Simon Moore

[grafikhaus]

Like much of comment on football from supporters, it's starts with 'what do I want to happen?' and then one constructs an argument to support why it should happen. The main thrust of the article is 'I want us to invest loads of money so that we're immediately challenging for promotion'. Yes, that would be nice but it's not very likely.

There was a lot about what we should do - spend loads of money, and a rough financial argument as to why - if we go up we'll be rich but very little consideration of how much we'd need to invest and what would happen if we don't go up. Talk of new investors or owners without considering that some owners are good and some are a fucking catastrophe.

This particularly annoyed me 'This isn’t the moment for faint hearts or eternal optimisim.' again, just completely failing to understand where we are right now, just a meaningless slogan. Almost as the comment about JOC, Coutts etc signing new contracts and saying 'but where would we be without them'. True, if half our first team get injured we might be in a bit of bother, like most clubs.

There's some good points in there but it's quite agenda-driven and just what I expected when I was reading the comments at the end of last season about back to back promotions coz Bassett did it. And again, another one saying the extent of Brentford's ambition is to stay in the championship. No it fucking isn't.

We're in interesting and unchartered waters, for sure. When Bassett took us up from the Third, straight through the second and into the top tier it was exhilarating for sure, but could it be done nowadays? The insane amounts of money being spent in football now would suggest not and it even leaves teams like Spurs looking in, enviously. I think they reached their zenith last season but - with Everton splashing the cash and selling Walker, a top six place for them is by no means assured.

But back to us. Huddersfield have gone up on a budget less than relegated Rotherham's, so miracles can happen. We all know that McCabe can't begin to match the riches of most teams currently in the Championship and that's not going to change. However what really worries me is that the 'powers-that-be' at the Lane could be setting their stall out to 'wait and see', 'this teams was good enough to smash Div. 3 last season, so let's give them all a chance', 'see how we're doing in January'.

If so, that's a recipe for disaster - both on and off the field and it will ensure that CW becomes pissed off and some of the crowd could well forget our exploits last season and turn on Wilder. We've got some money, don't wait until the roof is leaking before we spend it.

 

[Weasel]

Whereas your scintillating prose no doubt has them rocking in the aisles at your local hostelry, The Smug Critic? .

Your ( ) "boring" posts are actually quite, err, boring, you do realise that? However it does show that you are a two trick pony rather than one, here's me thinking the only interest you had was knocking McCabe whilst all the time you also feel superior to others.

We could carry on but there's some paint drying that needs watching so I'll leave you to it, Watch that heart rate, this sort of excitement seems to be a bit much for you.

Enjoy the paint sunshine.

 

[LJBlade]

We're in interesting and unchartered waters, for sure. When Bassett took us up from the Third, straight through the second and into the top tier it was exhilarating for sure, but could it be done nowadays? The insane amounts of money being spent in football now would suggest not and it even leaves teams like Spurs looking in, enviously. I think they reached their zenith last season but - with Everton splashing the cash and selling Walker, a top six place for them is by no means assured.

But back to us. Huddersfield have gone up on a budget less than relegated Rotherham's, so miracles can happen. We all know that McCabe can't begin to match the riches of most teams currently in the Championship and that's not going to change. However what really worries me is that the 'powers-that-be' at the Lane could be setting their stall out to 'wait and see', 'this teams was good enough to smash Div. 3 last season, so let's give them all a chance', 'see how we're doing in January'.

If so, that's a recipe for disaster - both on and off the field and it will ensure that CW becomes pissed off and some of the crowd could well forget our exploits last season and turn on Wilder. We've got some money, don't wait until the roof is leaking before we spend it.

So you think the board are ignoring Wilder's request to sign new players in the hope that our current players turn out good enough or are you suggesting Wilder is also a part of the 'wait and see' group?

 

[grafikhaus]

So you think the board are ignoring Wilder's request to sign new players in the hope that our current players turn out good enough or are you suggesting Wilder is also a part of the 'wait and see' group?

Almost certainly the former. 55 years of watching United have convinced me that we're destined to be 'one step forward, two steps backward'. Failing to give CW even a modicum of support (and no, I don't count our incomings so far) could see the best thing that's happened to us in years become disillusioned. And that would be a disaster on the scale of the Currie, Deane departures.

