Is there any side set up quite like us?

[Scooter_mcgavin]

We talk of this 3-5-2 formation, Conte and now Wender are also playing a similar formation.

BUT and it's a huge BUT....

Is there any side out there that actually has Centre Halves that double up as fekkin wingers?!!?!? Basham and O'Connell are constantly looking to overlap the wing backs, it must be an utter nightmare to defend against (as we have shown when on the front foot in our home games and vs Sunderland).

CCV come in yesterday and he slotted in superbly, a few times overlapping Baldock, or simply offering an option out wide.

At times our side is so attack minded it's bordering suicidal.

FUCKING LOVE IT!

 

[Tunstall Fred]

Confidence,Fitness and team discipline are the key to why our defenders can go gallivanting up the park,they know that if they are caught upfield one of the midfield will have slotted in to cover,

It is like you say,a joy to watch

 

[itsinyerblood]

I remember Wilder dismissing the reduction of a midfielder's role - what he said was that a player is a midfielder, therefore why restrict yourself to one measly part of your role as a footballer? Thus we have centre halves doing something we're not accustomed to. It's nice to see grown men, obviously possessed of skill and ability, doing something unorthodox.

I recall an author - Bernard Shaw I think - whose character commented something to the effect - "Some people ask why? I ask, why not?"

I think this captures Wilder's combination of the practical with the possible, so why not try this, that, or whatever, as long as there's discipline enabling positions to be covered we can attack in whatever way is comfortable for the players.

 

[Stretch]

We talk of this 3-5-2 formation, Conte and now Wender are also playing a similar formation.

BUT and it's a huge BUT....

Is there any side out there that actually has Centre Halves that double up as fekkin wingers?!!?!? Basham and O'Connell are constantly looking to overlap the wing backs, it must be an utter nightmare to defend against (as we have shown when on the front foot in our home games and vs Sunderland).

CCV come in yesterday and he slotted in superbly, a few times overlapping Baldock, or simply offering an option out wide.

At times our side is so attack minded it's bordering suicidal.

FUCKING LOVE IT!

Often thought the same and I am still amazed that we don't ship more goals. Wright can't do all the defending so I assume at least one of the other CBs stays back to support him with a CM and or WB.
Unfortunately my brain doesn't work fast enough to analyse all this during a game, so fuck knows

 

[Scooter_mcgavin]

Often thought the same and I am still amazed that we don't ship more goals. Wright can't do all the defending so I assume at least one of the other CBs stays back to support him with a CM and or WB.
Unfortunately my brain doesn't work fast enough to analyse all this during a game, so fuck knows

I thought we'd concede more goals too, due to our attacking mentality.

However, we've barely looked like conceding in our last 4 games.

 

[elgoog44]

I thought we'd concede more goals too, due to our attacking mentality.

However, we've barely looked like conceding in our last 4 games.

I bet the majority of teams we are played thus far thought we might as well

 

[Boxer Blade]

Yes but last season we were told early on that teams would find us out, they didn't, or couldn't, was told in the summer yes but you wont be able to play like that in the championship, well we will see, not doing too bad at the moment though, are we?

 

[Grizzly blade]

Organisation. Hard Work. Team ethic.

All prepared to cover for each other, all happy to do the donkey work, and everyone prepared to do a job for their mate.

You won't see that at Arsenal. I believe Conte has the minerals to get it right though. As shown by his expert handling of that pig ugly Spanish twat who thinks he's Brazilian.

 

[JohnDenver]

I remember when we played 3 centre backs under Spackman. He allowed the central man to step out, but what we do now to overload the flanks is far far better. And we have the players to do it.

 

[RMBlade]

We talk of this 3-5-2 formation, Conte and now Wender are also playing a similar formation.

BUT and it's a huge BUT....

Is there any side out there that actually has Centre Halves that double up as fekkin wingers?!!?!? Basham and O'Connell are constantly looking to overlap the wing backs, it must be an utter nightmare to defend against (as we have shown when on the front foot in our home games and vs Sunderland).

CCV come in yesterday and he slotted in superbly, a few times overlapping Baldock, or simply offering an option out wide.

At times our side is so attack minded it's bordering suicidal.

FUCKING LOVE IT!

I think the big difference between how we set up and how Chelsea and Arsenal setup is the role of central CB.

Take Chelsea for example. Their CCB is David Luiz who is a ball playing CB who will step up into midfield and cover the space in front of the defence whilst the wide center backs are the deepest. Spurs play a very similar way with their 4-2-3-1. The full backs push and a defensive midfielder (usually Dier) will drop deeper creating a back three.

United on the other hand use the CCB as the deepest player and he orchestrates the defence. When attacking 1 wide CB will push on along with the wing backs. When this happens 1 of Coutts or Fleck with stay back. They wont be as deep as the CB's but they will provide cover for the CB that has gone forward.

All 3 systems are very similar. and provide a similar amount cover and threat in similar area's.

 

[RMBlade]

As shown by his expert handling of that pig ugly Spanish twat who thinks he's Brazilian.

It is the other way round. He is a pig ugly Brazilian who thinks he is Spanish.

