we should be, it is as though realism gets tossed out of the window.

We are a league one club, we have been a league one club for around 5 years now and with this comes plenty of restrictions. The FFP rules just make things even more difficult for us, this coupled with the loss of revenue from TV rights and the fact that we now attract mainly local sponsors as opposed to nation sponsors all has it's impact. You only have to look at the books since relegation to see how things have changed financially at Bramall Lane. I personally think the board have been fantastic so far in keeping us reasonably balanced whilst still highly competitive.

When Adkins says "we have to cut the cloth accordingly" this is exactly what it means, we have to live to our means. Yet some interpret this as "Nah we ain't got the money, the board haven't got any ambition and won't give me anything to spend". The days of the board giving the manager "x" amount to just go out and spend are out of the window until we get promoted again.

The balance has got to be right. We have to bring in the right players with the right quality and experience but equally as important, for the right price and this means wages as much as anything. The manager can't overspend on one particular player because if he does that could be at the risk of neglecting other areas within the squad.

Adkins knows what money he has available to him, he knows what money he has available to him to spend including the Murphy money and he knows which areas ideally he wants to strengthen. He will try and beg, steal and borrow to get the best tools available for the job but he will get knocked back a good few times before he strikes oil. It's all good and well us sitting here saying why aren't they signing this, that and the other but we haven't got the books in front of us have we. The manager has done well so far in who he has brought in and we have no reason what to ever to doubt him or the board and to claim a lack of ambition is ludicrous. If people are letting the fact that the pigs are signing annoy them as well, be realistic about that as well, they are in the Championship and don't have the same operating restrictions as us.

We have a very willing board all things considered and a fantastic manager who targets could be regarded as "punching above our weight" but he is delivering so far. It's about time people started to "get real" and understand the implications of being in league one and the restrictions that come with it.

Rant over!

 

[metalblade]

It just bemuses and amuses me at times how people think we should be, it is as though realism gets tossed out of the window.

We are a league one club, we have been a league one club for around 5 years now and with this comes plenty of restrictions. The FFP rules just make things even more difficult for us, this coupled with the loss of revenue from TV rights and the fact that we now attract mainly local sponsors as opposed to nation sponsors all has it's impact. You only have to look at the books since relegation to see how things have changed financially at Bramall Lane. I personally think the board have been fantastic so far in keeping us reasonably balanced whilst still highly competitive.

When Adkins says "we have to cut the cloth accordingly" this is exactly what it means, we have to live to our means. Yet some interpret this as "Nah we ain't got the money, the board haven't got any ambition and won't give me anything to spend". The days of the board giving the manager "x" amount to just go out and spend are out of the window until we get promoted again.

The balance has got to be right. We have to bring in the right players with the right quality and experience but equally as important, for the right price and this means wages as much as anything. The manager can't overspend on one particular player because if he does that could be at the risk of neglecting other areas within the squad.

Adkins knows what money he has available to him, he knows what money he has available to him to spend including the Murphy money and he knows which areas ideally he wants to strengthen. He will try and beg, steal and borrow to get the best tools available for the job but he will get knocked back a good few times before he strikes oil. It's all good and well us sitting here saying why aren't they signing this, that and the other but we haven't got the books in front of us have we. The manager has done well so far in who he has brought in and we have no reason what to ever to doubt him or the board and to claim a lack of ambition is ludicrous. If people are letting the fact that the pigs are signing annoy them as well, be realistic about that as well, they are in the Championship and don't have the same operating restrictions as us.

We have a very willing board all things considered and a fantastic manager who targets could be regarded as "punching above our weight" but he is delivering so far. It's about time people started to "get real" and understand the implications of being in league one and the restrictions that come with it.

Rant over!

So what do the books say ? Sounds like you've seen em

 

[BushBlade]

It just bemuses and amuses me at times how people think we should be, it is as though realism gets tossed out of the window.

We are a league one club, we have been a league one club for around 5 years now and with this comes plenty of restrictions. The FFP rules just make things even more difficult for us, this coupled with the loss of revenue from TV rights and the fact that we now attract mainly local sponsors as opposed to nation sponsors all has it's impact. You only have to look at the books since relegation to see how things have changed financially at Bramall Lane. I personally think the board have been fantastic so far in keeping us reasonably balanced whilst still highly competitive.

