Time to move on?

[snootyfenooty]

Vested interests and I don’t believe it.

I suspect reporting has improved..

Racism in football is much lower than in life in general. (That doesn't keep people in employment mind).

Racism in football is a tiny fraction of what it was in the 70s & 80s. Anyone who says otherwise wasn't there, simple as that really. Those who are tagging all the hate stuff onto football are just as bad themselves in the discrimination department. Cure society of this stuff and you cure it in football at the same time. And don't forget in tackling it you do it from both sides.

 

[ForgeBlade]

Really looking forward to the start of this season and i'd love to think it would be a great time to move on from some of the bitterness some people seem to hold towards some other fans.

The West Ham debacle was 15 years ago, the miners strike nearly 30. Portsmouth and Southampton still bring up a dock strike break from over 100 years ago.

In times where racism and homophobia is thankfully showing signs of lessening it would be great to think we could enjoy the football without bringing up old grudges.

I know some will agree, I also suspect many won't but i'm not going to let anything like this get in the way of me enjoying Saturdays.

Racism, sexism and homophobia have no place in football, or indeed in the world as a whole.

However, I will never have a good word to say about W*st H*m until that revolting, scum-infested excuse for a club is rotting in non-league, and all their cheat-condoning, smug, "cheeky cockernee barrer-boy" fans have cried themselves to sleep over it every night for a year.

Fuck them.

 

[Keef Chedwyn]

I won't be totally happy until racism/sexism/homophobia is banished from life for good.
Not just at football grounds, but everywhere.

What offends me most though, is folks on here thinking that folks such as me, are wanting to be offended. How on earth does that work?

You do seem hell-bent on being offended tbf

 

[Manuel Azaña]

You do seem hell-bent on being offended tbf

No my friend. Far from it, I have my beliefs and my principles in life.
I don't want to be offended, why would anyone?
But if folks think that I am, that's their issue not mine.
If I see, hear, read something I don't like, I make a point to respond.
I feel the same towards people's abuse of animals.
I get involved. That's what i've done since I can recall.

 

[Charlieblade]

Interesting and slightly divisive debate. I need to be careful what I say here obviously, because I'm white, middle aged, and relatively well off. So wealthy, that I cannot afford to live in UK, (I know, because I tried).
I grew up in a small, northern mining community. I met and married a Sheffield lass, whose father was openly racist. Despite, or because of, Sheffield's rich heritage in welcoming ethnic minorities, there remains a few neanderthal attitudes to people who are different.

Black Lives Matter and Gay Pride get some stick in the media. That is no surprise. In my view, neither organisation is necessary, but that's easy for me to say, because I'm a white, middle class/working class product of my environment. Apart from a relatively benign, christian upbringing, my life experience has taught me to understand and accept those things I cannot change.

My racist father in law, and a life well travelled, with a decent education, have taught me to be totally circumspect about life, and people in general. The times, and peoples minds are changing, with or without protest groups for race, gender, and religion. Travel should, and does broaden the mind.
I've lived with the diverse communities in Sheffield, singular religious communities in the middle east and the far east. Experience is a wonderful thing.

I don't like the fact that some people struggle with the silent majority concept, that all of us are different, and we don't need to fear difference or changes in society. As I have a dislike of confrontation, I'm happy to let nature take its course, and evolve naturally. The diaspora of nations and individuals will make that a certainty because of globalisation.

Please don't waste your time on hatred or dislike of miners, gays, or ethnic and religious differences. The times are definitely changing and there's nothing any of us could, or should do to change it.

 

[Manuel Azaña]

The times are definitely changing and there's nothing any of us could, or should do to change it.

I'm off to bed.

 

[Camden Blade]

So, someone reporting racist behaviour might just be kidding, having a laugh?
The racism NEVER actually happened?

Anyone who stood on the terraces at football matches in the 70's and 80's with monkey chants and bananas thrown at black players knows that racism has all been but eliminated from football apart from a tiny unrepresentative minority. The notion that it has increased is utter bollocks. We have more BAME players and fans than ever before. Racism isn't a shadow of what it admittedly used to be in football. And that's progress, that's good and reflects progress in wider society. Those that say otherwise are just do-gooders with a moral superiority complex.

