Why did it go so wrong?

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

My comment about punching above or weight was not about the size of Clubs but more about the quality of players we have at the moment.
How many of our current squad would other championship sides really be interested in if we had gone back down maybe 4 max.

Blackman (admittedly not our player), Moore, Baldock, Evans, Freeman, JOC, Basham, Stearman, Coutts, Fleck, Evans, Brooks & Lundstram would all find gainful employment in the championship in varying capacities. It could also be argued that a couple off that list could play in the prem.

 

[Grappler]

I guess the frustrating/baffling thing is how our team can put in a performance like we did against Cardiff, and then a few days later, the same players put in a performance like we did yesterday against Barnsley?, we can't seem to defend a lead, which is worry, and while our season is dropping off (we will be lucky to stay in the top 10, and if we do, I will see that as a great achievement) you can't class the season as anything other than a success.

Yes, we should have signed a fast, strong aggresive striker in January, instead of James Wilson, but we didn't and that is history. We need Coutts back and we need Freeman back (as cover or first choice).

 

[stringer]

(3 perms & a loan), two of which will probably leave in the summer for less than we paid for them and had to send CCV back to Spurs to balance the books. I also thought we bid £4m for Conor Coady in August, or did I imagine that (you'll be able to confirm)?

Which two will probably leave in the summer of the three incomings? CCV didn’t go back to balance books and £4m is a bit steep for Coady (the bid not his value).

 

[Sean Thornton]

Which two will probably leave in the summer of the three incomings? CCV didn’t go back to balance books and £4m is a bit steep for Coady (the bid not his value).

CCV sent back to balance the books? Where does this nonsense come from?

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

I'd proffer Holmes & Leonard as being surplus to requirements. Unless he has fallen foul of some sort of illness/injury, I can only view Holmes as a complete and utter was of time, money & effort. Judging by the lack of playing time, I can only assume CW has come to a similar conclusion. Leonard is perhaps more of a discussion, however i'd still view him as being being below the bench mark of required quality next season.

I was told that CCV went back due to £'s. If CCV didn't go back to Spurs to balance the books and was based on footballing reasons, then it certainly left us short of quality cover at CB and the ability to rotate/save legs of either Basham and/or Stearman during the remainder of the season. The decision seems to have surprised both CCV & Spurs, and the timing of him going back whilst others came in is suspicious.

If not £4m, then what? Surely more than the money expended on Holmes, Leonard, Evans & Wilson? I'll happily defer to your access to the inside story on these matters.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

CCV sent back to balance the books? Where does this nonsense come from?

As mentioned in my post, I was told this by someone who's usually well informed. If i'm wrong and you're better informed, then why was he sent back? Two poor performances against Fulham and Bolton, or other issues of attitude? I'll happily stand corrected, ST.

 

[Hamburg Blade]

I knew at the end of last season, when everyone to a man was lauding Wilder and the team and riding on cloud 9, and most people had their sensible heads on talking about consolidation and how it would be far more difficult in the Championship, though some were predicting a good season and a fight for a double promotion, that there would be some who would not be happy with anything other than a top two finish and a spend that put us in the top few big spenders in the division.
The board are the usual fall guys, it's like Blades-Tourettes. Some people just don't want to be happy. First season back after six in League One. It's been a great season so far with hopefully a bit of excitement still to come.
The same moans and whinges would be levelled at the board, manager and players if we do go up but don't make a mid-table position comfortably ours in the PL (and don't spunk a load of moneh).
It's the Blades Way (for some).

 

[The Crab]

I hate that term 'punching above our weight' we are Sheffield United not fucking Burton. We (and the board) need to realise this.

Punching above the weight we had become maybe.

Six years in League 1 and all the financial impact that comes with it. The game has moved on in that period of time. Upon our return, we had to readjust. We were hoping, with the Prince, that there was going to be enough in the pot to take a decent seat at the table. But that hasn't turned out to be the case. So all things considered, perhaps in some ways we are "punching above our weight".

The position we are in, I'd have taken at the start of the season. The problem is, the bar was set really high, and got our hopes up that we could "do a Southampton" and go straight through.

For me, the first order of business is to get the Boardroom situation thing sorted out, quickly. Whoever ultimately takes over need to realise the investment needed if we are to kick on. It's no good saying "but spending big hasn't done the Pigs any good". Whilst that may well be true, it's no good going too far the other way either. I really feel that whatever happens with the Board will be pivotal and have a knock on effect for next season if it isn't nailed down quickly.

