VAR VAR

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

Scrap it.
Scrap it till it’s 100% accurate.
To be accurate senses would need to be implanted in the ball to determine the precise time of impact,then lasers will need to be used to determine the exact location of players body parts at the time of impact.
50fps cameras and a fuckin marker pen is laughable.
If it’s not 100% accurate it’s worse than useless.
If a system can parody itself and provide perfect evidence of it’s own inadequacy it’s fuckin VAR.

Linesmen aren't 100% accurate. The fans who provide most of the PL revenue don't want 100% accuracy. 100% accuracy isn't needed.

 

[Mumbo]

Linesmen aren't 100% accurate. The fans who provide most of the PL revenue don't want 100% accuracy. 100% accuracy isn't needed.

you’ve just come up with the best argument against VAR,wish I’d thought of it.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

you’ve just come up with the best argument against VAR,wish I’d thought of it.

You've just confirmed it doesn't really matter whether we have VAR or not. So, as it's the best part of 2020, we might as well have it.

 

[Akinbiyi]

Linesmen aren't 100% accurate. The fans who provide most of the PL revenue don't want 100% accuracy. 100% accuracy isn't needed.

The technology we have isn’t accurate so you’re potentially relegating clubs, deciding leagues, champions league positions, by disallowing goals due to badly drawn lines from the armpit, in which the frame rate provided is not quick enough to show exactly when the ball left the assisters foot.

Can you guarantee me me that Pukki goal was offside yesterday? The Zaha one? The Burn one? That’s in one day

If it can’t be decided within 20 seconds the original decision stands. For every single VAR decision. Simple as. It’s suppposed to have been brought in for clear and obvious errors so let’s keep it that way.

 

[Mumbo]

You've just confirmed it doesn't really matter whether we have VAR or not. So, as it's the best part of 2020, we might as well have it.

Why have it if it does’nt matter?

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

Why have it if it does’nt matter?

Why not have it if it doesn't matter?

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

The technology we have isn’t accurate so you’re potentially relegating clubs, deciding leagues, champions league positions, by disallowing goals due to badly drawn lines from the armpit, in which the frame rate provided is not quick enough to show exactly when the ball left the assisters foot.

Can you guarantee me me that Pukki goal was offside yesterday? The Zaha one? The Burn one? That’s in one day

If it can’t be decided within 20 seconds the original decision stands. For every single VAR decision. Simple as. It’s suppposed to have been brought in for clear and obvious errors so let’s keep it that way.

You're potentially relegating clubs based on a Linesman whacking his flag up. Me, I just don't get the difference

 

[Akinbiyi]

You're potentially relegating clubs based on a Linesman whacking his flag up. Me, I just don't get the difference

You are not the same as 90% of football fans then. The only fans behind VAR who I know are the ones who just watch it on TV, and most of them would scrap it to be honest.

 

[andy m]

You've just confirmed it doesn't really matter whether we have VAR or not. So, as it's the best part of 2020, we might as well have it.

At least with linesmen you knew the decision straight away instead of having to wait for 5 minutes.

 

[BettingBlade]

You're potentially relegating clubs based on a Linesman whacking his flag up. Me, I just don't get the difference

Surely you’re not being serious. VAR is supposed to overturn clear and obvious errors. Offside is NOT black and white regardless of what you say VAR cannot tell if certain offsides are black and white or not.

There is no reason for it to get involved in these instances when it cannot definitively say that it’s offside.

If this is what you wanted VAR to be used for then congratulations, you are complicit in destroying the game we all love.

 

[Dkc]

Fuck VAR. When a goal goes in I don't want to wait 5 minutes only to see it overturned because a player's toe was offside in a previous passage of play.

Wasn't it only supposed to be used for clear and obvious errors? It certainly is being used for more than that, and the game is suffering.

Those who say 'it's here to stay, get over it' are talking bollocks. That's what they said about Betamax and Blu-ray. Just because something is new doesn't mean it's 'here to stay'

 

[BettingBlade]

The technology we have isn’t accurate so you’re potentially relegating clubs, deciding leagues, champions league positions, by disallowing goals due to badly drawn lines from the armpit, in which the frame rate provided is not quick enough to show exactly when the ball left the assisters foot.

Can you guarantee me me that Pukki goal was offside yesterday? The Zaha one? The Burn one? That’s in one day

If it can’t be decided within 20 seconds the original decision stands. For every single VAR decision. Simple as. It’s suppposed to have been brought in for clear and obvious errors so let’s keep it that way.

He won’t respond to that because it factually distinguishes his entire argument.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

He won’t respond to that because it factually distinguishes his entire argument.

#Facts
"factually distinguishes"
Has your predictive text VARed that?
Look. I get it. A lot of people don't want it. I'm fine with that. I'm even fine with people accusing me of all sorts of stuff.
I'm just not losing my shit over it.