When Adkins says "we have to cut the cloth accordingly" this is exactly what it means, we have to live to our means. Yet some interpret this as "Nah we ain't got the money, the board haven't got any ambition and won't give me anything to spend". The days of the board giving the manager "x" amount to just go out and spend are out of the window until we get promoted again.

The balance has got to be right. We have to bring in the right players with the right quality and experience but equally as important, for the right price and this means wages as much as anything. The manager can't overspend on one particular player because if he does that could be at the risk of neglecting other areas within the squad.

Adkins knows what money he has available to him, he knows what money he has available to him to spend including the Murphy money and he knows which areas ideally he wants to strengthen. He will try and beg, steal and borrow to get the best tools available for the job but he will get knocked back a good few times before he strikes oil. It's all good and well us sitting here saying why aren't they signing this, that and the other but we haven't got the books in front of us have we. The manager has done well so far in who he has brought in and we have no reason what to ever to doubt him or the board and to claim a lack of ambition is ludicrous. If people are letting the fact that the pigs are signing annoy them as well, be realistic about that as well, they are in the Championship and don't have the same operating restrictions as us.

We have a very willing board all things considered and a fantastic manager who targets could be regarded as "punching above our weight" but he is delivering so far. It's about time people started to "get real" and understand the implications of being in league one and the restrictions that come with it.

Rant over!

A lot of my job involves looking at what can go wrong and mitigate against it so I can see where the doom and gloom merchants are coming from but I try to not take my negative attitudes I need for my job into the rest of my life.
At work, I can spot potential problems and do something about them, supporting United, I can do nothing. So I don't let it get to me (much, hate losing as much as the next man).

 

[BushBlade]

So what do the books say ? Sounds like you've seen em

https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/companies-house

Let me know when you've read them. I can't be arsed. Gave up accountancy a long time ago.

 

[The_Green_Man]

So what do the books say ? Sounds like you've seen em

I can only go on the annual accounts and stuff availbale in the public domain. I don't claim to be an expert but it is plain to see the changes. I would say that even with how little I have seen, I am more equipped with my opinions than those who are kicking up a fuss and claiming a lack of ambition.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

Agree we need 3 players in positions mentioned to give us the best chance of promotion.

They don't have to be the most talented but they do have to bring qualities that others already in the position don't currently.

E.g a CB that can bring the ball out of defence or a MD that knows how to win the ball back quickly and play a simple pass to get us moving.

These players can all be found in this league and can be used to safeguard our promotion push.

I for one am not interested in the 'long term' for these 3 players I just want to get out of this league THIS season and we should buy accordingly.

Warnock bought some players which I thought were shocking on the face of it but they all bought a different aspect to the team.

In my view Warnock bought us ultimate relegation .

Cannot see what all the fuss is about . Adkins can balance being realistic against ambition and expectation.

SUFC will still be in the hunt for players , as you can never stand still to progress. This will include CB , CM .

The rumour board throws up loads of suggestions , but the guy who will make the decision and get it right , working in the parameters he has - is Adkins and his backroom staff . I am sure the board is backing him to the hilt.

We , as fans , perhaps do not need to Wake Up , but we do have to use some common sense.

UTB

 

[Bladesway]

Where "ambition" is concerned, the Club "talk the talk" however they always fail miserably to "walk the walk" !!

I'm still waiting to see IF I see evidence that we have "ambition", following a good start with the arrival of Adkins. He's here and NOW he needs backing ........

Over to you "ambitious" Board ......
UTB & FTP

Previously i would have agreed but Brayford, Done, Sharp and Sammon will not have been cheap to buy or loan amd they wont be on buttons.

I think we are getting the balance between survival financially and ambitiin reflected in spending about right. If you expect Messi to walk through the door then of course you will be upset but most realistic people understand the need for sustainable growth over spending till the police come.

