Time to sack Wilder

[Bladezz]

Almost as if the transfer 'strategy' was to bring in decent players if they become available to us and fit in with our budget, rather than having a robust scouting team who actually go out and pro-actively seek the right players for the system that we want to use. The scouting of our transfer targets has been laughably woeful.

Let's just hope that we start to actually identify the players we want and go get them rather than seeing what becomes available and trying to fit pieces from different puzzles into the same jigsaw. No wonder the overall picture is a mess and we have pieces that don't fit.

I just don’t think Hecky was anywhere near good enough. Not blaming him but he was just so unprepared for this season. Zero experience at this level.

Think like you say we just signed players at random with no real plan. It sounds to me like Wilder has a plan he’s identified publicly that we have short comings in defence and mentality stand point.

Now let’s see if he can address it while only selling players. Hecky couldn’t address it whilst signing players for millions.

 

[Tony_Kaufman]

Wilder is 21 games not 31 games. Hence all your numbers are wrong.

Wilder ppg 0.53
Wilder goals per game 1.09
Wilder goals against 2.76

There is an improvement under Wilder. It’s certainly noticeable up front, but not at the back where the defence looks worse, but that’s what you get when you play Grbic.

Oops, my bad. An honest mistake due to a late night. Cheers for correcting.

 

[S17 Blade 1889]

Players fitness over a season generally deteriorates. Mid-season is not the time for getting players fitter

Wow, do we lay off the fitness coach mid season then? Funny how other teams players can last 90 mins including Coventry. They are proffesional athletes who played less than their peers given crap in the cup, really!

 

[Lower Drop Blade]

Hopefully a new owner will do that dirty work for us.

Unfortunately no idiot will be daft enough to buy us.....stuck with PA with his smoke and mirrors.
I honestly think administration will be our only escape from him

 

[Tony_Kaufman]

Unfortunately no idiot will be daft enough to buy us.....stuck with PA with his smoke and mirrors.
I honestly think administration will be our only escape from him

No idiot will buy us at the price the Prince is asking, but his current value includes the players as assets. With up to 16 players leaving and Archer plus one being sold, that value will immediately drop. Being in the Championship and not the Premier League will also reduce our value. It's greed why he hasn't been able to sell us. Pure and simple.

 

[Lower Drop Blade]

No idiot will buy us at the price the Prince is asking, but his current value includes the players as assets. With up to 16 players leaving and Archer plus one being sold, that value will immediately drop. Being in the Championship and not the Premier League will also reduce our value. It's greed why he hasn't been able to sell us. Pure and simple.

All correct unfortunately and selling as a championship club puts most potential owners off due to losing £m every season.

 

[Pollingtonblade]

If Wilder wasn't a "Blade" or if this was any other manager all but around 1 percent would want him out.

Of course 2016- March 7th 2020 he was great.

Subsequent to that there isn't any evidence to the contrary to say he's "good"

God knows what the summer will bring but our recent record on transfers doesn't make me confident.

Derby and Sunderland took years to recover from seasons like this. So God knows how we will fare next season, as it stands now I wouldn't back us to bounce back.

 

[cahill]

Listened to his interview, as predicted he said “this football club” enough to make it known to everyone who isn’t already bored of it that he’s a fan of Sheffield United.

He talks about getting the fans onside and getting the players and culture right. He also said this when he was reappointed, the players, with the odd exception haven’t even tried for the majority of his time as manager.

He goes on about finishing 9th, that was 3 seasons ago, when we had a unique mix of players. He did admit he won’t be able to repeat that but said “he knows what good looks like”. This is bloke who thought £22m for Brewster was a step in the right direction.

As a squad we’re unfit, not arsed enough, not good enough, poor at defending, tactically inept and have been hammered on numerous occasions as a result.

The chairman takes 90% of the blame, but the managers between them take the other 10% and neither is better or worse than the other for me.

