With Burnley winning tonight

[Gavlar]

Look whats gone has gone
You think we will continue to draw 1 game in 7

I think we will improve
You wallow in misery
I will enjoy the improvement ahead

I'm loving the attitude of the players in the last 2 games, it's much better than it was against Southampton, but the facts are, we still only got 1 point from those games. We need a much bigger improvement in quality and i'm not convinced we have the players to do it.

We could continue to get 1 draw in 7 yes, it is possible given our run of form, fixtures coming up and players available.

 

[mattbianco1]

Really? 2 points at Christmas?

Just to clarify, for the hard of hearing.... its not Christmas yet in the football calendar

 

[Gavlar]

Just to clarify, for the hard of hearing.... its not Christmas yet in the football calendar

I'll come back to you with the same message in a few games then.

 

[mattbianco1]

I'll come back to you with the same message in a few games then.

OK. 17th January after the spurs game. Thats actually Xmas day. Thats when we are "bottom at Xmas".

Will you come back if we're not bottom that day too?

 

[Gavlar]

OK. 17th January after the spurs game. Thats actually Xmas day. Thats when we are "bottom at Xmas".

Will you come back if we're not bottom that day too?

I will indeed mate! If we are not bottom by then I will be praising the Lord and singing in the street!

If i don't come back on this, feel free to come back to me with my wrong prediction.

I'll be very happy to be wrong, but the likelihood is, we will still be rock bottom.

 

[HeySethUTB]

After being firmly in the “let’s not be defeatist, we still have a chance“ Camp. Burnley have just been doing a Burnley play shite for a bit, steady the ship and play incredibly well in the last 10 missing out on Europe by 5 or 6 points. Standard fair.

In reality, There’s not a chance we actually stay up the run we would have to go on in order to survive would be something out of hollywood sport film. Mini montages of wilder in the dressing room pumping his fist, Alan Knill on his knees after sharp slots home a last minute winner, fans crying, close up shot of James shields fingers while he types up the headline “blades find the cutting edge”, Kammy classic unbelievable Jeff, slow motion football scenes with the sound of heavy breathing and heartbeats and a goalkeeper crisis that means Jags has to start in the net last game of the season pulling off a VAR induced penalty save before a recalled Regan Slater scores an overhead kick, the fucking lot.

 

[mattbianco1]

I'll be very happy to be wrong, but the likelihood is, we will still be rock bottom

I know, I know.

Trying to stay positive. Wilder needs to be targeting next 4 games as winnable. Or at least, not losing them. Everton have shown they are capable of losing but have recovered well from their blip. Get a draw there and go all put yo win v Burnley, Palace and Newcastle.

 

[blade too long]

we've had a bad run
14 games 12 losses
People
keep telling me there's no such thing as luck and things always even out

If that's true we will start getting the deflections in our favour
The ball will drop nice for us in the box

Brighton equaliser came off a shoulder and fell at Wellbecks feet 4 yards out

We just need some of that
Or the ref missing Berge getting fouled twice before Leeds scored might get seen

Perhaps another team might get a player sent off on a dubious red card like at Villa and Brighton

As I say small margins and we start winning

 

[Gavlar]

we've had a bad run
14 games 12 losses
People
keep telling me there's no such thing as luck and things always even out

If that's true we will start getting the deflections in our favour
The ball will drop nice for us in the box

Brighton equaliser came off a shoulder and fell at Wellbecks feet 4 yards out

We just need some of that
Or the ref missing Berge getting fouled twice before Leeds scored might get seen

Perhaps another team might get a player sent off on a dubious red card like at Villa and Brighton

As I say small margins and we start winning

We had a deflection go in on Sunday, and we had luck as they hit the bar in the last minute.

A bad run is 5 or 6 games, 14 games is terminal.

 

[blade too long]

After being firmly in the “let’s not be defeatist, we still have a chance“ Camp. Burnley have just been doing a Burnley play shite for a bit, steady the ship and play incredibly well in the last 10 missing out on Europe by 5 or 6 points. Standard fair.

In reality, There’s not a chance we actually stay up the run we would have to go on in order to survive

1.5 points per game
24 games left equals 36 points added to our 2 38

Last season 38 games 56 points was 1.5 points per game
We just have to get back to where we were. Not champions league form

 

[Gavlar]

I know, I know.

Trying to stay positive. Wilder needs to be targeting next 4 games as winnable. Or at least, not losing them. Everton have shown they are capable of losing but have recovered well from their blip. Get a draw there and go all put yo win v Burnley, Palace and Newcastle.

I am really hoping we bust a gut every game. We have improved in the last 2, but for me it's too late for this season.

In the long run, things are still rosy, Wilder is a great manager and we should do well in the championship. Burnley went down and back up to be fair, so we can too.

