Wilder Sky Interview

[Bladezz]

We are shopping at barging basement in January. We only found out about the boardroom turmoil after but surly this was happening throughout Jan.

For teams like Forrest it’s easy who’s available? Colback / Ben Watson / Tomlin. Yeah let’s sign them. We don’t get to shop in the markets everyone else does.

 

[finlaytheblade]

Wilder looked and talked like us all last night.

So much given and so little reward. Absolutely gutted with a point we would have taken pre-game.

Sense of injustice - again.

Yep Woody he feels it like we do as a fan.
He will get the players up for Barnsley a big game this for both clubs.
The effort our players put in is tremendous Cardiff strived to contain us all match and then ssicker punch.
Nearly a great performance

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

Clarke was the best striker on the pitch at Swillsboro and has outscored Madine this season. Do you think he’s worth 6m? You can’t judge a player on 1 game

Clarke is 33 and Madine is 27. Clarke has spent his whole career up until this point being frustrating & inconsistent. Madine has potential. Cardiff bought Madine on the back of his performances during the 1st half of the season. My opinion of Madine is that if he put his mind to it, he would be a decent quality 'old style' centre forward. He has many positive attributes, but he also has many negative ones. Premier league quality? Probably not, but certainly good enough for the championship. Can he put his mind to it? That's debatable. Is he worth £6m? Probably not, but let's not confuse 'worth' and 'value'. His value is what he was sold for. Just as Jordan Hugill's is £10m, Vydra's £8m, Grabban's £9m and Assombalonga's £17m. That is the market value of forwards at this level, and having heard of the sums being offered and turned down for League 1 strikers in January, then £4m - £6m is their value range. We can sit around and talk about whether player x or player y is worth the money, but the simple fact is that is what they cost and if we want to replace our front five partially or totally with established, competent sub 30 yr old forwards that is their cost.

 

[spongebobblade]

If Clarke was 27 or 28 then in today’s market he would be Worth around £6m.

Waghorn is 28 and has 14 goals. Lassogga is 26 and has the same number of goals as Madine. Would you pay 6m for either of them? Today’s market values may have risen but they won’t get value for money at that price

 

[spongebobblade]

Clarke is 33 and Madine is 27. Clarke has spent his whole career up until this point being frustrating & inconsistent. Madine has potential. Cardiff bought Madine on the back of his performances during the 1st half of the season. My opinion of Madine is that if he put his mind to it, he would be a decent quality 'old style' centre forward. He has many positive attributes, but he also has many negative ones. Premier league quality? Probably not, but certainly good enough for the championship. Can he put his mind to it? That's debatable. Is he worth £6m? Probably not, but let's not confuse 'worth' and 'value'. His value is what he was sold for. Just as Jordan Hugill's is £10m, Vydra's £8m, Grabban's £9m and Assombalonga's £17m. That is the market value of forwards at this level, and having heard of the sums being offered and turned down for League 1 strikers in January, then £4m - £6m is their value range. We can sit around and talk about whether player x or player y is worth the money, but the simple fact is that is what they cost and if we want to replace our front five partially or totally with established, competent sub 30 yr old forwards that is their cost.

See above. Value is not what he is sold for. It’s if the investment pays dividends. What clubs are prepared to pay and value for money are two different things. Have the investments in Assombalonga/Braithwaite/Hogan paid off? All that money and Boro are ahead of us by a point! Yes we need to invest more but not necessarily at the levels being touted.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

Market Value is the amount for which an asset or liability exchanges for between a willing buyer and a willing seller in an arm’s length transaction after proper marketing and where the parties had each acted knowledgeably, prudently and without compulsion.

You could argue that prudence & compulsion are missing in the JTW.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

Back to the original point. Assuming we don't go up and Wilder is given 6m to spend on one striker who would it be?

This is where is gets very tricky as I've got little idea ! Do we go for a Marriott type who is tearing it up in a lower division or do we try and turn someone's career around who is stagnating or not getting the games at a higher level club ? It definitely wouldn't be Nadine though !

If the club continues to ignore my scouting reports on 2nd tier european prospects, then so be it! Otherwise i'd suggest we go for players that are slightly younger versions of the ones they are replacing. The likes of Garner, Gregory and Smith, all of whom are in their late 20's. Bradshaw if Barnsley go down is a good shout. Slightly controversially, I'd have Lucas Joao from the pigs, whom I rate. I also like the look of Ameobi at Bolton, someone who is young enough and talented enough to spend coaching time on and I'd go for McBurnie on loan.

