Accept the inevitable and stick with Hecky

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Stanthemanfan said:
Can someone explain why the hell we, d want dean Smith? I'd rather keep hecky!
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Your opinion, Think he would get them playing with a system, which is something we have struggled to do since WIlder left.
 
Dkc said:
Hecky's Championship record is with us is auto promotion form for two seasons running. That isn't a fluke. If we're going down, there's no-one I'd prefer to be in charge at the start of next season. Even Wilder had a 10th-place finish before he took us up.
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But wilder had a side that had spent 6 years in league 1 before the 10th place finish , heckingbottom had a side that had finished 2nd in championship then spent 2 years in premier League, you can't really compare
 
Grappler said:
The Prince said (on Sky Sports News, I think) he wanted Chris Wilder to stay, even if we were relegated (we were), as he thought he was the best placed man to bring us straight back up. I assume he thinks the same of PH.
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Hecky's achievements in the championship can't be compared to Wilders achievement in the Championship.

When Hecky was promoted he was given the 2nd best squad in the league, the 4th highest budget in the league
the best players in the league and most neutrals in pre-season predicted United to finish 2nd.
Easier said than done but Hecky achieved what was expected, the club was under financial pressure and in the middle of a takeover making his job more difficult due to distractions but he stayed professional and focussed on the job.
However performances were consistently hit and miss, almost every match we had a 20 minute spell of playing some good passing football
(we looked a top team) but then in the same match we always had a 20 minute spell of struggling to string 3 passes together (we looked poor).
We often finished the last 20 minutes of many matches parking the bus and booting it clear anywhere.
Opposition fans always made the same comments like "not sure how they can be 2nd, every time I see them, they look so average"
and "they are basically just a mid table team with 2 top players Berge and N'Diaye ensuring they win".

Compare this to the Wilder Championship team we had no outstanding players.
We were considered a mid table table at best, no one expected us to be promoted.
We were bottom half based on budget......but we played as a team.
We were so well drilled, every player knew their job.
Every player seemed comfortable on the ball and we consistently played possession based simple pass and move football.
Our chance creation was mainly down to overloading the wings using our centre backs to get forward giving us an extra man.
Opposition fans (like a Bolton and Blackburn away) made comments like "very impressed with them, best team to come here for a few seasons".
and "you can see why they are near the top, they look so well drilled and play as a team".

Assume the Prince wants Wilder to stay because he knew he could work on a limited budget turning a set of average players into a good team.
Where as Hecky strengths are more about steadying the ship, staying calm, no drama and getting on with the job.

Much prefer Hecky as a person but Wilder is more of a winner, he's a terrible loser, where as Hecky is a nice man and a good loser.
So if we want any chance of staying up and I believe the players are better than what they are showing
I would prefer to give Wilder another chance, especially as his failure wasn't in normal times, it was during covid when many things become a surreal experience. Also only the Prince knows the truth, so if he is prepared to forgive Wilder then who am I to argue.
 
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Sheffsteel said:
I would prefer to give Wilder another chance, especially as his failure wasn't in normal times, it was during covid when many things become a surreal experience. Also only the Prince knows the truth, so if he is prepared to forgive Wilder then who am I to argue.
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Tried to amend this bit but ran out of time.

I'm not 100% convinced about Wilder, but I want enthused when he joined us in league 1 either, Wilder wouldn't be my normal 1st choice
but he's the obvious realistic short term solution, I'm very confident we'd very quickly improve regards performances, player confidence, player effort and general positivity regards designing tactics trying to win.

Basically the 1st half agains Man Utd and 2nd half again Wolves would be common/ normal performances almost every match.

The problem is if we greatly improve playing like the 2nd half against Wolves in every match, then still think we'll be relegated.
but at least we'd have a chance. Don't mind losing, don't mind being relegated as long as you go down fighting know your team gave its best.

At present you feel we've lost before the kick-off because you know our tactics will be sitting back in damage limitation mode.
 
We were terrible last season really, the league was utterly atrocious last season and we would turn up and play some of the worst football I've ever seen in many years and win 3-0. Theres a false sense of how good Hecky is because of the promotion. We like him but we need someone new. If we go down this season its only going to get worse from here, probably league one in a few years with how little money we have. How little the prince now wants to spend and uncertainty of our ownership. We need to stay up for the money and for the chance of new ownership as a premier league club still.
 
