New stadium at the Lane?

[blade too long]

"

"well I remember us being top for a couple of months in 72 and we reguarly got 40 k plus
an even mediocre decent season finishing 10th we would piss 45000 in this tv era
we get a few students visit now , imagine how many would tuirn up for chelsea"

yes if we get up there we would
but its all incremental
the plans state an extra few grand on the kop
then the south stand being two tiered
its in the plans think its 46000 actually

 

[Sean Thornton]

no you help me greatly by pointing out my faux pas , its only out of respect I reciprocate

There are only twenty four hours in a day.......

 

[Sean Thornton]

yes if we get up there we would
but its all incremental
the plans state an extra few grand on the kop
then the south stand being two tiered
its in the plans think its 46000 actually

So you want 38/39000 for the Championship?

 

[blade too long]

there are only twenty four hours in a day.......

and only 26 letters in the alphabet , but some run away sometimes

 

[blade too long]

So you want 39000 for the Championship

newcastle have 56000 , so why not
they arent back in the prem yet

plus itd take a year to build a new stand . just in time for the prem

 

[Tyler Durden]

Surely if its allowed by a government rule then the local council and/or the police can't obstruct? I think we're a away off the government allowing it anyway although we still have standing old school allowed in the lower leagues don't we?

I'm not 100% sure but I think that the local authorities have some degree of power when it comes to implementing it. You can bet that Sheffield Council will dig their heels in hard and use Hillsborough as an excuse not to allow it. Plus the club themselves have to be inclined to make it happen and there's no evidence yet that they are.

I just believe that the arguments in favour of standing are stronger than ever and common sense dictates that it's the right way to go. We've seen the start of that already with Celtic Park putting a terraced section in one of their stands.

 

[Sean Thornton]

newcastle have 56000 , so why not
they arent back in the prem yet

plus itd take a year to build a new stand . just in time for the prem

And they are the only one in that league who beat it. No one else gets within six or so thousand. Leeds in a play off place get 26000. Derby 29000.

 

[blade too long]

And they are the only one in that league who beat it. No one else gets within six or so thousand. Leeds in a play off place get 26000. Derby 29000.

again we get 27000 here in shitty league one
do you not see that
and next season if we rebuild in the championship our capacity will be only 19000
till we get in the prem 12 months down the line
its planning

and dont say its impossible
we did it last time

 

[Sean Thornton]

again we get 27000 here in shitty league one
do you not see that
and next season if we rebuild in the championship our capacity will be only 19000
till we get in the prem 12 months down the line
its planning

and dont say its impossible
we did it last time

Twice. Top of the table games with 2000 plus away fans. Our average is around 21000.

So this planning, higher division, higher ticket prices, board need to spend on players, let's reduce our capacity to 19000 while we make a push for the PL. Mmmm.

Which last time?

 

[Keen Blade]

the main point is to go from 38000 to 60000 was a big risk , and seeing as they havent won the prem since , it fills every week at silly prices

Rubbish , see next answer.

 

[Keen Blade]

still didnt fill it every game . which is the point , it was a huge step to go from 38000 to 60000 needed some grande cahones to do it

Rubbish , for years Highbury was effectively full at around 38,000. When I was a teenager in the seventies they were packing 60,000 into Highbury. And London's got bigger and richer ever since. No risk whatsoever. Spurs were also packing 60,000 into WHL but like Arsenal were, they are now stuck with a stadium of half its previous capacity due to no standing.

 

[Keen Blade]

I have never read such codswallop in my life. Comparisons with Arsenal are meaningless. Our normal gate this season is 20,000 at giveaway prices. Two fluke games against our main rivals doesn't justify any ground expansion whatsoever. Once the prices go up next season , in a low-wage City like Sheffield , we'll be lucky to match this season's gates. BTL is suffering delusions of grandeur worthy of the most gobshite Wendy. Goodness me it's only a couple of weeks ago that the Lane was accurately described as a library on here ! Please forget expanding the ground , we have never properly recovered from the curse of chucking cricket out in 73 to build the SS in 75 only to get relegated in 76. Once we have 25,000 season ticket holders , then you can start on about the fucking ground.

