Southampton

[Jimmy Fleck]

In light of that.... It still amazes me that we finished 9th with a squad of lower league journeymen, on a limited budget, 5 years ago and we were in a European place when lockdown happened.

People don't recognise enough how incredible that achievement was.

Since then the prems gone to a different level. A ready made prem player now costs what? 30m? The physicality is the big difference though- remember Arsenal being giants.

 

[McGrath]

Since then the prems gone to a different level. A ready made prem player now costs what? 30m? The physicality is the big difference though- remember Arsenal being giants.

So it was a very ordinary achievement?

 

[Jimmy Fleck]

So it was a very ordinary achievement?

Nope was phenomenal what we did that season, just saying it’s probably never gonna happen again

 

[CarlMcBlade]

So it's more embarrassing than being the worst? OK then...For all I care we could be on that list 5 out of the 6 entries and so long as we are not the worst, I don't give a toss. Even then it's a push to say it bothers me. Stats like that are just used by plastic fans to fluff up their sense of superiority.

Yeah, I did wonder why they showed the worst 6 instead of maybe the worst 3 or 5.
I’m guessing they thought a club represented twice in the list of shame was quite amusing.

 

[McGrath]

Yeah, I did wonder why they showed the worst 6 instead of maybe the worst 3 or 5.
I’m guessing they thought a club represented twice in the list of shame was quite amusing.

I think they probably didn't even think about it.

Dunno why anyone gives a toss me self about those seasons. Shit happens.... move on!

 

[HOT CURRIE 10]

The thing I hate most about the Premier League is these shitty little southern clubs like Brentford and Bournemouth who are only there because some rich blokes want a toy.

Going down to Bournemouth and losing in a soulless stadium smaller than Rotherhams, in a southern middle class town that's never cared less about our game, kills me.

Sorry,but that is a typical Wednesday statement. Their support and respect has grown immensely over a few years,they both have excellent football teams,stadiums full every week,no matter how big they are,I’d like us to be on their level sometime soon and have the respect other teams give them.

 

[McGrath]

Sorry,but that is a typical Wednesday statement. Their support and respect has grown immensely over a few years,they both have excellent football teams,stadiums full every week,no matter how big they are,I’d like us to be on their level sometime soon and have the respect other teams give them.

Nah it's not. There's no footballing soul in Bournemouth. It's all artificial

They don't deserve anything more than a League Two club. Take away their rich owner and that's where the club will sink back down to. Be like Wigan when Dave Whelan leftm

 

[HOT CURRIE 10]

They deserve everything they are getting, they have got there and stayed there and making a team like Arsenal look like muppets the other week. It doesn’t mean because you have a rich owner you are guaranteed success,it has to be earned.

 

[Kozzy_is_my_Dad]

Don't diminish what they did.

How do you mean?

 

[CarlMcBlade]

I have the upmost respect for what Bournemouth and Brentford have done in the lunatic world of Premier league football. The way they have steadily established themselves as top flight clubs has to be admired.
I think our high and mighty view of both of these clubs is a little outdated, and let’s be honest here, even if we got into Prem with a vastly improved budget we still couldn’t offer potential players the same sort of stability as both Bournemouth Brentford could.

 

[tomtheblade]

Nah it's not. There's no footballing soul in Bournemouth. It's all artificial

They don't deserve anything more than a League Two club. Take away their rich owner and that's where the club will sink back down to. Be like Wigan when Dave Whelan leftm

Artificial fans are those who decide to follow a top premier league club just because they're successful and famous.

It's possible Bournemouth have gained a few glory hunters since they reached the premier league but most of their fans have watched them play in league 2, I really don't see how that's artificial or soulless. There's no glamour to be had at that level: you're a fan because you're from the area, or because of family or because you genuinely love the club.

Having a small old ground is a sign of authenticity not artificiality. Its the out of town concrete bowls that lack character.

One of my friends is a lifelong Bournemouth fan and is just as passionate and genuine a fan as any other supporter.

If your point is that they benefitted from a rich owner then it's almost impossible not to make it without that these days, and the fans don't get to choose their owner either so it's not their fault.

 

[mattbianco1]

we currently more points, wins & goals 12 months ago than southampton & a similar goal difference

View attachment 201039

It's like entering a cunt competition and finishing second

 

[I should coco]

Sorry,but that is a typical Wednesday statement. Their support and respect has grown immensely over a few years,they both have excellent football teams,stadiums full every week,no matter how big they are,I’d like us to be on their level sometime soon and have the respect other teams give them.

I'm with the earlier poster.
Bournemouth have never been football team. The fact that some corpulent US investor, chooses to fund a town the size of Rovrum, is the point. Otherwise, they'd still be pointing out to sea, watching the daily lobster catch.

 

[mattbianco1]

I think the step up in quality has happened in the couple of years after that season though, it's like things rapidly ramped up several gears.

COVID caused it.

The rich clubs pulled away. The poor clubs relying on match day revenue fell away

 

[Ldn_Rd_Blades]

It got a lot harder with the time wasting rules and the 5 subs.