Of course we need to be positive and take every game as it comes and keep fighting til its mathematically over, but I think we need to be realistic as to how much of a change of fortunes we need to stay up. It will be a monumental turnaround of fairy tale proportions.

 

[blade too long]

We had a deflection go in on Sunday, and we had luck as they hit the bar in the last minute.

A bad run is 5 or 6 games, 14 games is terminal.

14 games is not terminal
See 1990
And we've scored as many goals as then

 

[metalblade]

Your not slightly worried that we are going down?

I'm not worried at all , we will come back stronger if we keep hold of Wilder and the majority of this team, the Championship is piss poor this season if you need any evidence look how well last seasons relegated teams are doing

 

[Gavlar]

14 games is not terminal
See 1990
And we've scored as many goals as then

Yes 1990 was incredible, but it has happened once in 30 years. We had Deane then who could score lots in the prem, who will do that now?
I'm all for us keeping fighting in every game, but with every game that goes by where we don't win and other teams around us do win, it's only a matter of time til we are mathematically down.

We 'just' need to get 1.5 points per game is a massive ask.

 

[Gavlar]

I'm not worried at all , we will come back stronger if we keep hold of Wilder and the majority of this team, the Championship is piss poor this season if you need any evidence look how well last seasons relegated teams are doing

I agree with that. I was asking whether the OP thought we would stay up.

 

[west_yorks_blade]

Compared to someone who believes that we were created from nothing!!

I’m sure we could have a lively discussion about religion, but obviously not appropriate here.

My point was that you have literally dedicated your life to ‘faith’ in something and yet feel that hopes of United’s survival are deluded and flying in the face of facts.

Of all people, it seems an odd and contradictory stand point. Particularly as there is a huge chunk of the season to go with lots of potential points on offer.

A tough challenge yes - but clearly not an impossible one. Maybe you should have a little ... faith.

 

[Rob86]

Roll on the “just 4 wins and a draw” thread on Boxing Day !

 

[benn5712]

It ain't our first Rodeo.

 

[FlamingLip]

we've had a bad run
14 games 12 losses
People
keep telling me there's no such thing as luck and things always even out

If that's true we will start getting the deflections in our favour
The ball will drop nice for us in the box

Brighton equaliser came off a shoulder and fell at Wellbecks feet 4 yards out

We just need some of that
Or the ref missing Berge getting fouled twice before Leeds scored might get seen

Perhaps another team might get a player sent off on a dubious red card like at Villa and Brighton

As I say small margins and we start winning

I do respect the persistent overt optimism and fully expect to see these comments until we're mathematically down - but to repeat a previous post BLT you do come across rather Adkins-esque. Luck hasn't been the governing factor in the 12 defeats from 14, and the suggestion that a few deflections going in our favour will suddenly turn United's season really is blind optimism. As my boss still hammers in to me, "hope isn't a strategy".

We've improved in the last 2 games, pleasing to see, but all we've returned is a bit of self respect - not much more. The sort of form required to conjure up a point tally to give any chance of survival just isn't realistic. We need to steadily rebuild team confidence and progress to overcome derby's record low total, but our focus should now be on next season.

 

[gordoncharles]

1.5 points per game
24 games left equals 36 points added to our 2 38

Last season 38 games 56 points was 1.5 points per game
We just have to get back to where we were. Not champions league form

2 games ago you were making the same argument, only then we needed 1.4 points per game.

Before Man Utd we were going to get 2 wins and a draw from our next 5 games. Well we still need two wins from the next three to hit that target.

At what point do you think you'll be able to admit to yourself that this excessive optimism is futile?

 

[ancientblade]

burnley winning last night was a major blow and cant see us getting anymore than a point against everton its all but over for me hope im way off but just cant see any escape from this now

 

[blade too long]

2 games ago you were making the same argument, only then we needed 1.4 points per game.

Before Man Utd we were going to get 2 wins and a draw from our next 5 games. Well we still need two wins from the next three to hit that target.

At what point do you think you'll be able to admit to yourself that this excessive optimism is futile?

When we are 10 points adrift with 3 games to go
I'd expect our squad to have the same attitude

 

[blade too long]

I do respect the persistent overt optimism and fully expect to see these comments until we're mathematically down - but to repeat a previous post BLT you do come across rather Adkins-esque. Luck hasn't been the governing factor in the 12 defeats from 14, and the suggestion that a few deflections going in our favour will suddenly turn United's season really is blind optimism. As my boss still hammers in to me, "hope isn't a strategy".

We've improved in the last 2 games, pleasing to see, but all we've returned is a bit of self respect - not much more. The sort of form required to conjure up a point tally to give any chance of survival just isn't realistic. We need to steadily rebuild team confidence and progress to overcome derby's record low total, but our focus should now be on next season.

