Clough out? A good article on the issue

[itsinyerblood]

For whatever reason, there's something wrong at the club this season. Players have mainly been nowhere near last season's standards in the league.

The only mitigating factor is Chedgate.

The fact Clough couldn't get his primary targets in pre-season is something every manager has to deal with. The pre-season was a complete mess.

I said at the start of the season I wanted to see progression. I've seen very little, if any, this season in terms of the football played.

Try harder mate, when you write 'The only mitigating factor is Chedgate', shouldn't you have written 'The only mitigating factor that I know of is Chedgate'?

I'm in partial agreement that we've not risen to the challenge at times, but whatever the reason for not performing to a more consistent standard it's beyond my comprehension. I think it's a little like buying a lottery ticket, convincing yourself that it's finally the one that'll make you wealthy, and when it doesn't deliver you blame all and sundry. That's how inexplicable this is. Be it players of lesser quality, poor tactics, injuries, or whatever, I believe we're just short of a good to decent squad. Talk of budgets, timescales, etc, aren't the only explanations for why this might take longer than we'd all hoped to gain promotion. And before anyone decides to ask what those reasons might be, save your breath. I'm no more party to what happens inside the club than you are.

 

[robbiez666]

Try harder mate, when you write 'The only mitigating factor is Chedgate', shouldn't you have written 'The only mitigating factor that I know of is Chedgate'?

I'm in partial agreement that we've not risen to the challenge at times, but whatever the reason for not performing to a more consistent standard it's beyond my comprehension. I think it's a little like buying a lottery ticket, convincing yourself that it's finally the one that'll make you wealthy, and when it doesn't deliver you blame all and sundry. That's how inexplicable this is. Be it players of lesser quality, poor tactics, injuries, or whatever, I believe we're just short of a good to decent squad. Talk of budgets, timescales, etc, aren't the only explanations for why this might take longer than we'd all hoped to gain promotion. And before anyone decides to ask what those reasons might be, save your breath. I'm no more party to what happens inside the club than you are.

oh, that's a given.

There's just no energy, purpose, drive or life this season in the league. But it was there in the cups. Which suggests motivation problems or issues with the tactics in the league.

We desperately need some drive and energy, I'd like to see Scougs and Adams playing some part tomorrow. We need them, Murphy or Flynn to get on the ball and go at the opposition. We've all seen Steven Gerrard single-handedly win games for Liverpool by giving everything and charging around. That lifts the whole team.

 

[itsinyerblood]

oh, that's a given.

There's just no energy, purpose, drive or life this season in the league. But it was there in the cups. Which suggests motivation problems or issues with the tactics in the league.

We desperately need some drive and energy, I'd like to see Scougs and Adams playing some part tomorrow. We need them, Murphy or Flynn to get on the ball and go at the opposition. We've all seen Steven Gerrard single-handedly win games for Liverpool by giving everything and charging around. That lifts the whole team.

Perhaps it's about chemistry, that indefinable mixture that could already exist within the squad. Done most certainly has that rampaging style that we've enjoyed ever since he was signed. Add to that Scougall's style of play, and maybe he and Done in the same team might ignite something that drives us forward. You're correct, energy, consistently applied, can be difficult to deal with if there's guile, good technique, intelligence, and a style of play that is quick, familiar to each player in the team, and can be shown to cause problems.

 

[robbiez666]

Perhaps it's about chemistry, that indefinable mixture that could already exist within the squad. Done most certainly has that rampaging style that we've enjoyed ever since he was signed. Add to that Scougall's style of play, and maybe he and Done in the same team might ignite something that drives us forward. You're correct, energy, consistently applied, can be difficult to deal with if there's guile, good technique, intelligence, and a style of play that is quick, familiar to each player in the team, and can be shown to cause problems.

we don;t play at any tempo or speed, and this must be down to instruction. We need players to grasp the nettle and go for it. Done was great and then was left out to fit someone else in, and whilst we needed someone like Davies, we really need Done to start.

 

[alcoblade]

we don;t play at any tempo or speed, and this must be down to instruction. We need players to grasp the nettle and go for it. Done was great and then was left out to fit someone else in, and whilst we needed someone like Davies, we really need Done to start.

I'm fairly sure Done is carrying an injury and has been saved for the play offs.

UTB

 

[itsinyerblood]

we don;t play at any tempo or speed, and this must be down to instruction. We need players to grasp the nettle and go for it. Done was great and then was left out to fit someone else in, and whilst we needed someone like Davies, we really need Done to start.

If that was the case wouldn't Done have been instructed to slow down? As regard's Done's omission, I think this is more likely to do with injury than being left out for another player. A fully fit Done, playing well of course, is, as things stand, a shoe-in.

 

[robbiez666]

I'm fairly sure Done is carrying an injury and has been saved for the play offs.

UTB

If that was the case wouldn't Done have been instructed to slow down? As regard's Done's omission, I think this is more likely to do with injury than being left out for another player. A fully fit Done, playing well of course, is, as things stand, a shoe-in.

You could be both right, but upfront? I can't see him either dropping Davies or playing two upfront, so he'd likely be on the wing.