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

You've just confirmed it doesn't really matter whether we have VAR or not. So, as it's the best part of 2020, we might as well have it.

I'd like to hope that European qualification will be the best part of 2020.

Looking forward to seeing VAR as the pinnacle is quite frankly depressing.

 

[BettingBlade]

#Facts

Go on then. Go and find the exact freeze frame where the ball leaves the assisting players foot from the three goals yesterday and tell me the VAR refs aren’t guessing.

 

[Mumbo]

The technology we have isn’t accurate so you’re potentially relegating clubs, deciding leagues, champions league positions, by disallowing goals due to badly drawn lines from the armpit, in which the frame rate provided is not quick enough to show exactly when the ball left the assisters foot.

Can you guarantee me me that Pukki goal was offside yesterday? The Zaha one? The Burn one? That’s in one day

If it can’t be decided within 20 seconds the original decision stands. For every single VAR decision. Simple as. It’s suppposed to have been brought in for clear and obvious errors so let’s keep it that way.

You've just confirmed it doesn't really matter whether we have VAR or not. So, as

Why not have it if it doesn't matter?

oh c’mon....
That Question is an interesting diversion into philosophy that could take me all day to explore.
but for practical applications is just a bit silly

 

[ShockingBadBuy]

(I'm not too fussed about the dick swinging oooohhhh I'm a big celebrator & I do all the limbs & shit, because I'm a self proclaimed superfan & it's spoiling it for me argument - but feel free....)

I really don’t think that is at all fair. At its best, the game delivers moments of adrenaline, intensity and pure unbridled joy. It’s the compromising of this, under VAR, that people object to. It has nothing to do with dick swinging.

 

[niktheblade]

Frustrating at the moment, but it has its place. There's a balance to be had. I'm a big fan of the clear and obvious part, what I can't get my head around is waiting 2, 3 or 4 minutes to decide whether the strikers left knacker was offside.

I get that some people will say that offside is offside, but in the grand scheme of things, would the 10mm offside make a difference? If Lunny had stepped 10mm back against spurs, it would still likely had the same outcome, therefore he isn't gaining a significant advantage.

Pukki's yesterday, armpit (shoulder by the way) 10mm offside, its still likely the same outcome if he's 10mm onside. Hence the clear and obvious part, if Pukki had gained a clear advantage, then fair enough, but he didn't.

 

[Woodwardfan]

VAR would give the race to the lass in red.

No it would not. Arm doesn't count.

 

[Woodwardfan]

When I started watching football and for years a goal was celebrated by the scorer turning back, walking back to his own half and a few handshakes on the way.

The players probably cared more than the current mercenaries, certainly no less.

Goal celebrations are ridiculous these days and should be curtailed.

I mention this because I question this instant and spontaneous joy thing. It is not the be-all and end-all. Three fans on our row in South Stand hardly react to goals, they remain seated, smile and sort of nod approval. They care, they are totally absorbed fans. Personally I jump up and instinctively celebrate with arms in the air and fist pumping etc. but I don't mind a disallowed goal if it is a correct decision, it will become the norm and routine

 

[BettingBlade]

When I started watching football and for years a goal was celebrated by the scorer turning back, walking back to his own half and a few handshakes on the way.

The players probably cared more than the current mercenaries, certainly no less.

Goal celebrations are ridiculous these days and should be curtailed.

I mention this because I question this instant and spontaneous joy thing. It is not the be-all and end-all. Three fans on our row in South Stand hardly react to goals, they remain seated, smile and sort of nod approval. They care, they are totally absorbed fans. Personally I jump up and instinctively celebrate with arms in the air and fist pumping etc. but I don't mind a disallowed goal if it is a correct decision, it will become the norm and routine

And with that will go the atmosphere. We all might as well go and watch snooker.

 

[ShockingBadBuy]

Anyone still defending this abomination on the grounds of ‘getting things right’ could do worse than check the list of flaws in the tech offered by Pierre's PC in yesterday’s shoutbox. This may have been missed by anyone not in the s’box at the time, so I’ll cut and paste it here. Some of these points have already been aired, but there were some eye-openers in this lot, for me at least:-

In cricket, there's a very small area where action happens. The crease doesn't move, balls can be tracked easily as there's at least a few centimetres to base projection on. In football there are a near infinite amount of possible player and ball positions that can extend from the halfway line to the goal line. We are expecting a low resolution, standard refresh camera to track this.

Has the camera been calibrated to ensure that its level? If not any vertical lines drawn will not be correct.

Is the camera capturing at the exact moment of contact?

Is there any compensation for sloped pitches?

Are the operators looking at raw images or compressed digital images?

