Premiership Quality

[bakeblade]

It's been the Premier LEAGUE since 2007. Saying Premiership will get you branded as a pig

To answer your question though. Our current squad that are good enough to be starters/squad players...

Starters
Baldock
Fleck (on form)
Basham
Brewster
Berge
Egan
Bogle
B. Davies
Gibbs-White
Ndiaye

Squad Players
A. Davies
Stevens
O'Connell (depending how he comes back - could go either way)
McBurnie
Sharp
Lowe
Norwood
Foderingham
Robinson
Osborn
Goode
RND
Gordon
Jebbison

That gives us these players that i'd be comfortable starting:

N/A
Baldock/Bogle - Basham - Egan - Davies - N/A
Berge - Fleck
Ndiaye - Brewster - GibbsWhite​

Which means we would need 6 or 7 good players

Realistically Bash would struggle and Fleck would definitely struggle. Davies and MGW are not our players and MGW would be out of our price range.
So we would be looking at 9 or 10 new starters, a massive rebuilding job.

 

[CPB]

We cross that bridge if it comes to it.

Sometimes players perform better as well a level up than in the champ.

It wasn't a fluke finishing 9th that season, flirting with europe was probably a bit of overachievement and of course no covid and I reckon we would have done too.

Last season exposed the frailties of the squad and as the season progressed the confidence of course dropped.

I would say that players capable of playing in the league above include: Egan, Bash, Baldock, Bogle, Fleck (If back on form) Berge and of course Gibbs White but he's not our player.
Other players within our squad could be useful too, the likes of N'Diaye, Norwood, RND, B.Osborn and I'd never discount Sharp either.

We would need some fresh impetus that's for sure and I feel it would be again a case of trying to attract best players from the Championship to make the step up, along with any top flight siginings or siginings from the continent to improve the squad. Realistically we would be odds on to drop back down, but you only need to stay up a few seasons for things to change the club. Brighton are starting to show this now too.

 

[Sheffsteel]

So, If United do get promoted this season, please let me know how many of the current squad you believe have the ability to perform at this level.

It's the same for most promoted clubs.

The Sky prize money rockets up from £7 million in the Championship to £110 million prize money PER SEASON.
It's a massive boost in finances, some promoted clubs prepare to be instantly relegated but regain promotion the following season with a much stronger squad. Promoted clubs CAN consolidate and stay up, if a small club like Burnley can do it, anyone can do it.

 

[gordoncharles]

Watching us defend for 90 minutes in the hope we nick a point doesn’t appeal to me at all. If we were financially stable I’d be happy to remain in this league, under the current ownership we can’t compete in the league above

I know this is a fairly popular view but I don't understand it, even after a lot of head scatching and picking out splinters.

The first aim in any season, accomplished a few weeks ago, is to at least maintain this level.

But if you want to remain in this league you're ruling out finishing in the top six, or at best, hoping we lose in the playoffs, and I don't really see what the advantage of that is supposed to be?

To answer the OP question, well, none of the players we have under contract. None. But then we didn't when we last went up. Without significant strengthening that we can't afford we'd be certain this time to come straight down but, so what?

If you can reconcile yourself to having a season where you lose more than half the games then at least we get the chance to mix it. Worst case? We start the following season at the level you prefer to be at. But the Championship isn't where our limit is so why settle? What's the point of it all if you don't even consider the prospect of any glory?

 

[jt64]

It hasn't been called the Premiership for 15 years.

And Bolton don't play at the Reebok but that's what it's being called

 

[Millhousesblade1889]

I know this is a fairly popular view but I don't understand it, even after a lot of head scatching and picking out splinters.

The first aim in any season, accomplished a few weeks ago, is to at least maintain this level.

But if you want to remain in this league you're ruling out finishing in the top six, or at best, hoping we lose in the playoffs, and I don't really see what the advantage of that is supposed to be?

To answer the OP question, well, none of the players we have under contract. None. But then we didn't when we last went up. Without significant strengthening that we can't afford we'd be certain this time to come straight down but, so what?

If you can reconcile yourself to having a season where you lose more than half the games then at least we get the chance to mix it. Worst case? We start the following season at the level you prefer to be at. But the Championship isn't where our limit is so why settle? What's the point of it all if you don't even consider the prospect of any glory?

I completely agree, I go into every game desperate for us to win & I'd be mortified if we had another failed trip to Wembley...I absolutely loved achieving promotion & that day vs Ipswich will live in my football memory forever, but the Premiership is such a step up for our players & I enjoy the occasional chilled viewing of us beating a lower-end team 3/4-0 plus turning up to every game with the expectation of winning as opposed to the hope of not losing.

 

[Houston_Blade]

They should bring in an option where you can forego your place in the PL and bank 50% of the TV money, the next best club then gets promoted and gets the other 50% TV money plus the prize money for league position and associated commercial revenue.

