post-match presser- "I think we need to keep all the players"

[Mouth of the South]

Pure speculation, but reading between the lines, PH may have to accept that the 5/6 players will be those in the current squad who need contract renewal.

It’s been done before when Ndiaye was described as a great new signing!

I agree with most fans that some have to move on, and PH probably has to accept that, however reluctantly that might be.
The only player retention where I disagree with supporters would be Osborn. Given the likely financial constraints, I would keep Osborn due to his age and versatility.

I’m sure that management and ownership will have done their sums for different scenarios, but I expect PA to be hard line on money, and PH will be left with no choice but to accept it. That’s why he got a 5 year contract in the first place.
The Prince probably didn’t expect to be discussing this with Blades in the EPL!

When you mention Osborn's versatility, do you mean he's able to play terribly and run round like a headless chicken in several positions?

He's not on a small wage and it will likely increase of PH is mad enough to think he's good enough to play at Prem level.

There are many, many better options available for what he'd cost, although I have a horrible feeling he'll still be asst the club next season.

 

[Kevincarterversion2.0]

it’s highly likely we’ll be relegated next season. But one of the perks of becoming a yo-yo club is that you can pick up better players in this process and shed a few that are not PL or top end championship standard. It sounds like the latter part is missing from what Hecky has said there.

Stevens, Fleck, Sharp, Osborn aren’t good enough for the PL anymore. It doesn’t make much sense to keep them.

If we are sold then maybe this changes. Maybe Hecky is playing some mind games with the board. Maybe the terms offered for example to Luke’s Fleck will be turned down by the players. Too early to know.

 

[HeySethUTB]

It’s a bit kicking the can down the road this strategy. I totally understand where he’s coming from in regards to not wanting to have to sign 10-12 players, but what he’s forgetting is a core of our current squad is aging (over 30) Players like Bash, Norwood, Sharp, Stevens, Fleck, Egan, Baldock will all be 31/32 by the end of next season, the removal of Clarke, Doyle and McAtee and if we don’t stay up the likes of Berge and Ndiaye (12) will definitely be gone, the influx of younger players realistically extends to Jebbo, Bogle, Brewster (if ever fit), Lowe and RND (5) The spine of the team left would worry me, leaving us like Norwich meaning any yo-yo club philosophy would have to be fuelled by players with a lot less vigour than previous years.

At the end of the day the 6 players he brings could keep us up, supplemented with what we’ve got. We then replace the age with another year of PL money, miss the target and we are having to replace age and what we’ve lost via parachute payments.

 

[blader]

On the one hand, it’s blatantly obviously this squad would finish in the relegation zone, and most likely not even be competitive.

On the flip side, both times we’ve been promoted our signings have been absolutely dreadful. Seriously, if someone can be bothered to compile a list of signings from 2007 and 2019, I’d like to see the hit/miss ratio!

We’ve actually made better signings has a championship team than a premier league team…

 

[AWetFlannel]

The reality is we'll start the season without a PL first 11. That people are complaining about signing non-PL squad players is a bit worrying, what do people expect?

The only good suggestion has been replacing our out of contract players with other free transfers. Someone like Manning would be great, but I actually think he'd be slightly more expensive. You'd then have to consider the dressing room element of your squad players, and we know people like Fleck and Stevens are positive in this regard.

 

[AWetFlannel]

On the one hand, it’s blatantly obviously this squad would finish in the relegation zone, and most likely not even be competitive.

On the flip side, both times we’ve been promoted our signings have been absolutely dreadful. Seriously, if someone can be bothered to compile a list of signings from 2007 and 2019, I’d like to see the hit/miss ratio!

We’ve actually made better signings has a championship team than a premier league team…

Our 2019 squad looked Championship mid table on paper. Most promoted teams like Brentford, Leeds, Bournemouth are clearly not full of PL talent, yet manage to stay up.

It's all about how they work as a team, not the quality of your individuals.

 

[YES Blade]

Our 2019 squad looked Championship mid table on paper. Most promoted teams like Brentford, Leeds, Bournemouth are clearly not full of PL talent, yet manage to stay up.

It's all about how they work as a team, not the quality of your individuals.

I agree, it really doesn’t take much to be in with a chance of staying up.

Man City, Man U, Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs, Chelsea and Newcastle are the only teams I would guarantee won’t be in the relegation battle next season. The other 13 teams could be in with a chance of Europe or go down depending on how they start the season.

It shouldn’t take a lot for us to be competing with the bottom half premier league teams.

