Old Photos For No Reason Whatsoever

[Kop sufferer]

Yes undoubtedly those things you mention have all contributed massively to the decline of the city centre. This latest pandemic isn't going to do many favours either.

I read the other day that John Lewis were considering not opening some of their stores. You can bet your life that they'll select the least profitable stores to remain closed. I don't know how the Sheffield store ranks in that regard, but in some cities they have moved to more out of town locations. Bristol and Manchester for example.

The John Lewis store in Sheffield has been on its last legs for about a decade now. I hope they don't close that down because it's one of the few remaining department stores of any note in the city centre.

I waik around the City centre today and dispare, the amount of investment the Council and their partners have put in looks to me that they are flogging a dead horse. The city centre to is just a too longer walk from Moorfoot to Fitzalan Square, but alas we are stuck with it. Cities that offer a more circular area of shops seem to do better

 

[Andingmen]

Ford Corsair indeed Eddie!

The stable-mate to the much more successful Cortina. The Corsair was, in motoring terms, "a bit of a lemon". It replaced the popular Ford Consul, but never reached those heights of popularity. It was dropped altogether when the Mk III Cortina was brought out. It sold approximately 300,000 worldwide during its short lifespan, if you compare that with the Cortina which sold almost 3 million in Britain alone, you get a sense of perspective on its popularity. Even the introduction of a V4 engine in later years did little to inspire folks to buy one.

I quite liked the Ford Corsair. It's pointy. winklepicker looks were a bit avant garde for the day, but I was amongst a minority obviously. Famous owners of the Ford Corsair include The Yorkshire Ripper - who had two of them! and I believe he was in a Ford Corsair (with false number plates) when he was finally caught in Sheffield.

Nowt wrong with the Corsair. Granted, mine had terrible wheel wobble at 55 mph, You could accelerate through it but at the risk of other things falling off.
Thanks to the column change, I did my first serious courting on the front bench seat.
Thinking about it now, maybe that caused the wheel wobble.

 

[I should coco]

Oct 1985. Hoyle Street. Many people just call it all Netherthorpe Road now. The route of Supertram from Shalesmoor to Brook Hill roundabout.

View attachment 83018

View attachment 83019

The big impressive building on the left was British Steel labs from the days when we still made stuff. It became a HSBC computing centre for a few years but is now going to be.....yes, you guessed it, student flats.

My Grandad lived in the middle block of high rise as you look up the road. Saturday dinner routine, fish and chips and a cup of tea, while gently winding up my grandad as he was a big Wednesdayite. Actually all the family were; his 5 brothers, his nephews cousins etc, but fortunately for me one of his two sons saw the light. Actually I think my dad just fell out with Grandad and watched United to spite him.

Then a 10 minute walk down Hanover Way to join the lads on London Road. The last bit hasn't changed but sadly my grandad died in 1996 still with shrapnel in his knee courtesy of the Luftwaffe in North Africa. It gave him some pain, but he could still walk and they feared damaging the knee further by removing it all, so he just lived with it. A different generation to us softies and our even softer offspring, whose feelings and 'rights' have to be protected at all costs.

 

[Cerberus Blade]

I waik around the City centre today and dispare, the amount of investment the Council and their partners have put in looks to me that they are flogging a dead horse. The city centre to is just a too longer walk from Moorfoot to Fitzalan Square, but alas we are stuck with it. Cities that offer a more circular area of shops seem to do better

The Bull Ring in Birmingham? Doesn't get much more circular than that! It's a very nice shopping centre now. I remember when it first opened and it was revolutionary, then it became one of the worst ones in the country until a few year ago when it underwent a huge revamp. It's really nice now with lots of good shops as well.



Now that's what you call a "cheese-grater"!

 

[Cerberus Blade]

Nowt wrong with the Corsair. Granted, mine had terrible wheel wobble at 55 mph, You could accelerate through it but at the risk of other things falling off.
Thanks to the column change, I did my first serious courting on the front bench seat.
Thinking about it now, maybe that caused the wheel wobble.

No squatting on the gear stick in that car eh?

 

[Kop sufferer]

The Bull Ring in Birmingham? Doesn't get much more circular than that! It's a very nice shopping centre now. I remember when it first opened and it was revolutionary, then it became one of the worst ones in the country until a few year ago when it underwent a huge revamp. It's really nice now with lots of good shops as well.

View attachment 83042

Now that's what you call a "cheese-grater"!

