What happened to those who questioned the Prince's commitment?

[itsinyerblood]

I'm happily retired thanks but I still do not have as much time as you appear to have going on the number of your posts in the last 18 months.

Ah, the easily reached and incorrect assumption that I share your amount of disposable time. It's not the quantity you should be focussed on.

Here's an example, Darren is a solicitor of some repute, yet the time he dedicates to posting on here might suggest he's a lazy bugger. Clearly that's not the case. See how easy it is to draw the wrong conclusion? Glad to be of help.

 

[Grecian2000]

There was a real buzz yesterday and I'm so glad this thread came along to kick off a load of shit again.

Ahh, but it did get 20+ likes and an orgasm.

Can we keep it going until the fixtures are out (or the new away kit announced)?

 

[JJ Sefton]

Ahh, but it did get 20+ likes and an orgasm.

Can we keep it going until the fixtures are out (or the new away kit announced)?

In a shameless attempt to top 20 likes...

...lets see what I can get for this.

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

Ahh, but it did get 20+ likes and an orgasm.

Can we keep it going until the fixtures are out (or the new away kit announced)?

Not long now

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

...lets see what I can get for this.

 

[itsinyerblood]

In a shameless attempt to top 20 likes...

...lets see what I can get for this.

Never! Not with what passes for a neck, or that train crash of a face! And what's with 'The Welsh Bible'?

 

[Pierre's PC]

In a shameless attempt to top 20 likes...

...lets see what I can get for this.

 

[pommpey]

As I have said before, bringing in that number of players even on average third division wages would have cost a fair whack. The Board must have given Clough a significant budget for players. If he chose to spend that on a large number of mediocre players rather than a few good ones, that's an issue for him is it not? Or are you suggesting that non football people (the Board) tell the football person (the manager) who he can and can't sign? I suspect very few managers would be prepared to work on those terms and I am sure most of us would be up in arms if McCabe were to say "yep, we had to funds to buy players X, Y and Z that the manager wanted, but I didn't like the look of them, so I said he couldn't".

How's about:

Clough: "So, before I sign, you say you will support me buying players I want to come in? They'll be good, but expensive."

McCabe: "Yeah, Nige. Whatever. Fuck's sake. Sign here before the twats start taking their shoes off."

Clough: *scribbles*

A month later

Clough: "Boss. That email I sent with the list of players I want in. You never opened it."

McCabe: "Yeah. Erm, my Outlook is playing up. Can't even get Youtube or Bladesplayer on it. Sort of."

Clough: "I printed it off. Here's a hard copy."

(McCabe studies the list. He studies it again. And again.)

McCabe: " ... yeeeah. Okay. Look Nigel. I know we said 'support', but these players are a bit expensive. This one ... and this one. They are half to three quarters of a mil each and on 15k a week. And we got rid of this one under Wilson to pay for the new carpet in the VIP suite. You're not serious. Are you? I mean ... haven't you got connections at Derby or summat? Haven't they got some great players who are kicking about in the reserves? Blackpool? Scotland? Somewhere cheap?"

Clough: "Hang on. You said you'd help me build a team to get promoted."

McCabe: "Did I?" (shrugs) "Can't remember that."

(Clough's eyes well up. A solitary tear falls from his cheek onto the A4 paper list.)

McCabe: "Look Nige. Never mind what we say at the press conference. Do you really think we have the money to spunk on expensive players? Those daft cunts want us to sign players better than the ones we have. Fucking hell! Imagine if we actually went up to the Championship! They'd want more! I went there with Warnock and the daft big nosed cunt wanted me to actually buy Premiership players! We got it easy here chum. If we ride the storm every season, buy the odd duffer, don't tell them how much we spent, get them excited by dong a cup run and fuck up the playoffs they'll still come back for more, like lab rats. They did it after the triple assault season. We couldn't fucking lose! Of course, sometimes you fuck it up completely and reach the Premiership ... but we're Sheffield United. We are set up to fuck up. Ker-ching!"

(Clough looks forlornly at his tear-stained list again)

Clough: "So I'm not going anywhere?"