 

[LJBlade]

Yes it is. In a typically flimsy bladey way.

But back to reality and the now.

We have some very good (and one or two outstanding) Championship standard players. We have dominated sides that are destined for either promotion or the play offs. We have a manager and assistant that deploy a strategy or method that has produced some of the very best football in a generation. We HAVE a good side, one which has Underperformed in recent weeks. NOT overperformed.

The manager fears NO ONE in the division. No one. There is good reason for this. In only 3 or 4 of the 41 games played home and away this year have we genuinely looked 2nd best. We MULLERED Cardiff, sitting pretty in 2nd as recently as this last week.

I do understand the steady progress line that a lot of our fans prefer to take. But even with this in mind, don’t sell yourselves (or your team) short !!!

Big ask, but 2 wins in next two games at home, and let’s check back to gauge your “mood” then !!!!!!!

UTB

Can you point out one person on here who would prefer us to not go up this season?

Not having a meltdown because we’ve missed out on the playoffs (most likely) isn’t selling ourselves short.

 

[Hartley Hare]

For what little I know.......

I do not see a strong leader in our team, a captain dynamo, a player with a strong personality to drive the team forward, to organise and chastise others for poor play, a winner with ambition and desire. Who is that player?

We should have got a third goal when dominating after taking the lead yesterday. How many times do we surrender a lead or allow the opposition to grab a last minute equaliser or winner. Time after time, year after year.

We missed the quiet assurance of Stearman yesterday, he has been an astute signing. Billy and Leon have been excellent, but they are both in the winter of their careers, Donaldson also. We need investment in the squad to move forward and it will be expensive.

A top ten finish this season is a success and above realistic expectations back in the championship.

HH

 

[DronnieBlade]

For what little I know.......

I do not see a strong leader in our team, a captain dynamo, a player with a strong personality to drive the team forward, to organise and chastise others for poor play, a winner with ambition and desire. Who is that player?

We should have got a third goal when dominating after taking the lead yesterday. How many times do we surrender a lead or allow the opposition to grab a last minute equaliser or winner. Time after time, year after year.

We missed the quiet assurance of Stearman yesterday, he has been an astute signing. Billy and Leon have been excellent, but they are both in the winter of their careers, Donaldson also. We need investment in the squad to move forward and it will be expensive.

A top ten finish this season is a success and above realistic expectations back in the championship.

HH

I’ll have a crack at your first question.?
It’s not Clarke. Categorically.

Bizarrely, IMHO, the gaffer thinks otherwise !

UTB

 

[Hartley Hare]

I want it to be Fleck. It should be Fleck, but does he have it in him? I do not know and doubt it now.

HH

 

[Broomhall Blade]

Blackman (admittedly not our player), Moore, Baldock, Evans, Freeman, JOC, Basham, Stearman, Coutts, Fleck, Evans, Brooks & Lundstram would all find gainful employment in the championship in varying capacities. It could also be argued that a couple off that list could play in the prem.

Sorry but JOC, Fleck, Brookes, and possibly Stearman. Rest no chance Freeman & Coutts coming back from serious injury Moore, Lunds & Evans can't see any Championship side being interested. Blackman not ours.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

Sorry but JOC, Fleck, Brookes, and possibly Stearman. Rest no chance Freeman & Coutts coming back from serious injury Moore, Lunds & Evans can't see any Championship side being interested. Blackman not ours.

Moore would be picked up by a championship club tomorrow as reserve keeper, the role he fulfilled when we bought him.

Including us, Lundstram has played for 3 championship clubs in his career, and played roughly a third of his games at that level.

Evans is a welsh international and has played over 1/3 of his career in the championship.

Since my initial post, I'd also sneak in Sharp into that list. A bottom five team would have him on a season's rolling deal due to his scoring record.

 

[JJ Sefton]

It didn't "go wrong". We had previously been in the 3rd tier for 6 years. Survival was the brief this season, and any of us would have taken 21st place at the start of the season. A top half finish was unthinkable in August.

But we did way better than that. We stormed to the top of the league in our first season back, and only dropped out of the top 6 a few weeks ago. We secured survival around new year, got the biggest win against Them Lot in a generation, stuffed Dirty Leeds twice and generally had some bloody good results, all with a squad which on paper, should be struggling against relegation.

With 5 games to go, we are a few points off top 6, and though I don't think we'll make it, the fact we're even in that situation is a brilliant result. We have overacheived significantly. Yes, it's disappointing that we haven't kept up that superb early season form. But we shouldn't let that take anything away from what Sheffield United has acheived in the last 18 months. It has been nothing short of meteoric. Nothing has gone wrong, and more importantly, a LOT has gone right.

