The Promised Land

[travellingblade]

I've posted this at other times.

Looking at yesterday's results in the Premiership, do we REALLY want to get promotion, to watch our team get humiliated week in week out, or see us struggle to survive one season to see us struggle for a second.

Even the "established" sides, such as Portsmouth, Bolton, Blackburn, and dare I say Wigan are only just holding their own.

For me, I'm comfortable nicely in the top half of the Championship, where we are well respected.

 

[grafikhaus]

'Fraid I agree, but how long will the fans put up with endless 'near misses'?

Without a doubt, the PL is no place for teams like United (and Hull, Stoke, Burnley, Wigan, Bolton, Blackburn etc. etc.) Take the top 4 + Man. City out of it and teams like Spurs, Villa and Everton are just wasting their time, and vast amounts of money. Sure they may pick up the odd Carling Cup, but is it all worth it? And when they get into the Europa Cup, they don't want it anyway!

As for the near-mythical £50-£60m to be gained, it all goes on players' salaries and agents.

Yesterday's results showed the true nature of the PL. Take away the initial excitement of seeing the big teams (which soon fades), and you're left with nine months of pain. Phil Brown's reward for taking Hull to the 'promised land'? Talk of the sack every week.

And leaving aside the gulf in ability and finance, there's always the refs to contend with. Burnley had a perfectly good goal disallowed at Spurs. If it had stood, they could well have got a point out of that game.

It all stinks.

 

[mall]

Well respected? Who says so?
That's your delusion. Nobody outside Sheffield gives us a moments thought I would assume.
The ONLY place to be is the Premier but it's looking sadly distant as Blackwell keeps buying more benchwarmers and allows his team to play 100 mph hoofball where mistakes are bound to be made.
Someone tell the players to calm down and play football, for god's sake.

 

[raul]

If we are well respected it's because of our brave and ultimately heartbreaking season in the Prem, because without that we'd be completely anonymous.

If we're happy to pootle along in the Championship, what the hell is the point of the Academy, Feeder Clubs, Hotels and the like? We were told at the recent meet the fans thing that the aim is to be a top 10 club (sensibly, he's dropped the timescale because he keeps missing the deadlines he sets) and that is why we're set up as we are, to give us a better than average chance when we get it right again on the pitch.

As for the risk of relegation, it's like not wanting to pass your driving test because theres a chance you might have an accident at some point.

 

[Bladesman]

We should just stay in this division and be happy with the failed trips to Wembley.

I know better still lets fold the club and become a property business that invests in other football clubs. We are already pretty much doing that anyway.

 

[travellingblade]

O come on, and don't take the comments too "literally".

 

[Deleted member 1486]

I'd like to be in the prem obviously, but it's not the be all and end all. I'd still go every week if we were in the conference, if for no other reason than it's a good excuse to get out of the house, have a few pints and sit around with other people and talk shit about a common interest that's utterly irrelevant. :thumbup:

I'd love us to be playing Man U, Chelsea, Arsenal, etc every week. It would be great if we could establish ourselves as a midtable prem team (and let's be honest, it's pretty unlikely any team without a billionaire is going to break the top 4/5 anytime soon). But even that kind of "stability" is a false sense of security, one wrong managerial/board room decision can quickly bring you back down to earth with a bump, as most of the teams in this league can testify to (not too mention a few league 1 teams and Bradford in league 2).

Where we are now isn't too bad. At least we're fighting for something, are building for the future and we seem to be a lot more financially stable than most of the teams around us.

 

[The Fox]

The Premier League have created a monster .

There's actually too large a gap within the PL itself , and whats more important is that apart from when the Top 4/6 play each other , no one will want to watch .

My prediction is that the top clubs will start to talk more seriously about a European Super league which will simply be a stalking horse to create PL 1 & 2 .

PL 1 & 2 will look after the Top 40 clubs ( Inc Ragers and Celtic) , the rest will compete in The Football league.

There will probably be no more than about 60 English Professional clubs in a few years .

Sometimes Football should be ashamed of itself

(Apols for the doom and gloom)

 

[dingledog]

In many ways I have no time for the premier league and what it stands for. That said, I want to believe that the mighty Blades are the best in the land and there is no way we can be languishing in the Championship. We neiter recieve the PR or air time that makes us a top team.

 

[Sensiblade]

(Apols for the doom and gloom)

About par for the course on here at the moment so no need to apologise
:fishy:

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

The Premier League have created a monster .

There's actually too large a gap within the PL itself , and whats more important is that apart from when the Top 4/6 play each other , no one will want to watch .

My prediction is that the top clubs will start to talk more seriously about a European Super league which will simply be a stalking horse to create PL 1 & 2 .

PL 1 & 2 will look after the Top 40 clubs ( Inc Ragers and Celtic) , the rest will compete in The Football league.