 

[alcoblade]

You could be both right, but upfront? I can't see him either dropping Davies or playing two upfront, so he'd likely be on the wing.

He'd play on the right, I'd imagine.

UTB

 

[super_pig]

progress is minimal a couple of places
I don't really give a monkeys about the cup
our back four is made up of midfielders and fullbacks in the wrong position
we have millions of small midfielders
our best forward is on the bench

I'm not totally convinced Nige but i'll give you another year

 

[alcoblade]

progress is minimal a couple of places
I don't really give a monkeys about the cup
our back four is made up of midfielders and fullbacks in the wrong position
we have millions of small midfielders
our best forward is on the bench

I'm not totally convinced Nige but i'll give you another year

My gut honestly sank as I thought about your last line. Unless the approach changes, I can just about stomach until Christmas, and I'd be astounded if the club didn't oblige me then.

UTB

 

[grafikhaus]

For whatever reason, there's something wrong at the club this season. Players have mainly been nowhere near last season's standards in the league.

The only mitigating factor is Chedgate.

The fact Clough couldn't get his primary targets in pre-season is something every manager has to deal with. The pre-season was a complete mess.

I said at the start of the season I wanted to see progression. I've seen very little, if any, this season in terms of the football played.

Agree. So we lost our 'star' striker. So did MKD (Afobe - and Dele Alli has missed a chunk of this season through injury). So did Chesterfield (Eoin Doyle). So did Rochdale (Done). The excuses are running out.

 

[Bladesway]

Since when did a contract make a difference ?

Everything you read in the papers and what Murphy has said to the press infers he is happy, but don't let that spoil your Walter Mitty esque dreamworld that he or anyone else is unhappy.

I don't mind having debates on whether Clough and the team are good enough based on fact but utter supposition based on nothing belongs in the crapper. Please put it there, or Blades Mad if you desire.

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

oh, that's a given.

There's just no energy, purpose, drive or life this season in the league. But it was there in the cups. Which suggests motivation problems or issues with the tactics in the league.

We desperately need some drive and energy, I'd like to see Scougs and Adams playing some part tomorrow. We need them, Murphy or Flynn to get on the ball and go at the opposition. We've all seen Steven Gerrard single-handedly win games for Liverpool by giving everything and charging around. That lifts the whole team.

Agreed. We are missing a commanding on pitch presence. Someone to rally the troops when we go behind, say. Davies has shown some signs of this. There's definitely something old school about him.

I've also seen Doyle do it: go around having a word with team mates.

I do sometimes wonder if this comes with the territory: there's a deliberate considered style which is fine and I like it but there's also sometimes a need for some passion.

But it's a fine line to tread: if you overcommit you can and up with a red card, or superficially exciting but ultimately ineffective hoofing.

Speed of movement is another aspect of it.

 

[davidpinder]

Is this Sheffield United ,or Abbey Lane under 8s your talking about ? Get a grip.

Just mentioning what I was told, this came from a young lad not me.

 

[davidpinder]

Everything you read in the papers and what Murphy has said to the press infers he is happy, but don't let that spoil your Walter Mitty esque dreamworld that he or anyone else is unhappy.

I don't mind having debates on whether Clough and the team are good enough based on fact but utter supposition based on nothing belongs in the crapper. Please put it there, or Blades Mad if you desire.

Why is it based on nothing, if I get told something from a player or someone close to them then I am entitled to share it on this forum if you think everything is rosey at the lane then you are very much mistake sir.

 

[davidpinder]

Everything you read in the papers and what Murphy has said to the press infers he is happy, but don't let that spoil your Walter Mitty esque dreamworld that he or anyone else is unhappy.

I don't mind having debates on whether Clough and the team are good enough based on fact but utter supposition based on nothing belongs in the crapper. Please put it there, or Blades Mad if you desire.

Maguire was happy last season, you watch when a higher club comes in that will soon change.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

progress is minimal a couple of places
I don't really give a monkeys about the cup
our back four is made up of midfielders and fullbacks in the wrong position
we have millions of small midfielders
our best forward is on the bench

I'm not totally convinced Nige but i'll give you another year

yep agree with all of that except the cups - come on, Spurs home and away - couple of fantastic nights and it wasn't bad leading up them either - saints at home?

UTB

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

progress is minimal a couple of places
I don't really give a monkeys about the cup
our back four is made up of midfielders and fullbacks in the wrong position
we have millions of small midfielders
our best forward is on the bench

I'm not totally convinced Nige but i'll give you another year

I am not totally convinced this season , and its nothing to do with not getting automatic . We have not really been a challenging threat all season. It really is to do with the fundamental basic issues of the squad ,team selections and transfer business , which has been a bit hit and miss , which sums us up.

If we don't make it , Clough may view the situation , that he cannot take us any further or he has unfinished business at the club , to achieve promotion next season.

We have had so many managers and disappointments in such a short period of time , in the clubs history , the players , and Clough management do IMO , look as battle weary as us fans , . Tomorrow may well be a barometer how we hit the play offs , and theres nothing like a win , whoever you are playing , or whats or whats not at stake , to boost moral of all.

