The McCabe Kop

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Sean Thornton said:
I assume it does for McCabe who charges well below the going rate for rent on the stadium.

How many exec boxes would you get in corners of the ground? What's the ROI? Similarly in the BL/JS corner, how many seats - away or home - and what would have been the cost?
Click to expand...

Oh, and guess who'd have paid for it all?
 



Yes, for sure.

Nobody, absolutely nobody, deserves it more. A fitting tribute.
 
Sean Thornton said:
I assume it does for McCabe who charges well below the going rate for rent on the stadium.

How many exec boxes would you get in corners of the ground? What's the ROI? Similarly in the BL/JS corner, how many seats - away or home - and what would have been the cost?
Click to expand...

That’s why most clubs famously fill the corners of their stadiums with Business Centres then.

You can have both. It doesn’t need to be part of the stadium. You could put one anywhere and it would yield the same income.
 
Sothall_Blade said:
That’s why most clubs famously fill the corners of their stadiums with Business Centres then.

You can have both. It doesn’t need to be part of the stadium. You could put one anywhere and it would yield the same income.
Click to expand...


Spurs should have put more seats in rather than the supermarket then?

How can you say building it anywhere would bring in the same income. That's an unquantifiable figure.

Isn't the new building part media centre?
 
Sean Thornton said:
Spurs should have put more seats in rather than the supermarket then?

How can you say building it anywhere would bring in the same income. That's an unquantifiable figure.

Isn't the new building part media centre?
Click to expand...

Are you telling me that Businesses pay more to rent an office that backs on to but doesn’t give a view of a football pitch?

Is that really what Spurs have done too? Bad design if so but I doubt it
 
Well it's the Brearley shed at the moment, so if McCabe build a new one his name can be used
 
Why is he replacing the seats with student flats before he sells up. I think we can forget any ground improvements until new owners take over that is if they dont relocate to Tinsley.
 
Sothall_Blade said:
Are you telling me that Businesses pay more to rent an office that backs on to but doesn’t give a view of a football pitch?

Is that really what Spurs have done too? Bad design if so but I doubt it
Click to expand...


The only thing I'm telling you is your statement about building elsewhere would have had the same financial results can't be proven, one way or the other. So it adds nothing to the debate.

You doubt Spurs have incorporated a supermarket in their new ground?

https://innovationcorridor.uk/sainsbury-to-run-spurs-supermarket

https://stores.sainsburys.co.uk/2306/tottenham


Why would I make it up?
 
metalblade said:
Why is he replacing the seats with student flats before he sells up. I think we can forget any ground improvements until new owners take over that is if they dont relocate to Tinsley.
Click to expand...


Which seats is he replacing?

I've said for quite sometime not much will happen until we have new owners.
 



Sean Thornton said:
The only thing I'm telling you is your statement about building elsewhere would have had the same financial results can't be proven, one way or the other. So it adds nothing to the debate.

You doubt Spurs have incorporated a supermarket in their new ground?
https://innovationcorridor.uk/sainsbury-to-run-spurs-supermarket
https://stores.sainsburys.co.uk/2306/tottenham
Why would I make it up?
Click to expand...

I didn't doubt that Spurs have incorporated a supermarket into their ground.
I doubted that they've built it overlooking the pitch where they could have put seats instead. Why would they?
My guess is it's been built out of the way under one of the stands, you know like a club shop or museum.

If you can explain why a Business Centre backing onto a pitch would bring in more than money than seats + a Business Centre elsewhere, then I'll be happy to hear it.
 
Sothall_Blade said:
I didn't doubt that Spurs have incorporated a supermarket into their ground.
I doubted that they've built it overlooking the pitch where they could have put seats instead. Why would they?
My guess is it's been built out of the way under one of the stands, you know like a club shop or museum.

If you can explain why a Business Centre backing onto a pitch would bring in more than money than seats + a Business Centre elsewhere, then I'll be happy to hear it.
Click to expand...


Well when the business centre was originally built, tell me what our gates where and why we needed more seats. It was planned to be income generating I expect and when we weren't selling out - for years and years - it would have made financial suspense. That part of your argument therefore makes no sense whatsoever.


As for the new build, which part of any business centre will be facing the pitch in the Kop/SS corner? Did you ignore the point about the media centre being required?
 
