Tuftys tactics

[Bergen Blade]

I didn't like the Basham to midfield change with 30 minutes to go, but for me his biggest mistake was starting Dowell over McGoldrick, as it appears he knew what sort of game it would be.

And I don't know why he didn't use a final sub either.

He was pleased with a point. Fancy that.

Before Cranie came on I think they were starting to look more comfortable and had more possession in midfield. After Basham pushed up, we stopped that trend, and bringing McGoldrick on also helped us.

Taking off the advanced midfielder and pushing Basham up looks a negative move, but it's often a realisation that the pattern of the game is going in the wrong direction and we've got to address it. Sometimes it can be to make us stronger defensively, to help cope with pressure, but last night I thought it was to regain control of the game.

I think Wilder will regret that he chose Dowell over Duffy. Maybe the general plan is to play Dowell if there's space, Duffy if it's tight. As it was at their place and they've had an upturn in form, maybe we expected them to be a bit more adventurous, giving more space for Dowell to exploit. Then if they did drop deep we'd have the added aerial threat of Madine to aim for, something we lacked at the Lane against them.

However they were very disciplined, prevented us from getting our passing going from deep, and we resorted to look for the strikers too early. Our wing backs couldn't do much. Duffy may have helped us linking play better in their half.

So in my opinion the two substitutions helped us, and although I was disappointed not to see Duffy at all, I'm not sure who we should have taken off, given the two previous subs.

 

[Ricky]

Agree. This game was crying out for someone to show some composure and put their foot on the ball. The way we started the second half was x10000 better because Wilder seemed to get this message through to the players. But, either way, that's a strategy that calls for one of McGoldrick or Duffy over Dowell. So the decision not to start either, and then bring Cranie on for Dowell, was way off for me. Oh well. No manager gets it right every time. And Wilder is doing such a good job and has banked a lot of credit that we can just let it go. This game won't define our season.

Cranie actually gave us a real boost, as it turned out, he was excellent. But I'm not sure how much good it did us having Basham in midfield, compared to what a more positive change might have done. Maybe Wilder looked at it and thought it was a waste of time having a player in the 10 position due to how tight and condensed the pitch was - Wednesday did a good job here but tailed off in the last 15 minutes or so.

I think it was obvious our players were unwilling to take risks in the first half, or that they were told not to. The usual composure levels were nowhere to be seen. Again, their tactics and the conditions were a big factor. But surely this suggests at least one of Duffy or McGoldrick should have started?

I called for McGoldrick to start behind Sharp and Madine, and it was his composure, strength and experience that improved us, and proved that it wasn't a waste of time having a player in the 10 position, we just needed the right player there for this game. There is no doubt in my mind that he should have started - especially in those conditions.

 

[anglian blade]

I am not sure if Wilder being a Utd fan was part of the issue. May have made it more important for him not to lose than for a more neutral manager.

 

[Boxer Blade]

I couldn't care less how Wednesday would fill midfield and try and stop us playing, if we were to come up with those tactics against other teams, say rovrum we would stick to our game plan that has got us where we are are, change tactics later on if it ain't working of course but you wouldn't get the teams at the the top of the premier playing a middling team away and change their tactics so much, we are the better team let the other team worry about their tactics, I am not unhappy with an away point at any time and I am not unhappy with a point last night but I am disappointed at the way we approached it,as others have said when we changed madine for mcgoldrick we started to play more like our nornal game the last 15 minutes I thought we might have gone on to win it, move on to the next game, at least we didn't lose.

 

[ChemEngBlade]

I am glad someone has started a thread about the tactics.

Wednesday main aim was to stop us playing and getting overlaps - so well done for achieving that.
They tried to close us down at every opportunity and it generally worked - again, well done to them.

But when teams do it - how should we respond.

Hindsight is a wonderful tool, but Wednesday were always going to keep it tight and we should have had Duffy and McG on. We should have gone 3421 and played through them in midfield.