Brought in to placate the American owners that don’t want relegation.

Add to that the spending rules, it’s becoming a close shop. By design imo.

 

[MadDad38]

COVID caused it.

The rich clubs pulled away. The poor clubs relying on match day revenue fell away

In that case how do we explain the fact that Crystal Palace, Bournemouth et al gave us repeated footballing lessons last season?

What ultimately killed us wasn’t the 8-0 hiding from Newcastle, it was that we couldn’t pick up enough points from those two, Fulham, Forest, Everton etc..

 

[CrookesBlade]

yeah thats the way i see it if west ham hadnt cheated with tevez in 2007 we would have stayed up even losing to wigan mind that nob ferguson wasnt totally innocent practically fielding a reserve side in last game against hammers

Never understood the argument that “we didn’t do our job”. It’s easy to ascribe a narrative to a particular game but the table is decided over a full season of 38 games (or 40 as it was in 94)

On both occasions the team that stayed up by a razor thin margin had a significant competitive advantage handed to them which was contrary to the rules. Arguably without this we’d done enough to stay up.

It’s entirely possible of course if Everton and Wimbledon had been asked to play again Everton could have won (although Wimbledon were the better side at the time).

It’s hard to refute though that West Ham would have got at least one goal fewer (or whatever the difference was) if they stuck to the rules everyone else was playing by and didn’t sign Carlos Tevez. There should also have been a sporting punishment applied I.e. a points deduction.

At least we’ve had a couple of horrendous PL seasons as a palette cleanser since then

 

[CrookesBlade]

In that case how do we explain the fact that Crystal Palace, Bournemouth et al gave us repeated footballing lessons last season?

What ultimately killed us wasn’t the 8-0 hiding from Newcastle, it was that we couldn’t pick up enough points from those two, Fulham, Forest, Everton etc..

Was talking about this yesterday - in my opinion the Tottenham defeat with the stoppage time goals killed us and opened the floodgates for the weekly batterings. Up til that point there was a bit of fight in the squad and a few spirited performances.

 

[Grizzly blade]

Controversial opinion here.

Firstly, I’m very happy with the job wilder did back when and has done since he came back.

However, if we are to become a premier league team for the long term like Brighton, Brentford or Bournemouth we will need to become a team that plays the type of football they do.
Possession based, fast athletic and skilful players, most likely sourced from abroad.
We aren’t going to do that picking up scraps from the UK and getting by through passion and “proper Sheff Utd performances”.
Whether that’s with Wilder is the question.

If it’s going to happen it has to start this window, and regardless of whether promoted or not it has to continue in every window thereafter with well scouted players who fit the necessary criterion.
Loans aren’t the answer, it’s building steadily and consistently while maintaining a group and gradually improving year on year.

Do we believe Wilder has that in him to be that manager? Or will he struggle to change from his current way picking up certain types of player?

 

[CarlMcBlade]

I'm with the earlier poster.
Bournemouth have never been football team. The fact that some corpulent US investor, chooses to fund a town the size of Rovrum, is the point. Otherwise, they'd still be pointing out to sea, watching the daily lobster catch.

If they had the foresight to build a decent sized ground I’m sure their large catchment area would provide them with crowds in keeping with an established Premier league outfit.

 

[Rodders]

Controversial opinion here.

Firstly, I’m very happy with the job wilder did back when and has done since he came back.

However, if we are to become a premier league team for the long term like Brighton, Brentford or Bournemouth we will need to become a team that plays the type of football they do.
Possession based, fast athletic and skilful players, most likely sourced from abroad.
We aren’t going to do that picking up scraps from the UK and getting by through passion and “proper Sheff Utd performances”.
Whether that’s with Wilder is the question.

If it’s going to happen it has to start this window, and regardless of whether promoted or not it has to continue in every window thereafter with well scouted players who fit the necessary criterion.
Loans aren’t the answer, it’s building steadily and consistently while maintaining a group and gradually improving year on year.

Do we believe Wilder has that in him to be that manager? Or will he struggle to change from his current way picking up certain types of player?

I don’t think that’s a totally controversial take, BUT the clubs such as Brentford, Brighton etc have all the infrastructure in place to get talent in from all over the world. While ever we don’t, then we’re always going to be scratching around, and paying the “English” tax.
Such an approach would need a director of football etc; Is Wilder open to working in such a manner? He said he was at Boro.
But I do agree with the general premise that swashbuckling performances can only carry a club for so long.

 

[Sheffsteel]

I'm with the earlier poster.
Bournemouth have never been football team. The fact that some corpulent US investor, chooses to fund a town the size of Rovrum, is the point. Otherwise, they'd still be pointing out to sea, watching the daily lobster catch.

Agree.....check the history of football clubs and it shows they are at a similar level to Rotherham and Doncaster.
Not quite as big as Rotherham but slightly bigger than Doncaster

The stats show that Rotherham have a bigger historical average gate and more seasons in the top 2 divisions.

AFCB have spent 14 seasons in the top 2 division and 80 seasons in the bottom 2 divisions.
History shows their normal level isn't even in the Championship. They've spent more seasons in division 4 than in the PL or the Championship.

