Archer buyback fee

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Weasel said:
As I understand it, Archer will go back in the summer (1 July) as the terms of the deal under which we 'bought' him from Villa states that in the event of our relegation then Villa will buy him back off us for 3 quarters of the original transfer fee. So, the accounts (for FFP purposes) will show that we paid £18m for the lad last summer, and also show that we sold the lad back to them this summer for £13.5m. In reality, we have paid single instalment of £4.5m for his services plus whatever his wages were.

I can see why some would think it was a bit of a waste of money, but when you consider that we spent £4m on Traore and £2m each on Garbage and Slimane, then a £4.5m fee for a half decent forward from the championship with a get out clause if it went tits up, wasn't as bad a deal as some make it out to be (when you consider just how much some players get transferred for in the PL anyway). It was a punt on him helping us stay up or even finish higher up the league in final placings, but in truth, it was never going to be enough as we didn't strengthen other areas. Its like we toyed with the idea of looking like we wanted to stay up, but in all honesty we were as good as down from last August.
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absolutely spot on weasel archer never stood a chance of scoring goals by us not spending on areas to create the chances for him i for one would love us to get him back on loan for the championship campaign where were certain to have lots more possesion therefore creating more chances for our strikers archer would get 25 plus with better service do however think he needs a physical type forward alongside him in a front 2 think kiefer moore would be an ideal partner for him if we cant get bbd back on loan
 

Just had a thought, probably should keep it to myself, but here goes. Villa will probably be in The Champions League next season and will need better strikers than Archer if they want to compete in the Premier League and a higher level in Europe than this season. I don't think Archer will make the Villa squad and will be let go. If this is the case, I'm thinking Villa are looking right now to see what they can get for him over the 14mil they would have to give us. If no one is willing to cough up more, I think he'll be with us next year. It would make no sense to give us 14mil and then sell him for less. Maybe I'm way off, but just a thought.
 
BobblesBlade said:
Our tactic stifled him much like it has for all our strikers.

What we need is a new manager with better tactics that want to score goals.

Archer we keep if a new manager comes in.
Sell him if wilder stays.
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Would that be out tactic of always gifting the ball back to the opposition?! 😉
 
Alex Cheeseright said:
Just had a thought, probably should keep it to myself, but here goes. Villa will probably be in The Champions League next season and will need better strikers than Archer if they want to compete in the Premier League and a higher level in Europe than this season. I don't think Archer will make the Villa squad and will be let go. If this is the case, I'm thinking Villa are looking right now to see what they can get for him over the 14mil they would have to give us. If no one is willing to cough up more, I think he'll be with us next year. It would make no sense to give us 14mil and then sell him for less. Maybe I'm way off, but just a thought.
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They aren’t giving us £14m though, we’ve given them somewhere between £4m and £5m to develop (or ruin?!) a player for a year on their behalf.

They can take him back and loan him out. If he does well then they either keep him or get a decent amount for him the following summer, if he doesn’t then they get less for him or keep him and loan him out again.

If they want the cash for FFP then they just sell him for whatever they can get this summer, but the £14m is irrelevant as they were never going to realise any more than 25% of the fee under their agreement with us as it was a dodgy loan deal dressed as a transfer to avoid FFP for them!
 
Just seen that villa are wanting the Premier league to increase the PSR to the maximum limit of permitted loses for its final season. Wonder even without archer deal they are close to breaching it
 
Alex Cheeseright said:
Just had a thought, probably should keep it to myself, but here goes. Villa will probably be in The Champions League next season and will need better strikers than Archer if they want to compete in the Premier League and a higher level in Europe than this season. I don't think Archer will make the Villa squad and will be let go. If this is the case, I'm thinking Villa are looking right now to see what they can get for him over the 14mil they would have to give us. If no one is willing to cough up more, I think he'll be with us next year. It would make no sense to give us 14mil and then sell him for less. Maybe I'm way off, but just a thought.
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We all know it was a loan in everything but name. Villa structured the deal this way to help themselves out with FFP. It may backfire on them a little though as technically they will be buying him from us, and I seem to recall that you cannot buy a player and them sell him again in the same window. If he doesn't make their 25 man squad (he won't!) they'll need to loan him out somewhere or make him play in the reserves - neither of which will help them with FFP for this year. I'm sure there's a deal to be had if he wants to stay with us. Trouble is he's never looked like wanted to be here this season, and I'm not sure Wilder rates him that highly either.
 
Silent Blade said:
Yes he is our permanent player until Villa buy him back this summer. Don't know how much of the £4.5m we get back. Don't think Darren knows.
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Get the guy from Villa back on?

Everyone is wrong apart from your pal.
 
No one is surprised are they?

£4.5m on a loan fee.

Fantastic business blades. No resale value and we no doubt paid his wages too. Incredible.
 
Balti Pie said:
We all know it was a loan in everything but name. Villa structured the deal this way to help themselves out with FFP. It may backfire on them a little though as technically they will be buying him from us, and I seem to recall that you cannot buy a player and them sell him again in the same window. If he doesn't make their 25 man squad (he won't!) they'll need to loan him out somewhere or make him play in the reserves - neither of which will help them with FFP for this year. I'm sure there's a deal to be had if he wants to stay with us. Trouble is he's never looked like wanted to be here this season, and I'm not sure Wilder rates him that highly either.
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If a deal can be done and we get him on a cheap loan to help them out ,I don't think Wilder would object to having him in the squad.
 