If we go with the same tactics v Leeds, they'll kill us - not only do they close you down and hassle, but they then break at speed - exactly what Wednesday didn't do last night.

McG is the key in games like that - he is all over the place and drops off the front when needed. We've seen it all season and it's ideal playing against teams like last night.

We need better tactics going to Bellend Road in 12 days time.

UTB

We tackle it by having guys who can find pockets of space, take 1 touch, offload then move into space again. Duffy & Fleck can do that. Leeds will press high as they did against West Brom, we just need to be able to find those pockets and be more intelligent

 

[BushBlade]

Cranie actually gave us a real boost, as it turned out, he was excellent. But I'm not sure how much good it did us having Basham in midfield, compared to what a more positive change might have done. Maybe Wilder looked at it and thought it was a waste of time having a player in the 10 position due to how tight and condensed the pitch was - Wednesday did a good job here but tailed off in the last 15 minutes or so.

I think it was obvious our players were unwilling to take risks in the first half, or that they were told not to. The usual composure levels were nowhere to be seen. Again, their tactics and the conditions were a big factor. But surely this suggests at least one of Duffy or McGoldrick should have started?

I called for McGoldrick to start behind Sharp and Madine, and it was his composure, strength and experience that improved us, and proved that it wasn't a waste of time having a player in the 10 position, we just needed the right player there for this game. There is no doubt in my mind that he should have started - especially in those conditions.

The pitch looked shocking on TV, I don’t mean visibly muddy etc but the way the ball ran and bounced, it looked heavy and uneven.

 

[South Bucks]

Thing that cheeses me off is Wilder seems more concerned about not losing than winning and hence the substitutions we've seen in a few games. Could have had em last night.

The two that get the autos will be the ones who go for it and are more interested in winning than not losing.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

We tackle it by having guys who can find pockets of space, take 1 touch, offload then move into space again. Duffy & Fleck can do that. Leeds will press high as they did against West Brom, we just need to be able to find those pockets and be more intelligent

I agree - I wanted 3421 v the pigges with in effect 6 in and around midfield. I want the same v Leeds away.

UTB

 

[Ricky]

Before Cranie came on I think they were starting to look more comfortable and had more possession in midfield. After Basham pushed up, we stopped that trend, and bringing McGoldrick on also helped us.

Taking off the advanced midfielder and pushing Basham up looks a negative move, but it's often a realisation that the pattern of the game is going in the wrong direction and we've got to address it. Sometimes it can be to make us stronger defensively, to help cope with pressure, but last night I thought it was to regain control of the game.

I think Wilder will regret that he chose Dowell over Duffy. Maybe the general plan is to play Dowell if there's space, Duffy if it's tight. As it was at their place and they've had an upturn in form, maybe we expected them to be a bit more adventurous, giving more space for Dowell to exploit. Then if they did drop deep we'd have the added aerial threat of Madine to aim for, something we lacked at the Lane against them.

However they were very disciplined, prevented us from getting our passing going from deep, and we resorted to look for the strikers too early. Our wing backs couldn't do much. Duffy may have helped us linking play better in their half.

So in my opinion the two substitutions helped us, and although I was disappointed not to see Duffy at all, I'm not sure who we should have taken off, given the two previous subs.

I see the reasoning behind occasionally changing to the deeper midfield 3 but I think at 62 minutes it was too early to conclude that Wednesday were gaining control in midfield without us first making a more positive change - a straight McGoldrick for Dowell, ideally. Then maybe Duffy for Madine.

McGoldrick and Duffy can both keep us in the final third longer and fight for the ball in central midfield areas. For me that would have been preferable to just throwing Basham into midfield.

Based on Cranie's performance, a straight swap for Basham would have been desirable, although that's never likely and is based on hindsight.

The change did help us solidify on this occasion and we didn't invite pressure like at Villa, but I don't think it maximised our chances of winning, and it should be said that their only chance (in the last 3 derbies) was created after that change.