 

[Booker4]

No they aren't forgetting those players but are talking about current (by which I think they mean very recent) experience.

Your'e probably right but I don't see that as a problem. Its not whether they have current Championship experience that matters (Conor Sammon had that) but whether we have enough players capable of playing at the Championship now and I think we do, but only time will tell.

 

[Bartleby]

Your'e probably right but I don't see that as a problem. Its not whether they have current Championship experience that matters (Conor Sammon had that) but whether we have enough players capable of playing at the Championship now and I think we do, but only time will tell.

Yeah I've got really no idea how we will fare, but a lot of faith in the management to adapt to whatever happens. Interesting point in the article I thought about us being at a bit of a crossroads now in terms of bringing in players on higher wages that would upset the pay structure.

 

[LJBlade]

Almost certainly the former. 55 years of watching United have convinced me that we're destined to be 'one step forward, two steps backward'. Failing to give CW even a modicum of support (and no, I don't count our incomings so far) could see the best thing that's happened to us in years become disillusioned. And that would be a disaster on the scale of the Currie, Deane departures.

Why don't our incomings so far count?

 

[Maidenhead]

Re medial ligament damage or Wilder being unhappy? cuz one thing's for sure if I was Wilder and had been promised championship investment and seen us bank an unexpected additional 6m I'd be well pissed off at our transfer activity so far!

you always appear to be well pissed off so wouldn't really be much different there

 

[grafikhaus]

Why don't our incomings so far count?

I just don't see any as a 'statement of intent'.

 

[Dkc]

I just don't see any as a 'statement of intent'.

You mean "they didn't cost enough"

 

[LJBlade]

I just don't see any as a 'statement of intent'.

Why do they have to be a 'statement of intent'? If Wilder wanted those players then why is it a problem that we haven't spent loads of money on them?

None of the other players we've been linked with (Holmes, Leonard, Lundstram) could be seen as a statement of intent. How does that translate to the board not backing the manager or even ignoring his wishes, as you've suggested?

 

[N20 Blade]

We're in interesting and unchartered waters, for sure. When Bassett took us up from the Third, straight through the second and into the top tier it was exhilarating for sure, but could it be done nowadays? The insane amounts of money being spent in football now would suggest not and it even leaves teams like Spurs looking in, enviously. I think they reached their zenith last season but - with Everton splashing the cash and selling Walker, a top six place for them is by no means assured.

But back to us. Huddersfield have gone up on a budget less than relegated Rotherham's, so miracles can happen. We all know that McCabe can't begin to match the riches of most teams currently in the Championship and that's not going to change. However what really worries me is that the 'powers-that-be' at the Lane could be setting their stall out to 'wait and see', 'this teams was good enough to smash Div. 3 last season, so let's give them all a chance', 'see how we're doing in January'.

If so, that's a recipe for disaster - both on and off the field and it will ensure that CW becomes pissed off and some of the crowd could well forget our exploits last season and turn on Wilder. We've got some money, don't wait until the roof is leaking before we spend it.

Bassett had Deane, Agana and Tracey, limited experience playing in the 2nd tier to say the least but no matter; I'd confidently predict a top 2 finish if we could add them to our current squad. Perchance to dream.

 

[grafikhaus]

You mean "they didn't cost enough"

No, I mean they hardly set the pulse racing, do they?

 

[HeCanDoMagic]

I just don't see any as a 'statement of intent'.

Was Jake Wright a signing of intent last season?

 

[Westran]

Jeez, I never thought I'd nip over to Blades Mad for a more balanced read.

 

[LJBlade]

No, I mean they hardly set the pulse racing, do they?

But again, why does that matter. If they're the players Wilder wants you can't blame the board for going and getting them.

 

[Sean Thornton]

No, I mean they hardly set the pulse racing, do they?

Not signing someone has upped the heart rate of at least one member

Seriously though they are Wilders signings. I'm sure with a bigger budget they'd be better players -in theory - coming in. But the budget is what it is. I trust in Wilders judgement. The club not doing the deals he wants is a different matter.