 

[Houston_Blade]

thats what they said at southampton
they dont do too bad

Leicester fill a new stadium before they won the prem

if you can get them in go for it

Here's a link to our stats on attendances, tell me where anything in here justifies an increase in attendances please? http://www.european-football-statistics.co.uk/attnclub/sheu.htm

The most recent PL season when we were in effect "tourists" and should have seen a big one-off attendances we averaged 30k, in 1972 where you recall 40k crowds the average over the season was 33k, so those crowds you remember were the exception not the rule. Apart from that we are an 18k-26k club with very fickle fans and if we went to the PL with away fans in the whole of the away end we would reasonably gain 8k floaters for the first season and probably less after this.

I understand that once you've started down the path of an argument you don't ever give in and you will swear black is white just for the sake of it, however the stats don't support a 46k stadium for us unless you like staring at between 8k-10k empty seats most weeks. Newcastle are a 1 club city, Arsenal are a premium brand in a completely different market to us. Leicester's first season in the PL was a sell out at 32k, the next season they won the league, this season will be good on the back of that but I guarantee next season won't be the same. Southampton have a similar attendance to Leicester, certainly not 46k and their stadium is a sensible size for their fan base and sells out a lot as a result based on good performances, if they went to 46k would they sell out?

A better option financially would be to generate the demand, create a waiting list and then build, not build for something that might never happen on the back of a few good results and some feel good factor. 2 losses and with the obvious exception of yourself it will be wrist slitting time on here again for some and realism time for others, this is representative of Blades fans, we are a hard bunch to please and vote with our feet (apart from the die hards who are probably 10k in number at home and 600/700 away).

 

[nopigfansintown]

For me, United have never really explored our potential since the advent of sky sports and the resulting increase in popularity of football. We never had the 90s in which to gain bandwagon fans - ala the pigs. When watching a relegation team in the premier league, our corporate facilities were sold out every week, and our stands sold out despite only allowing away fans one tier.In fact, the corporate facilities were at saturation point for the last two home matches in L1. We also had the problem that our facilities in some areas of the ground are lagging behind, and we have a lot of restricted view seats, and other problems with the kop end which make it unattractive to more casual fans. In conclusion, I think an extension of around 5000 seats would be supportable. Especially if this is done in line with an improvement in corporate facilities and other revenue generating facilities . This would allow us to give both tiers to away supporters, whilst putting up with SYP's excessive segregation. Remember, our current capacity is closer to 30,000 than the headline 32,000 due to this.

 

[Grizzly blade]

We can't use old figures to justify an argument.
There are too many variances to compare.....cost has changed dramatically with it now costing a tidy sum to attend matches. The days of it costing pence and being a sport for the masses has gone. Also attendance figures in days gone were a rough guess half the time. There was little else to challenge football for the attention of the people....since the 70's there has been a sharp increase in other sports that were once just accessible to the elite. Not only that, kids have much more choice as to where to go and what to do at weekends.....compared to the 70's where a swimming pool was a luxury to have...a cinema...etc etc.....so after football losing some interest in the 80's it's now on the up.

Football interest in the premier league is not restricted to England, it's a global market with fans all over the world supporting whoever is winning the most. This has seen a rise in interest in league football as well, certainly in the championship as more clubs go up and get a taste of the premier league and gain a few new fans along the way before going down again.

Overall, population has increased, and continues to rise. People are living longer, are more mobile in older age and healthier. Football isn't the place of thuggery it once was too, so people aren't too concerned about bringing the whole family so the spread of ages attending games is broader too.
So it isn't unreasonable to suggest that the club look to increase the capacity of the ground, while also looking at ways of increasing revenue outside football. If we gain success like we did under Bassett and look at successive promotions I can see us having thousands of people wanting tickets and unable to get any, whether seasoned fans through hard times or new glory supporters.
I certainly expect a huge surge in demand next season based in the success and performances of Wilders team....and that alone may well see 27-30 k most weeks imho.

So....get on with that Kop....pillars in the way is so 70's!

 

[blade too long]

Rubbish , for years Highbury was effectively full at around 38,000. When I was a teenager in the seventies they were packing 60,000 into Highbury. And London's got bigger and richer ever since. No risk whatsoever. Spurs were also packing 60,000 into WHL but like Arsenal were, they are now stuck with a stadium of half its previous capacity due to no standing.

well we used to 40000 back in the day so why aregue against us increasing for being in the prem . which one day soon we will
spo the stokes , sunderlands saints leicesters can all go for it
but we shouldnt

lets always be a pokey club with no ambition
is that your stance

 

[ShockingBadBuy]

It would be really interesting to know how many people, in total, attend home games throughout a season. Including all those whose circumstances/interest limit them to one or two matches a year. 35,000 ? 40,000 ? More ??