My choice as a realistic replacement would be someone like Ian Evatt, he’s never had money to play with and won promotions with different clubs.

Five seasons ago. Think young managers like Rosenoir, Carrick and the Ipswich manager have left him behind.

 

[Edgar Allan Poo]

Five seasons ago. Think young managers like Rosenoir, Carrick and the Ipswich manager have left him behind.

Carrick?

 

[FleaPitBlade]

I'm not sure I'd have re-appointed Wilder at the time we did. I'm not sure I'd have sacked Hecky either. And I'm also not convinced this season has planned out any differently to what it would have done if we'd stuck with Hecky or appointed any other random manager to the task. So whilst Wilder hasn't changed much of anything, I'm also not beating him with a stick for not doing. The rot was well and truly set before he come back and he's had the square root of fuck all wriggle room to do much to change it. I don't think he's been a success but also not a failure either.

Right now, though. Where we are, and the situation we face, I do think he's absolutely in his element.

Out of the top flight, with a point to prove. He's got to build a team almost from scratch without bags of cash but (I hope) a comparably healthy budget and a few young gems to build it around. This is where he's always done his best work. He's a builder of teams.

So I'm happy he gets the shot at it.

 

[Carlton Blade]

When a team loses, convincingly almost every week and knows it's relegated then 'getting up' for games just doesn't happen.

Look at Luton. 6 points from 14 games. They've been broken mentally by the losing. Stick any "average Championship team" in a one off game and they might keep it close. Put them in a 38 game season where they are at a significant talent deficit every week and they'd be folding in the exact way United are

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

When a team loses, convincingly almost every week and knows it's relegated then 'getting up' for games just doesn't happen.

Look at Luton. 6 points from 14 games. They've been broken mentally by the losing. Stick any "average Championship team" in a one off game and they might keep it close. Put them in a 38 game season where they are at a significant talent deficit every week and they'd be folding in the exact way United are

Great points, which is why starting the season strongly is so important. We started it like a wet fart and with some very winnable games early season.

Whatever happens next, we need to look at how you win games of football in 2024/2025 because it currently feels like we're working to a model that was rolled out in 1994 and each week looks more like a pub team...

The 'what good looks like' comment makes me feel slightly better, because there needs to be a diametrically different philosophy and culture next season.

 

[Carlton Blade]

Great points, which is why starting the season strongly is so important. We started it like a wet fart and with some very winnable games early season.

Whatever happens next, we need to look at how you win games of football in 2024/2025 because it currently feels like we're working to a model that was rolled out in 1994 and each week looks more like a pub team...

The 'what good looks like' comment makes me feel slightly better, because there needs to be a diametrically different philosophy and culture next season.

I'm not sure how easy it is to instill new culture when the club is still stuck in the "hire nobody off the pitch, we'll be reyt" era. It's a big ask for Wilder to completely change who he is with no guidance or commitment from above. Culture goes all the way across organisations but it comes from the top.

More likely is trying to do 18/19 again.

 

[Champagneblade]

I'm not sure I'd have re-appointed Wilder at the time we did. I'm not sure I'd have sacked Hecky either. And I'm also not convinced this season has planned out any differently to what it would have done if we'd stuck with Hecky or appointed any other random manager to the task. So whilst Wilder hasn't changed much of anything, I'm also not beating him with a stick for not doing. The rot was well and truly set before he come back and he's had the square root of fuck all wriggle room to do much to change it. I don't think he's been a success but also not a failure either.

Right now, though. Where we are, and the situation we face, I do think he's absolutely in his element.

Out of the top flight, with a point to prove. He's got to build a team almost from scratch without bags of cash but (I hope) a comparably healthy budget and a few young gems to build it around. This is where he's always done his best work. He's a builder of teams.

So I'm happy he gets the shot at it.

I’m on this train as well.

I don’t think Hecky has the experience of building.

He was ok getting the players back to where they were comfortable but it wasn’t his blueprint, was it?