UTB.

 

[Bladesway]

Why is it based on nothing, if I get told something from a player or someone close to them then I am entitled to share it on this forum if you think everything is rosey at the lane then you are very much mistake sir.

Nothing is rosy and it shouldn't be. We are in an unacceptable position and the players and Manager should feel determined to get promoted to make things right. If you are not in a winning dressing room it's shit and so it should be.

 

[Bladesway]

Maguire was happy last season, you watch when a higher club comes in that will soon change.

You almost relish the prospect of being proved right by the sound of it.

 

[JohnDenver]

Maguire was happy last season, you watch when a higher club comes in that will soon change.

But that's not news. Give me £2m and I'll go and work for Manchester United for a couple of years. Just watch me go.

 

[Benny and the Blades]

Agreed. We are missing a commanding on pitch presence. Someone to rally the troops when we go behind, say. Davies has shown some signs of this. There's definitely something old school about him.

I've also seen Doyle do it: go around having a word with team mates.

I do sometimes wonder if this comes with the territory: there's a deliberate considered style which is fine and I like it but there's also sometimes a need for some passion.

But it's a fine line to tread: if you overcommit you can and up with a red card, or superficially exciting but ultimately ineffective hoofing.

Speed of movement is another aspect of it.

I would have thought that that was the reason we paid so much money for Brayford.
He was to be the leader we required just as he was last season, but lightning hasn't struck in the same place twice, at least not this season although that doesn't mean it can't next.
Despite the disappointments and frustrations of this season are we that far away ? there have been times over the last 18 months when we thought we had found THE team, more so last season than this one and I know everybody is tired of waiting for that spark or that player that can turn this squad of players once more into the DREAM TEAM .
It hasn't happened this season, yet, and it may never happen under Nigel but he did at least come the closest we've been to it for quite a while last season and next season , who knows.....

 

[davidpinder]

You almost relish the prospect of being proved right by the sound of it.

Not at all I just worry that a playoff failure will result in another disappointing summer when we will find it a struggle to recruit without anything like the same amount of money available.

 

[Bladesway]

I agree with that. And Grayson has had longer, but not much. I'm more countering the point that some make about stability for stabilities sake. 2 Years is enough given resource, stature and position.

The other point is about repeated sacking of managers. I believe we have cause and effect mixed up here. If you keep employing shit managers you need to keep sacking them. You can't conclude that keeping them must reverse your fortunes. You should conclude that it's time to start to employ good ones - easier said than done, I appreciate, but you can at least follow the signs.

UTB

Just read this back and I agree with the cause and effect issue but in the case of both Blackwell and Wilson they were sacked at the wrong times. Also in both cases it was a law of diminishing returns because they both kept having the rug pulled from under you. You cannot do a job when your boss keeps selling your best players. I believe on 2 occasions this has cost us automatic promotion. One of those occasions to the Premiership.

 

[alcoblade]

Just read this back and I agree with the cause and effect issue but in the case of both Blackwell and Wilson they were sacked at the wrong times. Also in both cases it was a law of diminishing returns because they both kept having the rug pulled from under you. You cannot do a job when your boss keeps selling your best players. I believe on 2 occasions this has cost us automatic promotion. One of those occasions to the Premiership.

Certainly the last one. The sale of our leading scorer, at Christmas sat top of the table, was utter madness. For a million quid, no doubt costing us many times that.

I forgave the Chamionship sales as it was clear that the club was racking up debt faster than Gordon Brown.

UTB

 

[super_pig]

My gut honestly sank as I thought about your last line. Unless the approach changes, I can just about stomach until Christmas, and I'd be astounded if the club didn't oblige me then.

UTB

on paper.. he can start next season.. if we have the same crap and rumours of cliques and strange selections he won't make Xmas

 

[Davie Blade]

Certainly the last one. The sale of our leading scorer, at Christmas sat top of the table, was utter madness. For a million quid, no doubt costing us many times that.

I forgave the Championship sales as it was clear that the club was racking up debt faster than the failing banks

UTB

Fixed it for you.
ww.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financialcrisis/3156711/Bank-bailout-Alistair-Darling-unveils-500billion-rescue-package.html

 

[Sothall_Blade]

I am not prepared to say who said what when, but when a player comes on and scores 2 goals against a top 6 prem club then hardly plays after, I doubt anyone would be happy. Plus another player has said he's not with the "in crowd" so he doesn't even get passed to in training.

I find it hard to believe that any professional footballer would only pass to his best mates. Never mind a whole clique of them!

If a player has actually said this, it sounds like he's a bit immature and paranoid to me.

 

[BladeInBC]

Couldn't be bothered to read the whole thread so apologies if someone has already said this but isn't "second season syndrome" a very real thing? A new manager comes in and does well, people expect him to repeat this the following year but expectation is too high. Then it's the third year that dictates whether he stays or goes. David Moyes at Everton was the first time I'd been introduced to the idea - but he went on to do well the following year.

I'd stick with Clough for another year - unless we're in the relegation places by Christmas.