I agree with this completely.

 

[Sean Thornton]

As mentioned in my post, I was told this by someone who's usually well informed. If i'm wrong and you're better informed, then why was he sent back? Two poor performances against Fulham and Bolton, or other issues of attitude? I'll happily stand corrected, ST.

What do you mean by "balanced the books" ?

 

[Tom Bott]

Forget all that, think bigger Liverpool.

 

[Bellypork]

Top in November, smashed pigs, beat Wolves and playing wonderful attacking football. So what happened?

Coutts injury?

Poor Jan transfer window?

Bad luck??

Was in a false position?

In many ways, the two derby games tell a great deal.

The team Wednesday fielded at Hillsborough, on paper, was a better side than that fielded at the Lane.

But Wednesday's attitude in the second encounter was very different to that in the first.

In the first it was "Third division players, Third Division manager, just come out of the Third Division. All we've got to do is turn up."

Why else would you play a keeper with broken ribs, believe your midfield 4 could outplay United's 5, and throw in a rookie CB for good measure?

In the first half of the season United had the element of surprise, but not in the second.

 

[finlaytheblade]

I think you are simplifying things there.
We have come up short ( it looks like ) but in numerous games this season we have been the better team but not got the result we deserved .we are worthy of what we have acheaved we have not been out of our depth in any game.If we do reach play offs it will a good acheavement,if we don't Wilder will be disappointed as I will. We will get better the future looks bright with a sprinkling of academy kids coming through

 

[LJBlade]

Owners of clubs & businesses have decisions to make and react to circumstances as appropriate, that's what separates the winners from the losers in life. Opportunities are identified and taken. If ever there was an opportunity to sensibly strengthen than surely being top of the league is it? I'm talking about buying players who were capable of playing at this level this season and for reasons to come. It's not chucking money about, it's investing in the core enterprise of the business to increase the chances of success/promotion. And if promotion is achieved it then gives McCabe a better chance of selling the club for a figure he is happy with. Anyways the issue of players hasn't gone away has it? The need is still there and needs to be addressed. It can be ignored, but it is still there; in the summer, in the next JTW or in the summer of 2019. If there is no money now, they'll be no money in 3 months time and there'll be no money in the next JTW. Why don't the club be honest and say, we have a budget that is geared towards survival in the championship no more? Or are we continuing on our well worn path of jam tomorrow, europe in 5 years at BDTBL?

I have never asked for anything which hasn't been promised, discussed in an open forum or should reasonably be expected of a club of our size. I sat in a meeting with McCabe in August when he said that funds would be available in January to push for promotion or fight off relegation. This was at the same time as we couldn't afford to buy Devante Cole but Wigan could. There is also an interview with Alan Biggs and Tareq Hawasli saying that money was available in October. As it turns out we ended up borrowing a couple of million at the last moment from a bank to fund four purchases (3 perms & a loan), two of which will probably leave in the summer for less than we paid for them and had to send CCV back to Spurs to balance the books. I also thought we bid £4m for Conor Coady in August, or did I imagine that (you'll be able to confirm)?

Being top of the league might well have been a very good time to 'sensibly strengthen' but as the transfer window was shut I'm not sure you can blame the owners. You seem to be changing history to suit your argument. We were top of league for less than a week, in October. By the time the transfer window opened we were 7th.

We couldn't afford to buy Devante Cole? Again, you're trying to re-write the facts. We had an offer accepted for Cole but Fleetwood took so long that the transfer window shut before we could finalise it.

Money was available and money was spent. Can you tell me how our spending in January compares with the other teams in the division?

Which two of our signings in January will be sold for less than we paid for them? Where have you got the idea that we sent CCV back to Spurs in order to 'balance the books'?

EDIT: just noticed your later message where you say Leonard and Holmes will be leaving in the summer. You really think Leonard will leave after just a handful of games considering how long Wilder chased him? Good job we didn't get rid of Coutts after the same amount of games

 

[Broomhall Blade]

Moore would be picked up by a championship club tomorrow as reserve keeper, the role he fulfilled when we bought him.

Including us, Lundstram has played for 3 championship clubs in his career, and played roughly a third of his games at that level.

Evans is a welsh international and has played over 1/3 of his career in the championship.

Since my initial post, I'd also sneak in Sharp into that list. A bottom five team would have him on a season's rolling deal due to his scoring record.

