Hassan Ayari

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Gimli said:
Ball_Sup (Phil) would you concur with the assessment that Ayari looks to be an ‘unreal talent’?
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Gimli I'll play that one as I see it. What? No
Unreal talent? As in unreal? No. Of course not. Talent as in - obviously destined for the First Team - sort of talent? No. It's absurd isn't it?
Is he a good player, on park pitches, playing in what is effectively Utd's sixth XI? Hell yes. In the old days, when football was played in vision, did I enjoy seeing him play? Hell yes. Lovely to watch. His "Little Messi" background. The hype from his Dad's Soccer School & the Pay To Play Academies. They're going to push him into the limelight. Plus he's a ball on his feet player. Hips. The lot. People love that. Don't they? Understandably. Me too. But judging talent is the bomb isn't it. I can tell you who has played well on a day. I can tell you who has consistently done the business game in, game out. But talent spotting. Seeing him in a field & saying that Dominic Calvert-Lewin will lead the line for England soon. That sort of talent spotting. I ain't got that. Really really hope Ayari does develop, pushes on. But that's the hope.
 

I think hes got either a good agent or publicist as he's been in the press a fair bit this week with 2 articles on him on Yorkshire Live alone. Thats good going for a recently arrived academy kid!
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
Gimli I'll play that one as I see it. What? No
Unreal talent? As in unreal? No. Of course not. Talent as in - obviously destined for the First Team - sort of talent? No. It's absurd isn't it?
Is he a good player, on park pitches, playing in what is effectively Utd's sixth XI? Hell yes. In the old days, when football was played in vision, did I enjoy seeing him play? Hell yes. Lovely to watch. His "Little Messi" background. The hype from his Dad's Soccer School & the Pay To Play Academies. They're going to push him into the limelight. Plus he's a ball on his feet player. Hips. The lot. People love that. Don't they? Understandably. Me too. But judging talent is the bomb isn't it. I can tell you who has played well on a day. I can tell you who has consistently done the business game in, game out. But talent spotting. Seeing him in a field & saying that Dominic Calvert-Lewin will lead the line for England soon. That sort of talent spotting. I ain't got that. Really really hope Ayari does develop, pushes on. But that's the hope.
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A simple 'no' would have sufficed then ;)
 
I've asked on twitter but I will run it by you lot ad well.
Our under 23s (?) Dvelopment squad (?) Look on fire at the moment so how do they get in our squad or get game time?

Most are under 18 so they haven't signed professional contracts yet (if that's the right terminology) and only Brunt out of the academy players has been given a squad number for this season.

So what does that mean? Can they be bumped up if places are made available in January? Will they all be going out on loan in January or in the new season? Can any do a job for us now?

The list I was given was given to look out for was;
Hackford, Gordon, brunt, Ndiaye and Capello.
 
Doesn't matter how good he is, he'll never play for our first team if he's got flair.

We want industrious players.
 
Liaminho9 said:
Bit of a crazy one but possibly a chance for some good publicity for us.

A Northern Irish Youth Club have been fined £8,000 for allegedly not registering a player correctly, a fine they can’t afford to pay.

The player in question is Hassan Ayari, who now plays for us, and has apparently trained with the first team on occasion.

Full story here: https://www.skysports.com/football/...irish-youth-club-beg-for-fifa-mercy-over-fine

Should we offer to pay the fine for them?
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If the lad is sold on then that club will presumably get a cut of the money?
 
From the pig end said:
I've asked on twitter but I will run it by you lot ad well.
Our under 23s (?) Dvelopment squad (?) Look on fire at the moment so how do they get in our squad or get game time?

Most are under 18 so they haven't signed professional contracts yet (if that's the right terminology) and only Brunt out of the academy players has been given a squad number for this season.

So what does that mean? Can they be bumped up if places are made available in January? Will they all be going out on loan in January or in the new season? Can any do a job for us now?

The list I was given was given to look out for was;
Hackford, Gordon, brunt, Ndiaye and Capello.
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From the pig end I think it's brilliant that with Social Media & cameras at every game we get much more of a chance to hear about & see our Young Development players. And that some of them get a buzz about them. In the old days (March 2020) I used to be able to go & watch them live. But, obvs, I'm running out of credit to speak knowledgeably about them as time passes. Negatively, I do feel we need a reality check at times though. Many of these are very young lads. With only a handful of "proper" Academy games behind them. They score a worldy. Or great assist. It's on YouTube. And get people talking. An elite Premier League team like Utd basically have six XIs. (Disclaimer, not all are exactly XI).
1. The main core, more or less week in week out First Team. Your Egans, Baldocks, Berges.
2. Your First Team cover squad, on the bench & training together all week. Your Sharps, Bryans, Jagielkas.
3. Your advanced & experienced Academy Lads. Out on loan in lower & non league. Your RNDs, Slaters, Boyes.
4. Your next cohort cab off the rank U23 side. Playing week in week out against other U23 Academies. Your Gordons, Brunts, N'Diayes.
5. Your next cohort cab off the rank U18 side. Your Ayaris, Brooks.
6. The younger, less experienced U18 qualified lads, playing in things like the Clarets Cup.
And .... our U23 & U18 sides effectively play in DIVISION THREE of Academy football. If you like, at a low level.

