Transfer Talk

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Should we be looking more toward the players in the u21 tournament??
After seeing the young Romanian players taking England apart last night, I think there's some real talented players in their squad, and surely getable??
 
bazattwo said:
I think major signings is not a priority
Whe have a good ship, good crew and the BEST captain
Being in the Premiership is an excellent opportunity to show how team work can work
UTB
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Like your optimism there, shipmate.

But have you seen the United States Navy? One of their single deployed task groups has more firepower and capability than our entire navy.

We need to build better ships man them and train them and be prepared for the war of today, not WWII. We fought the Falklands Conflict assuming 'it'll be reet' and some non league outfit scored six goals against us and took us into extra time. At that time we had some brilliant managers and strategists, but our owners decided that prudence was the better path and failed to build ships properly, concentrated on one style of play (the Soviet Northern Fleet) and even made efforts to downsize by 35% with some beancounter called John Nott supplying the great ideas.

Hope this helps with the maritime context.

pommpey
 
The current squad as it stands isn’t strong enough , did a Herculean job getting promoted automatically but def needs some more additions for the inevitable step up in quality . Showed last season after we added to the squad the difference it makes ... Wholesale changes no ... strengthening in a few departments yes while retaining style of play & cohesion
 
bazattwo said:
I think major signings is not a priority
Whe have a good ship, good crew and the BEST captain
Being in the Premiership is an excellent opportunity to show how team work can work
UTB
Click to expand...
If we hadn't upset the crew last season we wouldn't have brought in Henderson, Norwood and Didsy to name but 3.................
 
pommpey said:
Like your optimism there, shipmate.

But have you seen the United States Navy? One of their single deployed task groups has more firepower and capability than our entire navy.

We need to build better ships man them and train them and be prepared for the war of today, not WWII. We fought the Falklands Conflict assuming 'it'll be reet' and some non league outfit scored six goals against us and took us into extra time. At that time we had some brilliant managers and strategists, but our owners decided that prudence was the better path and failed to build ships properly, concentrated on one style of play (the Soviet Northern Fleet) and even made efforts to downsize by 35% with some beancounter called John Nott supplying the great ideas.

Hope this helps with the maritime context.

pommpey
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One of the more enjoyable analogies I’ve come across.
 
YES Blade said:
Unfortunately every club in Europe will also be thinking the exact same!
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Obviously, I'm thinking future, as we need to be securing a place in the prem, are these the places our scouts should be scouting?
 
The players should've been scouted well before they started appearing regularly for u21 national sides and certainly not a tournament. If you look at the better players for the lesser teams, they are all at established clubs and full transfer fees have been paid for them in many occasions. Take Poland for example, the keeper is at liverpool and Szymański £5.5m, Kownacki £3.8m, Żurkowski £3.8m, Piotrowski £2m.

Also, you end up paying a tournament premium for players. Bielik is having a great tournament for Poland. Many on here have flagged him as good player & potential acquisition, He's at Arsenal, but has been on loan at Charlton & Birmingham, and wants to leave in the summer. He can play either at CB or DCM. He was probably available for £2m before the tournament, he's now probably at £5m by the time it ends.
 
If we don't make some key signings we'll likely be relegated with just 2 forwards, one attacking mid, no cover at right or left central defence and no cover for left wing back. We've also only got 3 centre mids, unless you count Bash but that means we have no right sided central defence! I'm not including Kean Bryan here who hasn't played a game yet.

We also need some real quality to supplement what we have. We need key signings!
 
Nicolaus_Copernicus said:
The players should've been scouted well before they started appearing regularly for u21 national sides and certainly not a tournament. If you look at the better players for the lesser teams, they are all at established clubs and full transfer fees have been paid for them in many occasions. Take Poland for example, the keeper is at liverpool and Szymański £5.5m, Kownacki £3.8m, Żurkowski £3.8m, Piotrowski £2m.

Also, you end up paying a tournament premium for players. Bielik is having a great tournament for Poland. Many on here have flagged him as good player & potential acquisition, He's at Arsenal, but has been on loan at Charlton & Birmingham, and wants to leave in the summer. He can play either at CB or DCM. He was probably available for £2m before the tournament, he's now probably at £5m by the time it ends.
Click to expand...
True, but that's the risk, I'm not saying buy them today, but as you say, they're at an age where they want to be making a name and playing regular football, and, as you also said, they want to leave their current clubs to get this, so, you need to weigh up that £Xm and wonder, if in 2 seasons it's going to be £XXm.
Just need to look at Brooks, Adams, Walker, Maguire etc, and that's just us.
If you don't take the odd risk you'll never move on.
 
BigBed said:
True, but that's the risk, I'm not saying buy them today, but as you say, they're at an age where they want to be making a name and playing regular football, and, as you also said, they want to leave their current clubs to get this, so, you need to weigh up that £Xm and wonder, if in 2 seasons it's going to be £XXm.
Just need to look at Brooks, Adams, Walker, Maguire etc, and that's just us.
If you don't take the odd risk you'll never move on.
Click to expand...

The thing is BB, our lack of foreign signings isn't due to a lack of an extensive scouting network, it's due to a conscious strategic decision, by those who run the team.

The miracles of the internet, mean that I could list 5 players in every position, currently playing in europe who are u21, who are worth looking at. That's 66 players.

That 66 could then be halved by people more knowledgeable than me, through 'footballing ocnatcts'. The remaining 33 could be scouted by 10 scouts (when I say scouts, I mean ex-pro's/trusted people) over the course of a month, very easily. We don't do it because we choose not to do it.
 

