Newcastle and Berge

[Houston_Blade]

Bemused at the criticism, bordering on ridicule and abuse. Berge had an average game in his first start in months. Playing in a holding role in front of a new defence against a team that likes to counter attack , I'm sure he was instructed to not be too advanced. He didn't misplace many passes, didn't dominate, but more than held his own against some top class opponents. In the ratings section on this site he's got the team's highest scores, but his usual critics spotted all of the imperfections, and seem to take great joy in pointing out how poor he was and how little he's really worth. I'd put less emphasis on his running style, his transfer fee or the transfer rumours, because it seems to affect people's judgement.

Berge is not a world beater. He won't ever be great in the air, nor strong in the tackle. He won't tear up the Championship, or any other league. He's a decent footballer who can carry the ball and put more attacking players in good positions to create something. He is unusally fast for a big guy, but he's not tenacious. I look forward to seeing him in the same side as MGW and Ndiaye, and hopefully we'll see more of his good qualities pretty soon.

Good post, however it’s only a few months since people were saying we needed to hold out for £35m for him and that he’s far too good to play for little old Sheffield United.

The notion that people are stupid because they don’t think he’s amazing and can’t see his world beating qualities is the bit that I have an issue with.

This is not aimed at you by the way, but there are far too many Berge fanboys on this thread sticking up for him regardless of his actual output as a Sheffield United player (average at best in my opinion).

 

[Houston_Blade]

Precisely that. I was watching him closely yesterday and every time he got on the ball he was looking for the forward pass but the movement ahead of him was non existent. Even when he'd beaten his man, there were very limited options for him. I'm confident that we'll see the best of him in that holding role, with more creative players in front of him. A destroyer type in there next to him would certainly help too.

Not that closely, I saw a few occasions where he passed the ball to a teammate and put them under immediate pressure so that he didn’t get himself into any trouble.

 

[alcoblade]

Bemused at the criticism, bordering on ridicule and abuse. Berge had an average game in his first start in months. Playing in a holding role in front of a new defence against a team that likes to counter attack , I'm sure he was instructed to not be too advanced. He didn't misplace many passes, didn't dominate, but more than held his own against some top class opponents. In the ratings section on this site he's got the team's highest scores, but his usual critics spotted all of the imperfections, and seem to take great joy in pointing out how poor he was and how little he's really worth. I'd put less emphasis on his running style, his transfer fee or the transfer rumours, because it seems to affect people's judgement.

Berge is not a world beater. He won't ever be great in the air, nor strong in the tackle. He won't tear up the Championship, or any other league. He's a decent footballer who can carry the ball and put more attacking players in good positions to create something. He is unusally fast for a big guy, but he's not tenacious. I look forward to seeing him in the same side as MGW and Ndiaye, and hopefully we'll see more of his good qualities pretty soon.

All good points -but for £25m he really should tare up England’s division two.

If he’d come from the youth team we’d be slightly excited by the potential. Having paid a fee in excess of a few million poinds, we’d have grounds to be disappointed. At £25m he’s been a disaster so far ( as have McBurnie and Brewster).

None if that is his fault - but as said above, it’s the fanboys that turn the debate into ridicule, not those pointing out that he’s just been a really poor signing, so far.

 

[alcoblade]

Someone who speaks sense. Refreshing! There is so much more that what is seen on the pitch. Don’t get me wrong, results do matter.

Hmmm, more fans if the invisible stuff that nobody sees.

Let’s bring back Adkins and Hammond.

 

[Gaini Blade]

Are you a 20 million pound asset and have a possible higher sell on value? If not I'd probably not say anything to your boss

 

[Deadly_D'Jaffo]

I look forward to seeing him in the same side as MGW and Ndiaye,

I do not see a formation where Berge compliments MGW & Ndiaye. Playing Berge behind those players, with defensive responsibility, would be suicide.

 

[JJBlade]

All good points -but for £25m he really should tare up England’s division two.

If he’d come from the youth team we’d be slightly excited by the potential. Having paid a fee in excess of a few million poinds, we’d have grounds to be disappointed. At £25m he’s been a disaster so far ( as have McBurnie and Brewster).