That's it CB, I don't know how far it is from Moorfoot to Fitzalan Square, but I'd guess it's pretty unique to have a long 'road/pavement' area which essentially only has shops on each side and no where else. Brum and Manchester are in a different class but Nottingham, Derby, L**ds, and many many more all benefit from an easy access round walk compared to the hike there and back we have here

 

[Cerberus Blade]

That's it CB, I don't know how far it is from Moorfoot to Fitzalan Square, but I'd guess it's pretty unique to have a long 'road/pavement' area which essentially only has shops on each side and no where else. Brum and Manchester are in a different class but Nottingham, Derby, L**ds, and many many more all benefit from an easy access round walk compared to the hike there and back we have here

I was brought up 7 miles from Sheffield, 6 miles from Chesterfield. My mother used to go shopping in Sheffield occasionally, but preferred Chesterfield, because Sheffield was “too spread art”.

She’d like it more now, no doubt, because it’s shrivelled up! That Castle Market area died years ago. as did the Wicker and Fitzalan Square. The Moor died as well, despite attempts to move the market there. The city centre took fright and fled to Barkers Pool and Division Street. Pinstone street, once a busy part of town with lovely Victorian Arcades, is just about all closed up. Fargate has banks, phone shops, charity shops and vaping shops. So sad!

I like the new stuff in the city centre (the cheese grater, St Paul’s and that Winter Garden area I think is great). And all that new stuff near the old Grosvenor hotel. I hope it can breathe new life into it, but truthfully, I’m not sure it can.

If the big names to occupy those places are H&M and Primark it’s only going on one direction.

 

[BushBlade]

I don’t really get this ‘too spread out’ thing. Stayed in town last autumn and had a good walk round and it seemed a lot smaller than I remember it. For me, it’s the parking that’s an issue. People want to take their cars, because if you’re buying a few things you want to stick them in the boot rather than carrying bags back on public transport. It’s expensive to park in town.

 

[Sean Thornton]

I don’t really get this ‘too spread out’ thing. Stayed in town last autumn and had a good walk round and it seemed a lot smaller than I remember it. For me, it’s the parking that’s an issue. People want to take their cars, because if you’re buying a few things you want to stick them in the boot rather than carrying bags back on public transport. It’s expensive to park in town.

It’s not about being too spread out, that’s a fallacy, it’s the fact that in many areas of the city centre, there’s absolutely nothing of interest to anyone looking for interesting independents. Other than the areas around the Peace Gardens side of Pinstone Street and Division Street up to the Forum beer “garden” It’s pretty dire even with the recent improvements. John Lewis is still our premier store. Try John Lewis in Liverpool and the Barkers Pool store seems like Patnicks in comparison, which is very sad considering as JL basically held the city centre together for so long. (Hopefully it stays open though).

 

[BushBlade]

It’s not about being too spread out, that’s a fallacy, it’s the fact that in many areas of the city centre, there’s absolutely nothing of interest to anyone looking for interesting independents. Other than the areas around the Peace Gardens side of Pinstone Street and Division Street up to the Forum beer “garden” It’s pretty dire even with the recent improvements. John Lewis is still our premier store. Try John Lewis in Liverpool and the Barkers Pool store seems like Patnicks in comparison, which is very sad considering as JL basically held the city centre together for so long. (Hopefully it stays open though).

Low wage city as well, can’t help.

The UK towns and cities with the highest and lowest wages

The towns and cities offering the best incomes aren't always the ones you'd expect.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Sean Thornton]

Low wage city as well, can’t help.

The UK towns and cities with the highest and lowest wages

The towns and cities offering the best incomes aren't always the ones you'd expect.

www.bbc.co.uk

I think general outlook helps as well. A couple of Soul Weekenders in Liverpool City Centre opened my eyes. Trendy bars, upmarket and concrete floored warehouses both, with bar prices well below Sheffield Centre bars.

 

[Ivanhoe]

The thing that often surprises me about some of these old photos of Sheffield is that they look "busy". It seems there is a lot going on, people out in the street, shopping, working. They give me a feeling that things were prosperous, people engaged. Look at how many different businesses there are in that one picture alone. And not a charity shop, nail bar or vaping store in sight!

That chap carrying the sack of something on his shoulder...he'd be stopped from doing that now. His employer wouldn't want the liability of him injuring himself by doing so. That would be a 2 man job now and they'd probably have a little trolley to put it in.

A bit like when I was a kid... this was a common sight...

View attachment 83006

Dustbin men, carrying metal dustbins, often filled with hot ashes from the coal fires which everyone used to have. They'd sling off the lid, then hoist the bin up onto their shoulders and walk them to the dustbin lorry, which looked like this...
View attachment 83007

(That looks like a Bedford O series to me btw)

The sides of the dustbin lorry used to lift up (you can see the handles on the sliding panels) and the contents of the bin were manually tipped into the lorry.