 

[Stu_Blade]

This is the most important question , what is our longer term objective ?
But in the absence of an owner who is content to stay for the foreseeable future , there is no answer.
So the club may well just lurch along , until ownership is settled.
There is so much demand upon our PL resources :
Transfer fees
Wages
Mortgage on McCabe assets
Other debts
Training ground
Academy
Scouting structure
Hotel
Ground improvement
It is a very complex exercise to decide which to fund and by how much.

Hopefully lessons have been learnt from however long it is now that the issues with Shirecliffe first raised their ugly head. Long term stability is a must both in infrastructure and offfield. Do I want us to get to the Prem and be beaten 3-0 every week of course not but looking at the standard of this season from 15th downwards still realistically could go 3 from 5 it wasn't that long ago that it was 12th downwards. 3 of those are being replaced with teams that we can get results against the other 2 be strong at home and see what we can do away and enjoy it. Are we a Premiership club on paper over the years you could quite easily say yes maybe just, we need to be clever in the transfer market and clever with the assets we already own, just because a bigger side might bid we don't have to sell.

 

[robbiez666]

If Fleck and Stevens get a new contract I'll be very worried about next season. Neither has really contributed to this season and both will be a year older and slower.

I don't expect us to spend as much as we did last time we went up but surely we can use the prem money to at least try and be competitive.

That's really unfair to Fleck. I agree, I'd not hand him another contract but to say he's not really contributed is wrong.

 

[S40BLADE]

Hecky and the team will only be polite regarding any squad plans ATM. I cant truly believe that players like Fleck and Sharp will be seen as premier league ready in 2023. Unlike others I think we will have more then enough cash to make some high quality additions to the squad. I remember in 2019 when we last got promoted that people were in a frenzy thinking we had fuck all cash and we had to brace for the storm ahead. We then proceeded to spend 10s of millions of pounds on the team within the summer window. The only thing I can see halting positive developments ATM is the multitude of takeover sagas. UTB

 

[Yellarbellyblade]

Pure speculation, but reading between the lines, PH may have to accept that the 5/6 players will be those in the current squad who need contract renewal.

It’s been done before when Ndiaye was described as a great new signing!

I agree with most fans that some have to move on, and PH probably has to accept that, however reluctantly that might be.
The only player retention where I disagree with supporters would be Osborn. Given the likely financial constraints, I would keep Osborn due to his age and versatility.

I’m sure that management and ownership will have done their sums for different scenarios, but I expect PA to be hard line on money, and PH will be left with no choice but to accept it. That’s why he got a 5 year contract in the first place.
The Prince probably didn’t expect to be discussing this with Blades in the EPL!

In fairness if Ndiaye did sign a new contract I’d celebrate like he was a new top signing

 

[Stu_Blade]

In fairness if Ndiaye did sign a new contract I’d celebrate like he was a new top signing

The first thing I would be doing is offering a 2 year deal at £4million a season. In theory a max of £8million paid for a £30mill player and if we do go down at the end of season one, can cash in

 

[PaulHalfway]

5/6 of the out of contract players need releasing they are no where near PL quality and would tie up loads of wages out of the budget
No sentiment in football, we need to move to forward with much better quality to give us any chance next season
Loan market needs to be maximised, out of contract players, better Championship players, without paying stupid money this time
Foreign market, who’s available like Anel etc

 

[Ndiayewillalwaysloveyou]

Obviously there's still two games left but yesterday it was a shame we couldn't thank the ones maybe leaving more.

Fleck
Stevens
Sharp
Norwood
JOC

I suspect most of them will be gone but they have been legend's in the past 6 or 7 years and deserve the send off.

 

[blader]

Our 2019 squad lOur 2019 squad looked Championship mid table on paper. Most promoted teams like Brentford, Leeds, Bournemouth are clearly not full of PL talent, yet manage to stay up.

It's all about how they work as a team, not the quality of your individuals.

I think that’s true, to a point! Especially just to achieve 17th teamwork (and let’s face it, luck) can you get there quite often.

However, when you look at some teams that have been awful all season (West Ham, palace, wolves come to mind) that their game changers have been decisive in just keeping them up despite their poor performance all year. Leicester may be the anomaly, but I’m backing them to stay up also, so we will see on that one.

Ofcourse the way the team functions is important, but individual quality can be even more decisive in key moments. For an example, see about 10 results where Ndiaye has won the game when we were not playing well this season!

Quality does shine through more often than not, in the long term. Without Mcatee and Doyle our squad looks bereft of PL quality right now.

 

[Champagneblade]

Obviously there's still two games left but yesterday it was a shame we couldn't thank the ones maybe leaving more.

Fleck
Stevens
Sharp
Norwood
JOC

I suspect most of them will be gone but they have been legend's in the past 6 or 7 years and deserve the send off.

Norwood started 86% of our league games. I'd be amazed if he wasn't offered a new deal.

