Carlos Tevez

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Chali 2na said:
I think we have had bad luck. In Wilson's season alone, Maguire and Lowton got suspended at the same time Collins was absent due to his Dad passing, we lost a couple on the trot which cost us ultimately. The same season Evans was convicted just before the season's end, leaving us with Hoskins. I thought we were pretty unlucky that year.

That being said, the major contributing factors to our decline haven't been to do with luck:
  • Signing the wrong sorts of players: older players, players on their way down and journey men. (Ugo Ehiogu, Lee Hendrie, Gary Naysmith, Barry Robson, Dave Kitson, Woolford and Hammond)
  • Not having adequate cover at centre half since 2011 until now.
  • Not having a consistent goal scorer since 2012 until Sharp arrived. (No player managed more than 14 goals a season between Evans and Sharp.)
  • Arguably not having a convincing goalkeeper since Kenny, hopefully Moore can change this.
  • Picking the wrong managers.
  • Selling assets for less than they're worth and/or not replacing them. (Murphy, Maguire, Blackman, Lowton and Beattie)
  • Paying championship wages to league 1 players.
I'd say it's 5% luck, and the rest is down to bad decisions from the owners, board and management. (There's plenty I've missed)
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I don't think we're that far apart Chali, I suppose it's a question of interpretation. You forgot to mention the sacking of Wilson, I'm still at a loss to know how the board arrived at this decision, especially as we'd done quite well until this monumental slice of boardroom incompetence. All the things you mention are dreadful as you describe them, but my point was to listen to McCabe use this as the foundation for the ongoing reasons for our stagnancy. I'm hoping that Wilder and Knill might have put an end to the notion that bad luck dictates our fortunes. Someone once said that character is destiny, so perhaps the single-mindedness that Wilder brings to the job is an indication of where we're headed. I don't think luck had anything to do with Wilder becoming our manager, I think it was more likely to do with destiny.
 
itsinyerblood said:
I don't think we're that far apart Chali, I suppose it's a question of interpretation. You forgot to mention the sacking of Wilson, I'm still at a loss to know how the board arrived at this decision, especially as we'd done quite well until this monumental slice of boardroom incompetence. All the things you mention are dreadful as you describe them, but my point was to listen to McCabe use this as the foundation for the ongoing reasons for our stagnancy. I'm hoping that Wilder and Knill might have put an end to the notion that bad luck dictates our fortunes. Someone once said that character is destiny, so perhaps the single-mindedness that Wilder brings to the job is an indication of where we're headed. I don't think luck had anything to do with Wilder becoming our manager, I think it was more likely to do with destiny.
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Definitely mate, and I wasn't trying to dispute your point, I was trying to add to it.

As for the sacking of Wilson, I didn't think we had a chance in the play offs with him being in charge after the dismal defeat to Crawley and the loss of Blackman, the top scorer in January.
That being said, it's obvious that putting Morgan and Unsworth in charge did us no favours, so in hindsight I'd agree, maybe we'd have been better sticking with him.
 
Ricky said:
We already had more than enough money after relegation to sort ourselves out and get back up, how the club managed to squander the Tevez money on top of that is absolutely scandalous. No thought or consideration involved whatsoever, and we're still reaping the rewards.
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It had already been spent before we received it, such was the extent of the cock up in the Robson season.
 
Chali 2na said:
Definitely mate, and I wasn't trying to dispute your point, I was trying to add to it.

As for the sacking of Wilson, I didn't think we had a chance in the play offs with him being in charge after the dismal defeat to Crawley and the loss of Blackman, the top scorer in January.
That being said, it's obvious that putting Morgan and Unsworth in charge did us no favours, so in hindsight I'd agree, maybe we'd have been better sticking with him.
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I should have expanded, better the devil you know where Wilson was concerned. Appointing in-house was a mistake destined to dreadful failure. So yes, I agree.
 
The only person who needs to remember the mistakes made in the past is McCabe. Although if he is still going to use bad luck as an excuse for 6 years in League 1 then there is no hope for us.

The sooner we get new owners the better.
 
Chali 2na said:
Maguire and Lowton got suspended
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This really cost us for the following games. As I recall Lowton picked up two bookings in a matter of minutes, the first for throwing the ball back to the centre spot just after we conceded (spectacular Cresswell own goal?). Just one of many examples of utterly ridiculous refereeing decisions I've witnessed.
 
As with most clubs at this level and the Championship, it's about having a manager who has a plan, distinct style of play (regardless whether it's attractive or not) and higher than average level of intelligence.

