CONFIRMED Kacper Lopata leaves for Southend

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A sad business all round but it seems he was unhappy here - very short-sighted by him.
 

Rootshallbloke said:
True, but he could play Championship football with us some seasons from now, that would be ironic. We've had visits there in the past but kept getting nose bleeds.
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You saying that triggered something in my head as I forgot about you being in the championship. I was trying to remember the striker I associated with you, had to Google the squad. Freddie Eastwood, remember his name coming up a good bit on the results.
 
BladeInIreland said:
You saying that triggered something in my head as I forgot about you being in the championship. I was trying to remember the striker I associated with you, had to Google the squad. Freddie Eastwood, remember his name coming up a good bit on the results.
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Another one of our players from nowhere. Got him from Grays for free and he slotted a hat-trick on his debut. My abiding memory of Freddie (apart from his goal ability) was passing me at speed down a nearby country road one Sunday morning in his racing trap and horse. Fred was from our local traveller community.
 
bongleblade said:
What confuses me even more about the transfer is that if we did loan him and let his contract run down…

A) we’d have a year extension just like every other u23 player

B) we’d be a due a tribunal fee if he left for free (correct me if wrong)
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We’d have got naff all at tribunal he’s only been here 5 minutes in academy terms and I’m not sure a tribunal will allow the insertion of future clauses but I could be wrong on that front.

If we had a years extension I don’t think this situation arises as we’d have quite happily sent him out on loan so I’m not sure that’s the case.
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
I can't help. I don't know whether there's a transfer fee involved. I don't know whether there are sell ons. I think we can assume Southend wanted him. I think we can assume he wanted to go to Southend. I think that's how the dynamics work. Speaking out of turn - you have every right to feel angry if you want.

Did you rate him that highly?

Just one of those things that happen as far as I'm concerned.
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This really for me.

It's not ideal, but as near as I can tell there was a bit of a bus queue in front of him.

So I fully get what Silent Blade is saying, but loyalty to contracts is something of a dying art.

Maybe his career will get the kick-start it needs at Southend United. He's well liked there. We shall see....
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
Personally, I don't think there's a right or wrong. Some people see the club solely in terms of the first team & league position. Good luck. Me, personally, I see the club as more than that. As a structure, as a set of teams, one of the Carrier Bag Firm's sons is about to start in the Community Foundation strand of this wonderful club, playing in the "shadow academy" while he continues his education. Superb. No chance/ambition of playing in the First Team (or of signing for Southend).

Pompously, it's a football club, not a football team. But, I get that not everyone will see it that way.
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This, this and more this.

The academy isn't a conveyor belt, the players aren't products. They're individuals.

Love to see a lad from the academy making it in the first team, and we can all understand why academy graduates and development players are key to the club staying financially afloat but let's not loose sight that these are kids, playing football, wearing red and white: not possessions.

For the sake of the game, rich clubs should have to compensate smaller ones when poaching talent but that's not what's happened with Lopata. He's a kid who's taken a liking to a great club, and will be playing men's football: we don't have to earn money from the transaction for it to be a success, as the Sheff Utd finishing school has seemingly just helped another young man make a career in the game.
Lanakshear has also moved on this week, and we appear to have been reasonably well compensated. You win some, you loose some.

All the best to Kasper.
 
Silent Blade said:
If this trend continues, then it is a waste of time having an Academy
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A bit hysterical!
We got him on a free from Brighton.
Blades offered a new contract but he didn't want to sign it (should we have forced him somehow?????)
As a result we allowed him to go to Southend for a nominal fee and have arranged a sell-on clause with Southend.
I think you'll find in reality, we discard many more Academy prospects than ones that walk away.
In this case we've made the best of an unfortunate situation and no real harm done.
 
Harrisblade said:
A bit hysterical!
We got him on a free from Brighton.
Blades offered a new contract but he didn't want to sign it (should we have forced him somehow?????)
As a result we allowed him to go to Southend for a nominal fee and have arranged a sell-on clause with Southend.
I think you'll find in reality, we discard many more Academy prospects than ones that walk away.
In this case we've made the best of an unfortunate situation and no real harm done.
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I am fine with discarding Academy products but I am worried that there is a growing number who have refused the new contract we offered.
 