None if that is his fault - but as said above, it’s the fanboys that turn the debate into ridicule, not those pointing out that he’s just been a really poor signing, so far.

He'll come good
Three months before his contract expires and we lose him for nowt

I wanted to keep him in the hope that somebody would become our manager that could get the best out of him
But that ain't happening, and he certainly isn't signing a new deal with us on threpence halfpenny a week, so we might as well sell him

And hopefully we've learned our lesson.......If it doesn't hoof, graft, kick, foul, run, spit and shout a lot, don't sign it.

 

[alcoblade]

He'll come good
Three months before his contract expires and we lose him for nowt

I wanted to keep him in the hope that somebody would become our manager that could get the best out of him
But that ain't happening, and he certainly isn't signing a new deal with us on threpence halfpenny a week, so we might as well sell him

And hopefully we've learned our lesson.......If it doesn't hoof, graft, kick, foul, run, spit and shout a lot, don't sign it.

Seriously, I think I've heard it all now. What a load shite that is - the ridiculous excuses just keep on mounting.

Berge is supposedly a top footballer, and we play a style (involving 3 different managers) through the middle where he has ample opportunity to influence games. The fact that he doesn't is entirely down to him.

Suggesting it's our "kick and rush" style that doesn't suit him is just more incredible Berge bullshit bingo.

 

[Bergen Blade]

All good points -but for £25m he really should tare up England’s division two.

If he’d come from the youth team we’d be slightly excited by the potential. Having paid a fee in excess of a few million poinds, we’d have grounds to be disappointed. At £25m he’s been a disaster so far ( as have McBurnie and Brewster).

None if that is his fault - but as said above, it’s the fanboys that turn the debate into ridicule, not those pointing out that he’s just been a really poor signing, so far.

When a player has signed for us I'm finished with his price tag. When I read other posters include that in their argument it warns me that they may not be assessing him objectively, maybe they've just lost hope.

The team hasn't done very well in Berge's time here. It's been a slide that he hasn't been able to arrest. But we've just made another managerial change and Berge is now fit. We've won four league games in a row, why not wait with the conclusions and see if Berge can be a part of that.

Things can change quickly in football. I'll translate something a Blackburn fan re-posted recently, his own tweet from January 2020: "I so want Brereton to succeed, but he's miles off. He looks like someone from the crowd being allowed to play. Poor touch, too slow, can't press. Really doesn't look good, sadly." I'm sure a lot of Rovers fans would get rid of him at that time. Brereton is now being linked to Real Madrid, Barcelona and Sevilla.

 

[Houston_Blade]

When a player has signed for us I'm finished with his price tag. When I read other posters include that in their argument it warns me that they may not be assessing him objectively, maybe they've just lost hope.

The team hasn't done very well in Berge's time here. It's been a slide that he hasn't been able to arrest. But we've just made another managerial change and Berge is now fit. We've won four league games in a row, why not wait with the conclusions and see if Berge can be a part of that.

Things can change quickly in football. I'll translate something a Blackburn fan re-posted recently, his own tweet from January 2020: "I so want Brereton to succeed, but he's miles off. He looks like someone from the crowd being allowed to play. Poor touch, too slow, can't press. Really doesn't look good, sadly." I'm sure a lot of Rovers fans would get rid of him at that time. Brereton is now being linked to Real Madrid, Barcelona and Sevilla.

That Brereton quote could apply to McBurnie now. Give it 2 years and Barca will be knocking.

 

[alcoblade]

When a player has signed for us I'm finished with his price tag. When I read other posters include that in their argument it warns me that they may not be assessing him objectively, maybe they've just lost hope.

The team hasn't done very well in Berge's time here. It's been a slide that he hasn't been able to arrest. But we've just made another managerial change and Berge is now fit. We've won four league games in a row, why not wait with the conclusions and see if Berge can be a part of that.