Sean Thornton said:
Well when the business centre was originally built, tell me what our gates where and why we needed more seats. It was planned to be income generating I expect and when we weren't selling out - for years and years - it would have made financial suspense. That part of your argument therefore makes no sense whatsoever.


As for the new build, which part of any business centre will be facing the pitch in the Kop/SS corner? Did you ignore the point about the media centre being required?
Click to expand...

So nobody could possibly have foreseen that at some point in the future, an increased capacity would be required and the Forsyth Business Centre would be a potential obstacle to that?

They could have built a Business Centre on the wasteland corner of Cherry Street and Shoreham Street and it would still have generated income for years.

Are you ignoring my question about why a Business Centre needs to back onto a football pitch?

Having a media centre actually facing the pitch is certainly a better use of the space but I’m wondering how other similar sized clubs manage to accommodate the media without allocating an entire corner of the stadium to them.
 
Sothall_Blade said:
So nobody could possibly have foreseen that at some point in the future, an increased capacity would be required and the Forsyth Business Centre would be a potential obstacle to that?

They could have built a Business Centre on the wasteland corner of Cherry Street and Shoreham Street and it would still have generated income for years.

Are you ignoring my question about why a Business Centre needs to back onto a football pitch?

Having a media centre actually facing the pitch is certainly a better use of the space but I’m wondering how other similar sized clubs manage to accommodate the media without allocating an entire corner of the stadium to them.
Click to expand...


Clearly your crystal ball told you what the future held for football and you and it only looks like you, would have advised the owner, and a property developer not to do it, but instead put in extra seats we wouldn't use for a good few years to come. Is that just in case or would you have given a cast iron guarantee? Without the benefit of hindsight obviously.

So now it's within the confines of the grounds, not "anywhere".
("Anywhere" rather obviously which would have needed a purchase of land.) l suspect at the timeit was the most cost effective plan. Maybe at the time it was believed there could be a bit of Kudos being in a building attached to Bramall Lane itself, rather being stuck in the corner of its car park as per your latest suggestion.

It's a stupid question to ask me. Ask McCabe. Do some research for a change.

You didn't seem aware of the media centre (see above) you suggested he was filling the corner with a business centre, now it's all about the existing one because of your ignorance. I did ask you the question which part of this "new" business centre faces the pitch. It's seems to have stymied you.
 
In fact wasn't the planning permission for apartments and a new club shop etc plus the media centre?
 
Sean Thornton said:
Clearly your crystal ball told you what the future held for football and you and it only looks like you, would have advised the owner, and a property developer not to do it, but instead put in extra seats we wouldn't use for a good few years to come. Is that just in case or would you have given a cast iron guarantee? Without the benefit of hindsight obviously.

So now it's within the confines of the grounds, not "anywhere".
("Anywhere" rather obviously which would have needed a purchase of land.) l suspect at the timeit was the most cost effective plan. Maybe at the time it was believed there could be a bit of Kudos being in a building attached to Bramall Lane itself, rather being stuck in the corner of its car park as per your latest suggestion.

It's a stupid question to ask me. Ask McCabe. Do some research for a change.

You didn't seem aware of the media centre (see above) you suggested he was filling the corner with a business centre, now it's all about the existing one because of your ignorance. I did ask you the question which part of this "new" business centre faces the pitch. It's seems to have stymied you.
Click to expand...

I think many people expected (or at very least hoped) that we might need extra seating capacity at some point in the life time of Bramsll Lane. No need to fill in the corner and scupper the possibility of ever using it for paying fans to watch football matches.. Just a bit of foresight needed not hindsight.

It’s not a stupid question to ask at all. You just don’t know the answer. Nobody does. Where exactly does one research “what are the benefits of Business Centres backing on to but not facing football pitches”?
 
Sean Thornton said:
In fact wasn't the planning permission for apartments and a new club shop etc plus the media centre?
Click to expand...

Not apartments on that corner no. “Do some research for a change” yourself:-

“Bramall Lane/Cherry Street Residential – WCEC is appraising the viability for an eight-storey residential development in two blocks on the Bramall Lane / Cherry Street corner adjacent to the Copthorne Hotel.