We have to start somewhere
Look if you and others want to give up at the earliest possible point thats your choice
There's 24 games left
Two thirds of a season to find a good run and a team playing as we KNOW we can
Its not over optimistic just a belief we can improve enough to get close
Teams have been 3 and 4 games points adrift before and got out of it

 

[blade too long]

I do respect the persistent overt optimism and fully expect to see these comments until we're mathematically down - but to repeat a previous post BLT you do come across rather Adkins-esque. Luck hasn't been the governing factor in the 12 defeats from 14, and the suggestion that a few deflections going in our favour will suddenly turn United's season really is blind optimism. As my boss still hammers in to me, "hope isn't a strategy".

We've improved in the last 2 games, pleasing to see, but all we've returned is a bit of self respect - not much more. The sort of form required to conjure up a point tally to give any chance of survival just isn't realistic. We need to steadily rebuild team confidence and progress to overcome derby's record low total, but our focus should now be on next season.

I don't give 2 fucks about Derbys record
We are 300 times better than they were
We created 23 opportunities v West Brom
Once we start converting those we will flourish

 

[TJ blade]

‘Just need to win 3’. Well we haven’t managed a win all season. This has nothing to do with politics or fear and everything to do with reality. Teams that can’t win don’t generally go on long runs of wins or turn things round. So far we cannot keep a clean sheet and can barely score. Of course I want us to fight to the end but the gap is already 10 points. We did it 1990 but I’m not sure lightning will strike twice. It will take a miracle to stay up. I would stick with Wilder and go for promotion next season.

Agree about Wilder, but send him on a recruitment course

 

[Bellypork]

The problem for United is that it's hard to see how to change things for the better. The club already has a top manager and the players are giving everything, so I'm not sure what else can be done in such a short space of time to bring about the improvement in results required. In the end, what will be will be but ensuring that the players give 100% until the end of the season is what really matters IMO. There's always tomorrow in sport and if the players keep trying for the remainder of the season then the club can't lose.

 

[FlamingLip]

I don't give 2 fucks about Derbys record
We are 300 times better than they were
We created 23 opportunities v West Brom
Once we start converting those we will flourish

I'm not saying you or any of our fans actually care about the Derby record but the players and certainly management will.

If our chance of staying up purely lies in the turning of apparent misfortunes - then it infers even you've 'given up' of a tactically mounted chance of survival.

And it's incorrect to say I or others have given up - despite the moans I still back and have faith in CWAK. Longer term we can come back stronger.

 

[Snowflake]

9 times out of 10 most sides get 30 plus points and make a fist of staying up.

it’s high time we started to look after our Own results instead of hoped for 3 worse teams than us to end the season with 20 points or it be a historically crap league. We can’t rely on everyone else to start losing

To all intents and purposes we are gone - may as well accept that and try and play our way into some form for next season.

I am a slightly deluded optimist when it comes to United, BUT....
... if we get 5 or more points from the next three games we stand a chance of staying up.
Less than that and we are gone and even I would accept it.
Add in two good players in the JTW and I become even more optimistic (or deluded ?)

 

[blade too long]

I'm not saying you or any of our fans actually care about the Derby record but the players and certainly management will.

If our chance of staying up purely lies in the turning of apparent misfortunes - then it infers even you've 'given up' of a tactically mounted chance of survival.

And it's incorrect to say I or others have given up - despite the moans I still back and have faith in CWAK. Longer term we can come back stronger.

I said it's small margins that change things. I never said it's just down to luck
But it's down to creating 23 chances v West Brom and converting the glaring misses we've made actually getting shots converted at a percentage even like last season would turn us round
But the difference between a win and a loss is all about who converts the chances.
Can we do it . Its certainly not beyond us

 

[Houston_Blade]

We have to start somewhere
Look if you and others want to give up at the earliest possible point thats your choice
There's 24 games left
Two thirds of a season to find a good run and a team playing as we KNOW we can
Its not over optimistic just a belief we can improve enough to get close
Teams have been 3 and 4 games points adrift before and got out of it

I don't give 2 fucks about Derbys record
We are 300 times better than they were
We created 23 opportunities v West Brom
Once we start converting those we will flourish

I know we’ve had this debate many times before but you’re referring to us recreating form from last season when we had:

• O’Connell
• Henderson
• Mousset actually fit and scoring
• confidence
• the momentum of a promotion behind us
• surprise factor over a lot of teams
• an aggressive approach to games

The 23 shots against West Brom wouldn’t keep us up even if we scored all of them, that would have been 3 points. We need to do better in other games, not just against the 2nd worst team in the league.

If you want to take the 23 shots against WBA as a plus side you’d then have to let Brighton and Fulham have their deserved 3 points against us rather than just cherry picking the best bits of a poor season to date.