 

[Cerberus Blade]

Really looking forward to the start of this season and i'd love to think it would be a great time to move on from some of the bitterness some people seem to hold towards some other fans.

The West Ham debacle was 15 years ago, the miners strike nearly 30. Portsmouth and Southampton still bring up a dock strike break from over 100 years ago.

In times where racism and homophobia is thankfully showing signs of lessening it would be great to think we could enjoy the football without bringing up old grudges.

I know some will agree, I also suspect many won't but i'm not going to let anything like this get in the way of me enjoying Saturdays.

Alderley Edge?

 

[Cerberus Blade]

Do you all sing the Shoreham boys song? Yep thought so.

I sing

O Sheffield is wonderful
O Sheffield is wonderful
It’s full of cocks, bollocks and United
O Sheffield is wonderful.

And

Shoreham boys
We are here
Shag your men
And drink your Prosecco

I’m not gay or LGBT SYPTE, whatever it is? I’m just trying to balance things up a bit in the interests of being politically correct.

 

[VwBlade]

But can we still sing "Take your time" when we play Norwich?

 

[robbiez666]

Racism is not as bad as the 70s/80s but reporting has risen dramatically. Which is great. People know it's wrong and are willing to take action. However, racism, intolerance, homophobia etc is on the rise because prominent people get away with it.

 

[Berlin Blade]

I am as left leaning and liberal as it gets, I hate tribalism in all walks of life and think it has no place in the world. I have lived in both Manchester and Berlin, both VERY multicultural and diverse cities so I literally don't even see race or sexuality unless I look REALLY hard.

However... When it comes to football I embrace tribalism openly and it makes the game what it is. I am allowed to do that and feel that way. I am not a bad or nasty person for feeling like that. I love football more than anything and taking away the 'us and them' aspect would ruin it for me. I despise Wednesday. I can't explain why and I shouldn't have to.


Without getting too political, there's no doubt that this Tory government literally trying to scrap the human rights act and Brexit being as anti-immigrant as it is has opened the floodgates on racist remarks and ideas being discussed openly. Immigrants have been dehumanised on the front pages of national newspapers or a while now, and you can't expect those ideas and attitudes not to filter down into the general public. Gay rights and ethnic minority rights are now seemingly open for debate. This government has got a lot to answer for.

 

[Pedro's Winger]

I am as left leaning and liberal as it gets, I hate tribalism in all walks of life and think it has no place in the world. I have lived in both Manchester and Berlin, both VERY multicultural and diverse cities so I literally don't even see race or sexuality unless I look REALLY hard.

However... When it comes to football I embrace tribalism openly and it makes the game what it is. I am allowed to do that and feel that way. I am not a bad or nasty person for feeling like that. I love football more than anything and taking away the 'us and them' aspect would ruin it for me. I despise Wednesday. I can't explain why and I shouldn't have to.


Without getting too political, there's no doubt that this Tory government literally trying to scrap the human rights act and Brexit being as anti-immigrant as it is has opened the floodgates on racist remarks and ideas being discussed openly. Immigrants have been dehumanised on the front pages of national newspapers or a while now, and you can't expect those ideas and attitudes not to filter down into the general public. Gay rights and ethnic minority rights are now seemingly open for debate. This government has got a lot to answer for.

I maybe a bit older than you but you can be assured racism didn't start in 2016, immigrants didn't start being dehumanised on the front pages of national newspapers in 2016 and homophobia didn't start in 2016.
Hopefully we can all agree there's nowt wrong with a bit of Hammerphobia either way, even if it's 12 or 13 years on.

 

[don240]

The miners strike nearly 30. Portsmouth and Southampton still bring up a dock strike break from over 100 years ago.

Once a scab, always a scab
Never forget.
Never forgive.