Years later, the depositing of hot ashes into dustbins became illegal? I certainly remember a new type of dustbin lid which had "No hot ashes" embossed on it. And then of course, the manual tipping disappeared with the advent of these...

View attachment 83008

The Seddon dustbin lorry - which did the heavy lifting and spawned a new generation of dustbin men, who were prized not for their ability to lift heavy things, but to push wheeled dustbins as fast as they can and then leave them randomly along the pavement for the general public to work out which belonged to whom?

I can remember the bin-men rolling the bins on their axis's rather than carrying them.. like spinning plates..

 

[Cerberus Blade]

I don’t really get this ‘too spread out’ thing. Stayed in town last autumn and had a good walk round and it seemed a lot smaller than I remember it. For me, it’s the parking that’s an issue. People want to take their cars, because if you’re buying a few things you want to stick them in the boot rather than carrying bags back on public transport. It’s expensive to park in town.

I don't think it's too spread out now, I think the opposite - there's not enough of it! I'm referring to the 1960's when Sheffield "city centre" effectively started down by the Wicker/Castle Market and all around that area and ran all the way down to Moorfoot, with a lot of choice of shops from one end to the other. The sheer number of big department stores back then was considerable and they were spread all over the city, like this one on Angel Street,



then you had other big stores like Robert Brothers, John Walsh, Cole Brothers, Paulden's, Atkinson's, etc, spread from one end of town to the other. At one time you could have said that the High Street/Fargate area was the shopping epicentre of the city, but over the years that's changed. The fringes of the city centre are pretty much dead for shoppers now and things are much more concentrated in terms of the main shopping area.

I think what it needs, what all cities need in fact, is a central area where all the main big stores are situated. That then has pulling power, a reason to go there. I appreciate that's what we are trying to do with the new shopping centre, I just hope we can make it work.

Totally agree about the parking btw. And it's expensive. I tend not to drive into town very much for shopping, but on the last occasion I think I ended up parking in the cheesegrater which cost an arm and a leg! Time before that it was the NCP down Campo Lane - ditto. John Lewis car park is probably the most reasonably priced central car park. I can see why folks think, "sod it - let's go to Meadowhall instead".

 

[BushBlade]

I don't think it's too spread out now, I think the opposite - there's not enough of it! I'm referring to the 1960's when Sheffield "city centre" effectively started down by the Wicker/Castle Market and all around that area and ran all the way down to Moorfoot, with a lot of choice of shops from one end to the other. The sheer number of big department stores back then was considerable and they were spread all over the city, like this one on Angel Street,

View attachment 83107

then you had other big stores like Robert Brothers, John Walsh, Cole Brothers, Paulden's, Atkinson's, etc, spread from one end of town to the other. At one time you could have said that the High Street/Fargate area was the shopping epicentre of the city, but over the years that's changed. The fringes of the city centre are pretty much dead for shoppers now and things are much more concentrated in terms of the main shopping area.

I think what it needs, what all cities need in fact, is a central area where all the main big stores are situated. That then has pulling power, a reason to go there. I appreciate that's what we are trying to do with the new shopping centre, I just hope we can make it work.

Totally agree about the parking btw. And it's expensive. I tend not to drive into town very much for shopping, but on the last occasion I think I ended up parking in the cheesegrater which cost an arm and a leg! Time before that it was the NCP down Campo Lane - ditto. John Lewis car park is probably the most reasonably priced central car park. I can see why folks think, "sod it - let's go to Meadowhall instead".

I remember being dragged around all of those apart from Paulden’s. Even then, from the bottom of Waingate to the bottom of the Moor, it’s about a mile. From Marble Arch walking along Oxford Street to Tottenham Court Road, it’s just over a mile. That’s just Oxford Street, a small part of the main shopping area. Considering it’s a large city, Sheffield city centre isn’t ridiculously big. I can remember the Wicker from the early 70s and there wasn’t much down there in terms of shops.

Anyway, here’s a picture of Wicker Station, then a goods station but apparently a passenger station before the Midland was built.

 

[S64 Blade]

The city centre is definitely too spread out. It is less spread than it was 10 years ago, since the markets moved and more recently, Primark. The real shopping thoroughfare now is top & tailed at Moorfoot/High Street.

We are yet to see how things now progress in the future, but to me, having an almost blank template in the city centre currently, could be a good thing - if managed properly (unlikely). Anyone who thinks that shopping is going to continue as it was before, is mistaken.