If that's the bar, we should be getting in touch with the Forest recruitment team!

Billy 32%, Fleck 30%, Stevens 18%, O'Connell 0%, were the others for which you can of course make a compelling case for each one if they are not starting 2/3 of the time.

 

[Mouth of the South]

The first thing I would be doing is offering a 2 year deal at £4million a season. In theory a max of £8million paid for a £30mill player and if we do go down at the end of season one, can cash in

His reps have apparently rejected the invitation to even start to discuss terms..
The amount you propose would fall way short on what's needed to even get them to the negotiating table

 

[Panini]

Norwood started 86% of our league games. I'd be amazed if he wasn't offered a new deal.

That's an interesting perspective but the rate of a player's decline comes into it.

We were arguably at risk of being caught by Boro and Luton had PH not made a significant change to our default starting XI and a big part of that change was dropping Norwood.

Let's also not forget he was the worst of an admittedly poor group who were relegated in 2021. For him to be able to contribute at that level two years after he wasn't close to doing so is an impossible ask.

If his contract wasn't up I wouldn't be shouting 'get rid' and I'd have no issue with using him as a fringe player but that's the crux...his contract is up.

Would we be looking to sign him if he was a Burnley player and his contract was about to expire?

 

[BalticBlade]

I heard that too.....think it's just manager speak.....a public way of saying "thank you" to the players.
If he had his way......he'd love to keep them all....and let them all play in the PL next year.
However in reality we know half of them aren't good enough to be 1st team starters at PL level.

He already admitted he hasn't a clue what our future or spending budget will be.
He's said he's due to meet the Prince next week.

Also until the takeover is sorted...then no one knows what budget we have.

He DOES know his budget. Go back and listen to Macca's presser on Friday. He said recruitment will be 'mostly loans'. They know exactly what they have t play with.

Going with loans means if we get relegated we haven't got the millstone of long, big money player contracts round our neck.

A takeover could change things, obviously, but although I fully expect we'll have new owners by the end of this year, given the way these things drag on, I think it is highly unlikely that this is completed before the end of the summer transfer window

 

[robbiez666]

That's an interesting perspective but the rate of a player's decline comes into it.

My response would be to question whether it's player decline or the fact he played every minute of every game and had the best stats in the league? He's 32. It may have just been fatigue? He was good yesterday. Seems back to form after a rest. There wasn't much between him and Doyle yesterday.

I don't think he's a nailed on first teamer next season but I'd be surprised if he didn't feature in most games.

 

[Stu_Blade]

His reps have apparently rejected the invitation to even start to discuss terms..
The amount you propose would fall way short on what's needed to even get them to the negotiating table

If that is genuinely the case we have to think about who we really are and I wouldn't be afraid to sell and say the reason to the media. I wouldn't want bad blood between him and us but we have to be realistic, he isn't a proven Premier League player. If we shifted him for £20million we could easily bring in a player with a similar position with European top division experience. It would be disappointing to lose him but I wouldn't think twice about it if cash was on the table.

 

[Mouth of the South]

If that is genuinely the case we have to think about who we really are and I wouldn't be afraid to sell and say the reason to the media. I wouldn't want bad blood between him and us but we have to be realistic, he isn't a proven Premier League player. If we shifted him for £20million we could easily bring in a player with a similar position with European top division experience. It would be disappointing to lose him but I wouldn't think twice about it if cash was on the table.

It's important to consider both transfer fee (amortised across the duration of the contract) and salary (including the myriad of bonuses), as well as the fact that any fees received by Utd for Ndiaye is likely to be structured over several years.
I'm not sure there'll be many proven top level strikers available for the sort of amount and willing to join Utd as you suggest.
If they're out of contract, they'll seek a large sign-on bonus - potentially what Ndiaye's reps have in their sight for the season after next.

 

[Blademan18891889]

My opinion is wes, baldock, bogle anel,Egan, rnd, sander and ndiaye, Mcburnie hopefully are the only 9 players that consistently get in our squard next season. Out of those 8, wes needs to be back up goalkeeper and Mcburnie most likely not a guaranteed starter. So I'd say a new goalie 100% (loan). Rb were ok, bash as cover, maybe robbo as cover with a new deal but a new centre half is a must. Left back rnd with Lowe as cover, don't think any need to spend money in that spot. Thankyou enda but goodbye. The the midfield is where the big overhaul is needed through permanent signings and loans. Maybe try and work bogle into a midfielder. But fleck, Norwood, osborn thankyou and goodbye. Obviously a new striker is a must and maybe jebbo can go forward in his career too. Billy thankyou and goodbye. Now I understand this leaves a small squad but the right signings can build towards a good future rather than just thinking of staying up for one year. Clear the wages of Davies, enda, joc, osborn, fleck, Norwood, Billy. There's no point keeping any of those at all imo.