Kop Extension/Business Centre (Kop to South Stand Corner) - Planning permission has been retained for a 3,200-seat extension at the back of the existing Kop, including a new roof and over trusses to allow the four existing roof support columns to be removed and the introduction of a new concourse with improved facilities. As part of this scheme permission was also granted for a new Business Enterprise Centre on stilts in the Kop/South Stand corner, allowing entry/exit routes to/from the Kop and South Stand to remain.

John Street/Shoreham Street residential - Planning permission has been retained and obtained for a three and four storey residential development consisting of 52 apartments on the corner of John Street / Shoreham Street

https://www.thestar.co.uk/news/late...al-plans-for-kop-south-stand-corner-1-8389190

P.S. I have no problem with any Business Centres, Apartments or other non-football related property developments that don’t overlook or back on to the pitch.
 
Last edited:
Sothall_Blade said:
I think many people expected (or at very least hoped) that we might need extra seating capacity at some point in the life time of Bramsll Lane. No need to fill in the corner and scupper the possibility of ever using it for paying fans to watch football matches.. Just a bit of foresight needed not hindsight.

It’s not a stupid question to ask at all. You just don’t know the answer. Nobody does. Where exactly does one research “what are the benefits of Business Centres backing on to but not facing football pitches”?
Click to expand...


The average attendance in 2000/2001 just over 17000. The following season 2001/2 18000. What was the ground capacity then and why did we need more seats at that point?

It was an attempt to diversify to other income streams. You're using hindsight to criticise a business decision made 17 years ago under very different circumstances. As of now, you don't have a clue about the ongoing building work. The media centre surprised you as you clearly expected a similar set up in the opposite corner of the ground. A ridiculous and unfounded claim.

As I said, do some research, rather than your modus operandi of asking questions and asking more when the answer doesn't suit.

Now you tell me why we needed more empty seats in 2002 rather than more income.
 
Sothall_Blade said:
I think many people expected (or at very least hoped) that we might need extra seating capacity at some point in the life time of Bramsll Lane. No need to fill in the corner and scupper the possibility of ever using it for paying fans to watch football matches.. Just a bit of foresight needed not hindsight.

It’s not a stupid question to ask at all. You just don’t know the answer. Nobody does. Where exactly does one research “what are the benefits of Business Centres backing on to but not facing football pitches”?
Click to expand...


The average attendance in 2000/2001 just over 17000. The following seas
Sothall_Blade said:
Not apartments on that corner no. “Do some research for a change” yourself:-

“Bramall Lane/Cherry Street Residential – WCEC is appraising the viability for an eight-storey residential development in two blocks on the Bramall Lane / Cherry Street corner adjacent to the Copthorne Hotel.

Kop Extension/Business Centre (Kop to South Stand Corner) - Planning permission has been retained for a 3,200-seat extension at the back of the existing Kop, including a new roof and over trusses to allow the four existing roof support columns to be removed and the introduction of a new concourse with improved facilities. As part of this scheme permission was also granted for a new Business Enterprise Centre on stilts in the Kop/South Stand corner, allowing entry/exit routes to/from the Kop and South Stand to remain.

John Street/Shoreham Street residential - Planning permission has been retained and obtained for a three and four storey residential development consisting of 52 apartments on the corner of John Street / Shoreham Street

https://www.thestar.co.uk/news/late...al-plans-for-kop-south-stand-corner-1-8389190

P.S. I have no problem with any Business Centres, Apartments or other non-football related property developments that don’t overlook or back on to the pitch.
Click to expand...


Sothall_Blade said:
Not apartments on that corner no. “Do some research for a change” yourself:-

“Bramall Lane/Cherry Street Residential – WCEC is appraising the viability for an eight-storey residential development in two blocks on the Bramall Lane / Cherry Street corner adjacent to the Copthorne Hotel.

Kop Extension/Business Centre (Kop to South Stand Corner) - Planning permission has been retained for a 3,200-seat extension at the back of the existing Kop, including a new roof and over trusses to allow the four existing roof support columns to be removed and the introduction of a new concourse with improved facilities. As part of this scheme permission was also granted for a new Business Enterprise Centre on stilts in the Kop/South Stand corner, allowing entry/exit routes to/from the Kop and South Stand to remain.

John Street/Shoreham Street residential - Planning permission has been retained and obtained for a three and four storey residential development consisting of 52 apartments on the corner of John Street / Shoreham Street

https://www.thestar.co.uk/news/late...al-plans-for-kop-south-stand-corner-1-8389190

P.S. I have no problem with any Business Centres, Apartments or other non-football related property developments that don’t overlook or back on to the pitch.
Click to expand...