 

[metalblade]

All a bit pointless unless we bring in some defenders and it is getting a bit late in the day, still the loan window opens in a few weeks ................. mind you we have all heard that one before

 

[Bladesway]

All a bit pointless unless we bring in some defenders and it is getting a bit late in the day, still the loan window opens in a few weeks ................. mind you we have all heard that one before

Get what you are saying but in fairness how many goals have we conceded in the last 3 games. Appears one centre half has made a massive difference to us. I'd like another couple of defenders myself but it's hardly panic stations is it?

 

[Bladesince59]

Well we got Edgar and eff all else. Doesn't look great from where I sitting. Adkins must be building for promotion in 2020 - bit like NN.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

Get what you are saying but in fairness how many goals have we conceded in the last 3 games. Appears one centre half has made a massive difference to us. I'd like another couple of defenders myself but it's hardly panic stations is it?

After the Gilliingham game , which was the Wake Up Call for Adkins and playing staff , we have more positives than negatives . The game tommorow is just another barometer , on how we are progressing , like wise the next game , and the one after that . Win at Swindon , and we will all be smug and happy. Lose and we will be having a post mortem.

At least this season , we are starting to look like a football club , heading in the right direction , which on its own is a refreshing change and good news.

Fancy a win tommorow , due to the fact its only us fans , are yet to realise how good we actually are , when firing on all cylinders. We are better than Swindon and more adaptable .

New players are required , but they will come , we just have to bide our time . Just cannot see the club letting us down anymore.

UTB

 

[Jan Age]

In my view Warnock bought us ultimate relegation .

Cannot see what all the fuss is about . Adkins can balance being realistic against ambition and expectation.

SUFC will still be in the hunt for players , as you can never stand still to progress. This will include CB , CM .

The rumour board throws up loads of suggestions , but the guy who will make the decision and get it right , working in the parameters he has - is Adkins and his backroom staff . I am sure the board is backing him to the hilt.

We , as fans , perhaps do not need to Wake Up , but we do have to use some common sense.

UTB

I think to sum Warnock up in the one PL season is to do him a disservice. Ultimately it was mainly his fault we got relegated but he did steady the ship and build and get us there.

I have no doubt we will be in the hunt for players but I'm not making a fuss just adding to the debate.

You are correct in as much as Adkins is the one that needs to get it right and should be judged as such. You can't question the boards commitment but let's keep in mind the other player sales and cup runs that make it easier to do so.

Hypothetical and difficult I know but I wouldn't imagine we would be where we are had we kept hold of Maguire, McDonald and Murphy and bought the players Adkins has now. (None of which we ever replaced adequately)

So now we are strong in certain areas and weak in defence and midfield none of which (Edgar aside) have been sorted.

PS: where about in Eckington you from I'm from there myself!

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

I think to sum Warnock up in the one PL season is to do him a disservice. Ultimately it was mainly his fault we got relegated but he did steady the ship and build and get us there.

I have no doubt we will be in the hunt for players but I'm not making a fuss just adding to the debate.

You are correct in as much as Adkins is the one that needs to get it right and should be judged as such. You can't question the boards commitment but let's keep in mind the other player sales and cup runs that make it easier to do so.

Hypothetical and difficult I know but I wouldn't imagine we would be where we are had we kept hold of Maguire, McDonald and Murphy and bought the players Adkins has now. (None of which we ever replaced adequately)

So now we are strong in certain areas and weak in defence and midfield none of which (Edgar aside) have been sorted.

PS: where about in Eckington you from I'm from there myself!

Jan , the thing is with all the 3no players mentioned . They all wanted to leave , whether the club made a effort to try and keep them , is another debate .

You never know HM may be on his way back , but if not we move on.

Yes we do require strenghening , to balance up a unbalanced squad . If Adkinds cannot sort it at this level nobody can.

Live in Eckington near the church , the other church is were 20, 000 of us go , on alternate saturdays.

UTB

 

[Jan Age]

Jan , the thing is with all the 3no players mentioned . They all wanted to leave , whether the club made a effort to try and keep them , is another debate .

You never know HM may be on his way back , but if not we move on.

Yes we do require strenghening , to balance up a unbalanced squad . If Adkinds cannot sort it at this level nobody can.

Live in Eckington near the church , the other church is were 20, 000 of us go , on alternate saturdays.

UTB

Agreed I'm backing Adkins all the way...UTB! Yep know where you mean I'm up there this weekend visiting parents , be nice to get back.