 

[Grappler]

McG made a world of difference when he came on, and I genuinely thought that we would have brought Duffy on near the end, if only for the bounce-killing fear factor.

Oh and Cranie, should have started him.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Cranie actually gave us a real boost, as it turned out, he was excellent. But I'm not sure how much good it did us having Basham in midfield, compared to what a more positive change might have done. Maybe Wilder looked at it and thought it was a waste of time having a player in the 10 position due to how tight and condensed the pitch was - Wednesday did a good job here but tailed off in the last 15 minutes or so.

I think it was obvious our players were unwilling to take risks in the first half, or that they were told not to. The usual composure levels were nowhere to be seen. Again, their tactics and the conditions were a big factor. But surely this suggests at least one of Duffy or McGoldrick should have started?

I called for McGoldrick to start behind Sharp and Madine, and it was his composure, strength and experience that improved us, and proved that it wasn't a waste of time having a player in the 10 position, we just needed the right player there for this game. There is no doubt in my mind that he should have started - especially in those conditions.

Agreed - we needed to be much smarter last night. Sadly our change of formations and tactics didn't quite work out. For sure we need to have better v Leeds away - and Brentford at home.

UTB

 

[blade too long]

local derbies are tense horrible games and the weather made it hard to play

if Leeds can go to QPR and lose 1-0 norwich get slapped 3-1 at preston we shouldnt panic over only drawing with Wednesday

 

[blade too long]

after boxing day results we were 10 points behind Leeds and 7 behind Norwich
As It Stood 11 games ago
Team P GD Pts
1 Leeds 24 20 51
2 Norwich 24 15 48
3 West Brom 24 21 45
4 Sheff Utd 24 11 41
5 Middlesbrough 24 8 39
6 Derby 24 5 39
7 Birmingham 24 10 37
8 QPR 24 -1 37

so dont tell me cant close a 4 and 2 point gap in the last 11 games

 

[NotTheSharpest]

That pitch looked full of pock marks I don't know if it was from the heavy rain but it looked in horrible shape which would have benefitted them.

Trotters!

 

[Pinchy]

Thing that cheeses me off is Wilder seems more concerned about not losing than winning and hence the substitutions we've seen in a few games. Could have had em last night.

The two that get the autos will be the ones who go for it and are more interested in winning than not losing.

That’s manifest nonsense. We’ve never had a manager who is more interested in winning rather than not losing. Where have you been for the last three seasons? Why are you ‘cheesed off’ by the best and most effective football we’ve seen in decades?

Jellybabies knee-jerking. What a sight.

 

[Pinchy]

I see the reasoning behind occasionally changing to the deeper midfield 3 but I think at 62 minutes it was too early to conclude that Wednesday were gaining control in midfield without us first making a more positive change - a straight McGoldrick for Dowell, ideally. Then maybe Duffy for Madine.

McGoldrick and Duffy can both keep us in the final third longer and fight for the ball in central midfield areas. For me that would have been preferable to just throwing Basham into midfield.

Based on Cranie's performance, a straight swap for Basham would have been desirable, although that's never likely and is based on hindsight.

The change did help us solidify on this occasion and we didn't invite pressure like at Villa, but I don't think it maximised our chances of winning, and it should be said that their only chance (in the last 3 derbies) was created after that change.

It should also be said that that chance was created by an appalling piece of judgement by Fleck. I do appreciate that, like Sharp, he is immune from criticism. That has to be directed at Madine and Dowell. The better they play; the more some people insist they are left out. Thank Pele the team isn’t selected by a committee of fans.

 

[Shoes_On]

Just out of interest, how many people were complaining about the lineup when it was first announced?

 

[sitwell]

Thing that cheeses me off is Wilder seems more concerned about not losing than winning and hence the substitutions we've seen in a few games. Could have had em last night.