Want to live at Bramall Lane? Sheffield United unveil residential plans for Kop/South Stand corner
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An impression of the new development, copyright WCEC Architects

DANNY HALL
Email
Published: 13:32Tuesday 14 February 2017
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Sheffield United have unveiled plans to build a four-storey development at Bramall Lane, to include apartments and a new club shop.

The Boundary Corner development, named to pay tribute to Bramall Lane's cricketing heritage, will sit on the corner of Cherry Street and Shoreham Street after a planning application was submitted by the club.

Planners say a "strong, contemporary architectural proposal has been designed whilst sensitively considering the nearby properties". The proposed new Blades Superstore will replace the existing one in the South Stand and is twice the size, also including a fan zone.

“The corner site we are developing could fulfil a dream for some of our supporters - a chance to live at the home of football!" said United director Simon McCabe.


"It will also enable the club to expand the Superstore, and ware working on several exciting projects to bring new activities and events to Bramall Lane soon,

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Fellow director Scott McCabe said: “We have identified several opportunities to further develop and improve the ground and the immediate surrounding area as we seek to build a broader commercial, leisure and entertainment offer, developing additional revenue streams to support the aim of supporting United’s return to the upper levels of the English game.

“Further development of the stadium area is a positive move to enhance income streams, ultimately supporting our plans for the key football side of the business."

Other proposals under consideration for Bramall Lane include an eight-storey residential development on the corner of Bramall Lane and Cherry Street, next to the Copthorne Hotel, and a 3,200-seat extension to the Kop, with a new roof and removal of the pillars.


OTHER PROPOSALS, in full:

Chaucer’s Yard (Countess Road) – formerly a cutlery casting workshop and is Grade II listed in part. The site is located immediately off John Street and Countess Road and is situated within the John Street Conservation Area. Pre-application discussions have begun with the local authority, assessing the feasibility of new residential and commercial space alongside a refurbished Chaucer Yard development.

image.jpg


Bramall Lane
Bramall Lane/Cherry Street Residential – WCEC is appraising the viability for an eight-storey residential development in two blocks on the Bramall Lane / Cherry Street corner adjacent to the Copthorne Hotel.

Kop Extension/Business Centre (Kop to South Stand Corner) - Planning permission has been retained for a 3,200-seat extension at the back of the existing Kop, including a new roof and over trusses to allow the four existing roof support columns to be removed and the introduction of a new concourse with improved facilities. As part of this scheme permission was also granted for a new Business Enterprise Centre on stilts in the Kop/South Stand corner, allowing entry/exit routes to/from the Kop and South Stand to remain.


John Street/Shoreham Street residential - Planning permission has been retained and obtained for a three and four storey residential development consisting of 52 apartments on the corner of John Street / Shoreham Street

image.jpg

Man detained after bus attack in Sheffield city centre
John Street Corner Stand Executive Boxes - Assessments are ongoing for a concept proposal to create additional executive boxes at high level at the back of the corner stand. Detailed costings will determine if the project is viable.

South Stand - Clean and improve the façade, creating a matching look with the hotel and a clearer identity to the component parts of the stand.





Read it all again. Especially the bit where it mentions the business centre. Nowhere does it state it's overlooking the pitch.
 
Sean Thornton said:
The average attendance in 2000/2001 just over 17000. The following season 2001/2 18000. What was the ground capacity then and why did we need more seats at that point?

It was an attempt to diversify to other income streams. You're using hindsight to criticise a business decision made 17 years ago under very different circumstances. As of now, you don't have a clue about the ongoing building work. The media centre surprised you as you clearly expected a similar set up in the opposite corner of the ground. A ridiculous and unfounded claim.

As I said, do some research, rather than your modus operandi of asking questions and asking more when the answer doesn't suit.

Now you tell me why we needed more empty seats in 2002 rather than more income.
Click to expand...

Well we were 90 minutes away from The Premiership and needing extra seats in 2003. A full ONE year later. Nobody could possibly have hoped that would happen in their lifetime,

Your research led you to believe there would be apartments in that corner. A ridiculous and unfounded claim.

