Coutts best passer in league

[Tyler Durden]

It’s getting a little desperate and sad now. No vendetta here.
Maybe it irks you that another player or two might be overshadowing your hero? I can think of no other reason why you might be misquoting posts, and being so tunnel vision when it comes down to the team.

Must have been awful seeing Clark and Brooks destroy the pigs without Sharp, the media raving about their link up play....were you getting a little tearful and stressed? That ex pig striker scoring two.....what if he scores 20 this season?? Can we all applaud his efforts, or do we have to reserve all plaudits for the one man who without him the team would be relegated again?

Then again, I recall you 12 months ago making your hatred for Coutts clear. Claiming he will never be part of a successful side. Perhaps you are simply lashing out because you were wrong and looked a bit daft in the end.

You hate Billy Sharp. Good for you. Maybe next time you can extend that bile to the next striker who scores 50 goals in two seasons.

Shouldn't take too long, anyone can do that after all.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

If he was from Sheffield, most of the forum would still think he's wank, a lá Billy Sharp.

1. Most (probably all) of the forum do not think Billy Sharp is wank.

2. Those who are critical of him, I suspect it has nothing to do with him being from Sheffield but more that they focus on what he can’t do instead of what he can (lack of pace and height). This is probably because most of our better forwards have had these attributes and the way we’ve often played has dictated that they are necessary.

3. You sound like Warnock with the complaints that Blades fans had a problem with him because he was one of them. Chris Wilder is proving that is categorically not true. As Dane Whitehouse disproves your theory re Billy Sharp.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

The 10 % saw a very talented player who just needed a decent team to play in.

I think what many of us saw was a player with ability who wasn’t performing well for our team. We had differing explanations ranging from his body is fucked, his attitude stinks, it’s down to the manager, the players around him etc. The truth is, that it was probably a mix of those factors.


It seems to have taken him a long time to regain confidence in his body and a certain level of fitness following his injury problems.



This may be down to attitude as when the chips were down, he would often stroll around and not put a shift in. And remember that interview in Scotland where he joked about always being fined for being overweight.


Wilder has shown what players like Coutts and Freeman are capable of when they couldn’t produce it under Clough and Adkins. That supports the manager theory.


Seeing the quality of the interplay of our midfield trio supplemented by the movement of our wingbacks is an absolute joy to behold and any ball playing midfielder must absolutely love playing in a team like ours with so much movement around them, players who are comfortable receiving the ball in tight areas etc.


So in summary, yes, there have been external factors which maybe hindered Coutts before and help him to thrive now but there’s also the internal element. When Wilder walked through the door, he wanted Coutts and Freeman out because he thought they were taking the piss and stealing a wage and he talks about teams having it too easy at the lane before he came. My impression is that he identified Freeman and Coutts as 2 big culprits. Credit to both for (eventually) having a long hard look at themselves, knuckling down and becoming integral parts of Wilder’s team.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Those 3 yard passes keep the ball moving and move the opposition around when there's nothing on,and create gaps to get attacks going.
Nearly everything comes through Coutts...starts us off...always showing for the ball,and keeping everything ticking over...rarely gives the ball away...Part of the best United midfield in years for me.

We might get a glimpse of how important he is with him not being available for the Ipswich game.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

I'm sorry to say he's far from loved. He's barely acknowledged in fact. If he goes two games without a goal, the knives are soon out for him.
He's the reason we aren't lining up against Forest Green this season, because he did his job even when we were shit, whilst some mainstays in this team (Coutts included) barely showed up.

I think you could say the same about Basham. I think he and Sharp were the 2 from the Adkins era that came through with credit and consistently put a shift in when the chips were down and the team wasn’t functioning. I’d chuck Brayford in to some extent but his injuries prevented him being effective over the course of the season. Wilder cited those 3 on arrival as real leaders in the dressing room and having great attitudes.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Not this again.

