Statement from McCabe - Official Site

[Sean Thornton]

Please can somebody explain how we can lose £8M this season?
If FFP means we are only spending 60% of our income on player's wages.
That rule is designed to avoid clubs overspending.

The £8M isn't going on wages or transfer fees, so what has it been spent on?
Why can nobody ever give or get a straight answer to this question?

FFP isn't about overspending per se, it limits the percentage of wages to 60% of relevant turnover. The wage bill will have gone up from last year so to keep inside that 60% turnover has to increase or equity investment - the £8m referred to by KMc - has to occur.

We've lost £9m over the last two years after receiving decent cup run monies. It's not hard to see where it could have gone if you have an open mind.

 

[Bert]

Bert has always spoke of Bert in the third person since all this were just fields. The patronising manner has just evolved with his elevated status as board oracle.

Pommpey reckons it's best if he just 'humours' Bert, as he is past caring. Pommpey also wonders if Bert is somewhat:

... when it comes to the colourful utterances of people brought up in shithole council estates like Gleadless Valley and schooled on naval messdecks, such as he.

pommpey

Bert can swear as good as anyone but he believes that there is a time and a place for everything and that an open message board is not the place.
Does pommpey swear in front of small children and women, presumably he does due to his upbringing?

 

[Sothall_Blade]

FFP isn't about overspending per se, it limits the percentage of wages to 60% of relevant turnover. The wage bill will have gone up from last year so to keep inside that 60% turnover has to increase or equity investment - the £8m referred to by KMc - has to occur.

We've lost £9m over the last two years after receiving decent cup run monies. It's not hard to see where it could have gone if you have an open mind.

I have got an open mind believe me, I'm just trying to understand.
So, how is an "equity investment" shown in the annual accounts because I've looked and I couldn't see it.
Just a massive amount of "administrative expenses" causing us to make an overall loss and what these expenses are is never broken down or specified.

 

[finlaytheblade]

Just concentrating on the facts Kevin McCabe himself supplied makes grim reading. Now most are concentrating on the ninety million figure when much more relevant are the financials from the last three years. Losses 2014 and 2015 totalling some £9 million and a forecast loss of £8 million this season virtually covers the Princes original ten million investment and the recent eight million investment ( the Desso pitch covers the rest?) and look where we are. Lower in the league, poor squad and not one penny of that eighteen million can be said to have improved the playing squad.

It's not all down to luck or Clough going mad with the cheque book.

He as I said is not hiding from mistakes made., spending all these years in league 1 has cost him and the club a lot of money, a club carrying our overheads is bound to.
Let's put the past to bed and be positive about the future. Accepted we are at a low point in our history,
Where would we be at this time with no wealthy owners?the future can be bright the backing is there but we have to play our part as well,put the recent past behind us and be positive.

 

[Sean Thornton]

I have got an open mind believe me, I'm just trying to understand.
So, how is an "equity investment" shown in the annual accounts because I've looked and I couldn't see it.
Just a massive amount of "administrative expenses" causing us to make an overall loss and what these expenses are is never broken down or specified.

It's on the balance sheet as share capital. It now stands at £28million.

For a company this size you won't get a breakdown of those expenses. No one does it and it's not required by Companies House filings. That's all been said before. But it's made up of the day to day costs of running the club other than things like wages, interest or anything else detailed seperately. So rent rates insurance, travel, accommodation, telephone stationery etc. it's not like that to hide something.

The insurance figure alone I imagine would amaze some people.

 

[sportinguista]

Apologies, I've just watched a documentary about propaganda and North Korea but....

A rational person wouldn't believe in luck
The Desso pitch was paid for by the cup run. YOU told us this
Would it not be better to place a for sale ad in a newspaper?

We are united. United behind our glorious club, our great leaders and exceptional manager. All our players are fighting for the cause. UTB

robbiez666

What was the Korea doc?

 

[Sean Thornton]

He as I said is not hiding from mistakes made., spending all these years in league 1 has cost him and the club a lot of money, a club carrying our overheads is bound to.
Let's put the past to bed and be positive about the future. Accepted we are at a low point in our history,
Where would we be at this time with no wealthy owners?the future can be bright the backing is there but we have to play our part as well,put the recent past behind us and be positive.

That's whyvi said the £90m isn't the figure to focus on. KMc concentrated much on the past though, with very little about the future, as far as I can see.

 

[Sothall_Blade]

It's on the balance sheet as share capital. It now stands at £28million.

For a company this size you won't get a breakdown of those expenses. No one does it and it's not required by Companies House filings. That's all been said before. But it's made up of the day to day costs of running the club other than things like wages, interest or anything else detailed seperately. So rent rates insurance, travel, accommodation, telephone stationery etc. it's not like that to hide something.