It would just be great to say to the PL "na, we're not arsed lads".

 

[Greystones Blade]

There was a suggestion years ago that the best way of creating a more fluid premier league AND spread the money around was to promote and relegate 8 teams each year. No play offs.

 

[JJBlade]

Watching us defend for 90 minutes in the hope we nick a point doesn’t appeal to me at all. If we were financially stable I’d be happy to remain in this league, under the current ownership we can’t compete in the league above

Sorry, but what a load of absolute bullshit
The only way to compete at a higher level is to play at a higher level.

The only way to get better ownership is to be playing at a higher level

The only way to improve the stadium, academy and training facilities is to play at the higher level

The reason we don't compete is because of the clubs obsession with signing players who have a history of not doing their jobs properly, whatever division they are playing in.

It's like we are the club to turn these mentally challenged fuckwits into world beaters, when in fact we are the worst club they could possibly be at because there is no stable plan for the club itself let alone having a plan in place to carry a bunch of moronic failures within the squad

 

[bonobo]

If we made Billy Sharp our first choice striker in the Prem, I suspect he would hit the 10 goal mark. Given what has gone before, how much do you think we would have to spend otherwise to guarantee that ?

 

[Northyorksblade]

So, If United do get promoted this season, please let me know how many of the current squad you believe have the ability to perform at this level.

Wes F, Sander, JOC, Egan, Bogle, Brewster, MGW(IF!! He becomes ours) Ndiaye, Jebbison, possibly Baldock and Jebbison

 

[Millhousesblade1889]

Sorry, but what a load of absolute bullshit
The only way to compete at a higher level is to play at a higher level.

The only way to get better ownership is to be playing at a higher level

The only way to improve the stadium, academy and training facilities is to play at the higher level

The reason we don't compete is because of the clubs obsession with signing players who have a history of not doing their jobs properly, whatever division they are playing in.

It's like we are the club to turn these mentally challenged fuckwits into world beaters, when in fact we are the worst club they could possibly be at because there is no stable plan for the club itself let alone having a plan in place to carry a bunch of moronic failures within the squad

I think you need to calm down a little bit, I agree with everything you've said, but we dont have the ownership or structure in place for longterm longevity in the Premiership. Our signings were wild in the in Premiership which is just as much Wilders fault, but I'm being honest I look at the 30 years I've followed United and my happiest memories are when we're challenging for promotion rather than fighting against relegation.

If we were taken over by someone that put a decent structure in place & you knew once we go up we'll have a plan in place to stay up then I'd be desperate for us to get back there.

 

[Swannyblade]

I think you need to calm down a little bit, I agree with everything you've said, but we dont have the ownership or structure in place for longterm longevity in the Premiership. Our signings were wild in the in Premiership which is just as much Wilders fault, but I'm being honest I look at the 30 years I've followed United and my happiest memories are when we're challenging for promotion rather than fighting against relegation.

If we were taken over by someone that put a decent structure in place & you knew once we go up we'll have a plan in place to stay up then I'd be desperate for us to get back there.

If your happiest times watching the Blades are when we're challenging for promotion, surely that's because the prize is promotion?...otherwise what are you excited about?
And surely, the financial rewards of promotion give us a better chance of putting in place a better structure or different ownership for long term longevity (as opposed to losing the parachute payments and having to sell half our squad at a knockdown price to survive).

 

[Millhousesblade1889]

If your happiest times watching the Blades are when we're challenging for promotion, surely that's because the prize is promotion?...otherwise what are you excited about?
And surely, the financial rewards of promotion give us a better chance of putting in place a better structure or different ownership for long term longevity (as opposed to losing the parachute payments and having to sell half our squad at a knockdown price to survive).

Read my posts above, I completely agree with the fact that what comes with winning games is promotion (obviously). I just wish that when we go up we could have a system in place to settle in the Premiership long-term because the Premiership is becoming a difficult beast to tackle & there's more wealth in there than ever.

We struggled massively to compete financially & that is in some ways unappealing knowing what's to come again. Like I said in the above posts though, of course, I want us to win every game we go into but sitting on the sofa last season watching us pinned in for 90 minutes and getting battered in most games wasn't an enjoyable experience.

The bigger issue though is if we stay in this league I think we're financially screwed. It's ok me sitting here saying I enjoy watching us winning games but that doesnt pay the players or the club. The only way we financially compete long-term is through promotion & a plan in place to stay there.

 

[Isaw Joeshaw]

About the same number that we had when we last went up ? Many thought we only had one or two.

As did many when Warnock got us promoted including me , yet in the very first match we gave as good as we got against Liverpool and were only denied 3 points by a shit decision .

Had it not been for Rob Hulse’s broken leg , the disgraceful behaviour of the authorities in respect of West Ham and Man Utd’s complicity on the final day and a number of other factors , that very ordinary squad would have comfortably avoided relegation.