Bricks and mortar retail has already been struggling for years and the lock down will have only furthered people's habits to buying online and online retailers are only going to continue to grow and innovative, making it cheaper and easier. Similarly, I can't see how some of the current plans for the centre, to build 0000s of square feet of office space are going to be viable in the long-term. Most organisations have proven that they can operate remotely and I'm sure most will be keen to reduce their real estate expenditure, when current leases expire and downsize to space that's at a much reduced desk capacity (HSBC did this with their new office even before the lock down).

I think leisure (as well as housing) is the way to go. People spend more and more money on experiences, rather than possessions, so if I was the city council I'd be seriously thinking of innovating and exciting opportunities here. What big attractions can we bring to the heart of the city to bring people here?

I'm brainstorming, but thinking about the current zeitgeist, perhaps a museum on diversity and inclusivity - Sheffield is known as the 'city of sanctuary', has a history of social reform and on the whole, is a tolerant place, so why not tell the story of the struggles of minorities and educate people. I'm not talking about at a local level either, but have it as a national museum to properly lay out Britain's murky role in the past and bring that through to the future and new hope. I've no idea who makes these kind of decision (suspect it's not really something the council can do), but I personally think it'd be something unique that would be attractive to many.

 

[I should coco]

I remember being dragged around all of those apart from Paulden’s

Pauldens was Debenhams. Your mum would have dragged you in through the corner doors that faced Pinstone Street and Furnival Gate. You would have got a tantalising glimpse of the Redgates sign, before being forced down the stairs to have your nose assaulted by old lady perfumes and watch you mum trying on a pair of shoes.
And another...
and another.
Toys were usually on the top floor in the 70s/80s but they could disappear when Debenhams alternatively consolidated/expanded their range, depending on the retail trend at the time.

After Pauldens you'd only have Atkinsons to suffer, unless your mum hadn't found what she wanted and had an inspiration to visit the S&E Arcade at the bottom of Eccy Road.

 

[bornablade]

Pauldens was Debenhams. Your mum would have dragged you in through the corner doors that faced Pinstone Street and Furnival Gate. You would have got a tantalising glimpse of the Redgates sign, before being forced down the stairs to have your nose assaulted by old lady perfumes and watch you mum trying on a pair of shoes.
And another...
and another.
Toys were usually on the top floor in the 70s/80s but they could disappear when Debenhams alternatively consolidated/expanded their range, depending on the retail trend at the time.

After Pauldens you'd only have Atkinsons to suffer, unless your mum hadn't found what she wanted and had an inspiration to visit the S&E Arcade at the bottom of Eccy Road.

Used to go in Atkinsons on a Saturday morning. In their cafeteria. My great aunt worked in there so it gave my mum a chance to catch up. They had a trio all dressed in dinner suits (at 10.30 in the morning) playing light jazz music. As you say it was Redgates that you wanted to go in.

Downstairs was Muffin the Mule - a kids coin operated ride. It's still there which must make it the best value for money piece of kit in Sheffield. Certainly longer shelf life than the Town Hall extension.

(Unless it's like Triggers broom, new head, new body, new legs).

 

[Andingmen]

It's pretty clear from these posts about the city centre that many of us have not just SUFC as our passion but also the city itself. We all, of course, have our different views and opinions about the way things have been and are being implemented. In my case it's from a completely amateur perspective. I have used this site below , which many on here already will also be familiar with, which gives an interesting angle on most of the ongoing and proposed projects, particularly in the centre
It's used by relevant professionals and interested amateurs alike and generally gives a critical, informed and detailed discussion on all the projects, often explaining the rationale behind many of the seemingly illogical decisions made.
Like many others, sometimes my heart bleeds when I think of our weak city leadership, but, having frequented this site for a considerable while now, overall I remain pretty optimistic for our city.

Sheffield Metro Area

For Sheffield, Doncaster and Rotherham

www.skyscrapercity.com

 

[benn5712]

C&A. Coats and 'ats. I was press ganged round there regularly as a nipper. Hated it.
I eventually dug my heels in and would stand at the staircase between floors. Ma would collect me when she'd done.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Pauldens was Debenhams. Your mum would have dragged you in through the corner doors that faced Pinstone Street and Furnival Gate. You would have got a tantalising glimpse of the Redgates sign, before being forced down the stairs to have your nose assaulted by old lady perfumes and watch you mum trying on a pair of shoes.
And another...
and another.
Toys were usually on the top floor in the 70s/80s but they could disappear when Debenhams alternatively consolidated/expanded their range, depending on the retail trend at the time.

After Pauldens you'd only have Atkinsons to suffer, unless your mum hadn't found what she wanted and had an inspiration to visit the S&E Arcade at the bottom of Eccy Road.