RedandWhite said:
We were terrible last season really, the league was utterly atrocious last season and we would turn up and play some of the worst football I've ever seen in many years and win 3-0. Theres a false sense of how good Hecky is because of the promotion. We like him but we need someone new. If we go down this season its only going to get worse from here, probably league one in a few years with how little money we have. How little the prince now wants to spend and uncertainty of our ownership. We need to stay up for the money and for the chance of new ownership as a premier league club still.
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Hecky has to be thankful Ndiaye stayed fit. He seems to base his tactics around 1 or 2 key players and if they are not available then the whole plan goes to shit.

We have gone back to being like we were pre Wilder, rely heavily on some star players to influence results and drag the rest of the team with them. MGW did it 2 years ago and Ndiaye followed in his footsteps.

What annoys me is despite Hecky being roped in to emulate the good work Wilder had done. He seems to have totally overlooked creating a team that is greater than the sum of its parts and not putting square pegs in round holes. Throw in the injures and it's more square pegs in round holes trying to force players into different positions where they are not comfortable especially in the midfield.
 
Sorry, think Hecky is stuck in a rut, we don't have the players we need for this league, and after watching us so far this season, I don't think we have a good enough squad to finish in the top 10 in the championship, the reality is, we need to do something asap.
 
Get Jags he has retired from playing bring him in as a defensive coach so he can teach certain players how to defend.
 
The Bohemian said:
Saturday was awful and the manager takes some responsibility for that performance. As he did for the two previous games against Brighton and Wolves, which yielded four points.

Our relegation was set before a ball had been kicked. Anyone with the most basic understanding of the Premier League understands that promoted teams who are serious about surviving in the “big league” need to sign next season’s best two players, not sell them. Hecky knew what was coming (or not!) and that’s why he tried to keep last season’s squad together. Banking on organisation and unity to keep us competitive. Berge and Ndiaye leaving, and a devastating injury list has made an incredibly difficult task, look impossible.

I would struggle to make a case for any of Saturday’s squad getting a start in any other Premier League team. Maybe McBurnie, Anel and McAtee would get a start at Luton. That’s not down to Hecky, who is playing the hand he’s been dealt. We are just not good enough.

Wilder brought in ten players in his first window, four or five more in January 2017 and ten more the following summer. Hecky has not had anything like that opportunity to rebuild but still got us up and there’s no reason to believe he wouldn’t do so again if given the chance.

There’s also a bigger picture in play here, with a well run Academy still producing good players, who see a pathway to the first team. Hecky is possibly the first manager since Shirecliffe was built who really gets it.

Those screaming loudest for change need to come up with a coherent argument for what and who makes it better given the current squad, injured list and lack of funds. Hecky has already proved he is a capable manager. They are hard to come by. We are in very real danger of making a bad situation considerably worse.
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"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results" - attributed to Einstein.

Well known quote everywhere but in our boardroom it appears.
 
The Bohemian said:
Saturday was awful and the manager takes some responsibility for that performance. As he did for the two previous games against Brighton and Wolves, which yielded four points.

Our relegation was set before a ball had been kicked. Anyone with the most basic understanding of the Premier League understands that promoted teams who are serious about surviving in the “big league” need to sign next season’s best two players, not sell them. Hecky knew what was coming (or not!) and that’s why he tried to keep last season’s squad together. Banking on organisation and unity to keep us competitive. Berge and Ndiaye leaving, and a devastating injury list has made an incredibly difficult task, look impossible.

I would struggle to make a case for any of Saturday’s squad getting a start in any other Premier League team. Maybe McBurnie, Anel and McAtee would get a start at Luton. That’s not down to Hecky, who is playing the hand he’s been dealt. We are just not good enough.

Wilder brought in ten players in his first window, four or five more in January 2017 and ten more the following summer. Hecky has not had anything like that opportunity to rebuild but still got us up and there’s no reason to believe he wouldn’t do so again if given the chance.

There’s also a bigger picture in play here, with a well run Academy still producing good players, who see a pathway to the first team. Hecky is possibly the first manager since Shirecliffe was built who really gets it.

Those screaming loudest for change need to come up with a coherent argument for what and who makes it better given the current squad, injured list and lack of funds. Hecky has already proved he is a capable manager. They are hard to come by. We are in very real danger of making a bad situation considerably worse.
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Yes let’s keep him.
 