The Premier League is not necessarily all it’s cracked up to be , as witnessed by the fact that Wilder’s equally ordinary squad not only finished 9th. but for long periods in some matches made the the likes of Spurs , Chelsea and Man U along with a number of others look very average to crap .

My view is that , should we get promoted ( which sadly is unlikely given the long term injuries to key players ) then the combination of our current management team together with two or three shrewd acquisitions will be enough to see us stay up and have some good times along the way .

 

[JJBlade]

Read my posts above, I completely agree with the fact that what comes with winning games is promotion (obviously). I just wish that when we go up we could have a system in place to settle in the Premiership long-term because the Premiership is becoming a difficult beast to tackle & there's more wealth in there than ever.

We struggled massively to compete financially & that is in some ways unappealing knowing what's to come again. Like I said in the above posts though, of course, I want us to win every game we go into but sitting on the sofa last season watching us pinned in for 90 minutes and getting battered in most games wasn't an enjoyable experience.

The bigger issue though is if we stay in this league I think we're financially screwed. It's ok me sitting here saying I enjoy watching us winning games but that doesnt pay the players or the club. The only way we financially compete long-term is through promotion & a plan in place to stay there.

Many clubs do very well from getting promoted.
And I don't mean getting up, and staying up.

Only 7-8 clubs can be fairly confident that they'll stay up each season

The rest are all walking a tightrope.
They are all a few injuries, suspensions and poor recruitment away from going down.

But Brighton, Watford, Fulham, Leicester, Southampton, West Brom, Palace, Burnley, Bournemouth, Norwich, Wolves, and even Newcastle have all been either a Premier League club, or a Premier League club in waiting as they got promoted again.

Norwich will almost certainly go down again, but I wouldn't bet against them going up again for the fourth time recently. It's no disgrace to go down, take stock and have another go at it next time.

And I also wouldn't bet against them one day having a season that puts our ninth place finish to shame, even if it is only a one off.

Did anybody doubt that Fulham would piss the League this season?

Did anybody doubt that Norwich would piss the League last season?

This is what we have to aim for, we have to be either a Premier League club or a club with one foot in the Premier League already if we go down

All aspects of the club will improve if we can at first become a bit of a yo yo club, I don't think any of our fans would mind one bit if we spent the next 10 years with five as a Premier League club and five being promoted as long as the infrastructure to move to the next level was being funded by it.

 

[Mumbo]

I know this is a fairly popular view but I don't understand it, even after a lot of head scatching and picking out splinters.

The first aim in any season, accomplished a few weeks ago, is to at least maintain this level.

But if you want to remain in this league you're ruling out finishing in the top six, or at best, hoping we lose in the playoffs, and I don't really see what the advantage of that is supposed to be?

To answer the OP question, well, none of the players we have under contract. None. But then we didn't when we last went up. Without significant strengthening that we can't afford we'd be certain this time to come straight down but, so what?

If you can reconcile yourself to having a season where you lose more than half the games then at least we get the chance to mix it. Worst case? We start the following season at the level you prefer to be at. But the Championship isn't where our limit is so why settle? What's the point of it all if you don't even consider the prospect of any glory?

We’ve had plenty of playoff failure or not even making the playoffs and even worse flirting with relegation down to Wednesday’s level and it sucks big time.
The top division is where we’ve spent most of our history and that’s where we need to be.

 

[ucandomagic]

Clubs like us have 2 sensible choices if we get promoted - play shit football to try to stay up or play the way we like, bank the cash and go down, happy, and repeat.

We tried to stay up and play decent football, but blowing the cash on second-tier or unproven talent like McB and Brew Dog just wastes the opportunity.

Our average position ever is about 23, and over 50 years is about 31. Unless we get new owners we just need to enjoy the golden moments.

Typically for us, we were locked out 2 years ago for some of the best of those moments!

Sheffield Club tonight, struggling to stay in Tier 8!
Magic.

 

[sportinguista in Warsaw]

There was a suggestion years ago that the best way of creating a more fluid premier league AND spread the money around was to promote and relegate 8 teams each year. No play offs.

That would be ace.
I’ve said for years divisions of 20 and 5 up 5 down would keep everyone involved til the end without the playoff having to exist.

 

[CornwallBlade]

It’s very easy to get sucked into the “Premiership Quality” hole. Many sides before have done it and Ourselves, Leeds and Brentford (currently) have shown that it’s possible to hold your own in the Premier league without blowing tonnes of money on so called quality. At least for a season. The problem comes when bringing in the next breed - budgets and sensible approach says go for lots of younger players, bring the squad age down and hopefully they’ll step up… rather than go for experience as experience costs more

Biggest issue any side going up will have is depth. Both in like for like replacements but also different players to change the way you play, the Plan B.