Silent Blade said:
I am fine with discarding Academy products but I am worried that there is a growing number who have refused the new contract we offered.
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Then, depending on the actual number of refuseniks, maybe someone outside of the club should take a look at the contract
 
EddieColquhoun said:
It has been reported our manager concluded he didn't want to be here. Why upset the applecart?
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Aye , Hecky knows him better than me , so I guess that in such a crucial season , we don't want any bad apples around.
The lad has done both himself & us no favours - I can't understand his attitude , just a little patience + he could have stayed + developed at a relatively big club ... And we'd have some useful defensive cover for our walking wounded.
I hope Kyron Gordon is ready coz an injury to any one of Baldock , Bash , Egan , RND or Anel will see him deployed and no defenders on the bench.
 
bertieblade said:
It is possible that we have included a clause which provides us with a sell on %age on all subsequent transfers
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It's not possible. How can that even be remotely possible?

Southend can't sell him and say - "oh by the way, if you sell him on, you owe United some money" 🤣
 
mattbianco1 said:
It's not possible. How can that even be remotely possible?

Southend can't sell him and say - "oh by the way, if you sell him on, you owe United some money" 🤣
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Theoretically possible - a contractual obligation to ensure that certain provisions are included in any future contract for sale… the future contract would need to expressly name SUFC as a third party entitled to benefit from the contract, otherwise we couldn’t enforce. If Southend failed to include it we could take action against them for breach of our contract.

No idea if such things exist in the football world, but not impossible from a legal perspective.
 
Teddy said:
Theoretically possible - a contractual obligation to ensure that certain provisions are included in any future contract for sale… the future contract would need to expressly name SUFC as a third party entitled to benefit from the contract, otherwise we couldn’t enforce. If Southend failed to include it we could take action against them for breach of our contract.

No idea if such things exist in the football world, but not impossible from a legal perspective.
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Are we not entering into 3rd party ownership stuff there?

Our contract is with Southend, it will stop when Southend move the player on
 
Silent Blade said:
Lopata has been a waste of time and I am sticking to this. I said IF there are more cases like Lopata then the Academy will be a waste of time
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There will be more cases. And cases of many more not making the grade.
Also there will also be gems found. That's what happens. Doesn't make the academy less vital in any way.
 
mattbianco1 said:
Are we not entering into 3rd party ownership stuff there?

Our contract is with Southend, it will stop when Southend move the player on
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You may well be right that it would fall foul of FIFA rules on third party ownership. I couldn’t be any less of an expert on that 😂. My point above works on a general legal/contractual level… maybe not for player contracts under FIFA jurisdiction though.
 
mattbianco1 said:
It's not possible. How can that even be remotely possible?

Southend can't sell him and say - "oh by the way, if you sell him on, you owe United some money" 🤣
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They can't but if they have a sell on clause then we could be due.

Say we sold for no fee but a 50% sell on clause.

They sell for 1,000,000 and we have a 50% clause then we get 500,000.

If they then insist on a sell on clause of their own of 50% and he then got sold for 10m, then Southend would be due 50% of the profit which would be 4,500,000. We would be due 2,250,000 because we are due 50% of any fee they receive from that player sale.

In principle of the next club sell him for more again then we will be due 50% of what Southend makes.
 
mattbianco1 said:
Are we not entering into 3rd party ownership stuff there?

Our contract is with Southend, it will stop when Southend move the player on
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The only possibility I could imagine would be that there is some type of sell-on clause which entitles us to a % of any and all future income Southend make from his transfers.

E.g.:
  • We sell him to Southend and include a 10% sell-on clause.
  • Southend sell him to Club A for £1m and include a 20% sell-on clause themselves. We get £100k from this transfer.
  • Club A sell him to Club B for £10m. Southend get £2m from their sell-on clause, of which we tale a cut of £200k from our 10% clause.
I have no idea if anything like this has ever been included in a contract before or if it would be enforceable.

Edit: what Champagneblade said.
 
Did we benefit from something like that when Maguire moved from Leicester to Man United for 80 million due to Hull having a sell on clause, or was it just a rumour on here?
 

Silent Blade said:
Lankshear was due to sign a pro contract when he turned 17 last April. It is obvious he held back. Looks like more than one.
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It depends on how you view the Academy.
If it produces a few to play in the main squad and a few to be sold, like these two, then I think that is a success for the Club.
Hopefully others will go on to have professional careers elsewhere or just play outside the professional arenas.
 
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