Things can change quickly in football. I'll translate something a Blackburn fan re-posted recently, his own tweet from January 2020: "I so want Brereton to succeed, but he's miles off. He looks like someone from the crowd being allowed to play. Poor touch, too slow, can't press. Really doesn't look good, sadly." I'm sure a lot of Rovers fans would get rid of him at that time. Brereton is now being linked to Real Madrid, Barcelona and Sevilla.

I think it’s wholly unrealistic to not judge a player against the amount you invested in him. But divide that value by ten - he’d still be disappointing and not influencing games enough to deserve a start a division below (and a gulf away from) where he was expected to excel.

I am not suggesting Berge won’t come good (as time moves on we’ve all got to doubt it more), or that there isn’t a decent player in there. I know my ability to spot that is quite poor. What I’m certain of his performance so far, for us, has been shite at worst and bang average at best.

As someone pointed about above, I don’t think there’s been a single performance where he’s impressed throughout - he’s just shown the odd glimpse of what we’re all desperate to see more of.

 

[CornwallBlade]

Good post, however it’s only a few months since people were saying we needed to hold out for £35m for him and that he’s far too good to play for little old Sheffield United.

The notion that people are stupid because they don’t think he’s amazing and can’t see his world beating qualities is the bit that I have an issue with.

This is not aimed at you by the way, but there are far too many Berge fanboys on this thread sticking up for him regardless of his actual output as a Sheffield United player (average at best in my opinion).

Nothing new there. We still have the McBurnie clappers saying he’s the answer and it’s everyone else’s fault he isn’t tearing the league up - although they’ve gone a bit quiet lately…….

 

[Revolution]

When a player has signed for us I'm finished with his price tag. When I read other posters include that in their argument it warns me that they may not be assessing him objectively, maybe they've just lost hope.

I find this ironic given you have form for championing Norwegian players who weren’t as good as you claimed - Erik Tonne springs to mind.

 

[Revolution]

Every time I see Berge get a decent amount of time on the pitch I'll see him do one or two things that make me perk up and think "Bloody hell, that was good", but I'm yet to see him actually have what I'd call a good game. I mean, something like close to a full game where you think he's been one of the most prominent players in it, or he's had an 8/10 performance. Not think about the time he waltzed past a couple, or when he shrugged off a defender with ease, but a solid overall performance as a midfielder getting involved in the game.

I'm not saying he's not got it in him, but I'm yet to see it. I wouldn't mind seeing him stay and I hope he lives up to the promise, but I'd feel almost nothing if we got a decent chunk of change for him.

This sums it up very well. Most games there’s a good run, and a good pass, and a good tackle, and…that’s it. Other than that he’s anonymous.

 

[blade67]

Good post, however it’s only a few months since people were saying we needed to hold out for £35m for him and that he’s far too good to play for little old Sheffield United.

The notion that people are stupid because they don’t think he’s amazing and can’t see his world beating qualities is the bit that I have an issue with.

This is not aimed at you by the way, but there are far too many Berge fanboys on this thread sticking up for him regardless of his actual output as a Sheffield United player (average at best in my opinion).

Indeed.

His highlights video showed him bossing players in the Belgian 1st divsion, and we've seen him do the same in isolated incidents whilst he's been here. I'd like to see him get some minutes under his belt and do well but it does irk somewhat to be told he's a top class player and that you have no idea about football if you can't see it. Based on what he's done for us so far, he needs to step in several areas of his game to have the carreer he wants.

 

[Alan Birchenall's hair]

A

Indeed.

His highlights video showed him bossing players in the Belgian 1st divsion, and we've seen him do the same in isolated incidents whilst he's been here. I'd like to see him get some minutes under his belt and do well but it does irk somewhat to be told he's a top class player and that you have no idea about football if you can't see it. Based on what he's done for us so far, he needs to step in several areas of his game to have the carreer he wants.