Who else were we going to get at that price ??

We took a gamble, even if we took the cheapest gamble we could have taken in trying to stay up with all the players we brought in we need to be realistic

We took a gamble from our most realistic market that most fans wanted to shop in when they realised we had no money, the championship where he had shown what he could do

If we had just spent the whole 18 million on him without the buy back people would be even more pissed

I get the negativity totally but if we all honest it was highly likely we would still be heading down if we had brought in Worral, the keeper from Rotherham, Doyle and some championship striker we over paid on and we still would have no guarantees of getting up again
 
Houston_Blade said:
They aren’t giving us £14m though, we’ve given them somewhere between £4m and £5m to develop (or ruin?!) a player for a year on their behalf.

They can take him back and loan him out. If he does well then they either keep him or get a decent amount for him the following summer, if he doesn’t then they get less for him or keep him and loan him out again.

If they want the cash for FFP then they just sell him for whatever they can get this summer, but the £14m is irrelevant as they were never going to realise any more than 25% of the fee under their agreement with us as it was a dodgy loan deal dressed as a transfer to avoid FFP for them!
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We certainly work harder not smarter when it comes to transfer deal. Thanks for the feed back though....time will tell I guess how bad a deal this was.
 
Berkshire Blade said:
BBD with resale/championship ability on a free..granted he may have picked Spain anyway but he's miles better for our side than Archer
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With hindsight BBD would have been one of the best if not best signing ever wouldn’t it if he had been this consistent all season

I think we might have even left ourselves a chance but overall I think we still would have ended up going down

But yes miles better but I doubt he even considers us
 
Just seen someone say Doyle loan fee to wolves is 4.3m, sounds about right in todays market that a years service of a young prospect talent will cost you around 5m per year considering they could cost 25m and go for a free at the end like Mcburnie and Brewster.
 
Berkshire Blade said:
Zero. We just don't pay further installments according to him.

If true it's not been a good deal for us!
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It was a gamble.
We couldn't have got another player of his standard for £4.5m, so I understand the reasons behind it.

If our defence had done its job properly, we might be going into these last 3 games with something to play for.

I'm more pissed off with the money spent on Benie Traore. He's awful.
 

finlaytheblade said:
He goes back to villa that's the deal , no reason he can't come back next season on loan if both parties and Archer wants to come back.
No way will we pay anything like 10million + for a player this window,I think that's obvious with the chat coming from United.
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Not only will we not pay the £9m owing , we desperately need the refund of whatever bit of the initial £9m we can get
 
Keen Blade said:
Not only will we not pay the £9m owing , we desperately need the refund of whatever bit of the initial £9m we can get
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Reports say we have paid one payment down. The others will not be paid now.

Why do some think we are due money from that?
 
ancientblade said:
absolutely spot on weasel archer never stood a chance of scoring goals by us not spending on areas to create the chances for him i for one would love us to get him back on loan for the championship campaign where were certain to have lots more possesion therefore creating more chances for our strikers archer would get 25 plus with better service do however think he needs a physical type forward alongside him in a front 2 think kiefer moore would be an ideal partner for him if we cant get bbd back on loan
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Was always a misconceived signing without a strong partner like Akpom.
We are so inept at recruitment, it's like we just haven't seen the player before signing him
 
Balti Pie said:
We all know it was a loan in everything but name. Villa structured the deal this way to help themselves out with FFP. It may backfire on them a little though as technically they will be buying him from us, and I seem to recall that you cannot buy a player and them sell him again in the same window. If he doesn't make their 25 man squad (he won't!) they'll need to loan him out somewhere or make him play in the reserves - neither of which will help them with FFP for this year. I'm sure there's a deal to be had if he wants to stay with us. Trouble is he's never looked like wanted to be here this season, and I'm not sure Wilder rates him that highly either.
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Once the writing was on the wall , he clearly stopped giving a fuck
 
Like I said. Villa will get rid asap. But has he warranted anyone paying him more than we gave them?
 
Weasel said:
It was a punt on him helping us stay up or even finish higher up the league in final placings, but in truth, it was never going to be enough as we didn't strengthen other areas. Its like we toyed with the idea of looking like we wanted to stay up, but in all honesty we were as good as down from last August.
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This, this and thrice this. We never stood a chance. The Archer deal could've worked really well. However, now it looks exactly like what I thought it was at the time - The Prince and board playing at showing some ambition, doing the bare minimum, papering over the cracks.
 
Our two liveliest strikers were never truly in reach. We could only effectively plan Archer, and we had to wait til January for BBD to be out of form to bag a loan. We've looked way off the standard and even still, we were also way off buying two of our better players.
 

Keen Blade said:
Was always a misconceived signing without a strong partner like Akpom.
We are so inept at recruitment, it's like we just haven't seen the player before signing him
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I would guess the plan was to pair with McBurnie but obviously him not being fit for huge chunks of the season torpedoed that idea.
 
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