Are the cameras set up exactly the same at each ground to ensure repeatability?

Points #4 and #6 suggest the “it‘s the same for everyone“ defence may not apply, either.

 

[BettingBlade]

Anyone still defending this abomination on the grounds of ‘getting things right’ could do worse than check the list of flaws in the tech offered by Pierre's PC in yesterday’s shoutbox. Some of these have been widely aired, but there are some eye-openers in this lot, for me at least:-

In cricket, there's a very small area where action happens. The crease doesn't move, balls can be tracked easily as there's at least a few centimetres to base projection on. In football there are a near infinite amount of possible player and ball positions that can extend from the halfway line to the goal line. We are expecting a low resolution, standard refresh camera to track this.

Has the camera been calibrated to ensure that its level? If not any vertical lines drawn will not be correct.

Is the camera capturing at the exact moment of contact?

Is there any compensation for sloped pitches?

Are the operators looking at raw images or compressed digital images?

Are the cameras set up exactly the same at each ground to ensure repeatability?

Points #4 and #6 suggest the “it‘s the same for everyone“ defence may not apply, either.

Never has the term run before they can walk been so apt. It’s ridiculous that an assistant referee is over ruling the referee so frequently on decisions even they don’t know are 100% correct. They certainly aren’t correct enough to over rule the original decision.

People go off as if offsides are black an white but no one can physically tell that. It’s why goal line technology worked so well straight away because there are limited variables. The goal post is the same, the ball is the same and the goal line is the same. You can say with accuracy that the ball has gone over the line or not.

The fact they are trying to use offsides in the same way is the most ludicrous decision in the history of football. Basic science says that it is completely impossible to use it in the same way. Its a complete farce.

 

[bypassblade]

Good job Ian Rush is retired with his nose he'd never be onside.

 

[Akinbiyi]

Good job Ian Rush is retired with his nose he'd never be onside.

He would if he was playing against Phil Thompson

 

[Woodwardfan]

Anyone still defending this abomination on the grounds of ‘getting things right’ could do worse than check the list of flaws in the tech offered by Pierre's PC in yesterday’s shoutbox. Some of these have been widely aired, but there are some eye-openers in this lot, for me at least:-

In cricket, there's a very small area where action happens. The crease doesn't move, balls can be tracked easily as there's at least a few centimetres to base projection on. In football there are a near infinite amount of possible player and ball positions that can extend from the halfway line to the goal line. We are expecting a low resolution, standard refresh camera to track this.

Has the camera been calibrated to ensure that its level? If not any vertical lines drawn will not be correct.

Is the camera capturing at the exact moment of contact?

Is there any compensation for sloped pitches?

Are the operators looking at raw images or compressed digital images?

Are the cameras set up exactly the same at each ground to ensure repeatability?

Points #4 and #6 suggest the “it‘s the same for everyone“ defence may not apply, either.

I think the counter to all that is that it goes a long way, not all the way to correcting all the serious flaws in the decision making standards of the inadequate previous 'system' which relied on three naked pairs of human eyes which struggled to help make judgements and were frankly guessing for much of the game.

Improve the technology by all means but presumably this is the best available. And it is the same for every club despite Pierre's informed opinion but within minor limitations, miniscule compared to a human being running at full stretch way behind the retreating last defender. For offsides it has been scientifically proven that the human eye is incapable of switching from the ball player to the offside line for any pass from even small distances; they were guessing.

As for penalties, it is clear and obvious to anybody that a match referee cannot see everything that happens through bodies of players, often at an unfavourable angle and distance. The pace of happenings in penalty areas is beyond any watching human's physical capability and frankly they were guessing a lot of the time, often taking the easier 'didn't see it clearly' non-award option.

If the current technology is not 100% reliable, maybe only 99% at different venues and at certain distances, surely we'll take that rather than revert back to the old, totally inadequate system of guesswork and injustice. I'll forsake a few false alarm celebrations for justice any day.

It's not sensible to focus on less than 1% weakness when it's generally the same for all and without comparing it to the old decision process and massive weaknesses that existed.

 

[bypassblade]

He would if he was playing against Phil Thompson

I thought of him I can remember at Lane when he played for us, he fell face 1st into ground we all thought his nose was stuck in ground.

 

[RossoDeltic]

I am sure I have just read a reference to The Fall.
Anyway, VAR seeming changes what it gives as reasons for decisions from one minute to the next.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

Look I haven't got the #Facts. But, a simple countback suggests that VAR is the 395th thing that "is killing the game" in my short lifetime. Wolf has been cried....

 

[Headshrinker]

In hockey there needs to be clear video evidence in order to overturn the call on the ice.

These VAR decisions are not evidence of offsides. They are guesses and the ruling on the field should not be changed unless the video clearly can prove offside.