We can overcome the defeat, but...

[HodgysBrokenThumb]

I've been to around 35-40 away matches over the past two seasons including Boro on Saturday and the hard man wannabes definitely seem to be on the increase. It seemed to start during Atkins reign when tickets were easily obtainable due to the poor football and we saw large groups of young uns acting pissed, drugged up and causing havoc at plenty of grounds on a Saturday within an hours drive or so. Donny, Rochdale Chessy etc to name a few but last season the older generation of thugs have started rearing there ugly heads again, Vale for one and I was surprised how many were involved at Boro. I had a bloke in his mid 50s with his daughter (20ish) stood in front of me against Boro and he ran down to the front and towards there supporters when it kicked off, trying to get involved and totally left his daughter. What sort of moron would do that?
I've seen far worse at matches than what we saw at Boro on Saturday but the worrying trend seems on the increase. Maybe it's time we tried to stamp it out before it escalates

This is the impression I have been getting (but only second-hand). And I agree with your conclusion.

 

[seanbeenstattoo]

Totally disagree with you on this. I quite see why you couldn't care less whether I end up taking my grandson to an away match, but I am partly using this to illustrate the danger for United if the problem of disorder is allowed to develop. Have a look at the attendances for the 1983-84 season when we got promoted from Div 3 like last season. Crowds of 10,000 regularly for home matches, reaching 20,000 just twice. Do you think United would flourish with crowds like that?

What have crowds in 1983 got to do with anything. What has anything in 1983 got to do with anything.
You're right on one thing,I really couldn't care less if you take your grandson to away games or anywhere for that matter. Sitting next to you would be excruciating in the extreme.
You are making a huge mountain out of a small molehill. If you have a brain you avoid bollox. You don't over analyse every decision before you act.
You'll have fucking died of old age before you make your mind up so taking your grand kid anywhere will be irrelevant.
He'll probably find someone else who just gets the fuck on with things to take him anyway if he wants to go and your dithering about like Reginald fucking Molehusband.

 

[SteveBlade]

Jees does anybody rea

Surely nobody really thinks the picture is genuine ISC? The kids laughing FFS.

they've accused Blades fans of roasting a nun. Shockingly bad taste but there you go.

She was pretty bitter wasn't she? Still, got to get your protein where you can.

 

[Sean Thornton]

You're right, they both strike me as men who would post on Blades Mad.

Both moderators.

 

[Sneinton Blade 1952]

I have supported the Blades home and away since the early 1960s - the days of Hodgy, Coldwell, Joe and Graham Shaw, Doc Pace, etc - and very rarely, almost never, experienced football violence. It's bad when it happens, but it is rare, and we shouldn't overreact. There is a brilliant thesis by the late Stanley Cohen, "Folk Devils and Moral Panics", that warns against such overreaction. It can lead to disproportionate societal response.

 

[Kenilworth]

Thanks for that reply. The stats from today's Guardian show a 1% rise in football related arrests, and the figure is still below what it was 5 years ago. Violence is much lower, but if it is beginning to creep up, then now is the time to address it; the gradual escalation of the 60s and 70s led to great damage to football, and it would be foolish in the extreme to let history repeat itself.
I was reassured by your experiences; but I am still unsure about taking on the responsibility of taking the young 'un.

To give you the confidence you might have been better doing this last season where the Blades contingent often dwarfed the home fans in number. Therefore, potentially safer than visiting some of the established Championship clubs, which will inevitably have a a larger portion of morons. That's maybe countered by better facilities.

Appreciate your apprehension.
Just know that away days with the Blades for my lad with me were great - and still are now he is in his early 20s

 

[HodgysBrokenThumb]

What have crowds in 1983 got to do with anything. What has anything in 1983 got to do with anything.
You're right on one thing,I really couldn't care less if you take your grandson to away games or anywhere for that matter. Sitting next to you would be excruciating in the extreme.
You are making a huge mountain out of a small molehill. If you have a brain you avoid bollox. You don't over analyse every decision before you act.
You'll have fucking died of old age before you make your mind up so taking your grand kid anywhere will be irrelevant.
He'll probably find someone else who just gets the fuck on with things to take him anyway if he wants to go and your dithering about like Reginald fucking Molehusband.

The answer to your initial question is that crowds in English football, which boomed following the World Cup in 1966, declined catastrophically in the late 60s and 70s, at the same time as violence around football became normalised; I can't prove that one led to the other, but one reason people regularly gave for not going to football was fear of violence. Why risk a repeat?
I will try to spare you details of my family in future, but I am sure you are pleased that 3 generations of my family have season tickets on the Kop.

 

[Hodgesleftpeg]

That's where players friends and families sit

Don't they sit in the boxes above?

 

[HodgysBrokenThumb]

I have supported the Blades home and away since the early 1960s - the days of Hodgy, Coldwell, Joe and Graham Shaw, Doc Pace, etc - and very rarely, almost never, experienced football violence. It's bad when it happens, but it is rare, and we shouldn't overreact. There is a brilliant thesis by the late Stanley Cohen, "Folk Devils and Moral Panics", that warns against such overreaction. It can lead to disproportionate societal response.

You may be surprised that I agree with that. I have very rarely felt personally under threat, and I would certainly not be in favour of longer jail sentences, etc. Just as people who drink heavily should be kept away from the steering-wheel, so those who cannot go to football without indulging in violence should be kept away from football grounds. Not easy to achieve, I know. And crowds have to be self-policing. I also agree that violence is rare; but there was a period when it was very frequent, even if it was possible for most of us to avoid it for most of the time.

 

[seanbeenstattoo]

The answer to your initial question is that crowds in English football, which boomed following the World Cup in 1966, declined catastrophically in the late 60s and 70s, at the same time as violence around football became normalised; I can't prove that one led to the other, but one reason people regularly gave for not going to football was fear of violence. Why risk a repeat?
I will try to spare you details of my family in future, but I am sure you are pleased that 3 generations of my family have season tickets on the Kop.

That is mind numbingly irrelevant in anyone deciding to go to an away game in 2017.
Perhaps you would be best leaving attending to those other generations and stay home.
Just in case some traffic survey from 1912 suggests abolishing the bloke with a flag walking in front of a car exponentially increases the risk of anyone leaving home getting hit by one.
Scary stuff eh.

 

[HodgysBrokenThumb]

That is mind numbingly irrelevant in anyone deciding to go to an away game in 2017.
Perhaps you would be best leaving attending to those other generations and stay home.
Just in case some traffic survey from 1912 suggests abolishing the bloke with a flag walking in front of a car exponentially increases the risk of anyone leaving home getting hit by one.
Scary stuff eh.

Let me try again.
1. Lots of people stopped going to football in the past because of fear of violence.
2. Recently there has been a perception that some Unitedites are behaving violently.
3. I am an example of someone who is likely to go to fewer matches this season because of concerns for a child's safety at away matches.
4. If fear of violence grows, crowds will decline.
5. This would be bad for United.
6. Therefore we should do what we can to maintain the generally low levels of disorder at football in recent years.
I think discussion of the bloke with a flag belongs in a different section (unless it's the lino from Saturday).