Apart from a couple of teams, the Belgian 1st div is not even up to Championship standard. It's a bit like Scotland really. And although they have a terrific national team, all the big names probably play abroad, or maybe some squad players play for Bruges or Anderlecht (I've surmised this, so if there is a stray squad player playing for
F.C. Sprouty Flems, I've no doubt I'll be informed). And F.C Sprouty Flems is where Berge will end up. Or in the Norwegian or Danish leagues or summat similar. If he had come through our youth team instead of costing £20m, he would be bracketed with Norrington-Davies etc. And no-one would even be discussing him......

 

[Stevo]

That Brereton quote could apply to McBurnie now. Give it 2 years and Barca will be knocking.

Is that Bar Ca, a new bar in Sheffield where he will be waiting tables??

 

[Houston_Blade]

Is that Bar Ca, a new bar in Sheffield where he will be waiting tables??

Waiting tables and scrapping with punters.

 

[SwitchBLADE Smiles]

All good points -but for £25m he really should tare up England’s division two.

Newcastle paid £40 million for Joelinton.
Liverpool paid £36 million for Salah.

The amount paid by a club should not reflect on the respective players performances IMO. Berge is very clearly, a very talented footballer & is a player (providing he’s happy to stick around) a player I’d like us to build a team around.

 

[JJBlade]

Seriously, I think I've heard it all now. What a load shite that is - the ridiculous excuses just keep on mounting.

Berge is supposedly a top footballer, and we play a style (involving 3 different managers) through the middle where he has ample opportunity to influence games. The fact that he doesn't is entirely down to him.

Suggesting it's our "kick and rush" style that doesn't suit him is just more incredible Berge bullshit bingo.

Look
Good players don't get along here,
Never have, never will

He might not be Lionel Messi, but he'll move somewhere else and automatically improve, as soon as he's out of the clutches of club retard.

He's too quiet to play for us, he doesn't get stuck in in a 1970's sort of way, so therefore he's crap

 

[CPB]

He's got talent although we haven't seen him do this enough.

I've said this before though and got shot down but he's basically never been able to get a proper run in the side, certainly not a settled side.
When he first joined he was fighting it out with Lundstram for the shirt, then covid hit and lockdowns.
Came back reasonably well in lockdown to end that season.

Season after was arguably our better midfielders, although not sure that said a massive amount last season. Pulled up injury vs. Man Utd pretty much out for season.

This season started the season under our new manager, got injured what less than 10 games in? Just come back again.

 

[JasonEllis]

When a player has signed for us I'm finished with his price tag. When I read other posters include that in their argument it warns me that they may not be assessing him objectively, maybe they've just lost hope.

The team hasn't done very well in Berge's time here. It's been a slide that he hasn't been able to arrest. But we've just made another managerial change and Berge is now fit. We've won four league games in a row, why not wait with the conclusions and see if Berge can be a part of that.

Things can change quickly in football. I'll translate something a Blackburn fan re-posted recently, his own tweet from January 2020: "I so want Brereton to succeed, but he's miles off. He looks like someone from the crowd being allowed to play. Poor touch, too slow, can't press. Really doesn't look good, sadly." I'm sure a lot of Rovers fans would get rid of him at that time. Brereton is now being linked to Real Madrid, Barcelona and Sevilla.

With all due respect, I think this statement is utterly bizarre. A player (or any other asset) has a value that has been given to it and a player costing x (and thereby generally suggesting a value at least in that range at the time of payment) would be expected to perform better than one worth less - I don't think it overly biased to consider this when an assessment is being made, as one assumes it is a commonly accepted view.

That being said, whilst I think Berge (to bring it back on topic) has yet to perform to the level I'd expect from the price we paid for him it is not to say that he never will (c.f. the statement being made about Brereton above with egg on face now). I hope he does, but it is the hope that kills you ...

 

[Deaneandagana]

Football & football players is/are notoriously difficult to predict, consider the following examples;

1. Mo Saleh & Kevin de Bruyne both bought by Chelsea both flopped, Saleh now being touted for world player of the year, KDB an outstanding & integral part of the English champions elect.

2. Ben Brereton Diaz - as already commented on in an earlier post.

3.Paul Coutts - I for one labelled him a wage thief under Clough / Adkins, but then Wilder got hold of him, he may, had it not been for Sordell, been an outstanding midfield player in the Premiership - possibly.