 

[Kozzy_is_my_Dad]

Just 6 games left and it’s still in our hands - win them all and nobody can stop us getting in the playoffs - and play like tonight and they are all winnable.

Beating Fulham and Villa after that will be a little more challenging - but we’ll face that when we get there.

Who wouldn’t have settled on it still being in our hands with 6 games to go at the start of the season. I will leave it to Tufty to be disappointed and just thank my lucky stars I’m not going to Fleetwood and Port Vale any more - not to mention fucking Walsall.

Magic is Relative not Absolute

I agree, Magic. I'm just still feeling deflated at the fact that we didn't get the six points we deserved this weekend. Last night wasn't even funny, we absolutely battered them. I can't even watch it back because the large periods of us being comfortable in possession, to then only get a point, will really pee me off.

 

[Houston_Blade]

We made 4 signings in the window. One started last night and has done reasonably well. One came on as we were eating up time (ha!) and has not done well. A third started well but showed little since, and is often injured. The fourth, who I had the highest hopes for, has hardly featured and done little when he has played.

It's easy to play captain hindsight but thus far we haven't done very well out of the transfer window.

Yes, however the fact that the league one strikers had done a good job in the Championship prior to the window didn’t help us really. I can imagine the conversation with the board:

CW: I need a striker
KM: no we dont, Leon has loads and Billy’s got a few
CW: don’t be tight Kev
KM: ok I’m sure Man Utd have a reserve they’ll let us have, sign one of them on loan, think Michael Twiss.

 

[Houston_Blade]

We also signed up Brooks on a new contract and his illness has been a major blow.

We could have taken £10m perhaps and spent it on a Jordan Rhodes-type proven striker just to ensure we had enough for that final push, just like Wednesday did last season.

With young lads you get inconsistency but we got illness as well. At least proven strikers like Rhodes are consistent. Mitrovic was a big gamble at a loan and wages cost of about £2m or thereabouts. He was absolutely hopeless for the Toon. Confidence, environment, circumstance, rapport all play a part and momentum plays along positively just as much as poor goal tallies eat away at hearts and minds. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

Donaldson started well and got an injury. Sharp and Clarke both went off at the same time, not for lack of effort though. Wilson has not clicked.

Wilder did the right things in January and the new midfielders are proving their worth and will be ready to go next season.

We have Semple and Leonard and Stevens can play at the back but will need another defender. Other than that we just need a striker or two. Unless we go up and how would we cope with that?

We did exactly the right thing in January with the team and form we had at the time. I just wish the forwards would have told Wilder that they were going to have a lean period and he might have bought another striker instead of Leonard or Holmes.

 

[Kev Gee]

We should be looking abroad next season for a quality striker. At UK prices we simply are not dinning at the same table as others.

 

[Gavlar]

I don't think it relates to this season.

Which season(s) is it referring to?

 

[Harry's Game]

We should be looking abroad next season for a quality striker. At UK prices we simply are not dinning at the same table as others.

Van Tinky Winky or what ever his name is may be in charge then if CW has gone to WBA. so this may happen....

Any one know any decent proects in the Dutch or Belgium Amateur Leagues?

 

[Sean Thornton]

Which season(s) is it referring to?

It says "cost to assemble". The Pigs haven't spent £35m this season for example.

 

[Harrisblade]

Clarke is 33 and Madine is 27. Clarke has spent his whole career up until this point being frustrating & inconsistent. Madine has potential. Cardiff bought Madine on the back of his performances during the 1st half of the season. My opinion of Madine is that if he put his mind to it, he would be a decent quality 'old style' centre forward. He has many positive attributes, but he also has many negative ones. Premier league quality? Probably not, but certainly good enough for the championship. Can he put his mind to it? That's debatable. Is he worth £6m? Probably not, but let's not confuse 'worth' and 'value'. His value is what he was sold for. Just as Jordan Hugill's is £10m, Vydra's £8m, Grabban's £9m and Assombalonga's £17m. That is the market value of forwards at this level, and having heard of the sums being offered and turned down for League 1 strikers in January, then £4m - £6m is their value range. We can sit around and talk about whether player x or player y is worth the money, but the simple fact is that is what they cost and if we want to replace our front five partially or totally with established, competent sub 30 yr old forwards that is their cost.