Great as it is to see Ayari banging goals, skilling skills & accrediting assists. That's in our "fifth XI". In Academy Division Three. There's a big queue of players in front of him for a spot on the first team bench. All of the names you mention are good, standout players at their level. The current pathway is clear - establish at U23, go out on loan to lower or non league to prove yourself, come back into the shadow first team squad, get a Premier League shirt.
Enjoy their videos now, hope they push on, but they need development.
 
If you're good enough you're old enough. Reminds me a bit of Rooney when he scored a long range free kick for Everton on what I believe was his debut. Wasn't he just 17 years of age at the time?
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
From the pig end I think it's brilliant that with Social Media & cameras at every game we get much more of a chance to hear about & see our Young Development players. And that some of them get a buzz about them. In the old days (March 2020) I used to be able to go & watch them live. But, obvs, I'm running out of credit to speak knowledgeably about them as time passes. Negatively, I do feel we need a reality check at times though. Many of these are very young lads. With only a handful of "proper" Academy games behind them. They score a worldy. Or great assist. It's on YouTube. And get people talking. An elite Premier League team like Utd basically have six XIs. (Disclaimer, not all are exactly XI).
1. The main core, more or less week in week out First Team. Your Egans, Baldocks, Berges.
2. Your First Team cover squad, on the bench & training together all week. Your Sharps, Bryans, Jagielkas.
3. Your advanced & experienced Academy Lads. Out on loan in lower & non league. Your RNDs, Slaters, Boyes.
4. Your next cohort cab off the rank U23 side. Playing week in week out against other U23 Academies. Your Gordons, Brunts, N'Diayes.
5. Your next cohort cab off the rank U18 side. Your Ayaris, Brooks.
6. The younger, less experienced U18 qualified lads, playing in things like the Clarets Cup.
And .... our U23 & U18 sides effectively play in DIVISION THREE of Academy football. If you like, at a low level.

Great as it is to see Ayari banging goals, skilling skills & accrediting assists. That's in our "fifth XI". In Academy Division Three. There's a big queue of players in front of him for a spot on the first team bench. All of the names you mention are good, standout players at their level. The current pathway is clear - establish at U23, go out on loan to lower or non league to prove yourself, come back into the shadow first team squad, get a Premier League shirt.
Enjoy their videos now, hope they push on, but they need development.
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You sir know your stuff.

doffs cap
 

Tech issues via site....It is 03:00 hrs in UK. 6pm somewhere.
 
nickwr37 said:
About time one via the academy was given a chance again. Ball_Sup (Phil) good synopsis.😎
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We seem to be seeing an up turn in young players starting to come through after a baron spell .Just hope they don't go on to other clubs like they used to.The Welsh guy on loan at Luton is getting rave reports and we already have clubs sniffing around. Hassan looks really special 10 goals and 5 assists in eleven matches wow we will have to coach that out of him ha .Just think if he was in the first team he could be our leading scorer after one match ha.
 
wavy-blade said:
Chris will never play him , he hasn’t spent 20 mill on him !
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Oh you!
That's pretty much what I think too...if that means you think he gives priority to big money signings to 'make' them work.
 
Farnboroughblade said:
If you're good enough you're old enough. Reminds me a bit of Rooney when he scored a long range free kick for Everton on what I believe was his debut. Wasn't he just 17 years of age at the time?
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It wasn’t a free kick, and it wasn’t quite his debut (it was close), but it was a brilliant goal and he was only 16. He’d been talked about for years and that goal felt like a real moment. I can still remember the front page of the sports pages the next day, a full-page shot of David Seaman flailing for the ball as it scorched over him into the goal.

Rooney was an absolute phenomenon though. It’s still incredibly rare someone breaks through that young. Not only was he exceptionally talented, he was quick and very well built for a 16 year old. He was basically a man. Most others at that age are just kids.

I do agree with your main argument though, and I’d hope that we’re not so set in our ways that all players must go through the ranks, including out on loan, before being tried in the first team.
 
