City get away with it......

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CW7 said:
Yeah, should just have it so that sponsors can't be affiliated with owners.
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What's the point in buying a football club if you aren't allowed to put your money into it?
 
Excuse my ignorance here, but does this mean that man city will not be playing Champions League football next season?
 
CW7 said:
Unpopular opinion, especially as this effectively ruins our chance to get into champions league, but what City did isnt actually prohibited.
They got a sponsorship deal, then they are allowed to spend that money. The fact that they got it from the owner isnt illegal, look at Mike Cashley, but perhaps it should be!
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That wasn't the allegation being levelled at City though.

UEFA were claiming that City were artificially inflating sponsorship deals in order to hide cash injections from their owners, which would have meant them breaking FFP rules.

And it is abundantly obvious that is what happened, but money talks. I think the greatest achievement of City's executives has not been to openly cheat the system, but to convince their fans they are part of some sort of targeted stitch-up by UEFA. Really amazing example of deceptive propaganda and PR taken up by a bunch of fans who were all to desperate to hear it.
 
nicksufc said:
That wasn't the allegation being levelled at City though.

UEFA were claiming that City were artificially inflating sponsorship deals in order to hide cash injections from their owners, which would have meant them breaking FFP rules.

And it is abundantly obvious that is what happened, but money talks. I think the greatest achievement of City's executives has not been to openly cheat the system, but to convince their fans they are part of some sort of targeted stitch-up by UEFA. Really amazing example of deceptive propaganda and PR taken up by a bunch of fans who were all to desperate to hear it.
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But I think it needs to be proven beyond reasonable doubt in court. And with sponsorship being an intangible thing, how do you prove that this has happened?
 
So apparently they have been cleared of the actual offence. The fine is just for failing to co-operate.
 
Not surprised to be honest. Money talks again, the rich get richer. One surprise is the reduction in the monetary value of the fine.
 
Let them have the champions league.
The issue is the governing body being unable to rule end police the sport.
Cheats always prosper where the regulations allow them to.
Clearly the FFP rules require overhaul and tighter regulation to resolve this issue. Sadly, I suspect the governing body won’t have the power to do it due to the levels of corruption that seem to be rife in the game.
 
CW7 said:
But I think it needs to be proven beyond reasonable doubt in court. And with sponsorship being an intangible thing, how do you prove that this has happened?
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If it's a civil case, it's on the balance of probabilities. At least here, god knows what happens in courts based in Switzerland, which of course is known for its financial openness
 

CW7 said:
But I think it needs to be proven beyond reasonable doubt in court. And with sponsorship being an intangible thing, how do you prove that this has happened?
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Well exactly, that's probably why they just remained as allegations and couldn't be proven.
 
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So I'm assuming that makes the league table a bit simpler. Ignoring Man U/Wolves winning Europe league:

5th Qualifies automatically
6th Qualifies because of the league cup
7th Qualifies assuming the winners are already in it
 
Tell you what. Man Utd vs Leicester on the final day is going to be a proper battle.
 
So, lets have a recap from somebody clever about the Europa League qualification places. It only varies on cup result know I think??
 
CW7 said:
But I think it needs to be proven beyond reasonable doubt in court. And with sponsorship being an intangible thing, how do you prove that this has happened?
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It's not that intangible. You ask for proof of sponsorship deals/offers, compare to deals at other clubs, ask for proof in how they went about getting sponsorship, what companies responded and what their reactions were.
 
Iffy Onuora's Shiny Head said:
So I'm assuming that makes the league table a bit simpler. Ignoring Man U/Wolves winning Europe league:

5th Qualifies automatically
6th Qualifies because of the league cup
7th Qualifies assuming the winners are already in it
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Is 6th a qualification place regardless now?
What do we need for 7th to be a qualifying place?
 
Kuwaiti_blade said:
Are you Chansiri?
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No it's a serious point, look at Man City before the buy out, how were they ever going to compete for championships on a regualr basis without a shit tonne of money being spent by a rich Sheikh?

With the money clubs like Man U generate globally, how can the vast majority of clubs in England compete with that without an owner pumping in hundreds of millions? To me, all FFP does is mantain the status quo in football.
 
Greasy Chap Butty said:
Is 6th a qualification place regardless now?
What do we need for 7th to be a qualifying place?
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I believe 6th is in the table regardless because of City winning the league Cup.

I believe the 7th league spot depends on who wins the FA Cup, if they have already finished in the top 6 then 7th place becomes unlocked
 
So the report says some of the breaches happened more than five years ago so cant be counted, but concludes that City deliberately impeded investigations which surely means they would then take longer
 
Sounds like the verdict is what I expected. They've essentially been fined for not properly co-operating with an investigation, and the major accusations were either poorly evidenced or found too late to act on.

I'm not saying it's a great position to be in but CAS' verdict seems entirely reasonable under the circumstances. The FFP rules always allowed people to get around them if they had enough money, and we all know the footballing bodies are pretty bad at enforcing even simple rules let alone ones with complicated legal loopholes. They gave clubs an out with time periods for investigation and that means they can't now go OTT with verdicts on things that far back.
 
Iffy Onuora's Shiny Head said:
I believe 6th is in the table regardless because of City winning the league Cup.

I believe the 7th league spot depends on who wins the FA Cup, if they have already finished in the top 6 then 7th place becomes unlocked
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I believe it gets a little more messy if Wolves were to win the Europa League and finish outside the top 7 (i'm assuming Man U will finish in the top 7 regardless). I think that then means 5 teams qualify for the CL and then only 5th and 6th qualify for the Europa League.
 
FFP is a piss weak way to try and level the playing field. We're too far gone for a salary cap because wages are so high that it would again only benefit teams who can afford to fulfill it, rugby league have had one for years but it's still only ever Leeds, Wigan or St Helens who win it.

I get that if someone owns something in principle they should be able to do what they like with it but at the same time football is a unique business, it's not a company that they've set up from scratch, the club was there before, many for 100+ years and they're just the current custodian in charge of it and one dictator ruling it shouldn't ruin it for the rest when they've had enough, hence the attempt to try and make clubs into sustainable businesses rather than a rich man's plaything. Of course, like anything else, the rich people get what they want at the expense of others, literally putting a monetary price on principle and saying "what can I give you if it means I can break the rules" whether its football, elections, freemasonry etc etc
 
Iffy Onuora's Shiny Head said:
I believe 6th is in the table regardless because of City winning the league Cup.

I believe the 7th league spot depends on who wins the FA Cup, if they have already finished in the top 6 then 7th place becomes unlocked
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Indeed.

If Man City (the favourites) win the FA Cup or, alternatively, Man U or Chelsea win it whilst already finishing in the top 4, 7th place will go into the Europa League 2nd qualifying round. 5th and 6th go straight into the group stages.

Basically, we don't want Arsenal to win the Cup and, frankly, there shouldn't be much danger of that happening; Man City will surely destroy them in the semi-final.

Having looked through the remaining fixtures, I believe that the the 'ghost goal' at Villa may well return to the agenda because the failure to beat Villa will be the difference between being in the Europa League 2nd qualifying round and being in the group stages. I have us finishing 7th - a point behind 6th.
 

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