I think you need to check your facts on Lundstram.

Moore would be picked up by a championship club tomorrow as reserve keeper, the role he fulfilled when we bought him.

Including us, Lundstram has played for 3 championship clubs in his career, and played roughly a third of his games at that level.

Evans is a welsh international and has played over 1/3 of his career in the championship.

Since my initial post, I'd also sneak in Sharp into that list. A bottom five team would have him on a season's rolling deal due to his scoring record.

I think you need to take the old Red and White specs off.

Moore is a bang average keeper no Championship would be rushing to sign him.

Lundstram hasn't played played a third of his games at championship level, he's been on loan about 6 times and only ended up at 1st Division Oxford. Again Can not see any Championship side rushing to sign him.

Evans possible but has he really done enough for a Championship side to be that intrested.

Sharp will be 33 early next year again can't see any Championship side interested.

I'm not writing the above players off by the way, just can not see any real interest in them from other championship sides, and why i think we have punched above our weight this season.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

Being top of the league might well have been a very good time to 'sensibly strengthen' but as the transfer window was shut I'm not sure you can blame the owners. You seem to be changing history to suit your argument. We were top of league for less than a week, in October. By the time the transfer window opened we were 7th.

We couldn't afford to buy Devante Cole? Again, you're trying to re-write the facts. We had an offer accepted for Cole but Fleetwood took so long that the transfer window shut before we could finalise it.

Money was available and money was spent. Can you tell me how our spending in January compares with the other teams in the division?

Which two of our signings in January will be sold for less than we paid for them? Where have you got the idea that we sent CCV back to Spurs in order to 'balance the books'?

EDIT: just noticed your later message where you say Leonard and Holmes will be leaving in the summer. You really think Leonard will leave after just a handful of games considering how long Wilder chased him? Good job we didn't get rid of Coutts after the same amount of games

I was lead to believe that we had a budget and buying Cole at a certain price allowed us to keep within that budget. Fleetwood up'd their price and we couldn't afford it. They then backtracked. Either way the price that Fleetwood wanted was paid by Wigan and not us in JTW and he now plays for them.

I've just checked and you are correct. On 1st January we were 7th in the table, seven points behind Derby in 2nd and one point behind Leeds in 6th. Off the top of my head I thought we were higher, but I would suggest that the general thrust of my point remains. We had been top of the league (however briefly), but we had been there or there abouts during the first 26 games of the season. It could be argued that the drop off was due in part to Coutts injury and a replacement of similar or better quality was needed.

According to sources I look at, we spent a touch over £2m pounds in the JTW, Fulham spent £3.4m, Leeds £10.75m, Norwich £4.25m, Derby £1.75m, Preston £1m, Cardiff £6.5m, Barnsley £1.35m, Wolves £2.5m and Bristol £1m. These are gross transfers and don't take into account associated fees and/or Loan fees. These figures tell us something & nothing tbf, as a lot of the clubs did the vast majority f their spending pre season.

As per my previous post, the two signings that we made in JTW whom I wouldn't be surprised to see leave sooner rather than later are Holmes & Leonard. Time will tell & possibly prove me wrong. As I mentioned in my post, I see no reason why Holmes should stay, although Leonard is more up for debate.

Also as per a previous post, I was recently having a chat with someone (who I view as being party to info) and I claimed that CCV's performance v Fulham and Madine had basically ended his Utd career, the response was that CCV going back was more financial and allowed other players to come in. Again as in my response to ST, if this is not the case, then I'm happy to be told the real reason. Again as in my previous post, although CCV was going through a sticky patch, I would have kept him as quality cover/rotation.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

I think you need to check your facts on Lundstram.

I think you need to take the old Red and White specs off.

Moore is a bang average keeper no Championship would be rushing to sign him.

Lundstram hasn't played played a third of his games at championship level, he's been on loan about 6 times and only ended up at 1st Division Oxford. Again Can not see any Championship side rushing to sign him.

Evans possible but has he really done enough for a Championship side to be that intrested.

Sharp will be 33 early next year again can't see any Championship side interested.

I'm not writing the above players off by the way, just can not see any real interest in them from other championship sides, and why i think we have punched above our weight this season.

The stats i've looked at say that Lundstram played in the Championship for Yeovil Town in 13/14, Blackpool 14/15 and us 17/18. He's played 177 league games in his career to date and 63 of those have been as Championship level player, that equates to 36%. As with all my posts, if i'm wrong, I'll happily be put right.