My push back on this is do you think Hecky has the tactical nouse to get us back? I disagree, I think last season papered over the cracks. The division wasn’t as strong as it has been in my view and players like Ndiaye and McAtee carried our long ball approach and see what happens tactics for months tbh. Seems a decent guy but I think he’s in over his head. I also think he has faith in players that are over the hill too much as well.
 
The Bohemian said:
Saturday was awful and the manager takes some responsibility for that performance. As he did for the two previous games against Brighton and Wolves, which yielded four points.

Our relegation was set before a ball had been kicked. Anyone with the most basic understanding of the Premier League understands that promoted teams who are serious about surviving in the “big league” need to sign next season’s best two players, not sell them. Hecky knew what was coming (or not!) and that’s why he tried to keep last season’s squad together. Banking on organisation and unity to keep us competitive. Berge and Ndiaye leaving, and a devastating injury list has made an incredibly difficult task, look impossible.

I would struggle to make a case for any of Saturday’s squad getting a start in any other Premier League team. Maybe McBurnie, Anel and McAtee would get a start at Luton. That’s not down to Hecky, who is playing the hand he’s been dealt. We are just not good enough.

Those screaming loudest for change need to come up with a coherent argument for what and who makes it better given the current squad, injured list and lack of funds. Hecky has already proved he is a capable manager. They are hard to come by. We are in very real danger of making a bad situation considerably worse.
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A squad void of quality and depth that falls on the owner and the board, however a squad that isn't running, competing and fighting regardless of gulf in quality, that falls on the manager. Newcastle (H) 0-8, Arsenal (A) 5-0, Fulham (A) 3-1, Bournemouth (H) 1-3. 4 Games there where we've looked like a team that's rolled over and had it's belly tickled. It's not good enough and that stops with the manager, we could've lost those games under anyone but to lose in the manner we have not excusable.
 
Sheffsteel said:
Hecky's achievements in the championship can't be compared to Wilders achievement in the Championship.

When Hecky was promoted he was given the 2nd best squad in the league, the 4th highest budget in the league
the best players in the league and most neutrals in pre-season predicted United to finish 2nd.
Easier said than done but Hecky achieved what was expected, the club was under financial pressure and in the middle of a takeover making his job more difficult due to distractions but he stayed professional and focussed on the job.
However performances were consistently hit and miss, almost every match we had a 20 minute spell of playing some good passing football
(we looked a top team) but then in the same match we always had a 20 minute spell of struggling to string 3 passes together (we looked poor).
We often finished the last 20 minutes of many matches parking the bus and booting it clear anywhere.
Opposition fans always made the same comments like "not sure how they can be 2nd, every time I see them, they look so average"
and "they are basically just a mid table team with 2 top players Berge and N'Diaye ensuring they win".

Compare this to the Wilder Championship team we had no outstanding players.
We were considered a mid table table at best, no one expected us to be promoted.
We were bottom half based on budget......but we played as a team.
We were so well drilled, every player knew their job.
Every player seemed comfortable on the ball and we consistently played possession based simple pass and move football.
Our chance creation was mainly down to overloading the wings using our centre backs to get forward giving us an extra man.
Opposition fans (like a Bolton and Blackburn away) made comments like "very impressed with them, best team to come here for a few seasons".
and "you can see why they are near the top, they look so well drilled and play as a team".

Assume the Prince wants Wilder to stay because he knew he could work on a limited budget turning a set of average players into a good team.
Where as Hecky strengths are more about steadying the ship, staying calm, no drama and getting on with the job.

Much prefer Hecky as a person but Wilder is more of a winner, he's a terrible loser, where as Hecky is a nice man and a good loser.
So if we want any chance of staying up and I believe the players are better than what they are showing
I would prefer to give Wilder another chance, especially as his failure wasn't in normal times, it was during covid when many things become a surreal experience. Also only the Prince knows the truth, so if he is prepared to forgive Wilder then who am I to argue.
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Well said

Wilder not my first choice but I agree with all of your post, there’s nothing to disagree with it’s facts whether people like it or not.
 