 

[robbiez666]

The first thing I would be doing is offering a 2 year deal at £4million a season. In theory a max of £8million paid for a £30mill player and if we do go down at the end of season one, can cash in

I genuinely don't think he cares about money. If reports are true, he earns a lot less than the rest of the first team squad at the moment. If money was a driver he could have joined Everton on someone else. In fairness, if he simply wants to move up in the world, going to somewhere like Villa/Palace/Brighton/West Ham makes sense. To a team where he can break into the first team but one with a number of similarly talented players around him. I suspect he'll move if a good offer comes in and stay if it doesn't. I don't think for one second he'll sign a new contract which extends his stay here. He'd be foolish to do so, imo.

There is a slight danger for him in this approach. Picking up an injury or a plummet in form.

 

[Stu_Blade]

I genuinely don't think he cares about money. If reports are true, he earns a lot less than the rest of the first team squad at the moment. If money was a driver he could have joined Everton on someone else. In fairness, if he simply wants to move up in the world, going to somewhere like Villa/Palace/Brighton/West Ham makes sense. To a team where he can break into the first team but one with a number of similarly talented players around him. I suspect he'll move if a good offer comes in and stay if it doesn't. I don't think for one second he'll sign a new contract which extends his stay here. He'd be foolish to do so, imo.

There is a slight danger for him in this approach. Picking up an injury or a plummet in form.

For me those 4 are one bad season off a relegation and financial ruin. To improve he needs to be looking at European football realistically that sits with some of the bigger boys. It is up to him in some ways but also us in others, does he want to stay yes or no if the answer is no then move him on this season. If the answer is yes he needs to sign a new deal £8million risk isn't the worst thing in the world compared to what we out layed on Brewster in fees and wages.

 

[robbiez666]

For me those 4 are one bad season off a relegation and financial ruin. To improve he needs to be looking at European football realistically that sits with some of the bigger boys. It is up to him in some ways but also us in others, does he want to stay yes or no if the answer is no then move him on this season. If the answer is yes he needs to sign a new deal £8million risk isn't the worst thing in the world compared to what we out layed on Brewster in fees and wages.

I'm confused. How are Brighton (8th with games in hand), West Ham (who seem to be in a European semi final or Villa (6th_ a bad bet to sign for? Palace are more iffy but they tend to sign Illy types of player.

but he should sign for a team which will be favourite or second favourite for relegation for half the money he'd get elsewhere?

 

[buddy]

My response would be to question whether it's player decline or the fact he played every minute of every game and had the best stats in the league? He's 32. It may have just been fatigue? He was good yesterday. Seems back to form after a rest. There wasn't much between him and Doyle yesterday.

I don't think he's a nailed on first teamer next season but I'd be surprised if he didn't feature in most games.

If Norwood starts games regularly next season then we are in trouble , agree he could be useful coming on if we are short and he gets some form back. The difference between Doyle and him is like the difference between night and day to me, one is always positive , winning tackles and headers all over the pitch and usually driving us forward or having a crack on goal , the other is Olly . You could be right about the fatigue aspect ,but not about the stats , which can be made to say anything , 20x10 yard back passes and 2 or three hollywoods achieves not much to me . As i say i hope he comes back strong , but if we still have him , Berge and one other in midfield ……

 

[robbiez666]

If Norwood starts games regularly next season then we are in trouble , agree he could be useful coming on if we are short and he gets some form back. The difference between Doyle and him is like the difference between night and day to me, one is always positive , winning tackles and headers all over the pitch and usually driving us forward or having a crack on goal , the other is Olly . You could be right about the fatigue aspect ,but not about the stats , which can be made to say anything , 20x10 yard back passes and 2 or three hollywoods achieves not much to me . As i say i hope he comes back strong , but if we still have him , Berge and one other in midfield ……

I would say that we'll probably need more of former and less of the latter in terms of the way games will go in the top flight, but yes.

The only issue with Norwood on the bench is that he seems to struggle to get up to the pace of a game. It's when we often see the horror tackles.

 

[bigbirdblade]

Keep, basham, Norwood, fleck, Stevens and Osborn on maybe year deals as squad players. Sharp becomes a player/coach, on pay as you play wages, O Connell the same or loan out for a year to get fitness back and see from there.

 

[Weasel]

Norwood is another who should now have run his race with us. Been great for us, but we ain't a charity and he along with a few others out of contract should be moved on. We should be very selective about who we give offers to if they are now OOC. By all means don't go silly with outlay for incoming singings and by a means have use all our loan slots, butets try and move on their who have run their race with us. Freshen things up and start building a younger squad with potential and talent.