CONFIRMED Kacper Lopata leaves for Southend

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If he wasn't going to sign a new contract, then loaning him again was pointless. Better to get what we could for him, with hopefully a decent sell on. If he is moving to Sarfend then presumably he has not been tempted to go there for the money. Presumably, he wants to play, rather than be a squad player like Eastwood for example.

Silent Blade said:
It has been a waste of time having him with us
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You could say that about most of the Academy lads though (and several first teamers of recent vintage!). The majority of them will never play more than half a dozen games for us. For every Phil Jagielka, there are ten Colin Cryans.
 
Rochdaleblade said:
If he wasn't going to sign a new contract, then loaning him again was pointless. Better to get what we could for him, with hopefully a decent sell on. If he is moving to Sarfend then presumably he has not been tempted to go there for the money. Presumably, he wants to play, rather than be a squad player like Eastwood for example.


You could say that about most of the Academy lads though (and several first teamers of recent vintage!). The majority of them will never play more than half a dozen games for us. For every Phil Jagielka, there are ten Colin Cryans.
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I am saying that it is a waste of time having a player who didnt have the heart in aiming to play for our 1st team
 
Rochdaleblade said:
If he wasn't going to sign a new contract, then loaning him again was pointless. Better to get what we could for him, with hopefully a decent sell on. If he is moving to Sarfend then presumably he has not been tempted to go there for the money. Presumably, he wants to play, rather than be a squad player like Eastwood for example.


You could say that about most of the Academy lads though (and several first teamers of recent vintage!). The majority of them will never play more than half a dozen games for us. For every Phil Jagielka, there are ten Colin Cryans.
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Probably not really about the money (not everyone is a greedy mercenary)
It's probably that he enjoyed his time playing there and wants to be happy while re-starting his football career. GLTTL!
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
Have you got an agreed list of the players with that "heart"? Because that would be really helpful in the war against waste of time...
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He is under contract with the club and he knew what he was signing in 2019 and he should have honoured the contract. I dont think we are "messing him around", I think he lacks patience and wouldnt be surprised if he showed the same impatience at Bristol City and at Brighton. I think he has wasted our time.
 
Silent Blade said:
He is under contract with the club and he knew what he was signing in 2019 and he should have honoured the contract. I dont think we are "messing him around", I think he lacks patience and wouldnt be surprised if he showed the same impatience at Bristol City and at Brighton. I think he has wasted our time.
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Fuck me. Have a look at the players "we" have signed in the Transfer Window who were under contract to the clubs we signed them from and didn't fancy honouring those contracts.

Surely your scrapbooks are full of players who've been transferred while under contract.
 
Bergen Blade said:
I don't like to speculate, but things must have turned really sour behind the scenes with him not even figuring in youth games this season.

As you say he was in a good position to challenge for Egan's role. One more loan spell and he may have had a real chance, but he wasn't prepared to wait for that.

As a player he looked to have two weaknesses. He lacked pace and looked uncomfortable in one on one situations. He didn't look capable of playing at RCB.
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Because of his Gaelic football background, considering he has the most head it, kick it role in the team, Egan is decent with the ball at his feet.

I’m not sure Lopata really showed that prowess.
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
Fuck me. Have a look at the players "we" have signed in the Transfer Window who were under contract to the clubs we signed them from and didn't fancy honouring those contracts.

Surely your scrapbooks are full of players who've been transferred while under contract.
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Yes we have signed players who didnt fancy honouring those contracts. Am angry because it looks like we are not getting compensation for Lopata's move to Southend.
 
Silent Blade said:
Yes we have signed players who didnt fancy honouring those contracts. Am angry because it looks like we are not getting compensation for Lopata's move to Southend.
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I can't help. I don't know whether there's a transfer fee involved. I don't know whether there are sell ons. I think we can assume Southend wanted him. I think we can assume he wanted to go to Southend. I think that's how the dynamics work. Speaking out of turn - you have every right to feel angry if you want.

Did you rate him that highly?

Just one of those things that happen as far as I'm concerned.
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
I can't help. I don't know whether there's a transfer fee involved. I don't know whether there are sell ons. I think we can assume Southend wanted him. I think we can assume he wanted to go to Southend. I think that's how the dynamics work. Speaking out of turn - you have every right to feel angry if you want.

Did you rate him that highly?

Just one of those things that happen as far as I'm concerned.
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Thought he played well in the League Cup games last season but he wasnt really ready to be a 1st team regular. He had a good spell at Southend so the next step should be a loan to a league 2 club or maybe to a league 1 club but it seems he wasnt prepared to wait until he is ready for our 1st team. If we have more Academy players who are as impatient as him then I think we should scrap the Academy.
 