McCabe: "We'll see, son. We'll see. Now get shopping. Aldi, not Sainsbury's, yeah?" "

(McCabe saunters off down the corridor, whistling 'Annie's Song')

pommpey

 

[pommpey]

I may do, but the quantity pales into insignificance when compared to you. See if you can find where I have ever called a performance "the worst ever" when I was not at the game - only substantiated by a radio summariser and a 52 second clip on you tube. Now that is talking out of your arse.

Unlike you, I don't have some sort of .xls spreadsheet on other postees comments on here, Mobile. If you will refresh me on that instance where I obviously made a wrong call on a game we lost and others obviously saw different, I'd be grateful. Be aware, if the Youtube clip contained edited highlights then it obviously contained goals, and if we lost, obviously by the opposition team and not from us. I'd be pushed to comment it was 'our worst ever' if we won.

And no, I don't think some of the decisions made by McCabe have been the best although I still believe they were made with the club at heart. Having met and spoken with him on a number of occasions, I do think he is always thinking what is best for the club. In the same way I have worked with many staff who make the wrong call but do so with the right intensions.

You can have the right intentions and crash the fucking Titanic into an iceberg. It's all about competency though, isn't it? That, and how you build the ship and staff it with decent crew.

pommpey

 

[Darren]

How's about:

Clough: "So, before I sign, you say you will support me buying players I want to come in? They'll be good, but expensive."

McCabe: "Yeah, Nige. Whatever. Fuck's sake. Sign here before the twats start taking their shoes off."

Clough: *scribbles*

A month later

Clough: "Boss. That email I sent with the list of players I want in. You never opened it."

McCabe: "Yeah. Erm, my Outlook is playing up. Can't even get Youtube or Bladesplayer on it. Sort of."

Clough: "I printed it off. Here's a hard copy."

(McCabe studies the list. He studies it again. And again.)

McCabe: " ... yeeeah. Okay. Look Nigel. I know we said 'support', but these players are a bit expensive. This one ... and this one. They are half to three quarters of a mil each and on 15k a week. And we got rid of this one under Wilson to pay for the new carpet in the VIP suite. You're not serious. Are you? I mean ... haven't you got connections at Derby or summat? Haven't they got some great players who are kicking about in the reserves? Blackpool? Scotland? Somewhere cheap?"

Clough: "Hang on. You said you'd help me build a team to get promoted."

McCabe: "Did I?" (shrugs) "Can't remember that."

(Clough's eyes well up. A solitary tear falls from his cheek onto the A4 paper list.)

McCabe: "Look Nige. Never mind what we say at the press conference. Do you really think we have the money to spunk on expensive players? Those daft cunts want us to sign players better than the ones we have. Fucking hell! Imagine if we actually went up to the Championship! They'd want more! I went there with Warnock and the daft big nosed cunt wanted me to actually buy Premiership players! We got it easy here chum. If we ride the storm every season, buy the odd duffer, don't tell them how much we spent, get them excited by dong a cup run and fuck up the playoffs they'll still come back for more, like lab rats. They did it after the triple assault season. We couldn't fucking lose! Of course, sometimes you fuck it up completely and reach the Premiership ... but we're Sheffield United. We are set up to fuck up. Ker-ching!"

(Clough looks forlornly at his tear-stained list again)

Clough: "So I'm not going anywhere?"

McCabe: "We'll see, son. We'll see. Now get shopping. Aldi, not Sainsbury's, yeah?" "

(McCabe saunters off down the corridor, whistling 'Annie's Song')

pommpey

Misses the point entirely. Clough had a certain amount of money to spend. Why would McCabe give a shit if Clough decided to spend it on 10 decent players rather than 20 odd mediocre players?

 

[blade too long]

all players purchases are punts
if alex ferguson can buy taibi djemba djemba and bellion toksic anderson kleberson and bebe for a combined 120 million , we cant complain at few punts at our level

 

[pommpey]

Misses the point entirely. Clough had a certain amount of money to spend. Why would McCabe give a shit if Clough decided to spend it on 10 decent players rather than 20 odd mediocre players?

Can't believe you have actually written that Darren. You're either baiting me, or you know something different.

pommpey

 

[Darren]

Can't believe you have actually written that Darren. You're either baiting me, or you know something different.

pommpey

You've lost me. You seem to be suggesting that there was pressure from McCabe to make Clough sign shit players. We know Clough signed 20 odd players and McCabe provided funds for that. There is a strong argument that many of those players were not that good and Clough would have been better off spending the money signing fewer but better players. Given that the money spent would be the same, why would McCabe give a shit if he did that?