8lade said:
Oh you!
That's pretty much what I think too...if that means you think he gives priority to big money signings to 'make' them work.
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Maybe in your world, yes. But in the real world he gives priority to players who are better than kids with potential. And certainly a team fighting for our lives against relegation is not the nurturing ground for very young, very (as in 'none') inexperienced potential (with potential being the key word) talent. If we were comfortably in mid table then it might be the time to quietly and gently introduce these types of players (via the normal route of U23s then possibly a loan out of course) into the first team picture. But at the moment we are far from this luxury.
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
The current pathway is clear - establish at U23, go out on loan to lower or non league to prove yourself, come back into the shadow first team squad, get a Premier League shirt.
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Given subsequent comments, I want to correct myself. I fully agree that any, once in a Century, exceptional youngster (a Rooney) can & should be fast tracked "over the ranks" to the first team, age irrelevant. What I was saying is that the normal, what we appear to be using now, pathway is the U23 (Division 3), out on loan, into the match day squad, route. And, in our Championship & Premier League seasons I don't think we've had any players who've completed that route. Brooks skipped the out on loan phase & once he was in the first team squad, he was sold on.
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
Given subsequent comments, I want to correct myself. I fully agree that any, once in a Century, exceptional youngster (a Rooney) can & should be fast tracked "over the ranks" to the first team, age irrelevant. What I was saying is that the normal, what we appear to be using now, pathway is the U23 (Division 3), out on loan, into the match day squad, route. And, in our Championship & Premier League seasons I don't think we've had any players who've completed that route. Brooks skipped the out on loan phase & once he was in the first team squad, he was sold on.
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Good stuff Phil. But Brooks did have a loan spell at Halifax 👍
 
From the pig end said:
I've asked on twitter but I will run it by you lot ad well.
Our under 23s (?) Dvelopment squad (?) Look on fire at the moment so how do they get in our squad or get game time?

Most are under 18 so they haven't signed professional contracts yet (if that's the right terminology) and only Brunt out of the academy players has been given a squad number for this season.

So what does that mean? Can they be bumped up if places are made available in January? Will they all be going out on loan in January or in the new season? Can any do a job for us now?

The list I was given was given to look out for was;
Hackford, Gordon, brunt, Ndiaye and Capello.
Click to expand...
They can be moved in the squad as they don’t have to be registered in the 25. will they be? In my opinion no not a chance they’re all still very young hackford especially one or two may go on loan brunt most likely but other than that they’ll stay at the club this year.
 
Yogi said:
They can be moved in the squad as they don’t have to be registered in the 25. will they be? In my opinion no not a chance they’re all still very young hackford especially one or two may go on loan brunt most likely but other than that they’ll stay at the club this year.
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Right, is that how it works?
Cheers.

I would have loved to hear that a couple could make the transition straight away but looking at them physically a loan would make sense at first.

Don't get me wrong, players with a build of Brooks will always rise to the top but in the Prem everyone seems to be an athlete. Maybe some would would get a spot if we were back in the lower league?

Either way, its great to see so many promising young faces coming through.
 
From the pig end said:
Right, is that how it works?
Cheers.

I would have loved to hear that a couple could make the transition straight away but looking at them physically a loan would make sense at first.

Don't get me wrong, players with a build of Brooks will always rise to the top but in the Prem everyone seems to be an athlete. Maybe some would would get a spot if we were back in the lower league?

Either way, its great to see so many promising young faces coming through.
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I’m not sure its necessarily about talent right now just age. Could they become prem players sure but could any of them now? No. I’ve said on other threads but how many teenagers get meaningful prem minutes not dead rubbers at the end of the season? I’d argue only generational players the last being England’s leading goal scorer so to expect these lads to contribute now isn’t realistic they need time to mature and for us the mould them in house to play in the manner we want them too. Then they need to be sent out to be tested in men’s football to play for points in a pressurised environment and then we’ll see if they get minutes for us based on our need and their progression in reality as good as they are at their level right now these lads are a long way off meaningful minutes for the first team.
 

LondonBlade89 said:
It wasn’t a free kick, and it wasn’t quite his debut (it was close), but it was a brilliant goal and he was only 16. He’d been talked about for years and that goal felt like a real moment. I can still remember the front page of the sports pages the next day, a full-page shot of David Seaman flailing for the ball as it scorched over him into the goal.

Rooney was an absolute phenomenon though. It’s still incredibly rare someone breaks through that young. Not only was he exceptionally talented, he was quick and very well built for a 16 year old. He was basically a man. Most others at that age are just kids.

I do agree with your main argument though, and I’d hope that we’re not so set in our ways that all players must go through the ranks, including out on loan, before being tried in the first team.
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There’s an article on BBC, that I read yesterday about a kid at Dortmund, who is going through a similar experience. There are just some exceptional talents out there, that are just on a different level and everyone can see it. They naturally understand football, where to run, when to pass etc. It’s all a question of how they are managed. Bellingham sounds like he is very well grounded and good luck to him, they have to sacrifice a lot but the rewards are huge
 
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