We don’t really need a ground with more than 40,000 seats. If the club are determined to push ahead with a permanent office block in the Kop/South stand corner, I’d like to see a “mirror image” block replace the Pukka pies corner. The stand is the worst piece of stadium architecture I’ve ever seen and has very poor seat layout and restricted views. The loss of the seats in that corner stand would be negligible, and would add to the atmosphere by making the Kop more cavernous thus giving the ground more symmetry.
I think if we became a stable mid-table Premiership team we'd actually see attendances lower a little as people will get bored eventually. We're currently on the crest of a wave so we have a lot of bandwagon jumpers.
If the club are determined to push ahead with a permanent office block in the Kop/South stand corner, I’d like to see a “mirror image” block replace the Pukka pies corner.
What does better designed seating mean? Do you mean split into 2 tiers?
Or do you mean more leg room which means a lower capacity. Can’t see the club spending money to actually reduce turnover.
The current rake and space would be fine for rail/ safe standing seating.
Not sure what you mean regards the Pukka pie corner....you’d remove the seating but replace it with better seating.
Personally as long as the pillars are removed and the concourse made bigger and put under cover with fancy bars, kiosks and toilets
then that would be a massive upgrade on the 80’s style facilities we currently have.
No, I mean a single tier, and ideally a corner with seats you can actually see the pitch from and would actually choose to sit on. To allow for a better rake and better visibility, just raise the height of the Kop roof a moderate amount to compensate.
If we had a few years of Premier League money it would make sense to completely bulldoze the kop and the corners and start afresh. It is ridiculous to have exits at the top and bottom it needs them halfway down too and a concourse underneath about halfway down. you would not lose capacity that would be taken care of by new useable corner sections.
I was reading this earlier. edit: This is a bit long sorry, but no fares, and time on hands!
As mentioned earlier in lots of posts, we don't want to lose capacity, but the Kop needs work. Can't do it when 11th in League 1 (as team first for money spending), or when in prem (as capacity first) - really there is no good time, so needs thought.
-
So I worked out a strategy (with rough drawings), shows how many fares I had today!
1st thing though, the only way I'd ever like that 'new kop' image if it was all [safe] standing, but mainly, AND that business centre next to SS is removed. Stadiums are for viewing matches not sitting in offices 9-5 M-F looking at an empty ground. This standing issue is important, as this plan is clearly the cheapest and easiest to do. If no stafe standing, then I would demolish it.
---- This year:
--- No change obviously.
---- Next year:
--- If we go down, then demolish the kop and rebuild with the payments we get and we earned. We went up with no mass funding under Wilder, so can do it again.
--- We'll have enough money to make decision on what to build, and without the minimum fans allowance, take all 3 sides of the ground, and put the away fans in the JS/Kop corner. See pics for potentials - very quick sketches, I'm no artist!
--- If we stay up, then remove the kop roof, and build a dual purpose section of pylons behind the kop (that can be used for new stand) and in the mean time, cantilever a temporary roof. (similar to post #148 by bromtom)
---- Year after:
--- If go down see above
--- If we stay up and look to be settled up there, then need to make decisions on what to do.
OPTIONS
1. The current plans - probably cheapest option - No thanks unless can stand up + no business centre
2. Connect up SS and JS with a lower tier Kop - then build behind it a large 2nd tier (see image)
3. Same as above but keep the Pukka corner - cheaper option quicker than above
4. Build new kop so it matches what the SS will look like (and could be joined up in the corner for extra room (Newcastle type thing), but smaller - time consuming - see image
5. A complete rebuild (Spurs style) - expensive and time consuming - see image
Then double the amount of option by adding to each of the above either:
i) - a basic build with no inside facilities - much like now - cheaper and quicker
ii) - a full stand rebuild with excellent facilities - more expensive and far longer
There is an option 6 I thought of...
If you have a glass or cup in your hand, put the drink down now, and get ready to ignore me!
Option 6: If we become comfortable in the prem, and don't want to lose any seats at all, then
i) Build new kop as options above
ii) Do the SS at the same time
iii) Hire out 'another ground' for 1 season, and the whole lot in one
With all of the plans that I've listed, the idea of the 2 tier system on all of them, is because the last 3 seasons, I've sat on the JS when could get ticket off friends if on hols etc. and there is only singing prematch, goal, or perhaps exciting moment might get 'United!' twice. This is why atmosphere is sometimes mentioned IMO. These kids when about 10-12 WANT to sing. So I would have the bottom tier (not exclusively) but encouraged as a stepping stone from the JS. It also goes back to the old concourse and could have facilities in or at the end of it.