Looks like the guy who works in my local kebab shop too.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Yes but last season we were told early on that teams would find us out, they didn't, or couldn't, was told in the summer yes but you wont be able to play like that in the championship, well we will see, not doing too bad at the moment though, are we?

I am interested to know "who" said we would be found out - it isn't the very same Wednesdayites saying we would get found out in the Championship.

We appear to be breaking the mold of how football used to be played and inventing something quite different - long may it continue.

UTB

 

[SwissBlade]

We talk of this 3-5-2 formation, Conte and now Wender are also playing a similar formation.

BUT and it's a huge BUT....

Is there any side out there that actually has Centre Halves that double up as fekkin wingers?!!?!? Basham and O'Connell are constantly looking to overlap the wing backs, it must be an utter nightmare to defend against (as we have shown when on the front foot in our home games and vs Sunderland).

CCV come in yesterday and he slotted in superbly, a few times overlapping Baldock, or simply offering an option out wide.

At times our side is so attack minded it's bordering suicidal.

FUCKING LOVE IT!

But its nowhere near suicidal. Suicidal would be trying to attack teams from the off and not getting back, being unorganised, like Keegans Newcastle.

We defend resolutely and we attack on the counter in numbers, but only when we have got ahead. The worst thing a side can do is go behind to us.

We defend in numbers and build slowly when its 0-0, we're patient and organised as we move forward as a unit. We are happy without possession as we are so well organised that when the ball breaks, we have the players to move the ball from back to front quickly and it presents more chances to split the defence up on the very edge of the final third, last night Sunderland and Derby being examples.

Perhaps the Brentford game was more akin to suicide as we weren't organised. However more recently we've looked very organised.

 

[TTMeysh]

Is there any side out there that actually has Centre Halves that double up as fekkin wingers?!!?!?

This, very much. It is interesting to be sat near the management duo during a game, a lot of their coaching from the dugout is directed at the spare CB encouraging him to get into a position to be available for the pass. Fleck's willingness to then make yards to plug any resultant gap if we lose the ball is, as others have mentioned, a key element of making this work.

In theory, the response to nullify this would be our opponents playing 4-2-3-1 with the wide players pushed right up on the wing-backs, but so far I haven't seen anyone execute this against us.

 

[Harrisblade]

I think the big difference between how we set up and how Chelsea and Arsenal setup is the role of central CB.

Take Chelsea for example. Their CCB is David Luiz who is a ball playing CB who will step up into midfield and cover the space in front of the defence whilst the wide center backs are the deepest. Spurs play a very similar way with their 4-2-3-1. The full backs push and a defensive midfielder (usually Dier) will drop deeper creating a back three.

United on the other hand use the CCB as the deepest player and he orchestrates the defence. When attacking 1 wide CB will push on along with the wing backs. When this happens 1 of Coutts or Fleck with stay back. They wont be as deep as the CB's but they will provide cover for the CB that has gone forward.

All 3 systems are very similar. and provide a similar amount cover and threat in similar area's.

Bloody hell - don't tell everyone how the system works !!!!


Erm' could you just go over it again please?

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Perhaps the Brentford game was more akin to suicide as we weren't organised. However more recently we've looked very organised.

I agree with you here - we are looking more organised as each game goes on. Considering the changes last night we still looked organised, and for me, it's primarily down to Jake Wright - he just brings that to the team. Last night he was bloody anonymous most of the time, but you just know he has to be there.

I didn't see the Brentford game, but it could just have been new division, big crowd, playing apparent promotion favourites. What is very clear is we are learning lessons very quickly about the division and the opposition.

I'll tip up on Saturday expecting to beat Norwich - it shouldn't really be like that so early in the season. Long may it continue and keep that bubble bursting pin locked up!

UTB

 

[BushBlade]

I recall Pochettino played 3 at the back during part of last season (and I believe he did so against Everton on Saturday but I haven't seen it) allowing both Vertongen and Alderwireld to go forward at times and start attacks.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

I remember Wilder dismissing the reduction of a midfielder's role - what he said was that a player is a midfielder, therefore why restrict yourself to one measly part of your role as a footballer? Thus we have centre halves doing something we're not accustomed to. It's nice to see grown men, obviously possessed of skill and ability, doing something unorthodox.

I recall an author - Bernard Shaw I think - whose character commented something to the effect - "Some people ask why? I ask, why not?"

I think this captures Wilder's combination of the practical with the possible, so why not try this, that, or whatever, as long as there's discipline enabling positions to be covered we can attack in whatever way is comfortable for the players.