The two that get the autos will be the ones who go for it and are more interested in winning than not losing.

Read that again ,think about it then have a word with yourself. I can help you with one if you want

 

[Houston_Blade]

He bottled it . He didnt want to lose. Simple as, But it will cost us 2nd place. Its now all on the Leeds away game. I know which game i would have rather gone for it more. They were there for the taking. Im gutted. Because Wilder the fan, took over his thoughts. And went through to the players , I love the guy, and he has worked wonders for us. But his fans head tonight has cost us

Have us and Leeds only got 1 game each left this season? I personally still think we'll finish 3rd, however to say it's all on the Leeds game is nonsense, we'll both win, lose and draw between now and the end of the season so that one match is not the be all and end all.

 

[Pinchy]

Just out of interest, how many people were complaining about the lineup when it was first announced?

Hindsight knee-jerking. It’s the Bladesfans’ Way.

 

[DronnieBlade]

Just out of interest, how many people were complaining about the lineup when it was first announced?

Just the one numpty. I believe

UTB

 

[Pinchy]

Have us and Leeds only got 1 game each left this season? I personally still think we'll finish 3rd, however to say it's all on the Leeds game is nonsense, we'll both win, lose and draw between now and the end of the season so that one match is not the be all and end all.

He wants us to know he’s gutted. Ten points out of twelve since Villa, four consecutive clean sheets, and his world has collapsed. Gutted, he is.

 

[BushBlade]

Just out of interest, how many people were complaining about the lineup when it was first announced?

Some fucker will have been. I’m not going to count them. What would be interesting is to see how many who complained last night also complained about the Reading line up before that game.

 

[blade53]

The usual over reaction from some people , it's the Blades way , so many years of let down & false dawns. But we are still in a great position , a point last night wasn't a disaster , though defeat would have been. We can pick it up again and finish the job, I really believe it. That's 4 clean sheets since Villa with 2 winnable home games to come this week. I'm convinced that we will get a result at Leeds , and looking at the remaining fixtures there are games they have where they could slip up. Norwich have a much easier run in & I think they are as good as up . We just have to keep our heads & carry on getting the results for 11 more games .

 

[PokerBlade]

So people are questioning why he went with the forward line that beat West Brom? And people think that was a tactical error on Wilder's part?

It's not Wilder's fault that the team didn't handle Wednesday pressing us and forcing us long as well as they should have. To some extent, it's not even the players' fault. We aren't Celtic marching through the division without a challenge and, despite being mid-table, Wednesday's players aren't entirely competent, neither's their manager.

Crap game, mediocre result, move on.

 

[wizadry]

Why we change our tactics, which has taken us this far, against those wankers, I’ll never know. We are by far the better side and proved so in the last 10 minutes but it was all too late then. We made them look a lot better than they are.

 

[LJBlade]

So people are questioning why he went with the forward line that beat West Brom? And people think that was a tactical error on Wilder's part?

It's not Wilder's fault that the team didn't handle Wednesday pressing us and forcing us long as well as they should have. To some extent, it's not even the players' fault. We aren't Celtic marching through the division without a challenge and, despite being mid-table, Wednesday's players aren't entirely competent, neither's their manager.

Crap game, mediocre result, move on.

He didn't go with the forward line that beat West Brom did he?

 

[PokerBlade]

He didn't go with the forward line that beat West Brom did he?

Sorry, he started McGoldrick there. So the tactical disaster is starting Madine.

 

[northsomersetblade]

A points a point against a revived and tough tackling piggy team playing for new deals in front of Steve Bruce. I can see why CW wanted to try battering them with Madine in the foul weather and they would have looked to give Duffy or any other playmakers a good kicking imho. If that early chance had gone in or that penalty been given we would be singing his praises. Onwards and upwards.

 

[LJBlade]

Sorry, he started McGoldrick there. So the tactical disaster is starting Madine.

Had me questioning myself, I had to check the team again from the West Brom game.