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multi stage build 1.jpg
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multi stage build 2.jpg
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Similar to New New South Stand projections, so a bit like newcastle potential with the corner.jpg
SAG have to feel important. OK to let away fans have front row seats with the risk of pitch invasion just to fit in with premier league rules. Home fans though can lump it, there has to be segregation otherwise SAG would be reduced to setting minimum priority points requirements and a few jobs would become redundant. I very much doubt there will be no netted off areas in the Home ends.
I was reading this earlier. edit: This is a bit long sorry, but no fares, and time on hands!
As mentioned earlier in lots of posts, we don't want to lose capacity, but the Kop needs work. Can't do it when 11th in League 1 (as team first for money spending), or when in prem (as capacity first) - really there is no good time, so needs thought.
-
So I worked out a strategy (with rough drawings), shows how many fares I had today!
1st thing though, the only way I'd ever like that 'new kop' image if it was all [safe] standing, but mainly, AND that business centre next to SS is removed. Stadiums are for viewing matches not sitting in offices 9-5 M-F looking at an empty ground. This standing issue is important, as this plan is clearly the cheapest and easiest to do. If no stafe standing, then I would demolish it.
---- This year:
--- No change obviously.
---- Next year:
--- If we go down, then demolish the kop and rebuild with the payments we get and we earned. We went up with no mass funding under Wilder, so can do it again.
--- We'll have enough money to make decision on what to build, and without the minimum fans allowance, take all 3 sides of the ground, and put the away fans in the JS/Kop corner. See pics for potentials - very quick sketches, I'm no artist!
--- If we stay up, then remove the kop roof, and build a dual purpose section of pylons behind the kop (that can be used for new stand) and in the mean time, cantilever a temporary roof. (similar to post #148 by bromtom)
---- Year after:
--- If go down see above
--- If we stay up and look to be settled up there, then need to make decisions on what to do.
OPTIONS
1. The current plans - probably cheapest option - No thanks unless can stand up + no business centre
2. Connect up SS and JS with a lower tier Kop - then build behind it a large 2nd tier (see image)
3. Same as above but keep the Pukka corner - cheaper option quicker than above
4. Build new kop so it matches what the SS will look like (and could be joined up in the corner for extra room (Newcastle type thing), but smaller - time consuming - see image
5. A complete rebuild (Spurs style) - expensive and time consuming - see image
Then double the amount of option by adding to each of the above either:
i) - a basic build with no inside facilities - much like now - cheaper and quicker
ii) - a full stand rebuild with excellent facilities - more expensive and far longer
There is an option 6 I thought of...
If you have a glass or cup in your hand, put the drink down now, and get ready to ignore me!
Option 6: If we become comfortable in the prem, and don't want to lose any seats at all, then
i) Build new kop as options above
ii) Do the SS at the same time
iii) Hire out 'another ground' for 1 season, and the whole lot in one
With all of the plans that I've listed, the idea of the 2 tier system on all of them, is because the last 3 seasons, I've sat on the JS when could get ticket off friends if on hols etc. and there is only singing prematch, goal, or perhaps exciting moment might get 'United!' twice. This is why atmosphere is sometimes mentioned IMO. These kids when about 10-12 WANT to sing. So I would have the bottom tier (not exclusively) but encouraged as a stepping stone from the JS. It also goes back to the old concourse and could have facilities in or at the end of it. -
Appreciate the effort and some of the drawings look really good. Love the look of the 3 tier with a slight wrap around.
The issue to consider though is that McCabe is a professional property developer.
His team of experts will have spent many weeks considering every single possible option, plan A, B, C, D and plan E with costings and return on investment.
No doubt there will be issues that no one has even thought about.
I’ll give an example....this is made up....just to explain weird potential difficulties.
The experts might have warned McCabe that there could be unexploded 2nd world war bombs and/ or asbestos hidden deep under the Kop.
Also buildings regulations might mean when they find asbestos it can take a minimum of 1 year to clear the site.
So if we demolish the Kop, there’s a chance we could have a 20,000 stadium capacity in the PL for 3 or 4 years, losing millions in revenue.
Liverpool recently expanded their stadium and built behind the current stand, so there was no loss of capacity.
The “no reduction of stadium capacity” were the massive benefits of the current designs regards our Kop and South stand.
The other benefits were bringing in an income 365 days out of year, regardless of relegation.
So the unpopular stuff like office blocks, rental accommodation, catering/ banqueting facilities are a big advantage to a club.... if put in the right places.
We're not planning on spending another 6 years in L1 either. The plans currently approved and ready to commence with are to increase the capacity to 41k, not 45k, and would be easily attainable for half the fixtures in the premiership. Some of our fans are terrified of the words "ambition" and "progression".