Zeblades34 said:
A squad void of quality and depth that falls on the owner and the board, however a squad that isn't running, competing and fighting regardless of gulf in quality, that falls on the manager. Newcastle (H) 0-8, Arsenal (A) 5-0, Fulham (A) 3-1, Bournemouth (H) 1-3. 4 Games there where we've looked like a team that's rolled over and had it's belly tickled. It's not good enough and that stops with the manager, we could've lost those games under anyone but to lose in the manner we have not excusable.
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The squad has depth if players are not constantly injured. Those injuries have meant we now have 5 left backs.
 
Zeblades34 said:
Wouldn't be surprised if we sent either larouci or thomas back in jan
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Well if Lowe is fully fit then we don’t need one of them. Ideally you would send Thomas back to free up another UK loan.
 
Reluctantly I now think Hecky must go. The Prince has clearly lost interest and Bettis is so far out of his depth that the lifeguard needs a call, but we still spent £60m or whatever it was over the summer. Did Hecky not have any say in who was brought in? As many on here have pointed out, there were better options available than the L1 misfits (with the exception of Hamer) that we have bought. The fitness issues, the tactics, the baffling substitutions, the playing people out of position and sheer obstinacy of keeping doing what's failing are all down to Hecky.
Anyone but Wilder for me. He got us in to exactly the same situation last time, and is the one person who has proven that he doesn't know how to get us out of this spot. There must be a bright, young, energetic manager out there who wants a tilt at the Championship next season with a decent budget, a large fan base and the core of a decent side.
 
Seth Rollins said:
FFS. I have no idea how long it's taken you to write this post but if you honestly believe that PH should still be managing our club then you are thick as PIG SHIT.
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Hmmm, not the most considered alternate view I've ever read on here🤔.
 
My opinion. Stick with him. But if he was to go, I wouldn't be shocked or disappointed tbh.

Most of it really isn't HIS own fault, you'd have to sack half of the club by the mentality some people have about this situation.

Also the Premier League is on course to break a record in the longest time before a manager is sacked. Don't know which club wants to be the first to cross that line. This is a good thing for the game really and is what many fans have asked for, for many years and that is stability. Also its probably no coincidence that with inflation the way it has been coupled with pandemics, wars etc then clubs are looking to spend as little as possible instead of forking out on remaining contracts, new managers etc.

I would sack him if he fails next season (If/when in Championship) and has one less year on a looooong contract.
 
You might well be getting your Wilder wish Steel.
Spoke to a football coach who knows our coaching staff and am informed that Wilder and Prince fallout was overegged somewhat.No surprises perhaps.
Discussions of a 6 mth contract beginning before or by Christmas with the caviat of him keeping us up, where further negotiations become an option.
Just passing on what I'm told.
The only consolation for me is the temporary nature of the position.Beyond that,let's see.
McKenna's name was in the conversation too.
Watching Ipswich last night, he'd be my pick.
Never a dull moment being a Blade.👍🙏
 
I keep reading about it being “The Boards” fault. There are no football people on the board. None. They are in fact a daughter, lawyer, accountant and a company secretary. Advisors watching the Princes back legally. There may be others at United World advising on football matters but the issue of blame is firmly at the owners door. (That doesn’t excuse the way Hecky is managing the team he’s been given appallingly) . Maybe someone knows how involved Bettis is with football matters, or Schreiber, Mitchell etc ?
 
Nice guy, but has to go. He's like a non swimmer in the diving pool at Sheaf Valley Baths(before it closed) with one deflated arm band on. If this carries on things will get toxic. No Passion, No Fight, No hope
 

SuperSonicBlade89 said:
My opinion. Stick with him. But if he was to go, I wouldn't be shocked or disappointed tbh.

Most of it really isn't HIS own fault, you'd have to sack half of the club by the mentality some people have about this situation.

Also the Premier League is on course to break a record in the longest time before a manager is sacked. Don't know which club wants to be the first to cross that line. This is a good thing for the game really and is what many fans have asked for, for many years and that is stability. Also its probably no coincidence that with inflation the way it has been coupled with pandemics, wars etc then clubs are looking to spend as little as possible instead of forking out on remaining contracts, new managers etc.

I would sack him if he fails next season (If/when in Championship) and has one less year on a looooong contract.
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We genuinely look like a group of players who have won a raffle to play against a Premier League team, every week. Heckingbottom has been absolutely awful and the board has tossed the season in the bin with the summer window. Both can be true.

It’s time for him to go.
 
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