Add in those who have been regulars (however irregularly) or occasionals (however occasionally) in the past ten years, say, and the pool of potential support presumably expands significantly. Sorry, I mean "customer base".

These are people the club needs to persuade either back thro the gates, or thro them more frequently, if we are to justify expanding the ground. But the potential for very large crowds in the medium-term is definitely there ...

 

[blade too long]

The most recent PL season when we were in effect "tourists" and should have seen a big one-off attendances we averaged 30k, ).

thats the biggest bag of bollocks Ive ever read
how many watched us in this shithole league the last 2 games
are you calling them tourists, its a fucking insult to our fans

No clubs had great attendances in the seventies and eighties
now since tv rules top league clubs get inflated crowds

sunderland had years of 15000 gates
newcastles crowds dropped through the floor

we would piss 40000 every game in the prem
its an insult to say we wouldnt when we get 27000 in league one just being top and not won owt yet

you would have been laughed at in 88 for saying Arsenal could fill a 60 k stadium

but things have changed big time

tell me would Arsenal get 27000 for a league one game v scunthorpe
in your opinion , if they were as big as millwall

 

[blade too long]

Here's a link to our stats on attendances, tell me where anything in here justifies an increase in attendances please? http://www.european-football-statistics.co.uk/attnclub/sheu.htm

and using your argument , explain how sunderland who historically have very similar crowds to us justified a 45-000 seater stadium
here is a link
http://www.european-football-statistics.co.uk/attnclub/sund.htm

they too only got 14000 to 19000 when they werent in the prem

but they had belief

you should try it, instead of calling us tourists

 

[blade too long]

Twice. Top of the table games with 2000 plus away fans. Our average is around 21000.

So this planning, higher division, higher ticket prices, board need to spend on players, let's reduce our capacity to 19000 while we make a push for the PL. Mmmm.

Which last time?

amazing what a bit of success does
gets in fans

youll get it one day

pigs get 2 or 3 30k s most season to boost their numbers

we turn up in numbers when we do well, always have always will

if we get back there in these times where football is king wed easily get 40 plus
sunderlands done it and they where down to our numbers in years gone by

but they wanted it

and got it
some of our fans obviously dont want it
or have tunnel vision

 

[metalblade]

One thing the club should be considering is that if (and it is looking very likely that) we are promoted to the Championship crowds will inevitably increase to between 20-25,000 every week with a number of games attracting between 25-30,000 which means when we do decide to upgrade the kop we will have a reduced capacity of 20,000 which is not enough for the clubs fan base. The time to increase capacity at the lane is now not when the present capacity is 90% taken up as it will be should we be pushing for the play off's to the Premiership, upgrading when the ground is full will only increase the loss of revenue and costs of the upgrade. It is not an easy choice unless some how the work could be done in small stages which does not at a stroke reduce capacity by 12,000.

 

[snootyfenooty]

but they wanted it

and got it
some of our fans obviously dont want it
or have tunnel vision

There's a lot of merit in both sides of the argument so far but you can't argue with that. It's the Blades half-empty syndrome.

 

[Grizzly blade]

With a Kop rebuild, it wouldn't be inconceivable to have a temporary stand in place while work went on behind it. We could get a couple of thousand on there, fill the remainder of the ground and find a solution to the segregation of BL end. (blades top tier...away bottom) and do some work on the turnstiles and internals to reduce the contact between fans on BL.

So lose a 10k kop....temporary stand of 2k, and we could still sell out 24k every week.
But agree, this needs doing ASAP.

 

[Sheffsteel]

One thing the club should be considering is that if (and it is looking very likely that) we are promoted to the Championship crowds will inevitably increase to between 20-25,000 every week with a number of games attracting between 25-30,000 which means when we do decide to upgrade the kop we will have a reduced capacity of 20,000 which is not enough for the clubs fan base. The time to increase capacity at the lane is now not when the present capacity is 90% taken up as it will be should we be pushing for the play off's to the Premiership, upgrading when the ground is full will only increase the loss of revenue and costs of the upgrade. It is not an easy choice unless some how the work could be done in small stages which does not at a stroke reduce capacity by 12,000.