The England goalkeeper looked a bit iffy, admitedly only seen him once but I wouldn't want to consider him after last night, send him to a middling championship club on loan for a season, I mean we are a premier league team now.
 
BigBed said:
Hence my question....Should we be!?
Click to expand...

I meant u21 as in age not regularly representing their national side.

I'm talking about under the radar players like robert bozenik, 19 yrs old, who plays for zilina in slovakia. They finished 2nd in the league last year and he finished 2nd in the goal scoring charts with 13 in 32. He was worth looking at in December as he was on fire. Called up to the full national team this month. He'll end up going to somewhere in Italy or Spain and then to a big club, like the polish lad piatek.
 
The more you study it the harder it looks and we're only playing at it, spare a thought for those who's job depends on getting it right first time .
Big rewards yes, but the stress must be something else.....
 
John Street West Terrace said:
The current squad as it stands isn’t strong enough , did a Herculean job getting promoted automatically but def needs some more additions for the inevitable step up in quality . Showed last season after we added to the squad the difference it makes ... Wholesale changes no ... strengthening in a few departments yes while retaining style of play & cohesion
Click to expand...
What I was saying was that don't upset the present team too much
Anyone can throw money away, we need some young players in the team ie give some of the academy lads a chance, George Best was given the chance at 17
 
pommpey said:
But have you seen the United States Navy? One of their single deployed task groups has more firepower and capability than our entire navy
Click to expand...

A couple of madmen driving a speedboat didn't do the USS Cole much good, did they?

It's not all about size and power. To continue your salty analogy, Drake's ships were outgunned by the powerful Spanish galleons but they didn't like it up 'em.

Happy to help with more naval analogies as required.....
 
I should coco said:
A couple of madmen driving a speedboat didn't do the USS Cole much good, did they?

It's not all about size and power. To continue your salty analogy, Drake's ships were outgunned by the powerful Spanish galleons but they didn't like it up 'em.

Happy to help with more naval analogies as required.....
Click to expand...

That couple of madmen made a small mark on the military capability of the US. With that analogy, we'd need every PL team to be off the pitch at half time and us to be allowed ro play to an empty pitch.

Drake wasn't outgunned as much as the Spanish Armada underestimated the strategy and failed to capitalise on the numeric advantage. Can you see Guardiola or Klopp doing that?

Me neither.

pommpey
 
Not seen any U-21 games.

Which way will Henderson's and Dowell's prices have gone if at all?

Any views?
 
Assuming the listed players go or don't play, I think we need.

1 x first choice keeper
2-3 x CB cover (we need cover for JoC and Egan - Hopefully we can find that in one player. I'm also dubious about Bash being able to step up but with MC going we're light)
1 x LWB cover. In a perfect world one who can play either flank.
2 x CM cover
2 x AMC
2 x ST

That's a lot of players and I can't see us being able to plug those gaps in summer.

I would suspect we're more likely to pick up suspensions and injuries this season. I guess that comes down to look. For injuries at least.
 
robbiez666 said:
Assuming the listed players go or don't play, I think we need.

1 x first choice keeper
2-3 x CB cover (we need cover for JoC and Egan - Hopefully we can find that in one player. I'm also dubious about Bash being able to step up but with MC going we're light)
1 x LWB cover. In a perfect world one who can play either flank.
2 x CM cover
2 x AMC
2 x ST

That's a lot of players and I can't see us being able to plug those gaps in summer.

I would suspect we're more likely to pick up suspensions and injuries this season. I guess that comes down to look. For injuries at least.
Click to expand...
ELEVEN PLAYERS ? IS THAT ALL ?
 
Niceguyeddie said:
ELEVEN PLAYERS ? IS THAT ALL ?
Click to expand...

In a perfect world. Which we don't live in. Look at who in the squad is left. Don't we have something like 14 players outside of those transfer listed? I can't think of any youth players likely to step up anytime soon.
 
Niceguyeddie said:
ELEVEN PLAYERS ? IS THAT ALL ?
Click to expand...

Yep. Long and short of it is we'll need £60m spent on the squad not to get relegated straight away. Lessons from the past and all that.

And they need to be Wilder and Knills choices entirely, not people who McCabe or HRH (or whoever) thinks Wilder and Knill should buy, because they are shit cheap.

pommpey
 
pommpey said:
Yep. Long and short of it is we'll need £60m spent on the squad not to get relegated straight away. Lessons from the past and all that.

And they need to be Wilder and Knills choices entirely, not people who McCabe or HRH (or whoever) thinks Wilder and Knill should buy, because they are shit cheap.

pommpey
Click to expand...

I wouldn't go that far but we'd need to be very lucky with injuries and suspensions.
 
Yes we have 14, no we don't need 25 teams typically Wolves used 19, Man City 22, to name 2 clubs from last year.
Better keeper (Hendo)
Strengthen the right side.
Extra body for midfield.
More up top.
 
8lade said:
Yes we have 14, no we don't need 25 teams typically Wolves used 19, Man City 22, to name 2 clubs from last year.
Better keeper (Hendo)
Strengthen the right side.
Extra body for midfield.
More up top.
Click to expand...

I think you have to factor in the fitness of Sharp, McGoldrick, Duffy and Basham given their ages. And no offence to our players but you have to admit that Man City and Wolves both have better athletes in their squads and play in a less physically taxing style. I assume both teams probably rested players for cup games as well.
 

I'd rather we spent the pot on 6 players than 10, working on the principle you get better players for your money.
Brighton used 21
Everton 22
Palace 23
Do I need to go through every team to prove a point (these are taken at random).
 
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