There will probably be no more than about 60 English Professional clubs in a few years .

Sometimes Football should be ashamed of itself

(Apols for the doom and gloom)

Spot on Fox. Indeed it is the height of irony that our PL status may well be decided off the pitch rather than on it. When the above scenario happens (Fox is right and it is 'when' rather than 'if') the decisions about who goes into PL 1 & 2 will have nothing to do with league position. Indeed if it happens as a complete re-structure then we may well go straight into the top tier at the expense of one of those people keep listing (Stoke, Wigan, Birmingham etc) who would drop to PL2. So the 'off-field' standing and structures that McCabe seems to get regularly vilified for by some supporters may well be the very thing that gets the longed-for PL status.

 

[Ollessendro]

Just think if he had reached the promise land last year we'd be in with a really good shout of staying up. Of course a lot of that is down to there being some dire teams in the Premiership. Hull and Pompey are down already. That leaves only one of the awful promoted teams going down. Crap teams such as Bolton and Blackburn must be very, very happy. Happy in the sense that they know they are shit, but will still stay up because the teams around/below them are utterly rubbish!?

I blame cheap as chips. What do you think Beighton??

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

The Premier League have created a monster .

There's actually too large a gap within the PL itself , and whats more important is that apart from when the Top 4/6 play each other , no one will want to watch .

My prediction is that the top clubs will start to talk more seriously about a European Super league which will simply be a stalking horse to create PL 1 & 2 .

PL 1 & 2 will look after the Top 40 clubs ( Inc Ragers and Celtic) , the rest will compete in The Football league.

There will probably be no more than about 60 English Professional clubs in a few years .

Sometimes Football should be ashamed of itself

(Apols for the doom and gloom)

Agree with all that. No way can a league in which you can predict the top 4 (maybe 5 now) every season, and it's the same top 4, sustain any long term success in terms of what should really matter, the bread and butter, the fans.

I know a few Bolton and Blackburn fans who just don't bother any more, the maximum they can hope for is pinching the odd 'glory' win and sneaking a Europa League spot and even then, the clubs tend to field weaken teams so what's the point ?

I agree that a European League is the next likely move, ffs, they play almost half a season's worth of games in the Champions League as it is now ! OK, the loss of the likes of ManU will take away a great deal from the English competition but at least we have a chance of making a competitive 'Premier' division in this country. There would still need to be changes in transfers, spending etc so as to avoid another 'top 4' surfacing but I, like most other fans over a certain age, would love to return to the days when a team can win Division 2 and win the top Division the year after. Whether this is practical any more, is open debate, but I suspect as you suggest, the damage has been done.

 

[Robbie]

Typical United mentality - wanting to be a big fish in a small pond.

 

[beightonblade]

Foxy is reight....

McCabe for what its worth is doing a decent job of protecting the Blades financial status, he's just about admitted we cant compete financially.

He shud stop the ambition bollox and keep his gob shut,he raises the expectations then does fcuk all.

as for cheap as chips ..... he's partly to blame because he's useless.

 

[Asaba/Djaffo]

No way in a million years will a European League happen,

1. Fans and clubs will not travel 1000+ miles every week to play or watch fixtures around the continent.

2. The various countries FA's will not allow 3 or 4 teams to just up and leave the the domestic competitions as it would severely harm the leagues' integrity and Television deals.

3. What would replace the Champions League? The Champion's Champion's League?

ps. I want United in the Premiership so we can mix it with the big boys and maybe pull off another Arsenal or Spurs or Liverpool result at the Lane, i Can't believe some of you are content to watch the Blades play shite like Doncaster and Blackpool every week.

 

[Asaba/Djaffo]

Foxy is reight....

McCabe for what its worth is doing a decent job of protecting the Blades financial status, he's just about admitted we cant compete financially.

He shud stop the ambition bollox and keep his gob shut,he raises the expectations then does fcuk all.

as for cheap as chips ..... he's partly to blame because he's useless.

Theres an idea...

 

[lenners]

Can't see a European League beyond what we already have any time soon.
Clubs and fans still have a strong attachment to their national leagues and I can't really see that changing much.
As for us, if we don't want to be the best we can we may as well pack up now.

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

No way in a million years will a European League happen,

1. Fans and clubs will not travel 1000+ miles every week to play or watch fixtures around the continent.

2. The various countries FA's will not allow 3 or 4 teams to just up and leave the the domestic competitions as it would severely harm the leagues' integrity and Television deals.

3. What would replace the Champions League? The Champion's Champion's League?

ps. I want United in the Premiership so we can mix it with the big boys and maybe pull off another Arsenal or Spurs or Liverpool result at the Lane, i Can't believe some of you are content to watch the Blades play shite like Doncaster and Blackpool every week.

Here's why it will!