Since Warnock our track record of hiring complete fuck-wits as manager is unparalleled. As such, it doesn't matter how much money we spunk on players/rapists we'll always come back to the same common denominator - the man who has the plan (or lack of one in the case of most of our managers).

McCabe has a track record of hiring names/reputations which has ultimately being the source of our complete fuckwittery.
 

IdLiketoRogerMoore said:
As with most clubs at this level and the Championship, it's about having a manager who has a plan, distinct style of play (regardless whether it's attractive or not) and higher than average level of intelligence.

Since Warnock our track record of hiring complete fuck-wits as manager is unparalleled. As such, it doesn't matter how much money we spunk on players/rapists we'll always come back to the same common denominator - the man who has the plan (or lack of one in the case of most of our managers).

McCabe has a track record of hiring names/reputations which has ultimately being the source of our complete fuckwittery.
Click to expand...

Micky Adams.
 
Hmmm, some great points here about "where it all went wrong" but I thought that it was very confusing when mcabe issued a ten million pound emergency loan to the club as soon as we got relegated, wonder what interest he charged and I still wonder why we needed it, we got parachute payments of 15 million back then if my memory serves me right, so why the loan, does anybody else remember this better and can put this straight, I found it really strange, we hadn't signed bergkamp or Zola had we...
 
Rodley said:
Ugo Ehiogu, Hendrie, Beattie, Naysmith, Ched and numerous others were on massive wages. Look where it got us!
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It SHOULD have been ample to compensate us and aid a rebuild. Instead mismanagement at the top cost us very very dearly. A crap owner with a string of crap managerial appointments. The owner was the one consistent factor.

Now and only now, all these years later, is the only time he's really come close to getting it right, Wilson aside. And ironically, this time things are only going so well because Wilder won't take his bluff and bullshit. I get the impression Wilder demands what he wants and needs in an assertive way.

BTW, Tevez is still a twat.
 
This thread is a good look back (or Luck back). McCabe is still revelling in his victory in court and it seems he believes we still all appreciate this and it overrides all our negative feelings since and we should respect the efforts of the worst chairman in the clubs history.
 
spongebobblade said:
It's a good job it's a Friday night. If We had seen all those horror pics on a Monday morning the Samaritans would have been inundated. You do realise some of us are already on medication don't you Dane?
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Sorry mate, just attempting to answer the question of what we had to show for all those West Ham millions. It really is depressing though.
 
Chali 2na said:
I think we have had bad luck. In Wilson's season alone, Maguire and Lowton got suspended at the same time Collins was absent due to his Dad passing, we lost a couple on the trot which cost us ultimately.
Click to expand...
Lecsinel Jean Francois also did his cruciates in that game against Oldham too, the game that cost us promotion, 2 up and losing an entire back 4 later we lost 3-2.
 
boo radley said:
This thread is a good look back (or Luck back). McCabe is still revelling in his victory in court and it seems he believes we still all appreciate this and it overrides all our negative feelings since and we should respect the efforts of the worst chairman in the clubs history.
Click to expand...


Where's he been revelling in it lately? As you say he's still doing it.
 

I still have that squad, the one that failed to stay up by a single goal, imprinted on my mind to this day:

G: Kenny, Bennett
FB: Fathi, Kozluk, Geary, Armstrong
FB/CB: Bromby
CB: Jagielka, Morgan, Kilgallon, Davis, Lucketti
M: S Quinn, A Quinn, Tonge, Montgomery, Leigertwood
W: Kazim-Richards, Gillespie, Law
F: Hulse, Stead, Shelton, Webber, Nade

Even given the 4m for Jagielka, the 3m for 'Knife man' Claude Davis and the 1.125m for the Coca Cola Kid, there was still a squad there capable of challenging for the top 6.

Kenny was good and Bennett a dependable deputy.

At the time, at least while we waited for Hulse, a clever player like Stead could have formed decent partnerships interchangeably with Shelton's pace, Webber's trickery or Nade's bustle.

A defence of Bromby and his Long throw, Armstrong's direct running from the back alongside the complimentary Morgan and Kilgallon was something we could have worked with, and had some reliable pros to back them up in Geary, Kozzy and Lucketti.

The midfield was probably the weakest link, but Monty was an excellent ball winner and you could have picked 2/3 to play to the left of him in the Quinn's and Tongey with Leigertwood for those more robust encounters. Even without CKR, for which the money was good, Fathi could have been decent, as a right winger. That still left the youth and experience of Law and Gillespie.

1 goal we fell short. If ever a team needed minor surgery to go again that was it. Not doubling, perhaps tripling the wage bill and the circus that followed.
 
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