 

[pommpey]

You've lost me. You seem to be suggesting that there was pressure from McCabe to make Clough sign shit players. We know Clough signed 20 odd players and McCabe provided funds for that. There is a strong argument that many of those players were not that good and Clough would have been better off spending the money signing fewer but better players. Given that the money spent would be the same, why would McCabe give a shit if he did that?

Because we still don't know how much was spent. Let's cast aside the 'finger in the air' £10m proclamation by Phipps for the moment. In fact forever.

Are you saying it is totaly unfeasible that the 'budget' was so low that the only option was to bring in benchwarmers and dressing room sweepers from other clubs? Let's face it, we don't exactly know how much Higdon cost do we? In fact, 2014 looks a bit like this:

Che Adams Ilkeston Undisclosed
Chris Basham Blackpool Free
John Brayford Cardiff City Undisclosed
Andy Butler Walsall Free
Jamal Campbell-Ryce Notts County Free
Paul Coutts Derby County Undisclosed
Ben Davies Derby County Free
Matt Done Rochdale Undisclosed
Kieron Freeman Derby County Free
Michael Higdon NEC Nijmegen Undisclosed
Jason Holt Hearts Loan
Jay McEveley Unassigned Players Free
Harrison McGahey Blackpool Undisclosed
Marc McNulty Livingston Undisclosed
Iain Turner Unassigned Players Free
James Wallace Tranmere Rovers Free

Much of that, we can't put a figure on. We can speculate that Done cost > £500k and Brayford was in the region of £1.25-1.75m. Given Maguire went for £2.5m we are not exactly struggling for transfer cash, even given some sort of 'budget' allowance from the lords and masters. If you are suggesting Clough actively shopped for Coutts, McGahey, McNulty and even Adams with cash burning a hole in his sky rocket then I will doubt your notions, especially as we are trying to build a Championship side. Even the freebies are substandard, save for Basham in bits and bobs.

I'm suggesting that Clough's list was possibly short, targeted and expensive and maybe board level influence recalibrated it to cheap players and freebies. Game Changing Investments. Unfortunately changing the games to humiliating losses, a predicatble playoff exit and a sacking at the end of it all.

I can understand Clough's ennui when he stands or leans on the dugout watching his team capitulate to seemingly lesser sides. He doesn'y play the football out there and the ability (or lack of) out on the green stuff is the sum total of our position, and vice versa. I would lay anyone a bet that much of what you say is a 'budget' was anything but and this mirage of 20 players were simply 'options', quantity over quality by a manager increasingly under pressure to get results. Come close season and the inquest, and the board put to Clough to 'change the style of play' and my reply to them in that situation would be 'what the fuck with?' We have no consistent goalkeeping structure, our back four is porous and our midfield easy to suss if you concentrate on stopping Murphy. And up front we are abysmal. I don't blame Clough for that. If your toolbox is full of duff stuff, you won't be making Chippendale furniture.

pommpey

 

[Darren]

Because we still don't know how much was spent. Let's cast aside the 'finger in the air' £10m proclamation by Phipps for the moment. In fact forever.

Are you saying it is totaly unfeasible that the 'budget' was so low that the only option was to bring in benchwarmers and dressing room sweepers from other clubs? Let's face it, we don't exactly know how much Higdon cost do we? In fact, 2014 looks a bit like this:

Che Adams Ilkeston Undisclosed
Chris Basham Blackpool Free
John Brayford Cardiff City Undisclosed
Andy Butler Walsall Free
Jamal Campbell-Ryce Notts County Free
Paul Coutts Derby County Undisclosed
Ben Davies Derby County Free
Matt Done Rochdale Undisclosed
Kieron Freeman Derby County Free
Michael Higdon NEC Nijmegen Undisclosed
Jason Holt Hearts Loan
Jay McEveley Unassigned Players Free
Harrison McGahey Blackpool Undisclosed
Marc McNulty Livingston Undisclosed
Iain Turner Unassigned Players Free
James Wallace Tranmere Rovers Free

Much of that, we can't put a figure on. We can speculate that Done cost > £500k and Brayford was in the region of £1.25-1.75m. Given Maguire went for £2.5m we are not exactly struggling for transfer cash, even given some sort of 'budget' allowance from the lords and masters. If you are suggesting Clough actively shopped for Coutts, McGahey, McNulty and even Adams with cash burning a hole in his sky rocket then I will doubt your notions, especially as we are trying to build a Championship side. Even the freebies are substandard, save for Basham in bits and bobs.