The insurance figure alone I imagine would amaze some people.

So you're saying that are wages are actually much more than 60% of turnover but the league allow it due to equity investment. Is that correct?

 

[Pollingtonblade]

Please can somebody explain how we can lose £8M this season?
If FFP means we are only spending 60% of our income on player's wages.
That rule is designed to avoid clubs overspending.

The £8M isn't going on wages or transfer fees, so what has it been spent on?
Why can nobody ever give or get a straight answer to this question?

Or answer the question I've posed many times "Who is the transfer committee ?"

 

[Sean Thornton]

So you're saying that are wages are actually much more than 60% of turnover but the league allow it due to equity investment. Is that correct?

Not much more no. But probably over 60% at the moment. That's only my opinion. The additional share issues would seem, to me at least, to bear that out.

But that's how the rules work. Loans to the club don't qualify, but investment in shares does.

The amount of losses forecast by KMc this season while hugely disappointing, doesn't surprise me but it will be almost a year before we see the actuals.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Or answer the question I've posed many times "Who is the transfer committee ?"

That's the new "zone man" question

 

[finlaytheblade]

That's whyvi said the £90m isn't the figure to focus on. KMc concentrated much on the past though, with very little about the future, as far as I can see.

Sorry Sean can't agree! he is repeatably accused of taking money out he was putting slant on things, and he did say that the backing is there to push on when we get to next level.what more do you want him to do? Open his bank account to all and sundry?.I suggest you're being negative for negatives sake show a bit of support and be positive.Life is a lot better when you are a positive person,of course it will be silly to have your head in the clouds.

 

[PeteBlade]

[


I heard his comments on Adkins in Statons interview on the way to the ground. When he eventually answered.

All I asked was if he mentioned future plans on investment etc. pretty much a yes or no answer rather than a journey around my cv. (And yours).

I can answer that more easily.

No.

Think we're all sitting around hoping we get really luck as the entire reason we are where we are is down to bad luck.

 

[Woodwardfan]

I think you were right about KMc not putting money into the club. Until December 2015 he hadn't for sometime. I think it was borne of necessity and that opinion is strengthened by his comment about losing £8 million this year. The trouble is it's not improved the squad at all but has gone on an inflated wage bill due to Clough apparently being handed the keys to the safe.

Clough by-passed the recruitment committee and maybe exceeded his wage budget.

I don't blame the manager but if I were on the Board I would hold the MD accountable; it's his job to control the company and he is on the recruitment committee as well.

 

[PeteBlade]

Sorry Sean can't agree! he is repeatably accused of taking money out he was putting slant on things, and he did say that the backing is there to push on when we get to next level.what more do you want him to do? Open his bank account to all and sundry?.I suggest you're being negative for negatives sake show a bit of support and be positive.Life is a lot better when you are a positive person,of course it will be silly to have your head in the clouds.

What's the point in making money available when we get to the next level if we're light years away from getting out of the league we're in?

A nonsense statement to make.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Sorry Sean can't agree! he is repeatably accused of taking money out he was putting slant on things, and he did say that the backing is there to push on when we get to next level.what more do you want him to do? Open his bank account to all and sundry?.I suggest you're being negative for negatives sake show a bit of support and be positive.Life is a lot better when you are a positive person,of course it will be silly to have your head in the clouds.

I think you have your head in the clouds. You obviously don't read many of my posts. I've commented many times of the stupidity of the " he's taking money out" posts and I'd guess I'm seen as a clapper by many on here.
When I comment on the finances it's usually based on facts available to all or an opinion based on what's out there. The facts here are that there has been an element of rank bad management so he can't get away from admitting his mistakes can he?
What I'd like him to do is deal with now, not fanny about with platitudes about " the next level". Let's get their first eh?

There's more to being positive than blindly following every club announcement. Thinking for yourself is one. There's nothing negative about pointing out that the majority of that interview was about how much he's invested etc etc. I for one accept that almost totally, I've met him, like him and find him open and friendly face to face and yesterday he clearly wanted to get some things off his chest regarding his commitment to the club, fair enough, but you tell me how much more you knew of his plans to get us out of this division now, than you did on Friday?

 

[Sothall_Blade]

That's whyvi said the £90m isn't the figure to focus on. KMc concentrated much on the past though, with very little about the future, as far as I can see.

In your opinion is the £90M "put into the club over the years" figure correct?

Of that £90M, how much is still owed to him by the club and how much has he written off?

How much of the £90M has been spent on non-football items and properties like the Hotel and The Business Centre? How much could he still get back from these projects if he sold them?

If money was spent on say a gym in Essex which he then sold. Has he counted that in his £90M investment?

How about a Chinese Football Club or an Hungarian Football Club and surrounding land? Do they count towards the £90M he's put in?