 

[OldBillBlade]

I won't be totally happy until racism/sexism/homophobia is banished from life for good.
Not just at football grounds, but everywhere.

What offends me most though, is folks on here thinking that folks such as me, are wanting to be offended. How on earth does that work?

I'd rather it was that all hatred was banished from life for good!

I suspect you are identifying certain selectors which score more points for virtue signalling.
I don't hate anyone. There are people I don't like, but I don't hate. I don't like people with extreme views, but I don't hate them.
Just challenge all hatred, not just your favourites otherwise you just become a 'look at me', which would be quite sad.
UTB

 

[OldBillBlade]

Once a scab, always a scab
Never forget.
Never forgive.

Why?

 

[OldBillBlade]

I am as left leaning and liberal as it gets, I hate tribalism in all walks of life and think it has no place in the world. I have lived in both Manchester and Berlin, both VERY multicultural and diverse cities so I literally don't even see race or sexuality unless I look REALLY hard.

However... When it comes to football I embrace tribalism openly and it makes the game what it is. I am allowed to do that and feel that way. I am not a bad or nasty person for feeling like that. I love football more than anything and taking away the 'us and them' aspect would ruin it for me. I despise Wednesday. I can't explain why and I shouldn't have to.


Without getting too political, there's no doubt that this Tory government literally trying to scrap the human rights act and Brexit being as anti-immigrant as it is has opened the floodgates on racist remarks and ideas being discussed openly. Immigrants have been dehumanised on the front pages of national newspapers or a while now, and you can't expect those ideas and attitudes not to filter down into the general public. Gay rights and ethnic minority rights are now seemingly open for debate. This government has got a lot to answer for.

Alas Tribalism is core human trait and will never change. The smallest to be is yourself. The largest humanity. In between is everything from your family, through street, estate, post code, sports allegiance, village, town city, county, country region etc etc.
To think that can or will ever change or suggest football tribalism is any different is misguided.
We will always have tribalism, just make sure it never leads to hate for having a tribe you prefer.
A bit unrealistic, but it would be nice!
UTB.

 

[Yoonited]

Do you all sing the Shoreham boys song? Yep thought so.

Err, no not all of us.

 

[raul]

This probably gets me some hate, but what's wrong with shaking Women?

 

[snootyfenooty]

I am as left leaning and liberal as it gets, I hate tribalism in all walks of life and think it has no place in the world. I have lived in both Manchester and Berlin, both VERY multicultural and diverse cities so I literally don't even see race or sexuality unless I look REALLY hard.

However... When it comes to football I embrace tribalism openly and it makes the game what it is. I am allowed to do that and feel that way. I am not a bad or nasty person for feeling like that. I love football more than anything and taking away the 'us and them' aspect would ruin it for me. I despise Wednesday. I can't explain why and I shouldn't have to.


Without getting too political, there's no doubt that this Tory government literally trying to scrap the human rights act and Brexit being as anti-immigrant as it is has opened the floodgates on racist remarks and ideas being discussed openly. Immigrants have been dehumanised on the front pages of national newspapers or a while now, and you can't expect those ideas and attitudes not to filter down into the general public. Gay rights and ethnic minority rights are now seemingly open for debate. This government has got a lot to answer for.

I wonder why anti-semitism doesn't get a mention when all the racist and hate stuff gets aired? I've already commented on the blame-it-all-on-Brexit in post #50. Similarly I'd like to challenge your blame-it-all-on-the-Tories line. As a self-confessed leftie, don't you think they also have a lot to answer for as a result of their recent appalling discriminatory jew-baiting diatribes?

 

[Nick Jansky]

As a self-confessed leftie, don't you think they also have a lot to answer for as a result of their recent appalling discriminatory jew-baiting diatribes?

As another self confessed leftie, yes I absolutely abhor the recent anti semitism as much as islamaphobia. Two cheeks of the same arse at the moment unfortunately, extremists running both main parties.

 

[don240]

Once a scab, always a scab
Never forget.
Never forgive.

Why?

