Woodburn

[Davalon]

Like others I was delighted with his signing and I've been impressed when I've seen him on tv.

Seen nothing as yet from here though.

Not sure where he fits in at present.

 

[Chali 2na]

He got played in with a beautiful pass near the end and decelerated onto it. At this level (or any level above park football), in that position as a forward you’ve got to be prepared to either take a hit off the keeper or a defender. If he had had the right type of fibre in his fabric, chances are he would either scored or won a penalty, he hasn’t and pulled out. 5 minutes later he avoided another coming together on the edge of their box, that led to them breaking.

He’s not what we currently need, his normal position doesn’t fit our system and he’s not at this level yet as a player. Round peg & square hole. He had the look of a rabbit in the headlights last night.

Rabbit in headlights is the perfect analogy - he may have talent but he lacks the ferocity needed to play men's football, based on his showings to now.

 

[Chali 2na]

I don't think he's any better than what we already have?

We dont have anything else, that's the problem.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

Like others I was delighted with his signing and I've been impressed when I've seen him on tv.

Seen nothing as yet from here though.

Not sure where he fits in at present.

He has the ability, it’s been displayed in small bursts for all to see prior to joining us. However, he is clearly low on confidence. It’s disappointing, but hardly surprising sadly, that many are already writing him off.

 

[CopenhagenBlade]

He has the ability, it’s been displayed in small bursts for all to see prior to joining us. However, he is clearly low on confidence. It’s disappointing, but hardly surprising sadly, that many are already writing him off.

Agree. I’ve seen it when he has played for Liverpool and Wales, so it is there. I saw it also at QPR, where he was technically very good. I think its a confidence thing and also he hasn’t found the right position or is at a level where we would build around him.

 

[EddieColquhoun]

At the very least, I can't see how he can be justified playing at this moment in time, just doesn't seem ready in the same way players from OUR academy are.

We're 6th in the Championship. With the exception of Billy Sharp, Harry Maguire and the Kyles etc.etc., which of OUR academy players are ready to play at that level?

 

[RossingtonBlade]

Doesn’t have the bollocks. Pulled out of 4 tackles last night

 

[EddieColquhoun]

I thought he was signed to have an impact. Certainly did naff all against Norwich when he started.

Great ball to Leon providing him a sitter from 6 yards.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

I saw it also at QPR, where he was technically very good.

Indeed – I think he’s looked better when introduced at a time when we’re playing well, rather than when there’s an expectation to make something happen, which again would point to it being a confidence rather than an ability issue.

 

[Scooter_mcgavin]

Sessegnon? Wasn't he 17 and running the show?

Where was he sent out on loan?

 

[BLADES1988]

Where was he sent out on loan?

He hasn't been out on loan I don't think, i diddn't realise that was part of the criteria for discussion. Thought we were just on about game changing whippersnappers.

 

[dc_blade]

There's a difference between saying "he's looked poor so far, and needs to improve on x, y, and z aspects of his game to make an impact for us."

vs.

"He's shit, not good enough for us, get rid" on the basis of one start and a handful of substitute appearances.

The former is objectively true. The latter is objectively daft.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

There's a difference between saying "he's looked poor so far, and needs to improve on x, y, and z aspects of his game to make an impact for us."

vs.

"He's shit, not good enough for us, get rid" on the basis of one start and a handful of substitute appearances.

The former is objectively true. The latter is objectively daft.

Yes and no, yes and no.

Within 45 mins it was apparent that Norwood was ace. Sometimes you can just tell. 45 minutes to tell he was ace, 15 minutes to catch my breath, and a further 45 minutes to fall head over heels in love with him. I’ve since left the wife, had his name tattooed on my mighty mallet & desperately try and catch his eye when he ambles over to take corners in the SS/BL corner. But to no avail. Anyway, as I was saying, sometimes you just know. There’s no doubt that Woodburn is technically highly competent, but it’s his ability to transfer that from youth football, through u23’s into the championship. I don’t think at the moment that he can or will within the timescale we need him to.