I'd say (pedantically) that both 'worth' and 'value' are dependent on outcomes.
Surely what we're discussing here is simply 'price' ?

 

[Gavlar]

It says "cost to assemble". The Pigs haven't spent £35m this season for example.

I see. Bit more of a misleading graph than I initially thought, but still says a lot about how well Wilder has done with a limited amount of funds.

Now where was that game changing investment? Lost down the sofa?

 

[Gavlar]

We should be looking abroad next season for a quality striker. At UK prices we simply are not dinning at the same table as others.

Sadly I probably agree. It doesn't say a lot for young English strikers coming through.

 

[ChipButtyBlade]

View attachment 38294

So has spending a fortune benefitted Sunderland? Norwich? Wednesday? Hull? Leeds etc? I ask the question because there will be calls for new striker(s) after tonight. Reality checks> Leon Clarke is the third-highest scorer in The Championship - ahead of Albert Adomah and Ryan Sessegnon.

Donaldson cost £50k but has scored more than Jordan Rhodes.

Cardiff's sub. tonight (Madine) cost £6m - more than United's entire squad.

As sickening as tonight's injustice was, both us and Millwall are doing fantastically well. The teams that have spent big and spectacularly under-achieved will be looking for new managers sooner rather than later.

I see the team that no one likes spent 800k and are currently 8th.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

I'd say (pedantically) that both 'worth' and 'value' are dependent on outcomes.
Surely what we're discussing here is simply 'price' ?

The worth of a player is their value to their Club or a prospective Club for their individual operational objectives.

 

[Woodwardfan]

We did exactly the right thing in January with the team and form we had at the time. I just wish the forwards would have told Wilder that they were going to have a lean period and he might have bought another striker instead of Leonard or Holmes.

They can both score goals, particularly Holmes from outside the box.

Holmes averages almost 1 every 3 games over the last 3 seasons.

 

[Revolution]

Wilder did the right things in January and the new midfielders are proving their worth and will be ready to go next season.

Evans - agreed
Holmes and Leonard - I don't agree. They have not shown it yet (though in Holmes' defence he's hardly played). The jury is still out on these 2.

 

[LJBlade]

The point is 10 goal a season strikers now cost £6m. People on here talking about signing two promotion winning strikers in the coming summer.

How much did Clarke cost? How many goals has he got?

 

[mattbianco1]

I just wish we had those 4 extra points for the run-in

Yep. We should be 5th tonight, a point above Derby.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

They can both score goals, particularly Holmes from outside the box.

Holmes averages almost 1 every 3 games over the last 3 seasons.

I met someone (an informed neutral) on Friday at the match, who was stunned that Holmes wasn't playing as they thought he was the dog's knackers.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Evans - agreed
Holmes and Leonard - I don't agree. They have not shown it yet (though in Holmes' defence he's hardly played). The jury is still out on these 2.

Quality players who have taken too long to settle and ,for example, Sanchez has too. Jordan Rhodes still hasn't. It's not easy in January but the group as a whole are right back on track. Goals will come as sure as night follows day if we play like we have these past two games.

We are going to be oh so powerful next season.

 

[mattbianco1]

Evans - agreed
Holmes and Leonard - I don't agree. They have not shown it yet (though in Holmes' defence he's hardly played). The jury is still out on these 2.

I think Leonard will become a big player for us. His versatility alone will see to that, he will eventually slot into a position and make it his own just as Basham did.

I don't know why we signed Ricky Holmes. Unless Wilder knows that Brooks is off in the summer maybe

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

How much did Clarke cost? How many goals has he got?

3 goals in 1620 minutes of league football since the start of December 2017.

 

[LJBlade]

3 goals in 1620 minutes of league football since the start of December 2017.

That’s very selective thinking

 

[Houston_Blade]

They can both score goals, particularly Holmes from outside the box.

Holmes averages almost 1 every 3 games over the last 3 seasons.

If they play!

 

[I should coco]

3 goals in 1620 minutes of league football since the start of December 2017.

Ah yes, the well known 'December to April' goal scoring period that most stikers are compared against.

There are lies, damned lies and some very silly posts.