We're not planning on spending another 6 years in L1 either. The plans currently approved and ready to commence with are to increase the capacity to 41k, not 45k, and would be easily attainable for half the fixtures in the premiership. Some of our fans are terrified of the words "ambition" and "progression".
45k was the number mentioned previously, in the comment I was originally replying to.
I'm not "terrified" of ambition or progression, I bet you can't find one person on here who is either.
As it is I think 41k is more realistic. The meaning of my original comment, which you seem to have missed, is that assuming that attendances at the lane will stay as high as this season if we establish ourselves as a PL may not be correct. We currently have a lot of band-wagon jumpers who may easily get bored if we spent 5-10 seasons at mid-table.
Don’t think so.....the stadium plan has always shown seats in the bottom tier Westfield corner but we know none actually exist.
Does anyone know the results of the Safety Committee and response from the PL?
Are we having areas with loads of netting again? Looks like part one full section of the upper tier isn’t for sale?
How many tickets do away fans receive and are we being forced to put 100 in the top tier meaning loads of segregation.
What will the official capacity be next season?
Edit: Just looked on the Leicester City ticket site and we’ve allocated them 2,865 tickets.
The normal rule is 3,000, the last time we were in the PL, they allowed us to allocate 2,990, less than the rule.
We’ve lost a further 100 seats in the bottom tier due to the stairways being built to exit the upper tier.
So it looks like the PL have allowed us just to put away fans in the bottom tier, suspect we’ll have the whole of the top tier.
Will the front rows of the BLUT be netted off though?
Doesn't mean they're terrified of ambition or progression does it though. You can still be both ambitious and progressive without adding to the capacity of your stadium.
Not sure the purpose of the rest of your ramble is about really but at least it's allowed you to talk down to me so well done you.
Doesn't mean they're terrified of ambition or progression does it though. You can still be both ambitious and progressive without adding to the capacity of your stadium.
Not sure the purpose of the rest of your ramble is about really but at least it's allowed you to talk down to me so well done you.
Your ground is part and parcel of your ambition otherwise we'd still have 3 fucking sides to it. Even McCabe, who I am no fan of whatsoever, recognises this and has had plans in place to upgrade for ages now for when the time comes.
I haven't the faintest what the last part of your post is all about.
Your ground is part and parcel of your ambition otherwise we'd still have 3 fucking sides to it. Even McCabe, who I am no fan of whatsoever, recognises this and has had plans in place to upgrade for ages now for when the time comes.
I haven't the faintest what the last part of your post is all about.
"Big clubs" like Villa shut off stands when not getting full crowds. It's not the end of the world if that was to happen. And guess what...when the crowds are back they open them back up. Same with Cardiff with their recent extension
A capacity of 41k would allow us to achieve and sustain an average of 35k. Half the games would bring in around 40k, the rest around 30k. That's how it works as I was trying to explain earlier. If we ever got to the stage where the average approached 40k then we would need to consider expanding the ground again for the same reason.
A capacity of 41k would allow us to achieve and sustain an average of 35k. Half the games would bring in around 40k, the rest around 30k. That's how it works as I was trying to explain earlier. If we ever got to the stage where the average approached 40k then we would need to consider expanding the ground again for the same reason.
But the discussion I was part of (post #180) was 45k, hence why I was also talking about 45k. You've put yourself into the middle of that discussion to disagree with me about something I wasn't talking about. If the discussion had been about the plans of 41k then I'd see what you're getting at.
A capacity of 41k would allow us to achieve and sustain an average of 35k. Half the games would bring in around 40k, the rest around 30k. That's how it works as I was trying to explain earlier. If we ever got to the stage where the average approached 40k then we would need to consider expanding the ground again for the same reason.
I was down there earlier as I took my nephew to get a Keeper top. The commentary box still looks some way away from being completed. I did over hear a builder saying "we need to be finished by today..." though I've obviously no idea what this was in reference to.
I was down there earlier as I took my nephew to get a Keeper top. The commentary box still looks some way away from being completed. I did over hear a builder saying "we need to be finished by today..." though I've obviously no idea what this was in reference to.
I was down there earlier as I took my nephew to get a Keeper top. The commentary box still looks some way away from being completed. I did over hear a builder saying "we need to be finished by today..." though I've obviously no idea what this was in reference to.
A capacity of 41k would allow us to achieve and sustain an average of 35k. Half the games would bring in around 40k, the rest around 30k. That's how it works as I was trying to explain earlier. If we ever got to the stage where the average approached 40k then we would need to consider expanding the ground again for the same reason.
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(with rough drawings), shows how many fares I had today!