 

[Maidenhead]

I subscribe to this too graf, it can make for a decent read if you're a committed Unitedite.

We may be about to enter a moment when one of our owners is out of his depth, and will clearly need to seek either new investment, or to off-load his shares onto a new owner. We're clearly struggling to match current wages and fees for Championship level players, and as much as I admire Wilder's insistence that there are decent players in Division 1 and 2 that can take that step up to the Championship, we're not capable of pursuing decent Championship players, so we fix our gaze on lower league players (many of whom I'm sure are good enough to become decent Championship players) in order to make a stab at surviving this season. I've no idea how we'll do this coming season, but I trust in Wilder's ability to get the maximum out of every player. As you can tell, I share the concerns of our friend from the blog.

One of our owners has been seeking new investment, and been willing to offload some or all his shares for a considerable time, but has been unable to find a suitably loaded buyer with the right motives and credentials.

Maybe someone on here could help him out?

 

[Maidenhead]

No, I mean they hardly set the pulse racing, do they?

unlike the days when Young and Finnieston set my pulse racing.

That turned out well, didn't it?

 

[1danewhitehouse]

We're in interesting and unchartered waters, for sure. When Bassett took us up from the Third, straight through the second and into the top tier it was exhilarating for sure, but could it be done nowadays? The insane amounts of money being spent in football now would suggest not and it even leaves teams like Spurs looking in, enviously. I think they reached their zenith last season but - with Everton splashing the cash and selling Walker, a top six place for them is by no means assured.

But back to us. Huddersfield have gone up on a budget less than relegated Rotherham's, so miracles can happen. We all know that McCabe can't begin to match the riches of most teams currently in the Championship and that's not going to change. However what really worries me is that the 'powers-that-be' at the Lane could be setting their stall out to 'wait and see', 'this teams was good enough to smash Div. 3 last season, so let's give them all a chance', 'see how we're doing in January'.

If so, that's a recipe for disaster - both on and off the field and it will ensure that CW becomes pissed off and some of the crowd could well forget our exploits last season and turn on Wilder. We've got some money, don't wait until the roof is leaking before we spend it.

Is there any substance in the claim that Udders' budget was less than Rotherhams?

Udders paid around £2.5 mil for a CB. Don't recall Rotherham spending anything like that on anyone.

 

[itsinyerblood]

One of our owners has been seeking new investment and willing to offload his shares for a considerable time but has been unable to find a suitably loaded buyer with the right motives and credentials.

Maybe someone on here could help him out?

I may be an innocent in these matters but I'd have thought that the best chance we'd have of attracting the type of significant investment we need would be to achieve promotion? And to secure a promotion place we'd need to have bought the type of players who could step up to the plate in the Premiership, so substantial figures whichever way you look at it. The Prince, or his minions, has suggested that once in the Premiership he'd be looking to sell his stake in the Blades. So our current owners aren't exactly committed to our future, which may explain their reticence to spend the types of money that an ambitious club needs if it's to make the types of moves that achieve promotion.

 

[Maidenhead]

I may be an innocent in these matters but I'd have thought that the best chance we'd have of attracting the type of significant investment we need would be to achieve promotion? And to secure a promotion place we'd need to have bought the type of players who could step up to the plate in the Premiership, so substantial figures whichever way you look at it. The Prince, or his minions, has suggested that once in the Premiership he'd be looking to sell his stake in the Blades. So our current owners aren't exactly committed to our future, which may explain their reticence to spend the types of money that an ambitious club needs if it's to make the types of moves that achieve promotion.

All very nice but our owners don't have the wherewithal to buy promotion.

Ever heard the song "we don't have a barrel of money"?

It's as true today as it was then, and Kevin McCabe would have sold out years ago to the right buyer.

 

[Dkc]

One of our owners has been seeking new investment, and been willing to offload some or all his shares for a considerable time, but has been unable to find a suitably loaded buyer with the right motives and credentials.

Maybe someone on here could help him out?

Princey or Kev? I'd have though Princey, as Kev would presumably want to retain control.

 

[itsinyerblood]

All very nice but our owners don't have the wherewithal to buy promotion.

