Chappell

[sheffielder]

I would suggest that the players that have maintained a team around the top of the third division are better players that someone who could not get in that team and who (despite only being 21) wasn't seen as someone fit to play 90 minutes in a team at the bottom of the 4th division.

Of course, I am not saying our current first teamers are world beaters - far from it - just that Chappell is obviously not as good as them.

It's not a fair comparison. Kitson, Doyle, McDonald, Collins, Robson etc would have to have had broken legs for Wilson to drop them. Even though it's only Torquay, Chapps might have had to fight to get in the team

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

Indeed, as I say, I can see the logic of Morgan wanting all hands on deck and hence recalling Chappell, but the guy's career up to the relatively advanced age of 21 does not inspire one with confidence in his abilities.

A bit like Lowton's then

 

[sheffielder]

I just hope everyone gets a clean slate and Morgan picks the team on merit. That is all I ask and something I don't think we ever got from Danny

 

[Darren]

A bit like Lowton's then

Exception proving the rule and all that

And to be fair, Lowton did stand out in the 3rd Division. Chappell can't get a game in the 3rd Division.

 

[secretchief]

If he picks Chappell it gives him the opportunity for the most straightforward instructions possible: go out and get crosses into the box. Nothing else matters.

 

[Darren]

It's not a fair comparison. Kitson, Doyle, McDonald, Collins, Robson etc would have to have had broken legs for Wilson to drop them. Even though it's only Torquay, Chapps might have had to fight to get in the team

Eh?

So you reckon a player who struggled to play 90 minutes in a struggling 4th division team, would have maintained a place in a top of the table 3rd division team if only Wilson wasn't biased towards his pet players?

 

[Flatulent_Bob]

5 games games since he went there in March.

Not to be nick-picky but its 6 and the reason that's relevant is because that's every game since he joined them.

Do I expect him to be the answer to our goal drought? No but he's an option we don't currently have on the bench, plus I think Murphy may be pushed upfront instead of 5 in midfield.

 

[sheffielder]

Eh?

So you reckon a player who struggled to play 90 minutes in a struggling 4th division team, would have maintained a place in a top of the table 3rd division team if only Wilson wasn't biased towards his pet players?

I am saying some of those players would struggle to get in Torquays team from their form this season, yes. Some teams make their players earn their spot

 

[sheffielder]

A bit like Lowton's then

Good catch Jim. How old was Lowton when he became a regular? 20/21?

 

[Selly]

A bit like Lowton's then

Ooof, game set and match there methinks...

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

Good catch Jim. How old was Lowton when he became a regular? 20/21?

Made his debut in the 09/10 season but yep, regular in the relegation season at 21.

 

[Selly]

Made his debut in the 09/10 season but yep, regular in the relegation season at 21.

Which just goes to show he's probably not good enough...

 

[S6Blade]

Are there a set of supporters in the country who dismiss players as being shit despite never seeing them play or is that particularly trait ours alone?

 

[Darren]

Are there a set of supporters in the country who dismiss players as being shit despite never seeing them play or is that particularly trait ours alone?

You've never seen me play, but I think you can take it - on the evidence of my total lack of a footballing career - that I would probably be shite if Morgan picked me tomorrow.

Ditto with Chappell (though at an obviously higher level) as he is 21 , been at United as a pro for 3 seasons and has never held down a first team place other than for 5 games at a team at the bottom of the 4th Division, its a fair assumption that he probably isn't good enough for the top of the 3rd division.

(Having checked I also note that he wasn't thought good enough to be more than a squad player at good 4th Division team Burton when he wsas on loan there earleir in the season: only one league appearance as sub in over a month there (though admittedly he scored on that one appearance))

 

[Pinchy]

I've seen Chappell play. He's not very good. His lack of progress in his career confirms that.

 

[S6Blade]

I dare say you wouldn’t be much worse than our illustrious captain.

He’s been at United for 3 seasons and during which a combination of us having superior players for his position and managers with questionable abilities on judging players limited his opportunities. Obviously that’s my opinion.

So he’s not received rave reviews whilst being out on loan. I don’t recall messrs Naughton and Walker being lauded as the next big things whilst they were out on loan either. Of course I could be wrong on this.

All I’m saying is give him a chance. If he’s rubbish and worse than our ever present dross out on the wings then we can go back to watching Flynn, Murphy and Robson not taking on their full backs and not getting decent crosses in.

 

[mattbianco1]

Neither did Blackwell, Speed or Adams Thats 4 managers who didn't rate him.

Tad harsh Darren..

He was never going to break into the squad under Blackwell, Speed & Adams.. It is well documented how superior that squad was to the one we have now

 

[mattbianco1]

I've seen Chappell play. He's not very good. His lack of progress in his career confirms that.

As stated above. Everybody thought Lowton would never amount to anything as he didn't break into the team until 21.

I will clap and clap for United and defend Danny Wilson but my biggest gripe with DW was that he didn't give youth a proper chance.

People whinge when he plays old ageing players: Kitson, Robson... even Doyle has been classed as old at the grand old age of 31.

Then,

People whinge when the new manager puts trust in youth.

 

[stannyblade]

Go for broke with the young uns now. At least we will know by the end of the season if theyre good enough

 

[Darren]

Tad harsh Darren..

He was never going to break into the squad under Blackwell, Speed & Adams.. It is well documented how superior that squad was to the one we have now

But then the managers of Torquay and Burton don't seem to rate him much either. That makes 6. Are they all wrong?

