Play the simple ball...

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Its not just a question of mixing it up, simple pass, then next time try something a little more intricate or the odd trick, the other basic we seem to lack is putting some pace on a pass, too often today, especially in the first half, the passes were rolled to their target
 



And how many times recently has this worked please?
Several. I assume you don’t want a full documented dossier on every time a piece of skill is or isn’t successful, but Gibbs-White and Ndiaye are pretty much our only exciting players. But sure, if you’d prefer Enda Stevens looking down the wing, turning back and knocking a safe pass to the keeper or simply hoofing it out for a throw then that’s your choice.
 
I do agree, but I can also understand if he doesn't want to pass to many of our players... Maybe things will change if we get our wingers so he has attacking threats to work with?
 
Respect your opinion but I thought Fleck was shocking. He finds 2 of their players to hide behind when our defenders need an outlet. Fleck just waddles around and then occasionally decides to make a burst with the ball before he disappears again for another 20 mins. Rinse and repeat.

The number of channel balls Davies played today because Fleck wasn’t available was awful.

It couldn’t possibly be that the opposition have done/did a very good screening job on Fleck rather than him hiding behind their players.
 
It quite simple really....Teams press us, whereas we don’t press teams at all.
And the players ain't good enough to play out of the press from the opposition. All they do is short pass to the nearest player who has already got a opposition player breathing down his neck, who then in turn gets rid with yet another short pass to yet another player that's pressured until a forward pass goes head height up to Billy or just a hopeful punt down the wing.
I think all the Championship teams have picked up on the fact all you have to do is press, work hard and keep their shape, and a point at minimum is what you'll get.
 
Its not just a question of mixing it up, simple pass, then next time try something a little more intricate or the odd trick, the other basic we seem to lack is putting some pace on a pass, too often today, especially in the first half, the passes were rolled to their target
this. He's a decent player but does need to mix iy up so we can retain possesion when it's not on.
 
And the players ain't good enough to play out of the press from the opposition. All they do is short pass to the nearest player who has already got a opposition player breathing down his neck, who then in turn gets rid with yet another short pass to yet another player that's pressured until a forward pass goes head height up to Billy or just a hopeful punt down the wing.
I think all the Championship teams have picked up on the fact all you have to do is press, work hard and keep their shape, and a point at minimum is what you'll get.
Absolutely bang on...We are one of the easiest teams to play against, and after the obligatory cautious start, it’s so annoying to see visiting teams grow in such confidence when they realise how easy it is to snuff out our threat.
 
Several. I assume you don’t want a full documented dossier on every time a piece of skill is or isn’t successful, but Gibbs-White and Ndiaye are pretty much our only exciting players. But sure, if you’d prefer Enda Stevens looking down the wing, turning back and knocking a safe pass to the keeper or simply hoofing it out for a throw then that’s your choice.
Resulting in how many goals recently exactly? Like everyone I want to see exciting and skilful football but what annoys the fuck out of of, is flicking the ball to the opposition regularly or trying to take on half the team and losing the ball.
Particularly when there are options to retain possession. No point having all the skills in the world if you gift the ball back the majority of times. If you want to be a smart arse and prepare me a dossier then crack on sweetheart.
 
One of the first things you're taught as a youngster. Morgan Gibbs-White is easily one of the most gifted players we've got, who clearly lacks this basic level of footballing knowledge
Agreed, Alongside Ndayie he needs to learn when is the right time, as opposed to trying something with every touch. We looked better once didsy startedholding it up and allowing the team to play 20-30 yards higher up the pitch.

It's not quite as irritating as my current pet hate, where a Centre mid drop 20 yards into a pocket of space to recieve a simple ball from the centre back only to then play a wall pass straight back to the centre half instead of turning into the mass of space behind them. Infuriating. This either leads to another 60 seconds of triangle play between the centre halfs and the goalie or if under pressure by this point a hoof up the pitch

The other frustration is when a wide centre back has it out wide with 30 yards in front of them. They hit a pass into feet of the wing back who is marked and has no choice other than to hit a ball striaght back to the 1st player. By this point the space is no longer there so he turns and passes it back to Egan or the goalie. Meanwhile the opposition are sitting comfortably in a strong defensive shape, thinking " yeah lads, build those possesion stats all you like" awaiting the chance to hit us on the break in a minute or two with two or three quick passes.
 
Resulting in how many goals recently exactly? Like everyone I want to see exciting and skilful football but what annoys the fuck out of of, is flicking the ball to the opposition regularly or trying to take on half the team and losing the ball.
Particularly when there are options to retain possession. No point having all the skills in the world if you gift the ball back the majority of times. If you want to be a smart arse and prepare me a dossier then crack on sweetheart.
Don't think anyone can argue that MGW and Ndiaye are the most skilful players, and perhaps we are expecting a little too much, both young and in Ndiaye's case first season in the league.

They will both learn, that doing the same thing, whatever it is, from a step over to a back heel, to cutting inside/outside, will be noticed, countered and blocked
 
Don't think anyone can argue that MGW and Ndiaye are the most skilful players, and perhaps we are expecting a little too much, both young and in Ndiaye's case first season in the league.

They will both learn, that doing the same thing, whatever it is, from a step over to a back heel, to cutting inside/outside, will be noticed, countered and blocked
Exactly this.
 