Ever heard the song "we don't have a barrel of money"?

It's as true today as it was then.

Think that's what I said in my post. So until a sale is achieved we're left with McCabe and the Prince as benefactors. I think most supporters realise that neither have, or want to spend, the requisite money necessary to achieve promotion. So the probability remains that we'll do well to remain as a mid-table Championship side.

 

[Maidenhead]

Princey or Kev? I'd have though Princey, as Kev would presumably want to retain control.

Kev effectively sold half the club to the Prince on the promise of matched investment.

Probably another mistake with hindsight, but he has been saying for years that he would sell to a buyer better placed to take the club forward than himself but they must have the right motives and the wherewithal do deliver.

 

[Maidenhead]

Think that's what I said in my post. So until a sale is achieved we're left with McCabe and the Prince as benefactors. I think most supporters realise that neither have, or want to spend, the requisite money necessary to achieve promotion. So the probability remains that we'll do well to remain as a mid-table Championship side.

Sorry I thought you were having a pop at them for not putting enough in.

My point is that they can't, not that they won't.

 

[itsinyerblood]

Sorry I thought you were having a pop at them for not putting enough in.

My point is that they can't, not that they won't.

That's ok, crossed wires etc.

Life has changed in both the Championship and definitely the Premiership. As has been mentioned elsewhere, within the Premiership there are divisions within divisions, and if United manage to achieve promotion it will see us somewhere in the lower to middle rung. Of course the money that clubs earn from simply remaining in the Premiership is astronomical - as a recent example of what can happen, I believe that Crystal Palace have offered Wilfred Zaha £100K per week to remain at the club. That's what we'll have to confront. Are we equipped for this type of madness? You have to ask the question; what's the point of achieving promotion if you haven't planned in advance? I forget how much the teams who suffer relegation from the Premiership get as parachute payments, but we all know it's what separates the established clubs from the 'upstarts' who seek membership of their club. Of course I'm being unnecessarily cynical. Of course it's possible for a new club, or at least one of the lesser clubs, to achieve great things despite the wealth of the so-called top clubs. Attitude and application count for so much in my book, and in Wilder we have a great manager/motivator who will get the last drop out of his players..........so here we are, not particularly wealthy, but in relatively good shape. I like the look of our squad - of course a few more additions won't harm our chances - and I think we'll do ok this season. So, to use a worn out adage, ONWARD AND UPWARD! UTB!

 

[Maidenhead]

That's ok, crossed wires etc.

Life has changed in both the Championship and definitely the Premiership. As has been mentioned elsewhere, within the Premiership there are divisions within divisions, and if United manage to achieve promotion it will see us somewhere in the lower to middle rung. Of course the money that clubs earn from simply remaining in the Premiership is astronomical - as a recent example of what can happen, I believe that Crystal Palace have offered Wilfred Zaha £100K per week to remain at the club. That's what we'll have to confront. Are we equipped for this type of madness? You have to ask the question; what's the point of achieving promotion if you haven't planned in advance? I forget how much the teams who suffer relegation from the Premiership get as parachute payments, but we all know it's what separates the established clubs from the 'upstarts' who seek membership of their club. Of course I'm being unnecessarily cynical. Of course it's possible for a new club, or at least one of the lesser clubs, to achieve great thins despite the wealth of the so-called top clubs. Attitude and application count for so much in my book, and in Wilder we have a great manager/motivator who will get the last drop out of his players..........so here we are, not particularly wealthy, but in relatively good shape. I like the look of our squad - of course a few more additions won't harm our chances - and I think we'll do ok this season. So, to use a worn out adage, ONWARD AND UPWARD! UTB!

I agree with every word of that

 

[Silvio Morris]

And as bad as Simmo was he was not solely responsible for our previous relegation, the names Micky Adams and Nyron Nosworthy ring any bells.?[/QUOTE]
We more or less down before Adams came in

 

[Balham]

We more or less down before Adams came in

We were 4th bottom when Adams came in. His failure to win any of his first thirteen games in charge sealed our fate and the fact he did that while alienating our best players was inexcusable. Worst manager in the last 10 years (by a nose from Weir)