Silent Blade said:
Thought he played well in the League Cup games last season but he wasnt really ready to be a 1st team regular. He had a good spell at Southend so the next step should be a loan to a league 2 club or maybe to a league 1 club but it seems he wasnt prepared to wait until he is ready for our 1st team. If we have more Academy players who are as impatient as him then I think we should scrap the Academy.
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PL & EFL clubs are no longer allowed to operate without an Academy. Brentford & Huddersfield are "in the process" of re-establishing theirs to replace the B Team structure they went with.

We could, of course, cull a lot of players & staff and drop down the Academy game program pyramid.
 

Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
PL & EFL clubs are no longer allowed to operate without an Academy. Brentford & Huddersfield are "in the process" of re-establishing theirs to replace the B Team structure they went with.

We could, of course, cull a lot of players & staff and drop down the Academy game program pyramid.
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This Lopata episode reminds me of what Slew, Mellis and Adams did to us
 
Personally, I don't think there's a right or wrong. Some people see the club solely in terms of the first team & league position. Good luck. Me, personally, I see the club as more than that. As a structure, as a set of teams, one of the Carrier Bag Firm's sons is about to start in the Community Foundation strand of this wonderful club, playing in the "shadow academy" while he continues his education. Superb. No chance/ambition of playing in the First Team (or of signing for Southend).

Pompously, it's a football club, not a football team. But, I get that not everyone will see it that way.
 
Silent Blade said:
This Lopata episode reminds me of what Slew, Mellis and Adams did to us
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Slew and Mellis hardly had stellar careers after leaving us though. Slew is at Halifax and Mellis is a free agent after a short spell at Leatherhead. The fees from both of those two will have helped run the academy, so if they aren’t good enough for us or don’t want to play for us then selling them on to bring more funds in seems to be the only sensible option.
 
shorehamview said:
Slew and Mellis hardly had stellar careers after leaving us though. Slew is at Halifax and Mellis is a free agent after a short spell at Leatherhead. The fees from both of those two will have helped run the academy, so if they aren’t good enough for us or don’t want to play for us then selling them on to bring more funds in seems to be the only sensible option.
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Yes, we got good fees from selling Slew and Mellis but not from letting Lopata go. Lopata has been a waste of time for us. I did see him as a possible 1st teamer but he wasnt prepared to wait for the chance so he was a waste of time
 
A Storm of Blades said:
It’s petulant and speaks badly of his character, which more and more is an integral part of what’s expected from a modern athlete. He’s young and made an error, but an error no doubt it is.
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It probably isn't a mistake at all as far as he's concerned.
Maybe being stuck with us isn't very enjoyable for him so he prefers to join Southend where he had a happier time
 
Silent Blade said:
This Lopata episode reminds me of what Slew, Mellis and Adams did to us
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How are you playing the Adams one? He wasn't waiting impatiently in the Academy was he? He waited for his chance didn't he? He was an established first team player wasn't he?
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
How are you playing the Adams one? He wasn't waiting impatiently in the Academy was he? He waited for his chance didn't he? He was an established first team player wasn't he?
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We gave him a chance after he fell back to non league, did ok with us and then he didnt fancy playing under Wilder
 
Silent Blade said:
We gave him a chance after he fell back to non league, did ok with us and then he didnt fancy playing under Wilder
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Fell back to non-league from where? Wasn't he an England C International when we signed him?

(Edit - I see Wikipedia has him at Coventry until he was 14)
 
Wasn't Ndiaye impatient? Didn't he have the same contract dispute as Lopata? Iliman was frozen out of the U23s like Lopata because he wouldn't sign a new contract. It's all "game" - eventually Iliman and United reached an understanding and his impatience came to an end. And look how that's worked out. That impatience was ambition, wasn't it?
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
Wasn't Ndiaye impatient? Didn't he have the same contract dispute as Lopata? Iliman was frozen out of the U23s like Lopata because he wouldn't sign a new contract. It's all "game" - eventually Iliman and United reached an understanding and his impatience came to an end. And look how that's worked out. That impatience was ambition, wasn't it?
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One of Slav's best decisions but it could have backfired if Iliman didnt impress in the 1st team games. We cannot "give in" to too many who did the same thing as Iliman did.
 
Thanks for explaining your views Silent Blade

I just see all this as a feelgood football story. Lopata didn't have a club, we took him on, contributed to his development, I enjoyed seeing him play & progress, he seems to have enjoyed his time at Southend, they wanted him, they've got him, they're a great club, with a loyal fanbase, he'll enjoy playing there, and maybe in the future he'll be able to make a step up the pyramid, either with Southend or with another club.
 

What confuses me even more about the transfer is that if we did loan him and let his contract run down…

A) we’d have a year extension just like every other u23 player

B) we’d be a due a tribunal fee if he left for free (correct me if wrong)
 
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