Lots of short passes eh....no pleasing everyone. Staggering as that is, if there is anybody who thinks that what he does is simple, then I suggest they give it a try. Because it’s not that he’s making simple passes, it’s that he is often receiving it under pressure and drawing a man to make space for others. With a sublime first touch helping him make that short pass very quickly.
Plus the fact that he is making that many passes and almost all find their target....it’s exceptional. He’s the Scottish Xavi.
Of course when Xavi did it, he was a genius. Coutts.....well he once didn’t run around like a nutcase for one of the top 3 shittest Blades managers in history so that single season means he’s not the messiah after all.

The player I would most liken him to is Aaron Mooy of Huddersfield. When I watched them in the playoffs, the way he gets on the ball, plays those short passes, steps off to receive a return ball and switches the play was completely reminiscent of the season I’d just seen Coutts have. Kevin McDonald is another comparable player.

 

[coaxingstar71]

Agree. I haven’t given him credit for that missing 18 months. To be fair, I doubt Coutts does either.
Adkins was useless, and Coutts arrived to work with Clough in a system designed for him. As coaxingstar71 put so eloquently I doubt it was as simple as Coutts just not being arsed.
Adkins was the manager, he lost most of the players and its a well known fact that if that happens then the players will see you sacked.
But what I will maintain, is that it was always clear he had ability, and that unlike Baxter who was unprofessional and wasting what he had, Coutts wasn’t performing due to the way he was being used in the team. The fact he impressed Wilder and forced his way back to vice captain shows that professionalism was never the issue.

I simply think that if you have a good player, like Coutts, you play a way to get the most from him and that means playing to suit him and surrounding him with players on his wavelength, like Fleck, Duffy, Sharp etc etc.
Another example being Britton....Useless Kev just thought one player would make the difference, when it was obvious he couldnt do it alone, he needs other good players alongside him. Evans when he arrived was making runs nobody could see, and if they did it was too late and he spent half a season offside. Evans was deemed the problem....but later found not to be the case when scoring in a team passing the ball.

Yes, useless Kev ruined many a good midfielders reputation, Britton and Howard being prime examples. It's almost as if he wanted to change the way we played but didn't quite know how to implement it.

Without wishing to enter into the side debate on Sharp, I would say that scoring 20 goals in a side that wasn't creating much, by your own admission Grizzly blade , was still a really good achievement. He's not got pace, he's not going to beat 2 or 3 men and he's not got height but what he does have is, the ability to hold it up, good determination and work-rate and that special knack of being in the right place at the right time, which is gold dust. For me, the amount of headers he's scored is a testament to this. He also invariably hits the target, the keeper might save it but he doesn't actually miss the goal very often.

If he stays fit, I still think he'll score 15-20 this season.

 

[Sothall_Blade]

Another example being Britton....Useless Kev just thought one player would make the difference, when it was obvious he couldnt do it alone, he needs other good players alongside him.

Yes, useless Kev ruined many a good midfielders reputation, Britton and Howard being prime examples. It's almost as if he wanted to change the way we played but didn't quite know how to implement it.

Blackwell only managed Leon Britton in 3 matches

(I think I might have to set up a function key to paste this in)

 

[super_pig]

Doesn't really mean too much, I love Coutts but most of those are short passes collecting from defenders and passing to the guy next to him.

Can't read too much into it.

heh yeah the important bit

 

[Dnblade]

This was covered in some depth on another thread.'Kevin McDonald'.

I don't see Coutts making a difference in the final third of the field that's all. Take the Forest game, top players find a way to create goals and if Coutts were that good he'd be able to capitalise on his team's dominance, speed the game up where it matters and play the strikers in on goal. He has no goals no assists this season despite taking corners and free kicks.

In that other thread I said he was one of our key players and one of the first names on the team sheet but he has a role and it's in the back two thirds of the pitch where sideways and backwards passes have high accuracy rates. Strikers and No.10's by nature play where the game is tighter and have to take more risks to make things happen. Ray Wilkins 'The Crab' used to find his own players invariably.

It's my point of view and I don't think it's "naive to the extreme", just a point of view. In any team there are all sorts of different roles to play and I think Coutts' role is way easier than Fleck's, Duffy's and Carruthers', Stevens' and Freeman's. That's not to say it's not an important role but limited players can and do fill the position up and down the leagues. Coutts has special skills in keeping hold of the ball and now he is fit and motivated he puts a shift in, no question.

