If Ched a waste of money?

All advertisments are hidden for logged in members, why not log in/register?

I'll go full on poker mode here and say that every decision is a gamble; there are few certainties in life. You can spend big money on a top player and have them crash their car on the way to the training ground.

Spend a million and get another Ebbrell. All the planning in the world won't stop another Dane Whitehouse from happening (not that he was a financial gamble, but an example of how things can go so badly).

Success doesn't come from predicting the future. It comes from the aggregate of all the chance decisions you take, and if you take enough good ones the probability of success increases. Now, I assume we all remember our Bastiat, so there's two costs to consider: the price of Ched, and the opportunity cost.

On the first, papers have speculated wildly, but I'm inclined given circumstance to believe the lower end of it. It's most likely somewhere between 150k and 500k with the higher side probably on add-ons. If you put this in the context of Wednesday's signing of Rhodes, or Wolves' supposed £15m bids, this is approximately fuck all in the Championship. Ignoring wages for a moment, you could effectively sign twenty Evanses and only one needs to bottle a penalty in a semi-final to equal signing one Rhodes. Seems like a fair shot on those odds.

Secondly, we have the opportunity cost i.e. what fantastic players we could have signed for 500k instead of Evans, and whether the wages of Evans will prevent us from securing other players. Again, since the actual cost of Evans is apparently relatively low, and we've signed other players since, and the manager insists we have funds to acquire even more, there doesn't seem to be much of an opportunity cost here. It's unlikely that there are many top Championship strikers available for similar or less money that we now won't be able to acquire.

The point isn't that if Ched fails to recover the talent he once had then he was a bad signing. The point is that for a very low cost we've got the chance at a player we once gladly spent £3m on. In those terms, cost vs. potential reward, I don't see how Evans is a bad deal. It's quite possible that even if Ched is more likely to fail than succeed that he's still a very good choice.

The question to ask should be "Will we be relying on Evans success to keep us in the Championship?". Then we have some valid concerns, because the last thing I want is for us to start the season needing a player who has a significant chance of failure to do well. But we have other strikers. And possibly, according to Wilder, another to come. I won't mind if Evans doesn't recover his form or ever feature much in the side as long as we properly prepare for that outcome. I'd obviously be happier if he netted 15+ next season, but as long as the team as a whole is where we want it to be I'll be repeating my mantra about proper decision making.

Look at last season. Hussey didn't pay off. Lavery didn't feature as much as we hoped. Clarke had a poor start and missed a lot of the season through injury. But the aggregate of Wilder's decisions landed us with the form of Fleck, Lafferty, Moore, Wright, EEL, O'Connell, and Duffy that spent most of the season marching towards a hundred points.

I don't give a shit about Hussey being a waste of money in retrospect. I care about Wilder having made far more good decisions than bad. Ched will be the same.
 



So you just conveniently ignore the season where he was unplayable scoring 35 goals ,and even the season before he was our top scorer ,did that simply not happen in your world. Did you not go that season ,did you not see a class footballer ?

He was class between November and May of that final season in a lower division than one we are in now. So yes class IS permanent and form IS temporary. Which one is it with him? Realistically evidence would suggest the latter ... I hope I am wrong
 
We needed a new striker this summer to partner Billy up front and sadly Ched wasn't it.

I wasn't convinced in the first place about us signing him due to his goals to games record at this level but if he's also going to be getting reoccurring injury problems on top of this then i have to say he'll be a waste of a wage.
 
He was class between November and May of that final season in a lower division than one we are in now. So yes class IS permanent and form IS temporary. Which one is it with him? Realistically evidence would suggest the latter ... I hope I am wrong

Decent reply that, that's the big question, just how good can Evans be?

Agree his career with us was unusual.
OK but underwhelming (not worth the big transfer fee and slary) for the 1st 2 years of his 3 year contract
Then in his final year he just gets better and better, tearing the league apart and playing like a superstar towards the end
What a surprise? He just timed it right as his contract was up for re-negotiations, you can bet he'd have wanted big money.
In fact I reckon a PL club would have wanted him and we'd have sold him for a big fee.
 