I'm suggesting that Clough's list was possibly short, targeted and expensive and maybe board level influence recalibrated it to cheap players and freebies. Game Changing Investments. Unfortunately changing the games to humiliating losses, a predicatble playoff exit and a sacking at the end of it all.

I can understand Clough's ennui when he stands or leans on the dugout watching his team capitulate to seemingly lesser sides. He doesn'y play the football out there and the ability (or lack of) out on the green stuff is the sum total of our position, and vice versa. I would lay anyone a bet that much of what you say is a 'budget' was anything but and this mirage of 20 players were simply 'options', quantity over quality by a manager increasingly under pressure to get results. Come close season and the inquest, and the board put to Clough to 'change the style of play' and my reply to them in that situation would be 'what the fuck with?' We have no consistent goalkeeping structure, our back four is porous and our midfield easy to suss if you concentrate on stopping Murphy. And up front we are abysmal. I don't blame Clough for that. If your toolbox is full of duff stuff, you won't be making Chippendale furniture.

pommpey

You still haven't addressed my point. You have listed 16 players. I would probably agree with you that the money spent on wages, signing on fees and transfer fees for that lot would have been better spent on just 8 better quality players.

Why would the Board care if Clough spent the same amount of money on 8 good players rather than 16 duff players?

 

[pommpey]

Why would the Board care if Clough spent the same amount of money on 8 good players rather than 16 duff players?

Because the 8 (or even less) good players were possibly beyond the 'allowance' maybe? And who is asying ther duff players cost much anyway? Many of them were freebies, the rest (mostly) 'undisclosed', by which we could possibly deduce the club is a bit shifty about the lo-cost option because they know we will judge them by the player's on-field output? Or lack of it.

Face it, we need a 20+ per season striker plus at least two other players who are 10+ to be promoted. We need to ship less goals, particularly from set plays. If you take a microcosm of our past few seasons - the last game we played at Bramall Lane for example, a full back scored for us out of nowhere and the opposition bulleted a header in and scored from distance where a decent defence would have prevented both goals. We need a midfield that dominates and dictates the game and doesn't rely on Murphy beating his three markers and solo-ing his nimble way toward goal, afraid to pass it to McNulty for fear the ball ends up somewhere down Charlotte Road. We have four players as a starting point here and they are:

--------------------------x----------------------

Brayford-------x----------------x------------x

x------------Basham-----------x-------Murphy

------------------x-------------Done------------

Its up to the board to fill in the gaps there. Adkins cannot get blood from a stone and the inconsistencies of Flynn, Freeman/Harris, Reed/Wallace and the youth and inexperience of Adams (for the moment) will not get us to the top. We will have to buy our way out of this division because the staff can't (largely) play their way out.

pommpey

 

[Darren]

Because the 8 (or even less) good players were possibly beyond the 'allowance' maybe? And who is asying ther duff players cost much anyway? Many of them were freebies, the rest (mostly) 'undisclosed', by which we could possibly deduce the club is a bit shifty about the lo-cost option because they know we will judge them by the player's on-field output? Or lack of it.

Face it, we need a 20+ per season striker plus at least two other players who are 10+ to be promoted. We need to ship less goals, particularly from set plays. If you take a microcosm of our past few seasons - the last game we played at Bramall Lane for example, a full back scored for us out of nowhere and the opposition bulleted a header in and scored from distance where a decent defence would have prevented both goals. We need a midfield that dominates and dictates the game and doesn't rely on Murphy beating his three markers and solo-ing his nimble way toward goal, afraid to pass it to McNulty for fear the ball ends up somewhere down Charlotte Road. We have four players as a starting point here and they are:

--------------------------x----------------------

Brayford-------x----------------x------------x

x------------Basham-----------x-------Murphy

------------------x-------------Done------------

Its up to the board to fill in the gaps there. Adkins cannot get blood from a stone and the inconsistencies of Flynn, Freeman/Harris, Reed/Wallace and the youth and inexperience of Adams (for the moment) will not get us to the top. We will have to buy our way out of this division because the staff can't (largely) play their way out.

pommpey

Your original point was that the Board had not made significant funds available. My point was that signing a large number of players would not be cheap. They all need paying, even if fees are undisclosed or they come on free transfer. It's obvious that if you add together the money paid for 2 average players you could use the same money to sign 1 better player.