As I said, do some more research yourself instead of your usual modus operandi of backing every decision ever made by Kevin McCabe without being to offer logical reasons to support them.
 
Sean Thornton said:
The average attendance in 2000/2001 just over 17000. The following seas









Want to live at Bramall Lane? Sheffield United unveil residential plans for Kop/South Stand corner
image.jpg

An impression of the new development, copyright WCEC Architects

DANNY HALL
Email
Published: 13:32Tuesday 14 February 2017
Sign Up To Our Daily Newsletter

Tick-tock, it's spring o'clock
A walk in the outdoors is good for us and vital for our dogs – but the countryside carries a risk, especially at this time of year.
Promoted by Abbey Veterinary Group Ltd
0HAVE YOUR SAY
Sheffield United have unveiled plans to build a four-storey development at Bramall Lane, to include apartments and a new club shop.

The Boundary Corner development, named to pay tribute to Bramall Lane's cricketing heritage, will sit on the corner of Cherry Street and Shoreham Street after a planning application was submitted by the club.

Planners say a "strong, contemporary architectural proposal has been designed whilst sensitively considering the nearby properties". The proposed new Blades Superstore will replace the existing one in the South Stand and is twice the size, also including a fan zone.

“The corner site we are developing could fulfil a dream for some of our supporters - a chance to live at the home of football!" said United director Simon McCabe.


"It will also enable the club to expand the Superstore, and ware working on several exciting projects to bring new activities and events to Bramall Lane soon,

Plus size : Paul & Shark, Field jacket with hood i...415 €
image

Cut: Comfortable cut Details: High standing collar Practical hood with drawstring Concealed zip with a covered button placket Closing buttons with ...
Promoted by hirmer.com
nai_small.png

Fellow director Scott McCabe said: “We have identified several opportunities to further develop and improve the ground and the immediate surrounding area as we seek to build a broader commercial, leisure and entertainment offer, developing additional revenue streams to support the aim of supporting United’s return to the upper levels of the English game.

“Further development of the stadium area is a positive move to enhance income streams, ultimately supporting our plans for the key football side of the business."

Other proposals under consideration for Bramall Lane include an eight-storey residential development on the corner of Bramall Lane and Cherry Street, next to the Copthorne Hotel, and a 3,200-seat extension to the Kop, with a new roof and removal of the pillars.


OTHER PROPOSALS, in full:

Chaucer’s Yard (Countess Road) – formerly a cutlery casting workshop and is Grade II listed in part. The site is located immediately off John Street and Countess Road and is situated within the John Street Conservation Area. Pre-application discussions have begun with the local authority, assessing the feasibility of new residential and commercial space alongside a refurbished Chaucer Yard development.

image.jpg


Bramall Lane
Bramall Lane/Cherry Street Residential – WCEC is appraising the viability for an eight-storey residential development in two blocks on the Bramall Lane / Cherry Street corner adjacent to the Copthorne Hotel.

Kop Extension/Business Centre (Kop to South Stand Corner) - Planning permission has been retained for a 3,200-seat extension at the back of the existing Kop, including a new roof and over trusses to allow the four existing roof support columns to be removed and the introduction of a new concourse with improved facilities. As part of this scheme permission was also granted for a new Business Enterprise Centre on stilts in the Kop/South Stand corner, allowing entry/exit routes to/from the Kop and South Stand to remain.


John Street/Shoreham Street residential - Planning permission has been retained and obtained for a three and four storey residential development consisting of 52 apartments on the corner of John Street / Shoreham Street

image.jpg

Man detained after bus attack in Sheffield city centre
John Street Corner Stand Executive Boxes - Assessments are ongoing for a concept proposal to create additional executive boxes at high level at the back of the corner stand. Detailed costings will determine if the project is viable.

South Stand - Clean and improve the façade, creating a matching look with the hotel and a clearer identity to the component parts of the stand.





Read it all again. Especially the bit where it mentions the business centre. Nowhere does it state it's overlooking the pitch.
Click to expand...

Nor apartments. Does the existing Forsyth Business Centre not overlook/back on to the pitch?
 



:)

So you've posted an article about a business centre being built at the back of the Kop adjacent to Cherry street and your gripe is that it shouldn't face the pitch. When it becomes evident that it won't you jump in Docs DeLorean and go back 17 years?

Hilarious.
 
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