When it needed a bit more of a stronger rethink you get the impression he was happy to go on with the thoughts of others rather than put his own stamp on things.

As Bladezz has further alluded, the type of player we got was wrong and that comes down to the manager. You either needed an Ndiaye-alike, at a push you even use Hamer as a midfielder with freedom, but then you need the midfield
Legs and at best Souza is a more
robust version of Norwood without the passing. You still needed legs and ball carrying from the middle. Not a poacher up front with a bit of pace.

Teams that stay up need to be hard to beat and we didn’t make any attempt to do that. At the bottom end of the recruitment but we didn’t even have a Regan Slater or a Monty in midfield to compete and run.

 

[Danetheblade]

Where will we finish next season then? Put up or shut up

Top six. £50 quid donation to a charity/this forum if not?

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

I'm not sure how easy it is to instill new culture when the club is still stuck in the "hire nobody off the pitch, we'll be reyt" era. It's a big ask for Wilder to completely change who he is with no guidance or commitment from above. Culture goes all the way across organisations but it comes from the top.

More likely is trying to do 18/19 again.

Totally. The longer we go without a Sporting Director/Head of Football Operations the further the rest of the top 20(ISH) clubs will disappear over the horizon.

Expecting Wilder to pull together squad development planning and the evolution of the first team whilst individually game planning for 46 games is destined for failure.

Clearly Hecky saw his role as the latter so focused on game planning but we've seen all to well what happens then when someone with their head in the day to day details is responsible for contracts and transfers....

 

[UddersBlade]

Carrick?

Yeah… Carrick….had a good 6 months. Has achieved nothing so far to impress me. Mind you the way it works he’ll probably still end up with a Premier League job!

 

[Carlton Blade]

Totally. The longer we go without a Sporting Director/Head of Football Operations the further the rest of the top 20(ISH) clubs will disappear over the horizon.

Expecting Wilder to pull together squad development planning and the evolution of the first team whilst individually game planning for 46 games is destined for failure.

Clearly Hecky saw his role as the latter so focused on game planning but we've seen all to well what happens then when someone with their head in the day to day details is responsible for contracts and transfers....

It's doable at a lower level but United were in the perfect circumstances in 16/17. Biggest budget in a league they could dominate if a few things went right. Still, the recruitment for 3 years was sensational.

Now, harder league, not the biggest budget, more clubs acting smarter as ideas move on. Much, much harder task

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

It's doable at a lower level but United were in the perfect circumstances in 16/17. Biggest budget in a league they could dominate if a few things went right. Still, the recruitment for 3 years was sensational.

Now, harder league, not the biggest budget, more clubs acting smarter as ideas move on. Much, much harder task

Exactly that. We're still going around as if it's 2016. Bit like Arsenal towards the end of the Wenger era, expecting/hoping Wenger could work his magic with young gems and pluck players from the French lower leagues... Ultimately football evolves....

For me one of the big questions is, who's the next Arblaster? Whats the plan for when he leaves in 6/18/24 months? Whose job is it to do the strategy for things like that. You bet your life there's someone at Brighton, Brentford, Fulham doing exactly that .....

 

[Carlton Blade]

Exactly that. We're still going around as if it's 2016. Bit like Arsenal towards the end of the Wenger era, expecting/hoping Wenger could work his magic with young gems and pluck players from the French lower leagues... Ultimately football evolves....

For me one of the big questions is, who's the next Arblaster? Whats the plan for when he leaves in 6/18/24 months? Who's job is it to do the strategy for things like that. You bet your life there's someone at Brighton, Brentford, Fulham doing exactly that .....

Our owner is only doing short term. Other than contracts being limited to 1 or 2 years so they end when parachute payments do I'm not sure the plan is much beyond "I need to sell the club"

 

[FriethBlade]

If he's going to let the injury prone players go then why is he trying to convince McBurnie to stay?