The Bournemouth success is false/ contrived and not organic/ natural.
I suppose they are a modern day version of AFC Wimbledon where a tiny club ends up in the top flight but they are being bankrolled to stay there.

 

[SGBlade]

I don’t think that’s a totally controversial take, BUT the clubs such as Brentford, Brighton etc have all the infrastructure in place to get talent in from all over the world. While ever we don’t, then we’re always going to be scratching around, and paying the “English” tax.
Such an approach would need a director of football etc; Is Wilder open to working in such a manner? He said he was at Boro.
But I do agree with the general premise that swashbuckling performances can only carry a club for so long.

Agree in general but just trying to copy Brentford, Bournemouth and Brighton exactly will be difficult for us and probably won’t work - they have had 100+ million pumped into them by wealthy owners to transform their stadia, infrastructure and recruitment network. We won’t have that and, as a pretty unfashionable northern club, are unlikely to in the future.

Of course we need to professionalize our scouting and upgrade our training facilities (which it looks like we will) but we’re very unlikely to be able to compete at their levels. I don’t know much about Palace’s journey in the last few years but they seem to have struck a balance and might be a more realistic model for us (similar club, albeit london based).

Personally, I think our secret sauce over the long term should focus around:
1) Our academy - we seem to be incredible at bringing in 16 years olds from other clubs (both Prem cast offs and from elsewhere eg Scotland, non-league) polishing them, and selling them for good money to reinvest.
2) Best young players from lower champ, League 1 and League 2 - Burrows and Cooper are fantastic examples. We wil always be a big draw for these players.
3) Supplement with the odd international signing in the recruitment markets where we are strong (we can’t build a global network to rival the others but we could focus on specific promising markets)

This is a longer-term approach which takes more time to come to fruition than buying the most promising 22 year olds from Africa and South America. But we can build a competitive advantage in these areas (and already have it for No 1).

Just to be clear, we’d still have to make some big, established signings to compete in the Prem (eg paying 30m for Bellingham or Sainz if we went up this year). But this is the model which allows you to fund those deals and build a competent, athletic and fit-for-purpose squad around them for reasonable cash.

To make all this work, I think the DoF / head coach model is a must after Wilder. But for now let’s see if Wilder can work his magic one last time.

 

[gordoncharles]

I must be in the fecking twilight zone. I come on to s24su, blink, and suddenly I'm on Owlstalk with everyone obsessed about attendances and the "rightful" place of clubs.

That's me finished with hallucenogenics

 

[RecordBreakers]

Who gives two shits about any other club?? Blades are all that matter anybody else in football is irrelevant

 

[The Bear]

The thing I hate most about the Premier League is these shitty little southern clubs like Brentford and Bournemouth who are only there because some rich blokes want a toy.

Going down to Bournemouth and losing in a soulless stadium smaller than Rotherhams, in a southern middle class town that's never cared less about our game, kills me.

Sour grapes. Good old Bomo, they have a go. Have more seasons in the PL than SU !

 

[SouthStandGBlock]

I think the step up in quality has happened in the couple of years after that season though, it's like things rapidly ramped up several gears.

I think it's the change to 5 substitutes, means the big clubs, with strong squads can change half their team if they need to.

Wilder voted against it at the time, and he was right.

If the league want to redress some of the imbalance (they don't), then move it back to 3 subs.

A number of times last season we competed until around the 70th minute, subs came on for the opponents, we couldn't match the strength off the bench and we conceded and lost the game.

 

[SouthStandGBlock]

There was only one catch and that was Catch 22 which specified that you need to spend £200m to have a chance of staying up.
But If you do spend £200m you get a points deduction for not meeting FFP/PSR targets.

That's the answer though - Forest set the blueprint.

Other solution is the Brentford/ Brighton model, which we haven't got, unless we can keep Des wired up on coffee 24/7.

 

[Champagneblade]

Yes, my sentiments exactly. Although strangely after the 0-8
I still thought we could stay up, but unfortunately all my hopes of a miracle ended with the first Burnley humiliation.

Southampton have now reached that stage where a lot of the belief has gone and they’re starting to take hammerings.

 

[CarlMcBlade]

Agree.....check the history of football clubs and it shows they are at a similar level to Rotherham and Doncaster.
Not quite as big as Rotherham but slightly bigger than Doncaster

The stats show that Rotherham have a bigger historical average gate and more seasons in the top 2 divisions.

AFCB have spent 14 seasons in the top 2 division and 80 seasons in the bottom 2 divisions.
History shows their normal level isn't even in the Championship. They've spent more seasons in division 4 than in the PL or the Championship.

The Bournemouth success is false/ contrived and not organic/ natural.
I suppose they are a modern day version of AFC Wimbledon where a tiny club ends up in the top flight but they are being bankrolled to stay there.

Every club needs to be bankrolled to stay there. Thing’s change, if Bournemouth stay in the top flight long enough everybody under forty would consider them a Premier league staple, whereas we are seen as that ill equipped Championship club who briefly comes visiting every so often.