 

[Sean Thornton]

I was lead to believe that we had a budget and buying Cole at a certain price allowed us to keep within that budget. Fleetwood up'd their price and we couldn't afford it. They then backtracked. Either way the price that Fleetwood wanted was paid by Wigan and not us in JTW and he now plays for them.

I've just checked and you are correct. On 1st January we were 7th in the table, seven points behind Derby in 2nd and one point behind Leeds in 6th. Off the top of my head I thought we were higher, but I would suggest that the general thrust of my point remains. We had been top of the league (however briefly), but we had been there or there abouts during the first 26 games of the season. It could be argued that the drop off was due in part to Coutts injury and a replacement of similar or better quality was needed.

According to sources I look at, we spent a touch over £2m pounds in the JTW, Fulham spent £3.4m, Leeds £10.75m, Norwich £4.25m, Derby £1.75m, Preston £1m, Cardiff £6.5m, Barnsley £1.35m, Wolves £2.5m and Bristol £1m. These are gross transfers and don't take into account associated fees and/or Loan fees. These figures tell us something & nothing tbf, as a lot of the clubs did the vast majority f their spending pre season.

As per my previous post, the two signings that we made in JTW whom I wouldn't be surprised to see leave sooner rather than later are Holmes & Leonard. Time will tell & possibly prove me wrong. As I mentioned in my post, I see no reason why Holmes should stay, although Leonard is more up for debate.

Also as per a previous post, I was recently having a chat with someone (who I view as being party to info) and I claimed that CCV's performance v Fulham and Madine had basically ended his Utd career, the response was that CCV going back was more financial and allowed other players to come in. Again as i my response to ST, if this is not the case, then I'm happy to be told the real reason. Again as in my previous post, although CCV was going through a sticky patch, I would have kept him as quality cover/rotation.

I read your "balance the books" comment as being he had to be sent back because of the financial cost to us. Simply that. The thought that he was seen as less important to Wilder than players he wanted and therefore freed up money for them obviously makes sense. The written word as opposed to an actual conversation I suppose although it wasn't just me

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

I'm not writing the above players off by the way, just can not see any real interest in them from other championship sides, and why i think we have punched above our weight this season.

If Rotherham achieve promotion, and they had the means to acquire the services of all the players mentioned, they would in a heart beat.

If Sharp was available on a free transfer, he would be snapped up on a one year deal by at least 5 championship teams simply down to his scoring record/ability. Just as if he were at Leeds now, we would take him in the summer for the very same reason.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

I read your "balance the books" comment as being he had to be sent back because of the financial cost to us. Simply that. The thought that he was seen as less important to Wilder than players he wanted and therefore freed up money for them obviously makes sense. The written word as opposed to an actual conversation I suppose although it wasn't just me

I'm currently working on a free transfer to bladesmad in the summer, I hear that they're a much easier audience.

 

[Sean Thornton]

I'm currently working on a free transfer to bladesmad in the summer, I hear that they're a much easier audience.

Very good on deaths and obituaries.

 

[Cerberus Blade]

Top in November, smashed pigs, beat Wolves and playing wonderful attacking football. So what happened?

Coutts injury?

Poor Jan transfer window?

Bad luck??

Was in a false position?

I was never any good at these multiple choice questions but I’ll have a go:

Is it poor Jan transfer WInkel?

 

[Tommoblade66]

Top in November, smashed pigs, beat Wolves and playing wonderful attacking football. So what happened?

Coutts injury?

Poor Jan transfer window?

Bad luck??

Was in a false position?

You've forgot its a long hard season and there are another 23 teams trying to take points from you. Also this takeover saga is not helping things

 

[grafikhaus]

Well said Sir!

It’s really about raised expectations. If the season had started poor to average but we’d ended up on 62 points with 5 games to play, this team would be hailed as heroes.

And that's the problem - managing expectations. Yes, the door to the play-offs has been hanging off its hinges for a few weeks now, but we've not been able to kick it in. Disappointing but we're nowhere near ready to have a proper go at the play-offs - there'd still be no Coutts, knackered players, no sign of puttting a run together that would send us into the POs with any confidence (Millwall haven't lost in 15 games including 10 wins) etc. It's no use just 'limping over the line' (as we would have done when we lost to Huddersfield in 2012).

I'm more than happy with the progress we've made this season. Now if we were like Ipswich (17 consecutive seasons in the Championship), we could moan!

If Cardiff shit it and miss out completely, they would be entitled to a 'where did it go so wrong' thread on their forum.