The reason for Fleck's anonymity

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Scooter_mcgavin

Scooter_mcgavin

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I've said it before and I'll say it again.

Most teams vs us sit back and we have a system where Norwood seems the go-to player for all attacks. At times from the keeper we're playing with 4 centre halves positionally, because Norwood drops to pick the ball up - completely unnecessarily a lot of the time.

In doing this, teams sitting back then have 1 MC to pick up, there's no wonder there's hardly an outfield ball as we have 4/5 players being covered by 10. Fleck I feel suffers greatly because of this. There's no space for him to offer a pass, this 9/10 Norwood ends up pinging a ball over the top of the full backs, or out wide.

It can be very frustrating as I feel our 3 centre halves are more than comfortable on the ball, particularly when given time. There's no reason for Norwood to become the 4th.
 

Scooter_mcgavin said:
I've said it before and I'll say it again.

Most teams vs us sit back and we have a system where Norwood seems the go-to player for all attacks. At times from the keeper we're playing with 4 centre halves positionally, because Norwood drops to pick the ball up - completely unnecessarily a lot of the time.

In doing this, teams sitting back then have 1 MC to pick up, there's no wonder there's hardly an outfield ball as we have 4/5 players being covered by 10. Fleck I feel suffers greatly because of this. There's no space for him to offer a pass, this 9/10 Norwood ends up pinging a ball over the top of the full backs, or out wide.

It can be very frustrating as I feel our 3 centre halves are more than comfortable on the ball, particularly when given time. There's no reason for Norwood to become the 4th.
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Isn’t the whole point of our system, that as soon as Norwood receives it, the wing backs and overlapping centre back get on the move? If Norwood receives it higher up the pitch, there’s no cover if the move breaks down.
 
mattbianco1 said:
Under Wilder we've always struggled to break teams down who just sit back.

Probably the only thing left to improve on in his management.
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I agree. Though it would help if we had someone who was good 1 v 1 and could beat a player with skill and pace. Jota for example, that would help with opening a packed defence.
 
Sikkim said:
Isn’t the whole point of our system, that as soon as Norwood receives it, the wing backs and overlapping centre back get on the move? If Norwood receives it higher up the pitch, there’s no cover if the move breaks down.
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It is, but this completely bypasses Fleck. He's never on the ball in space.
 
Luke1993 said:
I agree. Though it would help if we had someone who was good 1 v 1 and could beat a player with skill and pace. Jota for example, that would help with opening a packed defence.
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Duffy is probably our only player that can glide past a player with ease, however he's hit a bit of a wall recently.
 
Think we are doing not too bad really. 3rd in the league (with our budget) with a strong possibility of going up and we having a moan? :rolleyes:

If we don't go up this year, the owners sort it out this summer and we strengthen yet again pre-season then I feel we will be one of the favourites for autos next season.

People seem to forget how far we have come in such a little time frame.

Spending the majority of the budget on a Striker and a Duffy type play maker could make us unstoppable.

UTMB
 
Scooter_mcgavin said:
Duffy is probably our only player that can glide past a player with ease, however he's hit a bit of a wall recently.
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Probably our biggest weakness is players who can create something out of nothing.probably the reason we need our wing backs and centre backs to bomb on.which can leave us vulnerable at the back.We definitely have stopped going gung ho
 
When his involvement in matches is more fleeting, he doesn't show what he's capable of when he does get the ball. When we actually started getting the ball to him in the last 20 minutes he began to show signs of doing what he did last season, dominating that left centre area and driving us forward.

He needs more attacking responsibility to show his best form.

The management have to work on getting more out of him. We need to play to his strengths more. We need extra attacking threat, and he's still our best player.
 
Coutts used to orchestrate higher up the field and link more with Fleck, playing short distance passes in between gaps.

Norwood tried to dictate from deep and spread teams about, he prefers hitting men out wide over long distances. It doesn’t get the best out of Fleck who is adept at dribbling through tight spaces and operating further inside, but Norwood has been our lynchpin this season and we’re 3rd in the league. Coutts isn’t up to it at the moment so this is what we have to go with and hope it’s enough to get us over the line.

It would be nice to see Norwood try and get forward a bit more and link with Duffy / Fleck though.
 

Is it just me that thinks that Fleck has been one of the weaker performers for a while now?
I think he still has some great moments, but less so than a few months ago.
And I thought his passing/crossing was really poor last night.
 