I think you might need to replace “Wilder” with “Knill” in that post. Otherwise I agree. Wilder has talked about not liking tactics being quoted as saying “Knilly likes tactics”. I suspect he is the true mastermind behind the incredible fluidity with which we play. I think Wilder is the personality that puts the fire in their bellies and gives them that extra 10 percent making what we see even better.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Often thought the same and I am still amazed that we don't ship more goals. Wright can't do all the defending so I assume at least one of the other CBs stays back to support him with a CM and or WB.
Unfortunately my brain doesn't work fast enough to analyse all this during a game, so fuck knows

The team sort of rotates on an axis of Duffy whichever side we attack down



If we’re attacking down the right it becomes something like



-----------------Blackman

Wright-------O’Connell

---------------------------Fleck

---Basham----Coutts---------------------Stevens

Freeman-----------Duffy-----------Sharp

------------------Clarke-



When attacking down the left it becomes









--------------------Blackman



------------------------Basham----------Wright

-------------------Coutts

Freeman------------------------Fleck--------------O’Connell

-----------Clarke-----------Duffy------------------------Stevens

-------------------------------Sharp





If you ‘re looking on your phone. Rotate it 45% either side for each scenario and you come almost back to the 352 we start with. Duffy acts as a fulcrum around which the team rotates. As a result, we effectively play with 2 at the back when we have the ball as one CB is always given the license to bomb on. It really is mesmerizing to watch at times.

 

[itsinyerblood]

I think you might need to replace “Wilder” with “Knill” in that post. Otherwise I agree. Wilder has talked about not liking tactics being quoted as saying “Knilly likes tactics”. I suspect he is the true mastermind behind the incredible fluidity with which we play. I think Wilder is the personality that puts the fire in their bellies and gives them that extra 10 percent making what we see even better.

Fair point dane. Personally I think it's less about Knill moulding the players, than Knill and Wilder communicating to each other about who does what and who is capable of performing outside of their supposed 'comfort zone'. We have a classic managerial pairing in Chris and Alan, and it strikes me that Knill, previously a manager, now seems happy to play second in command. I doubt that titles mean a great deal between the pair of them but for appearances it gives some sort of guide as to who does what.

 

[HodgysBrokenThumb]

We talk of this 3-5-2 formation, Conte and now Wender are also playing a similar formation.

BUT and it's a huge BUT....

Is there any side out there that actually has Centre Halves that double up as fekkin wingers?!!?!? Basham and O'Connell are constantly looking to overlap the wing backs, it must be an utter nightmare to defend against (as we have shown when on the front foot in our home games and vs Sunderland).

CCV come in yesterday and he slotted in superbly, a few times overlapping Baldock, or simply offering an option out wide.

At times our side is so attack minded it's bordering suicidal.

FUCKING LOVE IT!

You are right about the centre-halves. I read an interview with Duffy recently (Star?) where he said he heard opposition players last season bewildered at where attackers were appearing from and with no idea who should be picking them up. Huge credit to the tacticians, and to the players responsible. Probably helps that they know they won't get a bollocking if the attack breaks down and they are stranded upfield.

 

[Boxer Blade]

I am interested to know "who" said we would be found out - it isn't the very same Wednesdayites saying we would get found out in the Championship.

We appear to be breaking the mold of how football used to be played and inventing something quite different - long may it continue.

UTB

You are right Fulwood, long my it continue, however am I alone in thinking it can't last? Sorry to sound slightly negative, not saying it wont but it may be because the last six years has made me think differently. Mind you each week that goes by and the journey keeps on going, ask me in April.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

You are right Fulwood, long my it continue, however am I alone in thinking it can't last? Sorry to sound slightly negative, not saying it wont but it may be because the last six years has made me think differently. Mind you each week that goes by and the journey keeps on going, ask me in April.

to be fair - we all think the worst of our team at times and all we can do is approach Norwich in a similar way to Bolton. We'll know what they are about and will hopefully prepare accordingly. It is noticeable that CW is alluding to how other teams change to suit us now - not the other way round as Clough used to do.
UTB

 

[I should coco]

We appear to be breaking the mold of how football used to be played and inventing something quite different

And as a pedant and long time UK resident, we also appear to breaking the mould of how spellings are done in this country.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

And as a pedant and long time UK resident, we also appear to breaking the mould of how spellings are done in this country.

my speeling has always been poor - can't help being like Office Crabtree in ello ello !

UTB

 

[beatific blade]

I think Harry Maguire would look incredible in our current system.

Shame Wilder didn't come in sooner!

 

[Boxer Blade]

to be fair - we all think the worst of our team at times and all we can do is approach Norwich in a similar way to Bolton. We'll know what they are about and will hopefully prepare accordingly. It is noticeable that CW is alluding to how other teams change to suit us now - not the other way round as Clough used to do.
UTB

Think the time to start worrying is when we start as favourites, we really do enjoy being the underdog

 

[Groucho Blade]

Not breaking the mold, more like scraping it off and starting again.

 

[Hull Blade]

Being fluid is the way forward. The ability to switch formations at a moments notice....to counteract the opposition.
e.g the back 3 becoming a back 5, leaving 3 in the middle with 2 wide and 2 up top to play on the counter attack...

PS...I've been to Mold.....Its in Wales...I think

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Think the time to start worrying is when we start as favourites, we really do enjoy being the underdog

Indeed and if we carry on like this, it won't be long before the football world looks up and takes notice.

I'd like to be favorites though - there are a lot of pundits that are good at their job and recognition for what CW and the team are doing would be good and raise the profile..............We're on the march...........as the song went last night again at Bolton.

UTB