Modern football is played between transfer windows. I see no reason why (should it be the case) that if Woodburn isn’t doing the business when the next TW opens that we retain his services. Betwixt now and then is a fairly narrow window of opportunity for the lad, but life is harsh. He’s on loan, he’s not being poorly paid and there’s no chance of him signing permanently, so with that in mind, I’m quite sure we can find a youngster of our own to look out of his depth for 10 to 20 minute cameos from January until May.

 

[Scooter_mcgavin]

He hasn't been out on loan I don't think, i diddn't realise that was part of the criteria for discussion. Thought we were just on about game changing whippersnappers.

Nah, I did say there's no way we could loan an 18 year old game changer....as if he was that good, he'd be unavailable for loan.

 

[dc_blade]

Yes and no, yes and no.

Within 45 mins it was apparent that Norwood was ace. Sometimes you can just tell. 45 minutes to tell he was ace, 15 minutes to catch my breath, and a further 45 minutes to fall head over heels in love with him. I’ve since left the wife, had his name tattooed on my mighty mallet & desperately try and catch his eye when he ambles over to take corners in the SS/BL corner. But to no avail. Anyway, as I was saying, sometimes you just know. There’s no doubt that Woodburn is technically highly competent, but it’s his ability to transfer that from youth football, through u23’s into the championship. I don’t think at the moment that he can or will within the timescale we need him to.

Modern football is played between transfer windows. I see no reason why (should it be the case) that if Woodburn isn’t doing the business when the next TW opens that we retain his services. Betwixt now and then is a fairly narrow window of opportunity for the lad, but life is harsh. He’s on loan, he’s not being poorly paid and there’s no chance of him signing permanently, so with that in mind, I’m quite sure we can find a youngster of our own to look out of his depth for 10 to 20 minute cameos from January until May.

Norwood is a bit of a anomaly, I'd suggest. It's exceedingly rare that you can just drop a player into a side and see him have the sort of impact Olli has had for us. That's not the standard by which we should be judging other players, especially not a young lad in Woodburn's circumstances.

If Woodburn continues at about this level until January, perhaps we should be considering an alternative, yes. But it's not even the end of September yet.

 

[BigBed]

We dont have anything else, that's the problem.

We have Duffy?

 

[Chali 2na]

We have Duffy?

And what do you plan to do after 60 mins? Or when we play 2 games in a week?

 

[cahill]

Doesn’t have the bollocks. Pulled out of 4 tackles last night

You can’t give people bottle if they don’t have it. Hope you’re wrong though.

 

[NotFallowfieldBlade]

We can’t be relying on an 18 year old kid nowhere near as good as brooks or Duffy , sure he has the potential but for that position we need someone who can drive forward.

Really should have signed Luke freeman he would be perfect for our system.
Just like we should have signed dack/Watkins in the last few seasons

 

[BigBed]

And what do you plan to do after 60 mins? Or when we play 2 games in a week?

Bring Coutts on and push Norwood forward?
What would you like to do?

 

[Trigger Blade]

There has to be a lot more to him than he's shown so far. You don't get into Liverpool's first team at 16 (almost 2 years ago) as well as be a full international (OK, it's only Wales ) and be rubbish at 18.

 

[HoodedClaw]

Yes and no, yes and no.

Within 45 mins it was apparent that Norwood was ace. Sometimes you can just tell. 45 minutes to tell he was ace, 15 minutes to catch my breath, and a further 45 minutes to fall head over heels in love with him. I’ve since left the wife, had his name tattooed on my mighty mallet & desperately try and catch his eye when he ambles over to take corners in the SS/BL corner. But to no avail. Anyway, as I was saying, sometimes you just know. There’s no doubt that Woodburn is technically highly competent, but it’s his ability to transfer that from youth football, through u23’s into the championship. I don’t think at the moment that he can or will within the timescale we need him to.

Modern football is played between transfer windows. I see no reason why (should it be the case) that if Woodburn isn’t doing the business when the next TW opens that we retain his services. Betwixt now and then is a fairly narrow window of opportunity for the lad, but life is harsh. He’s on loan, he’s not being poorly paid and there’s no chance of him signing permanently, so with that in mind, I’m quite sure we can find a youngster of our own to look out of his depth for 10 to 20 minute cameos from January until May.