You can bring forward increasingly convoluted and unlikely arguments forward to suggest that significant funds were not made available, but the overwhelming likelihood is that the Board did make significant funds available and Clough misused some or all of the funds. I think you are the only person on here who doesn't accept that.

On the "undisclosed" point. Virtually all transfer fees at all clubs are "undisclosed". It is not any indication of especial shiftiness on United's part.

 

[pommpey]

Your original point was that the Board had not made significant funds available. My point was that signing a large number of players would not be cheap. They all need paying, even if fees are undisclosed or they come on free transfer. It's obvious that if you add together the money paid for 2 average players you could use the same money to sign 1 better player.

You can bring forward increasingly convoluted and unlikely arguments forward to suggest that significant funds were not made available, but the overwhelming likelihood is that the Board did make significant funds available and Clough misused some or all of the funds. I think you are the only person on here who doesn't accept that.

On the "undisclosed" point. Virtually all transfer fees at all clubs are "undisclosed". It is not any indication of especial shiftiness on United's part.

You're still not getting this, or deliberately 'misunderstanding'.

If we have spent money, then how much and on which players? Then let us be the judge if Clough mis-spent. If Coutts (for example) cost £750k, then should we not be in on that transaction? What have they got to hide? Where is the spirit of openness and transparency? Or did he cost significantly less than that and his onfield performance (which you must admit has been underwhelming) justifies that fee.

Darren - I am not pro-Clough and anti-Adkins here. I think we have a great manager in Adkins and hope (once again) he is the catalyst to (once again) get this club out of this division and up where I feel we should be. I fear however that bru-ha-ha and optimism should be tempered until the summer transfer market has closed and we look at the shape and potency of the team Adkins has at his disposal because I struggle to see how he can even begin to shift a current team with some limited capability but large areas of doubt forward into an automatic spot and stay there taking into consideration player absences and strength in depth.

pommpey

 

[Cyprus Blade]

Why would the Board care if Clough spent the same amount of money on 8 good players rather than 16 duff players?

Wage levels - may be a ceiling on wages and Board scared it would create spiralling wage claims - just a thought. Not sure how Brayford fits in that though.

 

[Darren]

You're still not getting this, or deliberately 'misunderstanding'.

If we have spent money, then how much and on which players? Then let us be the judge if Clough mis-spent. If Coutts (for example) cost £750k, then should we not be in on that transaction? What have they got to hide? Where is the spirit of openness and transparency? Or did he cost significantly less than that and his onfield performance (which you must admit has been underwhelming) justifies that fee.

Darren - I am not pro-Clough and anti-Adkins here. I think we have a great manager in Adkins and hope (once again) he is the catalyst to (once again) get this club out of this division and up where I feel we should be. I fear however that bru-ha-ha and optimism should be tempered until the summer transfer market has closed and we look at the shape and potency of the team Adkins has at his disposal because I struggle to see how he can even begin to shift a current team with some limited capability but large areas of doubt forward into an automatic spot and stay there taking into consideration player absences and strength in depth.

pommpey

You're asking for a detailed breakdown of how much was spent and on whom. No club discloses that sort of information. You therefore can't infer that the lack of such information indicates some sort of conspiracy to hide how much was spent.

However, we can infer from the sheer number of players signed, some of whom cost fees and all of whom cost wages, that significant funds were made available. My point is that however much was spent on say, Coutts and McGahey, in wages and fees might have been better spent on one player better than both of them. Should Clough had wanted to go that, it's obvious the Board would not have objected is it not?

 

[pommpey]

You're asking for a detailed breakdown of how much was spent and on whom. No club discloses that sort of information. You therefore can't infer that the lack of such information indicates some sort of conspiracy to hide how much was spent.