Of course established sides have both but they also have players that can change a game in an instant with a moment of brilliance. Those players cost more!

We’ve built ourselves over the past few years with graft, athletic players at their prime.

What’s happening to our squad now is that we have several players who’ve played with so much intensity over several years, couple of stop start seasons (covid, spells out of the side etc) and we’ve ended up with some injuries. We’ll have to move a few on in the summer regardless.

There are several players who are reaching or have reached their limits (in age or ability) so we’re in a rebuild phase with younger players brought in or coming through. We’re transitional at the moment.

This, it’s not just about ability in a winning formation and style. You have to have the calibre of player and coaches who can adapt. I got shot down for saying, during lockdown, that we’d been sussed and had no plan B. But that was exactly it,Wilder was out of his depth just like Fulham, West Brom, Norwich, now Watford and possibly Leeds. There’s a list of managers attached to all of those clubs who failed to cut it for more than a couple of seasons. Take my hat off to Dyche, Burnley would have been down years ago without him.

 

[CornwallBlade]

There was a suggestion years ago that the best way of creating a more fluid premier league AND spread the money around was to promote and relegate 8 teams each year. No play offs.

Absolutely. Playoffs are a farce designed screw money out the season, nothing fair about it. However, many say it keeps the season alive?
8 though? That would see some clubs going up and being more embarrassed than Norwich. To keep the money men happy, maybe better to have 2 straight up with 3rd and 4th straight into the playoff final. 2 down and a playoff for the last slot between the 3rd and 4th worst - that would at least give the thing a degree of balance , I fail to understand the fan attraction for Everton, Palace, Newcastle, Brighton etc. They are never going to challenge for anything other than an occasional win against a top 3 team. At least they’d have some excitement by escaping relegation in a final.

 

[CornwallBlade]

If your happiest times watching the Blades are when we're challenging for promotion, surely that's because the prize is promotion?...otherwise what are you excited about?
And surely, the financial rewards of promotion give us a better chance of putting in place a better structure or different ownership for long term longevity (as opposed to losing the parachute payments and having to sell half our squad at a knockdown price to survive).

I think he meant that he recognises that, institutionally, we have remained a small club that is out of our depth in the PL. Can’t see that changing without a massive change brought about by an owner with serious money to spend. That being so, be careful what you wish for. Absolutely cracked me up that the Newcastle fans were singing, “You’ll get Mike Ashley in the morning” to the Chelsea crowd

 

[CornwallBlade]

That would be ace.
I’ve said for years divisions of 20 and 5 up 5 down would keep everyone involved til the end without the playoff having to exist.

Good option

 

[GrunkyPeep]

If we went up I don't think I'd want to see the same level of spending as last time. It was great fun but I think this time we'd have to be more strategic with signings.

I'd much rather spend a significant chunk of money on infrastructure than players. Build up what we need to be successful off the pitch and then hold back the funds to be able to make a proper go if we get relegated.

 

[bonobo]

If we went up I don't think I'd want to see the same level of spending as last time. It was great fun but I think this time we'd have to be more strategic with signings.

I'd much rather spend a significant chunk of money on infrastructure than players. Build up what we need to be successful off the pitch and then hold back the funds to be able to make a proper go if we get relegated.

Agree, get that training ground sorted, build on success of U23s, see if we look at developing a modern scouting network closer to the Brentford model. If we make ourselves dependent on big signings coming off, we are never realistically going to be competitive.

 

[Houston_Blade]

we'd have to be more strategic with signings.

Like actually signing decent players for around the £20m mark?!

 

[Edinblade]

Bogle, Baldock, Basham, Egan, Berge... Brewster was starting to look a real player before his injury. A load of others would be "do a job" types.
We'd struggle without a lot of investment. Same as most promoted sides.

Only Berge out of that list comes close and even he will struggle.

 

[CaptainMorgans]

Only Berge out of that list comes close and even he will struggle.

I think those players have the potential. But they'd need to be surrounded by good, experienced players, not our current lot.

To be honest, it's starting to look some way off on current form and our run-in. Probably not worth concerning ourselves too much with it.

 

[FriethBlade]

If ungo up u have to sign the best Championship players hoping they can flourish in the league above and if not they should be good for another run at.promotion the next season.

Last 2 games for example, and I'm no scout, but you dont have to be to see that O'hare and Bowler would add massively to our attacking threat.

 

[Houston_Blade]

If ungo up u have to sign the best Championship players hoping they can flourish in the league above and if not they should be good for another run at.promotion the next season.

Last 2 games for example, and I'm no scout, but you dont have to be to see that O'hare and Bowler would add massively to our attacking threat.

The problem is that we did that by signing Callum Robinson and Luke Freeman and they turned out to be rubbish for us. Coveting the best players from other teams is fine, just accept that it might not always work.