I'm sure I remember the plans said that the design to build at the back of the Kop meant that much of the Kop could still be used during all the preparatory work. So only the back of the Kop would need closing off and we wouldn't lose that much capacity (maybe 3K).

All the major work, replacing the pillars and the roof would be done during the Summer.

Of course if we built a totally new stand then the capacity would be massively reduced for a full season.

 

[Houston_Blade]

and using your argument , explain how sunderland who historically have very similar crowds to us justified a 45-000 seater stadium
here is a link
http://www.european-football-statistics.co.uk/attnclub/sund.htm

they too only got 14000 to 19000 when they werent in the prem

but they had belief

you should try it, instead of calling us tourists

Again, taking the part of the argument you don't agree with and spinning it into utter rubbish. As a team and a club the PL season was a "tourist" season, no one expected us to stay there and demand was greater than normal because of the novelty factor and we expected only a short time there. Now calm yourself down old lad and read the whole post.

Do Sunderland sell out every week?

Are comparing Arsenal to Millwall?

"Batshit crazy" was one description used of you the other week, I am tending to agree!

 

[Silent Blade]

funnily enough I went in there the night we drew with man utd in front of 40k plus
got served ok

45,045

 

[blade too long]

Again, taking the part of the argument you don't agree with and spinning it into utter rubbish. As a team and a club the PL season was a "tourist" season, no one expected us to stay there!

who wasnt expecting us to stay there

had the tribunal done its job wed still be there

we went down with 38 points , clubs like Hull have stayed uip with 33

stop calling us tourists we wanted and expected to stay , and really should have done

you west ham apologist

taking part of the argument you said , that is the argument
So you believe fervently we wouldnt get 40 k in the prem now, just a few extra tourists
answer that
if we upped our capacity to 44k and stayed in the prem wed never fill it is your stance then

 

[Houston_Blade]

who wasnt expecting us to stay there

had the tribunal done its job wed still be there

we went down with 38 points , clubs like Hull have stayed uip with 33

stop calling us tourists we wanted and expected to stay , and really should have done

you west ham apologist

taking part of the argument you said , that is the argument
So you believe fervently we wouldnt get 40 k in the prem now, just a few extra tourists
answer that
if we upped our capacity to 44k and stayed in the prem wed never fill it is your stance then

We went down, that is the crucial point, we were tourists, the players used it as an opportunity to collect shirts and were criticised numerous times for doing so. Done a million times but if we'd not rolled over at Villa or Liverpool and scored a single goal on either game we'd have stayed up. Lots of peripheral factors but we acted like tourists and ended up back in the Championship.

I'll ignore the West Ham apologist comment as it's utter tripe, keep trying though.

On the last point if you read my posts properly instead of frothing at the mouth and spouting rubbish at the odd word this might have been a bit clearer to you. Anyway I'll put it in simple terms.... No I don't think we could never fill a 44k stadium, I think we'd fill it the odd game and have a few thousand empty seats the rest of the time like we did with 32k in the PL season.

I always look at investments from a point of view that if it was my money would I spend on that particular thing. In this case I can think of a lot of better things to spend the money on than a few thousand largely empty seats for a time when we MIGHT become a PL side on a regular basis. The risk and reward levels aren't of a level where I would consider it at the moment. Prove we have the demand then I would do. Let's see how you try and twist this one.

 

[blade too long]

well your just wrong
we would fill it these days as crowds turn up for prem games as sunderland stoke newcastle show us
you have a very low opinion of our fans who would clamour for tickets in the prem

unless theres the capacity you wont get big gates , but 44000 would be do able in this unprecedented era of prem football for those clubs with the pulling power
and with 680000 or so people in sheffield and a transient 70k of students who want to engage with a prem side we would follow a club like sunderland and fill it more often than not
Im gobsmacked some blades have such a downer on blades fans, ability to turn up in numbers , when we do ok in the prem

Im not sure which appalls me more
your lack of belief in the fans
or your lack of belief in the club

 

[Jesus_was_a_Blade]

Attendances can sometimes seem to suddenly skyrocket. Just had a quick look at West Ham, from 1990-2001 their average attendance never went above 26,000. The average looks to be about 22,500.

Now they're getting 55,000 in their new stadium. No reason to suggest if we had a 10 year stint in the PL we wouldn't be getting close to 40,000. Assuming we had a big enough ground.