I don't see Coutts making a difference in the final third of the field that's all. Take the Forest game, top players find a way to create goals and if Coutts were that good he'd be able to capitalise on his team's dominance, speed the game up where it matters and play the strikers in on goal. He has no goals no assists this season despite taking corners and free kicks

He has no assists this season,but with him playing deeper he's often involved somewhere in the build up,and does get forward to support when we attack.
It's not that easy to break teams down sat behind the ball...Against Forest we couldn't find a way through to get an equaliser,but it wasn"t just upto Coutts.
Just to compare...Ryan Woods impressed a lot on here playing a deep midfield role for Brentford...similar to Coutts,and looking at his stats has only one assist this season and Coutts compares favourably with all the other stats...one stat says Coutts has created 11 chances,so if that stats is correct... 11 chances could have ended up as 11 assists potentially.

 

[nopigfansintown]

I think there's something in what Tyler Durden says. It was a pretty lonely place sticking up for Sharp on other Blades message boards, when old Robbo and Hoofy weren't making best use of his talents. I enjoyed laughing at them when he flourished elsewhere and Robbo and Blackwell's careers went from strength to strength.It's all a bit begrudging even now.

 

[Pinchy]

Blackwell only managed Leon Britton in 3 matches

And that was three too many. In fact, every match in which that useless, hoof-loving, elpiton, semi-professional, non-league, reserve goalkeeper managed us was one too many.

 

[Pinchy]

He has no assists this season,but with him playing deeper he's often involved somewhere in the build up,and does get forward to support when we attack.
It's not that easy to break teams down sat behind the ball...Against Forest we couldn't find a way through to get an equaliser,but it wasn"t just upto Coutts.
Just to compare...Ryan Woods impressed a lot on here playing a deep midfield role for Brentford...similar to Coutts,and looking at his stats has only one assist this season and Coutts compares favourably with all the other stats...one stat says Coutts has created 11 chances,so if that stats is correct... 11 chances could have ended up as 11 assists potentially.

Quite right. There it is.

Coutts-Royce very often plays the pass before the assist. He’s invariably pivotal in the build-up. He’s pivotal in everything we do.

Lies; damned lies and statistics...

 

[Grizzly blade]

I think there's something in what Tyler Durden says. It was a pretty lonely place sticking up for Sharp on other Blades message boards, when old Robbo and Hoofy weren't making best use of his talents. I enjoyed laughing at them when he flourished elsewhere and Robbo and Blackwell's careers went from strength to strength.It's all a bit begrudging even now.

And so did I.
You won’t be seeing me labelling players as shit. Nor do I have a hatred of Sharp like what Tyler seems to want to portray.

 

[Pinchy]

I think there's something in what Tyler Durden says. It was a pretty lonely place sticking up for Sharp on other Blades message boards, when old Robbo and Hoofy weren't making best use of his talents. I enjoyed laughing at them when he flourished elsewhere and Robbo and Blackwell's careers went from strength to strength.It's all a bit begrudging even now.

Not from me. He’s great. That doesn’t mean he’s entitled to some special status or a guaranteed start though. That’s plain Bladey-Bladeness and the only point at which some of us beg to differ. The recurring notion of “Sharp and one other” doesn’t wash with me.

 

[Woodwardfan]

He has no assists this season,but with him playing deeper he's often involved somewhere in the build up,and does get forward to support when we attack.
It's not that easy to break teams down sat behind the ball...Against Forest we couldn't find a way through to get an equaliser,but it wasn"t just upto Coutts.
Just to compare...Ryan Woods impressed a lot on here playing a deep midfield role for Brentford...similar to Coutts,and looking at his stats has only one assist this season and Coutts compares favourably with all the other stats...one stat says Coutts has created 11 chances,so if that stats is correct... 11 chances could have ended up as 11 assists potentially.

DnB. At no stage have I said that Coutts is not a good player and a worthy member of the team.