However, we can infer from the sheer number of players signed, some of whom cost fees and all of whom cost wages, that significant funds were made available. My point is that however much was spent on say, Coutts and McGahey, in wages and fees might have been better spent on one player better than both of them. Should Clough had wanted to go that, it's obvious the Board would not have objected is it not?

What then if this?

(for example figures)

Coutts - £120k signing + £3k pw wages (Derby Benchwarmer - never gonna be first team, in Championship)
McGahey - £80k signing + £2k pw wages (Blackpool development player - team in crisis - sell them all to reduce costs)

"Please Mr McCabe, can we sign Barry Gooddefender, out of favour at Norwich because of recent signings at £900k signing + £13k pw wages. I also have my eye on Nick Twentygoals at Swansea who will come for £1.2m and £18k, Billy Boxtobox at Ipswich who is pissed off with not playing and we can have him for £750k and £15k and Robbie Wideman at DirtyLeeds, getting on a bit but can find the front man with a cross at £350k plus £20k"

pommpey

 

[LoughboroBlade]

What then if this?

(for example figures)

Coutts - £120k signing + £3k pw wages (Derby Benchwarmer - never gonna be first team, in Championship)
McGahey - £80k signing + £2k pw wages (Blackpool development player - team in crisis - sell them all to reduce costs)

"Please Mr McCabe, can we sign Barry Gooddefender, out of favour at Norwich because of recent signings at £900k signing + £13k pw wages. I also have my eye on Nick Twentygoals at Swansea who will come for £1.2m and £18k, Billy Boxtobox at Ipswich who is pissed off with not playing and we can have him for £750k and £15k and Robbie Wideman at DirtyLeeds, getting on a bit but can find the front man with a cross at £350k plus £20k"

pommpey

So presumably you would accept it would have been in Clough's power to instead sign one player for £200k + £5k pw wages, which would likely have meant a player of moderately higher quality than the two you give in the example?

 

[Darren]

What then if this?

(for example figures)

Coutts - £120k signing + £3k pw wages (Derby Benchwarmer - never gonna be first team, in Championship)
McGahey - £80k signing + £2k pw wages (Blackpool development player - team in crisis - sell them all to reduce costs)

"Please Mr McCabe, can we sign Barry Gooddefender, out of favour at Norwich because of recent signings at £900k signing + £13k pw wages. I also have my eye on Nick Twentygoals at Swansea who will come for £1.2m and £18k, Billy Boxtobox at Ipswich who is pissed off with not playing and we can have him for £750k and £15k and Robbie Wideman at DirtyLeeds, getting on a bit but can find the front man with a cross at £350k plus £20k"

pommpey

So you're saying that the Board might not let Clough spend more than the combined costs of Coutts and McGahey on one or more better players. You may well be right on that. However, they would not have an issue with him signing one better player whose value equals the costs of the said two players would they?

No-one is arguing that the Board did not give unlimited funds to Clough. However, in third division terms, the funds were significant and, if wisely spent, should have been enough to get us out of the division.

 

[MobileBlade]

I would say that of the list that Pommpey has put on, when you include things like employers NI, pension contributions and other employer costs, you will be looking somewhere of the region of about £3.5 million per year just in payroll costs - the same as Wayne Rooney's left leg.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

Wage levels - may be a ceiling on wages and Board scared it would create spiralling wage claims - just a thought. Not sure how Brayford fits in that though.

I am sure the club , board , Clough ( as with Adkins) , have a fixed ceiling , not on transfer fees , but salaries , length of players contacts . This sets the benchmark of the budget the manager has on player recruitment , and the players we can be interested in , and ultimately purchase.

Brayford must be the exception to the rule .

Bonuses , league position , promotion all come into play , as incentives.

Just nice we have some money to spend , after so many years of not having a pot to piss in.

UTB

 

[itsinyerblood]

I am sure the club , board , Clough ( as with Adkins) , have a fixed ceiling , not on transfer fees , but salaries , length of players contacts . This sets the benchmark of the budget the manager has on player recruitment , and the players we can be interested in , and ultimately purchase.

Brayford must be the exception to the rule .

Bonuses , league position , promotion all come into play , as incentives.

Just nice we have some money to spend , after so many years of not having a pot to piss in.