 

[broomhillblade]

A
I will clap and clap for United and defend Danny Wilson but my biggest gripe with DW was that he didn't give youth a proper chance.

Long... Maguire ... Ironside ... McFazdean... Westlake... Poleon (not one of ours, I know)...

Whitehouse could well have been in the side if he hadn't broken a metatarsal in a pre-season game.

 

[Pinchy]

As stated above. Everybody thought Lowton would never amount to anything as he didn't break into the team until 21.

I will clap and clap for United and defend Danny Wilson but my biggest gripe with DW was that he didn't give youth a proper chance.

People whinge when he plays old ageing players: Kitson, Robson... even Doyle has been classed as old at the grand old age of 31.

Then,

People whinge when the new manager puts trust in youth.

The problem is far too many of our fans have come to believe in youth for youth's sake. I prefer ability, regardless of age. Chappell could be 18 or 80 for all I care. I've seen him play on a number of occasions and have yet to see him impress in any way. Poor 35 year old footballers used to be poor 18 year old fooballers and then poor 25 year old footballers. The recall of Chappell will not make any more or less difference than the recall of Cressswell would [i.e. none whatsoever] yet the fan's perception varies solely because one is young and not good enough and the other is Cresswell.

 

[mattbianco1]

The problem is far too many of our fans have come to believe in youth for youth's sake. I prefer ability, regardless of age. Chappell could be 18 or 80 for all I care. I've seen him play on a number of occasions and have yet to see him impress in any way. Poor 35 year old footballers used to be poor 18 year old fooballers and then poor 25 year old footballers. The recall of Chappell will not make any more or less difference than the recall of Cressswell would [i.e. none whatsoever] yet the fan's perception varies solely because one is young and not good enough and the other is Cresswell.

I don't claim to go to reserve games because I don't go to them so maybe you are better suited to comment. However, he played well vs. Notts County in the JPT. That is the only time i've seen him start.

 

[mattbianco1]

But then the managers of Torquay and Burton don't seem to rate him much either. That makes 6. Are they all wrong?

Have they said that then? Especially the Torquay one. Thought we recalled him? Plus, I thought he played all Torquays games during his loan spell?

 

[Pinchy]

Are there a set of supporters in the country who dismiss players as being shit despite never seeing them play or is that particularly trait ours alone?

Our supporters have any number of traits, the common factor being stupidity:

1. We should recruit and select only young players, regardless of ability.
2. Players who are not being selected for the first team just get better and better, simply by virtue of not playing.
3. Any player we sell or otherwise get rid of was/is a worldbeater, however crap they were for us. We should constantly strive to bring such players back to the club.
4. If we haven't scored within 15 minutes, it's time for a substitution.
5. Players are much, much better when sitting on the bench.
6. Managers and coaches should be selected solely and strictly by reference to whether they have played for or managed us previously.
7. The worst, most anachronistic, most embarrassing of all: We ❤ Hoof.

 

[Pinchy]

I don't claim to go to reserve games because I don't go to them so maybe you are better suited to comment. However, he played well vs. Notts County in the JPT. That is the only time i've seen him start.

No he didn't! He was rubbish. He made no meaningful contribution whatsoever. What did he do to justify the description "played well" apart from being quite young?

 

[mattbianco1]

Long... Maguire ... Ironside ... McFazdean... Westlake... Poleon (not one of ours, I know)...

Whitehouse could well have been in the side if he hadn't broken a metatarsal in a pre-season game.

Ok..

Long - Forced. If Howard hadn't gotten injured, he wouldn't have played.
Maguire - Already an established fixture in the side when DW came.

Ironside/McFadzean - Null and Void... Both of these haven't been given the chances they both deserve. They have come on for ten mins here and ten mins there these should've been given game time earlier in the season when we were 2 or 3 up against certain teams.

• Colchester at Home for example went 2 up with about 15mins to go. Brings De Girolamo on with about a minute to go.
• Oldham away, Ironside on in last minute.
• Oxford in FA Cup, Port Vale in FA Cup.. these are the games they should've been given the chance in and neither got on the pitch.

Westlake - McMahon is currently suspended but he's playing a LB at RB. That's not giving Westlake a chance.

Poleon - As you've stated not ours but why sign him when we already have our own youth players for these positions?

 

[DazBlade88]

Long... Maguire ... Ironside ... McFazdean... Westlake... Poleon (not one of ours, I know)...

Whitehouse could well have been in the side if he hadn't broken a metatarsal in a pre-season game.

Maguire was already established in the first team to be fair, and his hand was forced with Long because he tried everything to get a keeper in before he gave him a chance.

Stats taken from SKY, so may be wrong...

Ironside - 0 starts, 12 sub appearances
McFadzean - 2 starts, 6 sub appearances
Westlake - 10 starts, 2 sub appearances (67 league appearances for Walsall previously) and we were playing two players out of position instead of him in his natural position
Whitehouse - 1 start, 1 sub appearance.

So that's 34 appearances between 4 players in league and cup, and I'd bet the minutes on the pitch are very low. Westlake has plenty of experience at this level too.

I'm not saying they are the answer, but I don't think they've been given a real chance to impress like Maguire was in the relegation season and Long when Howard got injured.

 

[DazBlade88]

mattbianco1 just beat me!

I just don't see how the likes of Whitehouse and McFadzean could have done less than what Robson has done so far. It would have cost us far less money too...

 

[sheffielder]

I am pretty sure McFadzean hasn't started this season. He's not old enough, needs to be at least 30.

EDIT - or should I now say, he NEEDED to be at least 30.