Fleck seemed to struggle to link with Cranie and Stevens in the first half and also at times with Dowell when he came on. Probably because our system is dependent on players knowing what each other are going to do.

I also think we played quite ‘safe’ football. First half we had a lot of possession but as people have mentioned, we didn’t really drive into attacking positions enough. Second half we went longer.

I think we were scared of being caught on the counter. Stevens talked about how good Brum were at counter attacking in his post match interview. There’s a fair chance that if we’d been more gung ho we’d have been discussing a defeat today as we’d have played into their hands.
 
Norwood’s refusal to carry the ball really frustrates me. When he is forced to sit deep it is both ineffective and, as said in the first post, bypasses Fleck.

Norwood wants the ball ALL the time but I just wish he’d keep it for longer periods sometimes - ideally moving us up the pitch a few inch.
 
The style of play last night, with Norwood dropping very deep and trying to dictate everything from alongside the centre-halves, was reminiscent of the way we played before Christmas—dominating the ball but struggling to break teams down. If we do that we desperately need Duffy to be finding space and showing for the ball. McGoldrick was the only one doing that last night.

We did find our Plan B for the last 20 minutes when Madine and Dowell came on, but we just couldn’t quite create a big chance.
 
GallonofMagnet said:
Norwood’s refusal to carry the ball really frustrates me. When he is forced to sit deep it is both ineffective and, as said in the first post, bypasses Fleck.

Norwood wants the ball ALL the time but I just wish he’d keep it for longer periods sometimes - ideally moving us up the pitch a few inch.
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When he was receiving the ball deep I noticed Bash would be more or less on the halfway line in the RWB position. I don’t think it would have been sensible for Norwood to bomb forward when we’re playing like that.

It’s his choice of passing that sometimes frustrates me. There are times when he could take a touch and look up but he plays it first time in the direction he’s facing. For a good player he doesn’t always protect the ball well, too easy to dispossess.
 
BushBlade said:
When he was receiving the ball deep I noticed Bash would be more or less on the halfway line in the RWB position. I don’t think it would have been sensible for Norwood to bomb forward when we’re playing like that.

It’s his choice of passing that sometimes frustrates me. There are times when he could take a touch and look up but he plays it first time in the direction he’s facing. For a good player he doesn’t always protect the ball well, too easy to dispossess.
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I know what you’re saying but I don’t want him to bomb forward - just carry it for a few yards rather than straight back where it came from. He’s a top player but some tactics outdo him... but our reliance remains heavily on him. Then we don’t tick.
 
GallonofMagnet said:
I know what you’re saying but I don’t want him to bomb forward - just carry it for a few yards rather than straight back where it came from. He’s a top player but some tactics outdo him... but our reliance remains heavily on him. Then we don’t tick.
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I think it’s all part of the same thing; decision making. He doesn’t ‘see a picture’ like a Scholes type player (i.e. a PL version of him) who can think two or three moves ahead. Still a good player but I can see why he’s still in the championship.
 
Disagree entirely with the “touch heat map” thingie where folks are saying this should have him higher up the pitch.

He is the quarter back. His role dictates his positioning on the pitch in open play will be mostly deep lying.

UTB
 
Scooter_mcgavin said:
I've said it before and I'll say it again.

Most teams vs us sit back and we have a system where Norwood seems the go-to player for all attacks. At times from the keeper we're playing with 4 centre halves positionally, because Norwood drops to pick the ball up - completely unnecessarily a lot of the time.

In doing this, teams sitting back then have 1 MC to pick up, there's no wonder there's hardly an outfield ball as we have 4/5 players being covered by 10. Fleck I feel suffers greatly because of this. There's no space for him to offer a pass, this 9/10 Norwood ends up pinging a ball over the top of the full backs, or out wide.

It can be very frustrating as I feel our 3 centre halves are more than comfortable on the ball, particularly when given time. There's no reason for Norwood to become the 4th.
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You make some interesting and valid points.

But anonymous ? Seriously ??

Not for me.

UTB
 
I'm not complaining, we're third. That's unbelievable.

Enjoy the ride
 

So basically when fleck plays badly it's Norwood ( or madines)fault and we should change the whole system that has got is in promotion contention to the richest league I the world
 
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