UTB

That's about as precise a summary as there is Bos. Regarding Brayford, whatever his fee, given the desire to secure promotion next season, I think JB's fee will, in hindsight, prove to be good value. I see moderate Championship players swap clubs for between £2-4 million, and one thing Brayford isn't and that's moderate. I hope the signing of a decent center half will enable Brayford to resume his place at right back (all based on him returning to full fitness during next season). It's where he's most effective, he adds another dimension to our attacking play, and you know that when he's on form we've got a great player.

Your question about having funds, of course it's refreshing. For far too long we've been forced to act like paupers, never sending out the message that we were ambitious, instead just keeping our head above the depressing waters of the lower divisions. And yet we still manage to pull regular crowds of between 18-20 thousand, throughout a period where we've often flattered to deceive. We simply weren't good enough. We praised players who contributed to our life in the footballing gutter, we've signed players who should never have worn the shirt, and it's only now that we're sensing the possibility of something realistic happening. Something positive that will make us all look forward to what's ahead. Don't get me wrong, we'll certainly hit sticky patches, there'll be times when we question the manager and players, but I guess that's the same whoever you support. For now it's time to look forward to a better future...here's hoping. UTB

 

[Sothall_Blade]

Seriously? We signed 20 odd players last season and didn't sell anyone. Those players don't sign for free or play for free. What more "material evidence" do you want?

The Board made significant funds available to Clough last season. The fact that he misused those funds is hardly the Board's fault.

Clough sold or released Brandy, Taylor, McGinty, King, McMahon, Miller, Whitehouse, Hill, Westlake, Butler, Porter, McGinn, Ironside, Williams and of course Maguire.
None of those played for free either. The money received for Maguire and Taylor and increased attendances will have funded most of the transfer fees paid out. The cup run last season funded the new pitch. Two more good cup runs since then..
According to Phipps, the Prince has put in £10M over the last 2 seasons. That's £5M per season.
McCabe used to claim that he was putting in roughly that much every season anyway.
It seems to me that our expenditure has increased since the Prince came in but the manager has still had to generate most of the funding for this himself.

 

[Darren]

Clough sold or released Brandy, Taylor, McGinty, King, McMahon, Miller, Whitehouse, Hill, Westlake, Butler, Porter, McGinn, Ironside, Williams and of course Maguire.
None of those played for free either. The money received for Maguire and Taylor and increased attendances will have funded most of the transfer fees paid out. The cup run last season funded the new pitch. Two more good cup runs since then..
According to Phipps, the Prince has put in £10M over the last 2 seasons. That's £5M per season.
McCabe used to claim that he was putting in roughly that much every season anyway.
It seems to me that our expenditure has increased since the Prince came in but the manager has still had to generate most of the funding for this himself.

As I recall ins and outs under Clough were as follows:

IN

Alcock
Harris
Brayford (loan)
Brayford (permanent)
Butler
Basham
J. Wallace
Scougall
McNulty
Done
B. Davies (loan)
B. Davies (permanent)
McGahey
Paynter (loan)
Coutts
McEveley
Campbell-Ryce
Higdon
Turner
McCarthy (loan)
Freeman (loan)
Freeman (permanent)
Adams
O'Grady (loan)
S. Davies (loan)
K. Wallace
Holt (loan)
OUT

Westlake
Williams
Maguire
Butler
Hill
Porter
Taylor
Miller
McGinn
Coady (loan ended)
King
Brandy
Lappin (loan ended)
McGinty
Ironside
Whitehouse
McMahon
Johns

That's 24 different players in (20 permanently) and 18 out (16 of whom were permanent. I believe we only got fees for Taylor and Maguire and I think the wages of the ins would significantly exceed the wages of the outs. Given that over the last few years players sales have used to fund the running of the club, the fact that there was most likely a significant net loss on player costs does indeed show a funding commitment by the Board

 

[JJ Sefton]

If this thread can survive Gail Platt giving it curtains, it can survive owt.

 

[metalblade]

Strange to hear McCabe on radio pig this morning saying one of the reasons for sacking Clough was that he had OVERspent on players, make of that what you will. Did he overspend throughout the season or just on Brayford in the JTW or was the overspend just on wages ?

btw. I don't think significant amounts would be needed to be classed as an overspend on that shower of shit.