He might be a waste of money, he might not. But so what? It is impossible not to 'waste' money in football. No manager alive or dead has a 100% success rate in recruitment.
As Poker has said, you take risks with every decision you make and the key is to get most of them right.
 
IMO, we didn't pay anything for Ched. I believe that when Chesterfield needed a cash injection to survive, United were the source of that money (circa £200K I believe) and that it was agreed then that we would get Ched instead of a repayment of that money. I may ne way off the mark........but I might be bang on. All speculation of course.......absolutely no ITK.

Even if that was anything resembling the truth, he'd have cost £200k in that situation no?
 
Even if that was anything resembling the truth, he'd have cost £200k in that situation no?

I'd say a £200K gamble on someone potentially worth £10 million seems a worthwhile gamble.
Agree the odds on him getting to that level are long odds
But for a club in the Championship £200K isn't a massive amount to lose.

Reminds me of a potential Daniel Sturridge transfer.
At his best Sturridge is worth over £50 million but he always seems to have mysterious injuries and rarely plays.
So anyone buying Sturridge should make the transfer fee and salary performance related.
According to Wilder the package offered to Ched is mainly performance related so it's a relatively low financial risk for us.
 
Based on the more reliable cost information he's surely a low risk gamble in football terms.

My own opinion is that I doubt he'll come close to recapturing the form of 6 years ago. He needs patience to see if he can get there however.

Those utterly obsessed by him do him no favours imho constantly talking him up as though it's a given that he'll tear the league up.
 
We needed a new striker this summer to partner Billy up front and sadly Ched wasn't it.

I wasn't convinced in the first place about us signing him due to his goals to games record at this level but if he's also going to be getting reoccurring injury problems on top of this then i have to say he'll be a waste of a wage.
He`ll be delighted to know that you have written him off before he has even taken part in a competitive game !
 
Probably one of the most ridiculous posts Ive read on here ,and that takes something.
Do you really think so?
I think it hit the mark on a couple of areas.
Which signing so far has improved us significantly in any area apart from maybe depth of squad?
I'm hoping some of these lesser lights have done exactly that but you can't know that with any certainty right now.
Personally I thought we needed strengthening in all positions, and significantly in defence and up front. I've not seen anyone coming in who makes me sure we've hugely stepped forward in either position.
Evans can only have been seen as a shot for nothing, or a small gamble worth taking, but if he doesn't end up playing any major part this season, it's a viable point.

The OP was a bit knee jerk given where we are in the season but I don't think the post you quoted was at all ridiculous and without a few points worthy of debate.
 



Let's see how he does after the season has actually started before writing him off. These could just be minor niggles and it's more down to our medics and physios not wanting to risk his progress than him not being fit to play.

I'll make my own judgment maybe 2 or 3 months into the season by which time hopefully he's scored a few and hit the winner at the Sty.
 
Didn't fair too badly at Norwich?
Just out of interest how many years ago was that?

Since then he had a season with us at that level and didn't do a great deal, he's had one fantastic season at League 1 level, he then went to prison and spent a few years out of the game and then when a club finally had the balls to give the lad a chance, he had an injury blighted season at Chesterfield and didn't do a great deal there.

I think some people are letting one fantastic season at League 1 level cloud there views of Ched and look at this signing for what it is and that is a gamble with very little evidence that it will pay off.

I would LOVE IT if Ched goes out, bangs in 20 goals next season and proves me wrong but sadly I can't see him getting double figures.

I'm still of the opinion we need a new regular partner for Billy up front.
 
Just out of interest how many years ago was that?

Since then he had a season with us at that level and didn't do a great deal, he's had one fantastic season at League 1 level, he then went to prison and spent a few years out of the game and then when a club finally had the balls to give the lad a chance, he had an injury blighted season at Chesterfield and didn't do a great deal there.