The answer to that is far too long & complicated to answer on here, there have been numerous books & thesis on the subject, if you are genuinely interested I would suggest that you study the fights to abolish the corn laws, the workhouses & to end child labour.
Read up on Peterloo & the 1929 general strike.
It might also be worth reading about how & why the formation of unions & co-operative societys came about.
When working people are fighting for better pay & conditions, or to repeal draconian laws (such as the corn laws) they are not only fighting for themselves, but for a better society.
The scab thinks only of short term monetry gain, nothing of the future & nothing for their fellow worker.

 

[snootyfenooty]

As another self confessed leftie, yes I absolutely abhor the recent anti semitism as much as islamaphobia. Two cheeks of the same arse at the moment unfortunately, extremists running both main parties.

Pretty much what I said earlier, racism needs weeding out from the top down. Racism in football consists of a minority of gobshites who would be cured by a fucking good hiding. The stuff going on in the labour party is institutional and is on a different gravitational level. Find a cure at the top and the residual matter in football will disapear with it. John Barnes said the same thing yesterday despite the efforts of the BBC to twist his words.

BBC Breakfast presenter in racism row with ex-Liverpool player John Barnes

 

[Nick Jansky]

The stuff going on in the labour party is institutional and is on a different gravitational level.

Which of course is no different to the Tory party.

 

[silver blade]

Really looking forward to the start of this season and i'd love to think it would be a great time to move on from some of the bitterness some people seem to hold towards some other fans.

The West Ham debacle was 15 years ago, the miners strike nearly 30. Portsmouth and Southampton still bring up a dock strike break from over 100 years ago.

In times where racism and homophobia is thankfully showing signs of lessening it would be great to think we could enjoy the football without bringing up old grudges.

I know some will agree, I also suspect many won't but i'm not going to let anything like this get in the way of me enjoying Saturdays.

 

[snootyfenooty]

Which of course is no different to the Tory party.

Sure they've got a few Islamaphobes in there. There's probably a few in the Labour party as well. The difference is this is not going on at boardroom level as anti-semitism is in the Labour party.

I'm no Tory by the way so you're not going to get the reaction you're expecting.

 

[essexblade73]

Sure they've got a few Islamaphobes in there. There's probably a few in the Labour party as well. The difference is this is not going on at boardroom level as anti-semitism is in the Labour party.

I'm no Tory by the way so you're not going to get the reaction you're expecting.

So being against the current apartheid regime in israel is anti sematic? Get the fck out of here

 

[Tynemouth Blade]

Hartlepool United & Dover Athletic: Racist chants almost cause players to walk off

Hartlepool United & Dover Athletic: Racist chants almost cause players to walk off

Hartlepool United and Dover Athletic's managers discussed taking their players off the pitch after allegations of racial abuse.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Bert]

Investigation finds ‘no evidence’ of alleged racism against Chelsea’s Rüdiger

Investigation finds ‘no evidence’ of alleged racism against Chelsea’s Rüdiger

Tottenham Hotspur said the Metropolitan Police have ended their investigation into the alleged racial abuse of the Chelsea defender Antonio Rüdiger during the Premier League match last month, having found ‘no evidence to support the allegation’

www.theguardian.com

 

[BushBlade]

Investigation finds ‘no evidence’ of alleged racism against Chelsea’s Rüdiger

Investigation finds ‘no evidence’ of alleged racism against Chelsea’s Rüdiger

Tottenham Hotspur said the Metropolitan Police have ended their investigation into the alleged racial abuse of the Chelsea defender Antonio Rüdiger during the Premier League match last month, having found ‘no evidence to support the allegation’

www.theguardian.com

When I was a kid and you got the big coppers on the kop it was quite common to do things like sing the Laurel and Hardy theme or ‘United hate fucking coppers’. If you did it quickly (particularly as a kid when you can hide amongst the taller adults) you could do it before the copper spotted you.

So it’s quite possible that he heard something but it can’t be proven. It’s equally as possible that he misheard it. It would be surprising and disappointing if he made it up and would probably cause a lot of issues with his team mates.