We don't know he is for sure and this latest injury may be the straw that breaks the camels back.

Thing is in the Championship a fully fit McB gets us 20+ goals, however history tells us that we will be lucky to get 25 games out if him. However if we let him go then what? Hes on a free and we can't afford to sign an equivalent striker. If we can keep BBD and Archer he'd be out the door. Assuming we can't and McB goes we r then left with Brewster, Osula and Jebbo

 

[Black Cloud]

Loved the interview with CW and got a tad emotional…..then the reality set in…..he has repeatedly failed in the transfer market and made huge errors that have put the club under the financial cosh, IMO he cant spot the right type of player. Without having his knowledge on coaching, I would suggest his tactics are average at best and he doesn’t seem to be able to change mid game, his substitutions sometimes border on the unbelievable.

in summary then we could and should change Manager but I do get people's reasoning as to who the alternative option would be…however, Pashun doesn't gives anyone the divine right to have the job…..

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

Our owner is only doing short term. Other than contracts being limited to 1 or 2 years so they end when parachute payments do I'm not sure the plan is much beyond "I need to sell the club"

Which clearly is the reason he's struggling to get a buyer!!

 

[Carlton Blade]

Which clearly is the reason he's struggling to get a buyer!!

There at least seems to be an attempt to get the non-football part of the club in order. No wasted/unowned space at the ground now is certainly more attractive then dealing with external stakeholders as a buyer

 

[Grizzly blade]

This thread proves yet again most on here haven’t a fucking clue.

Sack him. To replace with who?

And what budget we got to fund a super new manager able to transform the playing squad into this defensive masterclass attacking team…AND get his players in…
It’s fucking delusion of the highest order.

Planning at this club is at best shit….we will have been doing our shit planning for months ready for this relegation. Lining up players, scouting etc etc. making decisions on contract offers, making decisions on contracted players and eyeing up potential targets to replace them.

So, regardless of the quality of the last few months of work in the background, you whoppers are advocating we rip all that up and start again with another new manager?

Do you forget what happened with your top target Slav? Get a fucking grip and use some grey matter.

We stick with what we’ve got, complete the transfer season and assess in September. If we are still in a mess with no sign of improvement then we will have to make a call on it then.
And not before.

Now stop with all this fucking stupidity, the club set its course when they rehired Wilder. We were down when he came in, and the mission was impossible. The time to go the different approach was when the sacked Hecky, so if you do t like that Wilder is here then you really need to up your game and aim the attacks at those actually responsible for the mess in August, the mess rehiring Wilder and the course they set us on for next season.

 

[Bladezz]

I’m on this train as well.

I don’t think Hecky has the experience of building.

He was ok getting the players back to where they were comfortable but it wasn’t his blueprint, was it?

When it needed a bit more of a stronger rethink you get the impression he was happy to go on with the thoughts of others rather than put his own stamp on things.

As Bladezz has further alluded, the type of player we got was wrong and that comes down to the manager. You either needed an Ndiaye-alike, at a push you even use Hamer as a midfielder with freedom, but then you need the midfield
Legs and at best Souza is a more
robust version of Norwood without the passing. You still needed legs and ball carrying from the middle. Not a poacher up front with a bit of pace.

Teams that stay up need to be hard to beat and we didn’t make any attempt to do that. At the bottom end of the recruitment but we didn’t even have a Regan Slater or a Monty in midfield to compete and run.

I just think he was inexperienced. But I don’t think he’s young enough to have a good managerial career.

Exactly same thoughts on Slater he would have been better than Souza as would Ben Whitmeman etc.

We didn’t get it right but as a club I hope we are learning.

 

[CarlMcBlade]

Unfortunately no idiot will be daft enough to buy us.....stuck with PA with his smoke and mirrors.
I honestly think administration will be our only escape from him

Why do so many fans get sucked in this man’s rhetoric. PA is nothing more than a Saudi politician and being deceitful will be second nature to him. Throwing a dead cats on the table (training ground, hotel etc) shouldn’t detract from the fact he came into a largely solvent football club and is now residing over a club that can’t pay its debts. This has been an extremely embarrassing season both on and off the field.