Now let’s consider Mcburnie & Berge, both disappointing flops - so far, but who’s to say what may happen?

 

[SwitchBLADE Smiles]

With all due respect, I think this statement is utterly bizarre. A player (or any other asset) has a value that has been given to it and a player costing x (and thereby generally suggesting a value at least in that range at the time of payment) would be expected to perform better than one worth less - I don't think it overly biased to consider this when an assessment is being made, as one assumes it is a commonly accepted view.

That being said, whilst I think Berge (to bring it back on topic) has yet to perform to the level I'd expect from the price we paid for him it is not to say that he never will (c.f. the statement being made about Brereton above with egg on face now). I hope he does, but it is the hope that kills you ...

This issue here is the players intrinsic value is always set by the selling club & the total price to be paid for any player will be determined as such.

We wanted him because the management team believed he would improve our midfield. Genk set a monetary value that we’d need to pay to obtain his services. How much that is, isn’t a determining value as to how well Berge should perform. The price a club pays for a player is quite literally how much the selling club want to release a player from his contract. Nothing else.

 

[Deadly_D'Jaffo]

He's too quiet to play for us, he doesn't get stuck in in a 1970's sort of way, so therefore he's crap

Sorry, but that's incorrect.

Was the Zidanes, Keanes, Gerrards, Vieiras, Scholes' et all all marvellous footballers simply because they 'got stuck in'? No, even contemporary flair players like Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar all have the desire to impose themselves on games. Berge simply doesn't possess this attribute (yet) and at the beginning of the season was constantly looking towards the ref with a sulked expression because opposing players were earning the right to play.

This kind of attitude in our fanbase, the one that esteem themselves as progressive because they don't think you need to be tenacious if you're technical, is sheer ignorance.

"Hard work beats talent if talent doesn't work hard"

 

[WF10BLADE]

Lets be fully honest here, if the Pigs had signed Berge for the amount of money we had, we would be laughing our bollocks off about it on the 'Wednesday' thread.

 

[Keen Blade]

That Brereton quote could apply to McBurnie now. Give it 2 years and Barca will be knocking.

The only people still knocking him will be Donnie Blade & me

 

[SouthportBlade]

This issue here is the players intrinsic value is always set by the selling club & the total price to be paid for any player will be determined as such.

We wanted him because the management team believed he would improve our midfield. Genk set a monetary value that we’d need to pay to obtain his services. How much that is, isn’t a determining value as to how well Berge should perform. The price a club pays for a player is quite literally how much the selling club want to release a player from his contract. Nothing else.

A million times this.

It doesn't help as a club we have rarely ventured into 10 figure fees, so these stand out.

Newcastle fans won't really care about how much Joelinton cost, just he's been naff. Fees are business matters, ability and performances are football matters.

On Berge, there are a fair amount of excuses/context/mitigating factors touted behind his performances (and much of the squad). This doesn't absolve Berge of responsibility, but to ignore them clearly doesn't give an accurate view of the situation.

I think everyone agrees, he's shown glimpses of his talent which if he applied consistently would put him head and shoulders above the rest of our squad. Fact of the matter is he hasn't shown this talent consistently enough in red and white.

Whilst I've said this before, now is his time to shine. New manager, bit of confidence in squad, decent results, coming back to full fitness.

Whether he fulfils his potential in red and white remains to be seen... But I'd love to see it, as the odd occasion when he glides past players with apparent ease is a fucking joy to watch.

 

[Keen Blade]

Lets be fully honest here, if the Pigs had signed Berge for the amount of money we had, we would be laughing our bollocks off about it on the 'Wednesday' thread.

Yeh but no but yeh but not as much as we'd be in convulsions about their signing of Brewster's Millions , McKnob , Moussefat , Burkey Whizz , Whacko Jacko Robbo , Luke Freeman etc etc

 

[Keen Blade]

Is that Bar Ca, a new bar in Sheffield where he will be waiting tables??

Too tall + nowhere near fast enough to be a waiter