What I have said is that it is a relatively safe and easier role to play than Fleck alongside him and anyway if the manager is happy for that role to exist then I am obviously. When Wilder arrived he said he wanted midfielders to bring a bit of everything to the party not just this and not that, but I think Coutts has grown on him and the partnership with Fleck balances well.

Take McDonald when he was with us, his long standing partnership with Doyle was limited because Doyle ended up having to play out of his comfort zone more forward. Imagine Doyle alongside our current vice-captain who would be under far more personal pressure to do more further up the pitch.

 

[sitwell]

Yes, useless Kev ruined many a good midfielders reputation, Britton and Howard being prime examples. It's almost as if he wanted to change the way we played but didn't quite know how to implement it.

Without wishing to enter into the side debate on Sharp, I would say that scoring 20 goals in a side that wasn't creating much, by your own admission Grizzly blade , was still a really good achievement. He's not got pace, he's not going to beat 2 or 3 men and he's not got height but what he does have is, the ability to hold it up, good determination and work-rate and that special knack of being in the right place at the right time, which is gold dust. For me, the amount of headers he's scored is a testament to this. He also invariably hits the target, the keeper might save it but he doesn't actually miss the goal very often.

If he stays fit, I still think he'll score 15-20 this season.

Owd Kev was the same with wingers ,Cotterill ,Ward ,Gillespie and Nathan Dyer. No put them on the bench and play Greg Halford on the wing because he can throw it. Tactical genius that pillock ,badged up to fuck.

 

[Tyler Durden]

And so did I.
You won’t be seeing me labelling players as shit. Nor do I have a hatred of Sharp like what Tyler seems to want to portray.

You're right, actually. Hate is a strong word...you just really don't like him.

Anyhow. Some of us were right all along about Billy and some revisionists were apparently right about Couttsy-Come-Lately.

So lets all bask in our respective schadenfreude and leave it at that.

 

[Pinchy]

DnB. At no stage have I said that Coutts is not a good player and a worthy member of the team.

What I have said is that it is a relatively safe and easier role to play than Fleck alongside him and anyway if the manager is happy for that role to exist then I am obviously. When Wilder arrived he said he wanted midfielders to bring a bit of everything to the party not just this and not that, but I think Coutts has grown on him and the partnership with Fleck balances well.

Take McDonald when he was with us, his long standing partnership with Doyle was limited because Doyle ended up having to play out of his comfort zone more forward. Imagine Doyle alongside our current vice-captain who would be under far more personal pressure to do more further up the pitch.

A football pitch is out of Doyle’s comfort zone. Coutts-Royce, on the other hand, embraces that environment with the consummate ease, elegance and style of his roadgoing namesake.

 

[Pinchy]

Owd Kev was the same with wingers ,Cotterill ,Ward ,Gillespie and Nathan Dyer. No put them on the bench and play Greg Halford on the wing because he can throw it. Tactical genius that pillock ,badged up to fuck.

Agreed, but watch that flying comma...

 

[Grizzly blade]

You hate Billy Sharp. Good for you. Maybe next time you can extend that bile to the next striker who scores 50 goals in two seasons.

Shouldn't take too long, anyone can do that after all.

Be good if you can point to examples of this hatred of Sharp I seem to have, because your blinkers seem to have missed the point a lot in your rage.

Bit of a weird little rant you are having here. I will be overjoyed with any player scoring 50 goals over two seasons, as I was with Sharp. What’s a little bizarre is you think nobody is ever going to be able to do it again.

Seeing as in your simple but basic world of football that it’s goals scored by a player that count the most, then I guess we can always hope Evans gets back to his best, after all his record for United is statistically slightly better than Sharps.
48 in 113 - 2.35
65 in 163 - 2.50
Then we will see Evans score 50 over two seasons. Happy days. Shouldn’t be long eh?








For the reasonable minded reading this, of course I realise there’s a lot more to it, but I can’t get my head around this Tyler lads problem. Not seen anyone slating Billy.

 

[Tyler Durden]

Be good if you can point to examples of this hatred of Sharp I seem to have, because your blinkers seem to have missed the point a lot in your rage.