Roberts Brothers!!

 

[BushBlade]

Roberts Brothers!!

I think that was a bit further down the Moor.

 

[Sean Thornton]

I think that was a bit further down the Moor.

I thought it was between Pauldens and Atkinsons?

 

[Eddiecolquhounsleg]

I thought it was between Pauldens and Atkinsons?

It was. Here's a picture with Roberts Brothers just below Pauldens. Atkinson's is out of the shot on the left. Roberts Brothers was like Grace Brothers but without the laughs. And don't get me started on the Moggie, Ford Anglia and Ford Cortina in this shot

 

[BushBlade]

I thought it was between Pauldens and Atkinsons?

Yes, sorry, I thought you were saying Debenhams used to be Roberts. I realise now you meant I’d have been dragged in there before Atkinsons. Which is correct. I was. Don’t remember Pauldens, I always remember it as Debenhams. Which we never went into, as my Mum just didn’t like it.

 

[XM657]

I remember being dragged around all of those apart from Paulden’s. Even then, from the bottom of Waingate to the bottom of the Moor, it’s about a mile. From Marble Arch walking along Oxford Street to Tottenham Court Road, it’s just over a mile. That’s just Oxford Street, a small part of the main shopping area. Considering it’s a large city, Sheffield city centre isn’t ridiculously big. I can remember the Wicker from the early 70s and there wasn’t much down there in terms of shops.

Anyway, here’s a picture of Wicker Station, then a goods station but apparently a passenger station before the Midland was built.

View attachment 83121

Like for the photo of what you say is Wicker station, would that be the goods station on Broad St.? Passing it on the tram as a kid made me think Sheffield must be an important place to have two station, Vic. and L.M.S., and a station just for goods. On a 1905 OS map its called City Station L&NWR (Goods). I never realised it had originally been for passenger and maybe the first large station in Sheffield.
WOOOOW!!!!!, Keks in a twist, this is the one on Saville St., which I never realised had been a station always thought it a goods yard. Map says, Wicker Station,(M.R. Goods), presumably that's Midland Region. Four stations, metropolis.
Well, thanks for the info, sorry for the hic up but it is 1710 and we all know what's happening in 50 minutes.

 

[Trigger Blade]

(Unless it's like Triggers broom, new head, new body, new legs).

I could do with all of those

 

[GeorgeLColdwell]

Hi guys, im the grandson of Cecil Coldwell, and im trying to find out a bit more about his playing time, since he can't be with us today. Dad doesnt say much about his time now because apperantly the club treated him unfairly, but i just want to hear some fun stories about him, thanks https://images.app.goo.gl/ujiw2BXdkpsgKNL48

 

[XM657]

Hi guys, im the grandson of Cecil Coldwell, and im trying to find out a bit more about his playing time, since he can't be with us today. Dad doesnt say much about his time now because apperantly the club treated him unfairly, but i just want to hear some fun stories about him, thanks https://images.app.goo.gl/ujiw2BXdkpsgKNL48

No stories just an honest opinion from memories. His left leg was for standing on, or at least that's what they used to say on the terrace in an affectionate way rather than a critical one.
He was well liked and I'm sure you know ,one of the members of the almost ever present defence of the 1960's. Well liked and respected with supporters, a stalwart of the club for many years.
Positive there will be more members along in time with better offerings than myself. Will endeavor to post photos later, have you any of him playing that have not been widely seen before? Sure there would be more than myself who would be interested to see them, Many thanks in advance if there are any.

 

[bornablade]

Hi guys, im the grandson of Cecil Coldwell, and im trying to find out a bit more about his playing time, since he can't be with us today. Dad doesnt say much about his time now because apperantly the club treated him unfairly, but i just want to hear some fun stories about him, thanks https://images.app.goo.gl/ujiw2BXdkpsgKNL48

Cec Coldwell was part of a great defence made up of Alan Hodgkinson, Cec, Graham Shaw, Brian Richardson, Joe Shaw & Gerry Summers.

They played hundreds of games together. At present we have a superb defence under Chris Wilder and many of us old 'uns have compared favourably today's defence to the one your grandad played in. Can't really give any higher praise than that.

The one thing I always think of when referring to Cec was the fact he started at Norton Woodseats.

As a stand in caretaker manager he achieved a very good win percentage.

 

[GeorgeLColdwell]

Cheers for responses, I've seen few images and videos, and we have a few picture frames around the house, his testimonial being a note one on the landing. I've been told he was part of united's best defence but I lost him when I was too young to understand the type of guy he was, its nice to see he was respected by many