Was Norwood Ace when he was 18?

I appreciate Norwood's been good since he arrived but I think it's slightly unfair to compare an 18 year old in his first loan move with a 27 year old who is probably at his peak and has 55 international caps.

Agree though if he's not right for us we should maybe send him back. No point potentially setting him back or damaging a relationship with a big PL club.

 

[FMBlade1]

There has to be a lot more to him than he's shown so far. You don't get into Liverpool's first team at 16 (almost 2 years ago) as well as be a full international (OK, it's only Wales ) and be rubbish at 18.

Freddie Adu was capped by the US at 16 and played for Benfica and Monaco at the age of 18. He's now playing for Las Vegas Lights.

I'm not saying that Woodburn is/will be a rubbish player, he has just played rubbish for us thus far.

If you're good enough you're old enough.

If you're not good enough I don't care how old you are. So far he's not been good enough, and it's fair to call that out.

 

[CarlMcBlade]

David Brooks has more chance of playing in the Liverpool first team than Woodburn.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

Was Norwood Ace when he was 18?

I appreciate Norwood's been good since he arrived but I think it's slightly unfair to compare an 18 year old in his first loan move with a 27 year old who is probably at his peak and has 55 international caps.

Agree though if he's not right for us we should maybe send him back. No point potentially setting him back or damaging a relationship with a big PL club.

The easy answer to that question is ‘yes, Norwood was ace at 18’. It might not be the truthful answer, but it is the easiest for me to give.

Between 18 and 21, whilst at Man Utd, Norwood went on loan to Carlisle, Scunthorpe and Coventry. During this time he made his full international debut for NI. That maybe something for Woodburn and Liverpool to think about. Many a mickle makes a muckle.

Tammy Abraham showed last season that even after a cracking loan spell at one level, it doesn’t necessarily mean you can perform at the next.

 

[Yellarbellyblade]

There are two types of posts in this thread.

'He's been shit at the football so far'

'Leave him alone he's a child'

I’ll add a third

“I’m not sure yet can I sit on the fence”

 

[Chali 2na]

Bring Coutts on and push Norwood forward?
What would you like to do?

That's my point, we have no options without pulling someone out of position.

 

[FMBlade1]

Didn't come off the bench last week, didn't even make the squad this week.

Something has gone very wrong.

I really don't want to know how much money we are paying Liverpool in fines, its totally inappropriate that we get punished for him not being good enough.

 

[bromtom]

Didn't come off the bench last week, didn't even make the squad this week.

Something has gone very wrong.

I really don't want to know how much money we are paying Liverpool in fines, its totally inappropriate that we get punished for him not being good enough.

Or we just didn't need a number 10/ wide forward on the bench. Probably looked at it and thought "we've probably got enough to win here, we're scoring, so let's go for midfield options and injury cover".

Sure he'll be on the bench against Blackburn or Hull.

Don't think he's been "not good enough" either really, he helped a lot against QPR, holding the ball for example, his clearances are a bit squiffy but I'd not say he's been bad. Average.

Doesn't help that we don't have anywhere to play him though really.

 

[Sheffsteel]

Didn't come off the bench last week, didn't even make the squad this week.

Something has gone very wrong.

I really don't want to know how much money we are paying Liverpool in fines, its totally inappropriate that we get punished for him not being good enough.

It is appropriate, it’s business, supply and demand.
Liverpool have a young player in big demand, they rate him far higher than Brooks. He’s wanted by clubs at Championship level but needs games at a decent level. So Liverpool can easily put in penalty clauses/ fines and there’s still many clubs that are interested.

I know an Everton fan he’s says his Liverpool mates say he’s going to be a PL star.
Brooks was poor ar his age and look how he progressed, suspect Woodburn will be the same.

Just needs patience, some of our fans are so quick to write off a player after 4 subs appearances and 1 start. Although there is the factor of wrong club wrong time....as well as right club right time. He just needs time
...although my concern is more that his body language looks poor, as though he’s not that bothered and not trying.