Bit of a weird little rant you are having here. I will be overjoyed with any player scoring 50 goals over two seasons, as I was with Sharp. What’s a little bizarre is you think nobody is ever going to be able to do it again.

Seeing as in your simple but basic world of football that it’s goals scored by a player that count the most, then I guess we can always hope Evans gets back to his best, after all his record for United is statistically slightly better than Sharps.
48 in 113 - 2.35
65 in 163 - 2.50
Then we will see Evans score 50 over two seasons. Happy days. Shouldn’t be long eh?








For the reasonable minded reading this, of course I realise there’s a lot more to it, but I can’t get my head around this Tyler lads problem. Not seen anyone slating Billy.

Well I'm delighted to know you were overjoyed with Billys contributions.

As with many on here, it takes a fair bit of teeth-pulling to get any acknowledgement but most do begrudgingly praise him eventually.

Anyway, I'll leave the rest of you to it.

 

[I should coco]

The recurring notion of “Sharp and one other” doesn’t wash with me.

Which brings to mind the disturbing question of 'who does wash with you'?

Do you share soap and the same towel?

 

[Dnblade]

DnB. At no stage have I said that Coutts is not a good player and a worthy member of the team.

What I have said is that it is a relatively safe and easier role to play than Fleck alongside him and anyway if the manager is happy for that role to exist then I am obviously. When Wilder arrived he said he wanted midfielders to bring a bit of everything to the party not just this and not that, but I think Coutts has grown on him and the partnership with Fleck balances well.

Take McDonald when he was with us, his long standing partnership with Doyle was limited because Doyle ended up having to play out of his comfort zone more forward. Imagine Doyle alongside our current vice-captain who would be under far more personal pressure to do more further up the pitch.

Fair enough Woody,but not sure I agree with safe and easy though...Typically,he often receives the ball facing his own goal while being closed down...he then either turns away from his man or manages to calmly control the ball and pass it off before getting it back facing the other way to start us off...if he loses the ball in deep areas we're in trouble...not a role for anybody not comfortable on the ball...his close control and calmness while under pressure do make it look easy at times though.

 

[Silent Blade]

Me, me, I knew, I knew. Said it when he frst came.

Me too and sitwell

 

[Liaminho9]

Coutts plays like a Quarterback. Sets up most attacking plays, some just a simple pass to a direct dribbler, sometimes a precise through ball to an overlapping wing back or number 10/striker. He simply makes us tick.

Class act.

 

[boo radley]

Some midfield heroes never quite mastered that three yard pass...

View attachment 31766

I've told you before. You shouldn't see him like that. It's took him a long time, he's now 29 but he's getting there. Tackling looking better, closing looking better, moving into space looking better.
Still loves to play the long ball out of play that you like but hey, with the Masters support and guidance he'll continue to improve. Me and Chris would both like him to add to add shots assists and goals to his game. We'll continue to work with him and I'm sure he'll continue to progress.

 

[sitwell]

I've told you before. You shouldn't see him like that. It's took him a long time, he's now 29 but he's getting there. Tackling looking better, closing looking better, moving into space looking better.
Still loves to play the long ball out of play that you like but hey, with the Masters support and guidance he'll continue to improve. Me and Chris would both like him to add to add shots assists and goals to his game. We'll continue to work with him and I'm sure he'll continue to progress.

So you have a quality FOOTBALLER and your priorities are tackling ,closing and tracking back. Do you really not see how he makes us dominate games and set the pace and pattern ,while starting so many moves with intelligent passing and movement ,or are you just too set in your ways to admit you are wrong ?

 

[boo radley]

So you have a quality FOOTBALLER and your priorities are tackling ,closing and tracking back. Do you really not see how he makes us dominate games and set the pace and pattern ,while starting so many moves with intelligent passing and movement ,or are you just too set in your ways to admit you are wrong ?

What am I wrong about?

 

[Pinchy]

What am I wrong about?

Fucking hell, how long have we got? Send for Fyodor Mikhailovich Dostoyevsky. This is one for him...