 

[Sean Thornton]

Clough by-passed the recruitment committee and maybe exceeded his wage budget.

I don't blame the manager but if I were on the Board I would hold the MD accountable; it's his job to control the company and he is on the recruitment committee as well.

I'd imagine they have monthly management accounts though. Did they just file them away? Because they certainly didn't act on them.

 

[Revolution]

In your opinion is the £90M "put into the club over the years" figure correct?

Of that £90M, how much is still owed to him by the club and how much has he written off?

How much of the £90M has been spent on non-football items and properties like the Hotel and The Business Centre? How much could he still get back from these projects if he sold them?

If money was spent on say a gym in Essex which he then sold. Has he counted that in his £90M investment?

How about a Chinese Football Club or an Hungarian Football Club and surrounding land? Do they count towards the £90M he's put in?

The first thing that occurred to me when I heard this was what Phipps said about how much has been put in over the past 2 years. It turned out this included money from the cup runs and from transfer fees, which is not investment by the owners.

On the other hand, McCabe has been in charge for 15 years, so perhaps 90 million is right. Mind you, he owns the stadium and other property and half the club. He's got something to show for his investment.

 

[Houston_Blade]

What I read from his statement is:

• He's half admitting he's made some mistakes on managers
• Until someone else coughs up it's his money so if he wants to make mistakes it's his loss
• Him and the Prince still talk (but doesn't paint a rosy picture of their relationship)
• Fans have high expectations
• He's still covering the losses himself (along with the Prince)
• He's a Blade
• It's in his interest for things to improve on the pitch

Not really groundbreaking stuff is it?

What is doesn't give me is the confidence that they have a coherent plan to turn it around. He isn't going anywhere anytime soon as the Football Club is not worth what he'd need to walk away. More years of guesswork and good money after bad is my expectation now.

 

[PeteBlade]

I'd imagine they have monthly management accounts though. Did they just file them away? Because they certainly didn't act on them.

Didn't our Finance Director quit?
Could this have been a cause/result?

 

[PeteBlade]

The first thing that occurred to me when I heard this was what Phipps said about how much has been put in over the past 2 years. It turned out this included money from the cup runs and from transfer fees, which is not investment by the owners.

On the other hand, McCabe has been in charge for 15 years, so perhaps 90 million is right. Mind you, he owns the stadium and other property and half the club. He's got something to show for his investment.

I lost all trust in the foreigners that bought a football club as a hobby and then got bored of their hobby once Phipps tried to pretend that money recouped from selling OUR players counted as THEIR investment.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Adkins is under orders to cut the size of the squad and I'm sure he understands the rationale. The club seem to be accruing losses of £1m per month so outgoings have to be reduced drastically.

The squad is only as good as it is despite the costs. Balancing the books will have to be achieved by players moving on and my instinct tells me that we'll have to gather some transfer fees in the process.

Only fresh investment will avoid selling one or two of our better players. Added to that there are a number of players who will move away next summer so their wages will be saved. However, how many good players will we be left with and how many new, relatively inexpensive players will Adkins have to integrate before next season?

There is absolutely no point in accruing losses of £1m per month without gaining promotion or at least making real progress with the quality of the squad. Achieving that and balancing the books is a huge challenge, an awesome challenge in fact.

The Board can only make plans for next season when they know which league we are in. At the beginning of the season Adkins said time and again that promotion this season was "imperative" and by the start of next season we will know why. Let's hope we squeeze up and increase the income side of the profit equation. What shape would we be in to play at the higher level though?

 

[PeteBlade]

What I read from his statement is:

• He's half admitting he's made some mistakes on managers
• Until someone else coughs up it's his money so if he wants to make mistakes it's his loss
• Him and the Prince still talk (but doesn't paint a rosy picture of their relationship)
• Fans have high expectations
• He's still covering the losses himself (along with the Prince)
• He's a Blade
• It's in his interest for things to improve on the pitch

Not really groundbreaking stuff is it?

What is doesn't give me is the confidence that they have a coherent plan to turn it around. He isn't going anywhere anytime soon as the Football Club is not worth what he'd need to walk away. More years of guesswork and good money after bad is my expectation now.

I reject, completely totally and utterly any suggestion that expecting this club to put together a credible promotion campaign from league one counts as 'high expectation'.

McCabe, Adkins or anyone else suggesting the fans here have 'high expectations' just make themselves look like daft pricks.

 

[Sothall_Blade]

Or answer the question I've posed many times "Who is the transfer committee ?"

The club have answered that one to be fair. The "new player contract negotiation specialist" Scheiber has really earned his money so far, hasn't he?