MGW and Ndiaye offer the only creativity in the side , granted doesn’t always come off and at times can be frustrating,
But without them we are so bloody predictable the current players that have got into this slow deliberate super safe I don’t want to be the one that lost possession mode , by the time the balls crossed the halfway line the opposition got 10 men behind the ball . We’re in a real rut with this style of play now & without a change in personnel we’re gonna be hamstrung by it ⚔️
 
MGW and Ndiaye offer the only creativity in the side , granted doesn’t always come off and at times can be frustrating,
But without them we are so bloody predictable the current players that have got into this slow deliberate super safe I don’t want to be the one that lost possession mode , by the time the balls crossed the halfway line the opposition got 10 men behind the ball . We’re in a real rut with this style of play now & without a change in personnel we’re gonna be hamstrung by it ⚔️
I think a lot of that is down to a lack of confidence, and players hiding from each other, no one looks capable of standing up for themselves, instead of putting the onus on someone else, making that first time cross or pass and shouting/questioning why the XxXxx! Aren't you on the end of it, they take the safe option, easy pass
 



I think a lot of that is down to a lack of confidence, and players hiding from each other, no one looks capable of standing up for themselves, instead of putting the onus on someone else, making that first time cross or pass and shouting/questioning why the XxXxx! Aren't you on the end of it, they take the safe option, easy pass
Agree 100%
 
Agree 100%
The obvious question is, other than replacing 6/7 or 8 players on the January window, something we can't afford, not to mention the monumental risk/chance they all gel, and all work.
How do you fix what's broken, CW, Hecky and Slav (so far) haven't managed to fix the collective mind set, lack of confidence etc
 
Resulting in how many goals recently exactly? Like everyone I want to see exciting and skilful football but what annoys the fuck out of of, is flicking the ball to the opposition regularly or trying to take on half the team and losing the ball.
Particularly when there are options to retain possession. No point having all the skills in the world if you gift the ball back the majority of times. If you want to be a smart arse and prepare me a dossier then crack on sweetheart.
What annoys the fuck out of me is when we play negative safe passes when we could play an attacking pass to, you know, actually try and create something.

Safely retaining possession is great and all but we’ve the highest average possession in the league and we’re 17th. That tells me that too much of that possession is keeping the ball for keeping the balls sake. Teams can easily deal with that.

For the record, Gibbs-White has contributed to 6 goals and Ndiaye 3.
 
That would be a more logical explanation than saying a player like Fleck hides behind the opposition every week
He makes zero effort to get in front of his marker, the throw ins for us yesterday being the biggest indicator of this but it happens in general play often as well.
 

Take the piss all you want, but every single other player on that pitch wouldn't have even seen the guy in space never mind attempt to find him, albeit unsuccessfully. He pulls that pass off and he's got acres of space and time and is facing the right way, rather have players taking a risk and trying that kind of thing than pass it back to the full back for the 863rd time.
 
I get the point that not everything he tries will always come off, but its about balance within the team not just the individual. If everything he tried came off he'd be playing for a top 6 side.

We regularly have 65% possession in games. Keeping the ball, or the simple pass is not the issue.

I'm not going to cross check, but i'm near enough certain there are fans complaining that we are boring and like watching paint dry who also arent happy with MGW trying to make things happen.

With the exception of a couple the whole squad play mostly with fear and take the easy or safe ball near enough every time. Baldock and Stevens are prime example, confidence is shot and faced with the opposition defender 1v1 turn bsck and recycle the ball.

MGW is a breathe of fresh air, seeing players trying to actively influence the game every time the ball is at their feet, never change fella.
 
Think the point is he tries something fancy and runs the ball out of play when there is absolutely no requirement to do that. Sometimes just do the basics. Yes, something clever can create a chance but I know exactly what the OP is talking about.

Didzy did something similar on the left. Instead of controlling the ball and laying it off, he tried some flash turn through his legs which just ran the ball out of play. Why? We're not auditioning to be the Harlem Globetrotters, we're aiming to be an effective team. If you want to do that at 3-0 then go for it, but at 0-0 at home and struggling, every attack needs to count. It could just peter out because your party piece that looked good in training in the week didn't come off. It's all far too blasé at the moment.

Maybe they're shitting themselves that if they did achieve something this season they'd all be without a job next season?
Achieve ?
Don't hold your breath 😉
 
Maybe they're shitting themselves that if they did achieve something this season they'd all be without a job next season?
I have though the same.. However, we get relegated they get another pay cut...

I'm guessing they think mid table will be reyt..
 
Clearing the ball I think, and it did the job perfectly
I believe it landed at their man in midfield. That's not a perfect clearance. If a player is facing the right way and puts it to their man in the middle of the park, questions would rightly be asked.
 
I believe it landed at their man in midfield. That's not a perfect clearance. If a player is facing the right way and puts it to their man in the middle of the park, questions would rightly be asked.

What would you have expected him to do differently in that situation? I'd have thought most other players would have chosen to head the ball clear, which wouldn't have taken it anywhere near as far away.
 



What would you have expected him to do differently in that situation? I'd have thought most other players would have chosen to head the ball clear, which wouldn't have taken it anywhere near as far away.
The easy ball is to his right towards our left for Hourihane and Fleck. That's not a particularly difficult ball to make.

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A more difficult ball would be to put it over the man in the "D" and out towards our Right Hand side towards Basham. This is dangerous as if he does get it wrong, it could easily fall to their man in the D. With MGW's ability though, I would expect him to be able to pull this pass off.

1637682105537.png

All his teammates bar Ndiaye and Hourihane (pretty much on line) are infront of him, so it's actually more a "hit-and-hope" kind of ball. The only way we can retain possession from that type of clearance is if Ndiaye wins the first ball in midfield. He didn't and they had possession again
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It looked good though so I guess that's all that matters

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