1. The fans aren't important. The TV money is!

2. Just like when the PL was formed, there will be very little say from the respective associations about it. You may even finish up with the clubs forming or threatening to form their own association if that's what it takes to breakaway. It will not happen like that as UEFA will sanction it (see below)

3. The new 'Nike European League' will replace the 'Champions League'. UEFA may try and organise an alternative competition, but more likely they will throw their lot in with the new league because that will be the financially prudent thing to do.

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

No way in a million years will a European League happen,

1. Fans and clubs will not travel 1000+ miles every week to play or watch fixtures around the continent.

2. The various countries FA's will not allow 3 or 4 teams to just up and leave the the domestic competitions as it would severely harm the leagues' integrity and Television deals.

We're talking about maybe 15 or so away games every season in Europe so it's not as if they're travelling 1000 miles every week and these days it's as cheap for fans getting over there as it is travelling internally.

I guess you'd never have thought the FA would have allowed ManU to opt out of the FA Cup either.

Things change, some of the founder members of the League no longer exist, clubs such as Wigan were in the non League 20 years ago. Of course it would be a loss for the likes of ManU to leave and this would affect TV money etc but to me, football is losing at the moment and the top clubs are doubtless getting bored with this countries Premier football competition and have already reduced one of the World's greatest competition, the FA Cup, to a shambles.

 

[dingledog]

Here's why it will!

1. The fans aren't important. The TV money is!

2. Just like when the PL was formed, there will be very little say from the respective associations about it. You may even finish up with the clubs forming or threatening to form their own association if that's what it takes to breakaway. It will not happen like that as UEFA will sanction it (see below)

3. The new 'Nike European League' will replace the 'Champions League'. UEFA may try and organise an alternative competition, but more likely they will throw their lot in with the new league because that will be the financially prudent thing to do.

And good ridance to them all, we can get back to footballs roots, something people do on a Saturday afternoon.

 

[Robbie]

2. The various countries FA's will not allow 3 or 4 teams to just up and leave the the domestic competitions as it would severely harm the leagues' integrity and Television deals.

How would you propose the FA's stopped them?

 

[The Fox]

Personally I'm not convinced that the EL will happen for some of the reasons Asaba mentions .
However -
The G14 will have an agenda to grow their influence within Uefa
The PL will have an expansion plan which will be threatend by any EL
Uefa dont really want breakaways as they want to retain control, want smaller PL's in each country but dont support cross border leagues ( Scottish cluubs in the EPL)

The comprimise may well be that the G14 scrap the EL in exchange for more flexibility in the domestic PL's allowing PL1 and PL2 which suits the PL expansion. Allows the inclusion of Rangers and celtic but reduces the clubs in PL1

( Benelux have muted for a while to have a league which could also be santioned under the same flexibility)

Somewhere along the line someone will make lots of money and no one will have a second thought for the supporters .

And to be even more hypothetical - If we have PL1 & 2 do you think that they would allow 2 sheffield teams ?

 

[judge]

if this crazy idea ever gets off the ground it will be the death knell for the lower league teams

its purely financial and will mean the chances of actually winning something meaningfull will be even less remote than they are now

events like the sales of naughton and walker and the top clubs hoovering up everyone elses young talent will be common-place and clubs like ours will HAVE to do this to survive

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

events like the sales of naughton and walker and the top clubs hoovering up everyone elses young talent will be common-place and clubs like ours will HAVE to do this to survive

yep, like this isn't happening already

 

[judge]

yep, like this isn't happening already

thats what i mean ,if youre not happy with it now how will you feel when it is even worse ?

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

Some can see it coming, which is why Phil Gartside at Bolton is proposing the PL1 and 2 idea this week to the PL. It will get thrown out at this stage so Bolton will have to take their chances, but he knows that at some point clubs like Bolton will bite the bullet and get relegated. He also realises that the likelihood of Bolton doing a 'Forest' is greater than going straight back up, so he's looking to change things to guarantee finance.

It will happen eventually as will the EL. The latter by stealth rather than re-structure. Why else does the CL seemingly expand year on year? Already they play almost enough games to constitute a full league. Do away with the groups and lump them all together playing each other home and away and you have a full blown league running alongside the domestic competition. The rest sorts itself out!

 

[SheepdipBlade]

The assumption behind all this is that the financial situation remains unchanged.

If the Germans persuade Herr Blatter to not allow more that 49% foreign ownership of clubs (as in the Bundesleague) then all the arab and US monies leave European football.

If the continuing shake up in global economics draws football into it - we may see football once again drawn into the world of real economics. What then happens when clubs have to live within their means? (Haven't F1 been trying to deal with just this issue earlier this year?)

And then there's global warming - when it's £5.00 a litre, who will be going to games - let alone games half way across the continent?

 

[Macfarlane21]

I'd love to be in the Prem again purely for the coverage. It sucks having to wait until 12pm on a saturday night to watch 15 seconds of highlights.