I think some people are letting one fantastic season at League 1 level cloud there views of Ched and look at this signing for what it is and that is a gamble with very little evidence that it will pay off.

I would LOVE IT if Ched goes out, bangs in 20 goals next season and proves me wrong but sadly I can't see him getting double figures.

I'm still of the opinion we need a new regular partner for Billy up front.


Just read the first line and skipped the rest....

How long was it ago that you're basing his record for us at that level?! 1 year sooner?
 
I'd say a £200K gamble on someone potentially worth £10 million seems a worthwhile gamble.
Agree the odds on him getting to that level are long odds
But for a club in the Championship £200K isn't a massive amount to lose.

Reminds me of a potential Daniel Sturridge transfer.
At his best Sturridge is worth over £50 million but he always seems to have mysterious injuries and rarely plays.
So anyone buying Sturridge should make the transfer fee and salary performance related.
According to Wilder the package offered to Ched is mainly performance related so it's a relatively low financial risk for us.

Not disputing that. The original poster said along the lines of 'I think Ched cost us nothing, we gave Chezzy £200k and they gave us the player' which just sounds to me like he cost 200k in that scenario :)
 
The thing is, we're going into a tough division where teams are splurging £17million on quality.

I don't feel like we've got the breathing space to 'give someone a break' and wait till October/November.
I agree with u, everyone got pissed off when James wa
How's about "form is temporary, class is permanent"?

If he can get properly fit, he will come good and he will do a job for us.
he did fuck all in the championship before for us
 
And whilst on the subject....I don't think a 'Partner for Billy' is what we need at all. Granted he'll start a fair few games, but I don't think he's as much of a shoe in as some seem to think.
 
We're just clearing the decks before the annual drop Billy Sharp mega thread.
It's inevitable for two reasons.
1.) Those who never rated him will look for it.
2.) I genuinely think he's going struggle at this level to maintain a goal scoring average which would prevent 1.).
 
not many had him on their first XI for the start of the season. Most went with Sharp & Clarke/Lavery.

If it takes him to October to get back to fitness that still gives him 8 months of the season to make an impact.

July is way too early to make a judgement on how good/bad a signing he is. Like many have said, he has the quality he just needs time after having so long off.

Baldock was out injured last night, why aren't people moaning about him being a waste of money?
Because that's one Achilles injury which is mainly caused by a collision tackle or an over extension. Not just pulled muscles. Plus baldock is much younger, and has just come off of a full season playing, not a stop start season
 
The fee was nowhere near the amount you stated.

I note you failed to specify who you would have preferred the club to buy instead - please enlighten us.

Regardless of how much he cost, did you also write off Clarke last season while he suffered from injuries?
I wrote Of Clarke, I think a lot of people did. He only started scoring once the job had virtually been done and only needed a point for promotion. And there's plenty of kids we could have got, we could have easily got devante Cole whose only in hit early 20,s. And he would have been less of a risk, you can train up a young lad. But everyone saying on here, wilder turns players around, fair enough if he does but we will get one season out of Evans
 
Just read the first line and skipped the rest....

How long was it ago that you're basing his record for us at that level?! 1 year sooner?

It was the last time he played football at Championship level mate, that's what I'm basing it on as well the amount of time he has spent out of the game and his rather disappointing spell at Chesterfield last season.
 
So you just conveniently ignore the season where he was unplayable scoring 35 goals ,and even the season before he was our top scorer ,did that simply not happen in your world. Did you not go that season ,did you not see a class footballer ?
So you just choose to ignore where he says, the first of his two seasons with us, in championship he was shit.

Moron!
 
I would also add that whilst at Norwich, Ched was averaging a goal every 3 games which is ok but not fantastic.

Fast forward all these years later and look what he's had to go through in that period and I think it's naive to think he'll pick up where he left off at Norwich.
 



All advertisments are hidden for logged in members, why not log in/register?

All advertisments are hidden for logged in members, why not log in/register?

Back
Top Bottom