"David Green, previously chairman of United’s football board, will also chair the technical board which directs player recruitment. Manager Nigel Adkins and senior members of his coaching staff are represented on the panel, alongside new player contract negotiation specialist Carl Shieber. A Loughborough University Business School scholar with an MBA in football industries, Shieber acted as United’s head of football administration between 2010 and 2012 before spending 11 months as their head of group co-ordination. Adkins, together with chief scout Lee Turnbull, maintain full authority for identifying transfer targets."

Read more: http://www.sheffieldtelegraph.co.uk...y-changes-at-the-lane-1-7611521#ixzz40nNL0200

 

[Sean Thornton]

In your opinion is the £90M "put into the club over the years" figure correct?

Of that £90M, how much is still owed to him by the club and how much has he written off?

How much of the £90M has been spent on non-football items and properties like the Hotel and The Business Centre? How much could he still get back from these projects if he sold them?

If money was spent on say a gym in Essex which he then sold. Has he counted that in his £90M investment?

How about a Chinese Football Club or an Hungarian Football Club and surrounding land? Do they count towards the £90M he's put in?

I've already said it doesn't seem unreasonable, not that it's correct. I've also said I believe that's probably the total input but some loans have been repaid and you can see this by looking at the various accounts available.

There are net loans from related parties in the SULtd accounts of around £24m. Then there is £41m in SUFC Ltd.

You're confusing his investment with spending. His investments will be in Share Capital and Loans.

 

[Woodwardfan]

The first thing that occurred to me when I heard this was what Phipps said about how much has been put in over the past 2 years. It turned out this included money from the cup runs and from transfer fees, which is not investment by the owners.

On the other hand, McCabe has been in charge for 15 years, so perhaps 90 million is right. Mind you, he owns the stadium and other property and half the club. He's got something to show for his investment.

From memory Phipps quoted £25m of which £13m was from cup runs, transfer fees and the like. Net £12m at that time.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Adkins is under orders to cut the size of the squad and I'm sure he understands the rationale. The club seem to be accruing losses of £1m per month so outgoings have to be reduced drastically.

The squad is only as good as it is despite the costs. Balancing the books will have to be achieved by players moving on and my instinct tells me that we'll have to gather some transfer fees in the process.

Only fresh investment will avoid selling one or two of our better players. Added to that there are a number of players who will move away next summer so their wages will be saved. However, how many good players will we be left with and how many new, relatively inexpensive players will Adkins have to integrate before next season?

There is absolutely no point in accruing losses of £1m per month without gaining promotion or at least making real progress with the quality of the squad. Achieving that and balancing the books is a huge challenge, an awesome challenge in fact.

The Board can only make plans for next season when they know which league we are in. At the beginning of the season Adkins said time and again that promotion this season was "imperative" and by the start of next season we will know why. Let's hope we squeeze up and increase the income side of the profit equation. What shape would we be in to play at the higher level though?

My point was that we'd heard nothing about plans for getting us out of this division, this season or next. All we got was that investment would be there for the next level. How long have we been hearing that? Surely that investment availability diminishes the more we rack up big losses in L1?

 

[Alfreton14Blade]

"This statement is not proffered as an excuse but as a rational assessment in understanding some of the reasons for failure to date to meet our objectives in spite of applying best efforts coupled with major funding."

The only problem with that is that it includes nothing whatsoever in the way of rational assessment of how objectives have failed to be met. Just complaints about bad luck & self-justification.

And it doesn't even pretend to offer any rational assessment about how objectives might be met going forward. And other very big questions remain hanging. Will there be any money to spend this summer (once the clear-out occurs)? Will big sales (of Che Adams et al) continue to be necessary to offset losses? Will investment continue to be made by Abdullah (& Kevin?) to cover losses & to improve the playing squad?

Yes, Kevin McCabe's a nice man, he's a Blade, he's "sacrificed" a significant portion of his personal fortune (although, to offset this, he's advanced the interests of his property empire at the same time through his involvement with United - it hasn't all been losses). We get the personal story. But how about, just for once, leaving the personal stuff out of it, & just analysing things as a chairman. More important than what's gone wrong in the McCabe era (& far, far more important than whiny-voiced complaints about the unfairness of it all) are actual, rational plans for the future, both short- & longer-term. What are the plans? - how exactly do we put ourselves in the very best position to overcome "bad luck"?

 

[Sothall_Blade]

I've already said it doesn't seem unreasonable, not that it's correct. I've also said I believe that's probably the total input but some loans have been repaid and you can see this by looking at the various accounts available.

There are net loans from related parties in the SULtd accounts of around £24m. Then there is £41m in SUFC Ltd.

You're confusing his investment with spending. His investments will be in Share Capital and Loans.

Sorry if you've said it elsewhere as I've not ploughed through all the threads in detail.

The bottomline is that it's disingenuous for McCabe to say he's put in £90M if some of that has already been repaid to him.