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

The manager has done well so far in who he has brought in and we have no reason what to ever to doubt him or the board and to claim a lack of ambition is ludicrous.

Agree with all of that post but this part in particular.

 

[Bladesway]

You never know HM may be on his way back ,

Bollocks, just as Brownfact retires we get an even younger one to take his place. I expect him to be coming back for the next 15 years but bet he never will.

 

[wizadry]

OK Wiz you appear an intelligent bloke who generally talks some sense, certainly more reasonable than some. Lead me through this please and tell me the disconnect between what I read and what I see here. Bits in bold for discussion

You are not disputing we need the best we can get (generally from higher divisions if we can is how I read this). Then you say we have just as good a chance by getting the best players out of this league and it's less of a gamble? This is where I am losing you. The best players we can buy are the best players we can buy, no matter where they come from. This division isn't significantly different to any other. They play a game of football. 11 a side (usually, unless Baxter has one of his moments). It isn't a different brand of football unique to what we have seen in the modern world. If we are better than other teams we will beat them usually. I would suggest getting someone from the Premiership is less of a gamble than a jouneyman from League One who has got promoted then been deemed surplus to the newly promoted sides requirements. We need to get promoted but if those players are good enough for the Championship (like Brayford) then the less the gamble.

The last bit in bold is the most important bit. Why do we all go into meltdown over a rumour posted by some lazy jouno with fuck all better to do with his time? Its a rumour. Now we are approaching the end of the transfer window and with the added barmy bonus that this also falls within the school holidays it appears the collective meltdown is through the roof. The clamour for any player is off the scale. I'd recommend everyone get off the roundabout that is the transfer window and just go with the flow over the next few days. How many times have we been here before and there's more life in a eunuchs underpants than at BDTBL? And Adkins doesn't strike me as a man to get flustered by a window snapping shut (thanks Sky Sports for that).

My opinion is we stay calm and let the Manager get on with doing the right things. He appears to be doing ok so far. It's not spectacular but it isn't Wigan either (remember some people shitting their collective knickers every time they signed someone this summer). We have won 3 out of 4 which if my maths is working gets us to almost 100 points. Hardly shit right now is it? Best signing he has made so far in my mind is Edgar who seems rock solid at the back and instils calm in all those around him.

What we don't need right now is a dose of this......

I probably worded it wrong BW, i rushed it whilst working. What i'm getting at is we don't have much chance of getting players from the Premier whereas we do from our own league. In theory, if we get the best players from our league that should be enough to achieve promotion, then we should go from there, obviously trying to get a spine of players that could possibly play in the league above would be better, that's what i meant.

You're right though, if there's an incline that we could get someone from an higher league and it is affordable then we should do everything in our powers to get said players.

I also agree that Adkins has a plan and think that his plan will more than likely end up with promotion this season, that shouldn't stop us from discussing our possible transfer incomings and outgoings though, as i say we've done some good transfers this season but i personally think we could get that one or two more players in that could really cement our place towards the top of this lovely division

 

[Barney]

I can only go on the annual accounts and stuff availbale in the public domain. I don't claim to be an expert but it is plain to see the changes. I would say that even with how little I have seen, I am more equipped with my opinions than those who are kicking up a fuss and claiming a lack of ambition.

5 years in league one. Different managers have been and gone. One thing however, has remained consistent.

I'll leave you to do the rest.......

 

[Darthblade]

You think Sharp, Sammon and Edgar come cheap on the wages front? If that ain't ambition I don't know what is.

Minimal fee for Sharp and I suspect that we're only funding a proportion of the wages for Edgar & Sammon.

I see no "game changing investment" at this point in time ..........

We failed miserably last season because NC wasn't backed with "real funds" until the end of January when it was way too late to compete and we NEVER addressed the lack of CH's even then. I hope that we don't make the same error of judgement again, and consign ourselves to yet another season in this agricultural division ......

..... and before I get a lecture on finances ...... I do not expect the Club to be spending millions on players in this crappy Division, because its not necessary. However we do need solid, consistent performers in key positions and we need them NOW, not at the end of January when it will be way too late to compete for the automatic positions.
UTB & FTP