 

[Weasel]

I'm not sure I'd have re-appointed Wilder at the time we did. I'm not sure I'd have sacked Hecky either. And I'm also not convinced this season has planned out any differently to what it would have done if we'd stuck with Hecky or appointed any other random manager to the task. So whilst Wilder hasn't changed much of anything, I'm also not beating him with a stick for not doing. The rot was well and truly set before he come back and he's had the square root of fuck all wriggle room to do much to change it. I don't think he's been a success but also not a failure either.

Right now, though. Where we are, and the situation we face, I do think he's absolutely in his element.

Out of the top flight, with a point to prove. He's got to build a team almost from scratch without bags of cash but (I hope) a comparably healthy budget and a few young gems to build it around. This is where he's always done his best work. He's a builder of teams.

So I'm happy he gets the shot at it.

Other than your point about not sacking Hecky (cos he absolutely had to go), I agree with your post 100%.

 

[crazyblade1889]

I'm not sure I'd have re-appointed Wilder at the time we did. I'm not sure I'd have sacked Hecky either. And I'm also not convinced this season has planned out any differently to what it would have done if we'd stuck with Hecky or appointed any other random manager to the task. So whilst Wilder hasn't changed much of anything, I'm also not beating him with a stick for not doing. The rot was well and truly set before he come back and he's had the square root of fuck all wriggle room to do much to change it. I don't think he's been a success but also not a failure either.

Right now, though. Where we are, and the situation we face, I do think he's absolutely in his element.

Out of the top flight, with a point to prove. He's got to build a team almost from scratch without bags of cash but (I hope) a comparably healthy budget and a few young gems to build it around. This is where he's always done his best work. He's a builder of teams.

So I'm happy he gets the shot at it.

See my biggest issue with Wilder is this belief that fans seem to cling to that he’s a “builder of teams”. The truth is he’s failed at a rebuild on several occassions and has only really got it right in one pre season and that was 2016/17.

That season we had a relatively healthy budget (particularly for league 1) and given our size of our club at that level we could take our pick from the best in the division. Since then his signings have been hit and miss, earring mostly on miss

The time we really needed a rebuild was 2020/2021 season when he claimed it had been “our best transfer window in the clubs history” but set us back 10 years. His signings at Boro were poor. I understand some signings were taken out of his hands which he then refused to play which ended up being solid signings like Archer.

He was in the lower leagues for years. What did he build at Halifax or Oxford? I’m not a fan of either and can’t say I know their histories but 1 promotion in about 10/15 years wasn’t it? Up until his season with Northampton he was a complete nobody.

 

[DeanLearner'sCat]

See my biggest issue with Wilder is this belief that fans seem to cling to that he’s a “builder of teams”. The truth is he’s failed at a rebuild on several occassions and has only really got it right in one pre season and that was 2016/17.

That season we had a relatively healthy budget (particularly for league 1) and given our size of our club at that level we could take our pick from the best in the division. Since then his signings have been hit and miss, earring mostly on miss

The time we really needed a rebuild was 2020/2021 season when he claimed it had been “our best transfer window in the clubs history” but set us back 10 years

He built a promotion team that first season, then built another one in the Championship (Moore, Wright, Lafferty, Freeman, Coutts, Clarke became Henderson, Egan, Stevens, Baldock, Norwood, McGoldrick). 20/21 wasn't a rebuild. We didn't "really need" a rebuild the season after we'd just finished 9th in the Premier League. And the nucleus of that team got us promoted under Hecky, despite "setting us back 10 years".

Basically he's been given the chance to build two promotion teams here and he succeeded both times on a shoestring budget. It doesn't mean that will happen again, but let's not rewrite history.