Mentally weak

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Maurice Maurice

Maurice Maurice

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We ran out of lungs and legs half way through the first half today. We set off ok for about 10 minutes but as soon as they gained control it was game over. We were chasing shadows, making silly mistakes and our passing became woefully bad. Thankfully they were shite, they really were poor, and that helped us get to half time at 0 - 0.

Second half I thought we'd come out buzzing but no, same tired performance with no one wanting the ball, clueless when we did get it and it was pretty inevitable that their goal would come from us jogging and not running. We switched off and got caught out. Second goal, we're collectively thinking about the coach ride home by this point and forgot to defend. Terribly sloppy goal to give away but sums us up perfectly.

The players look mentally exhausted, and that affects the energy levels but for me, as a professional athlete that shows a real weakness of character. Winners step forward, they fight and they don't roll over. We have a squad that don't do that. They all laugh and joke and pose for the cameras at Shirecliffe, before climbing in their Premier League cars to drive home but when game time comes they hide. It's a good job the fans are made of sterner stuff, fucking excellent support today again. Shame the ones wearing the shirt don't have the same level of commitment.
 

If we believe the reports of a senior player approached Hecky before the season started saying the morale was on the floor, that is happening before the season starts. That is pretty fucked up even before we start getting hidings.

Winning creates momentum and positive energy where teams dig out results when the going gets tough. Losing consistently has the opposite effect. Togetherness disappears and some players say fuck this when the going gets tough.
Our biggest concern is once the rot has set in how do we turn that around next season. Let's just hope the correct deadwood is jettisoned.
Getting the mentality right throughout the club is the big challenge.
 
Mentally we aren’t at it certainly, we down tools far too easily. But physically we have a team in by far the worst condition in the league, championship teams would put us to shame in that department. Bright start, and as usual even if we went 2-0 up we still wouldn’t have had it in us to hold out. The players are out of their depth, everyone knows this, but what on earth were we doing in pre-season?
 
Maurice Maurice said:
We ran out of lungs and legs half way through the first half today. We set off ok for about 10 minutes but as soon as they gained control it was game over. We were chasing shadows, making silly mistakes and our passing became woefully bad. Thankfully they were shite, they really were poor, and that helped us get to half time at 0 - 0.

Second half I thought we'd come out buzzing but no, same tired performance with no one wanting the ball, clueless when we did get it and it was pretty inevitable that their goal would come from us jogging and not running. We switched off and got caught out. Second goal, we're collectively thinking about the coach ride home by this point and forgot to defend. Terribly sloppy goal to give away but sums us up perfectly.

The players look mentally exhausted, and that affects the energy levels but for me, as a professional athlete that shows a real weakness of character. Winners step forward, they fight and they don't roll over. We have a squad that don't do that. They all laugh and joke and pose for the cameras at Shirecliffe, before climbing in their Premier League cars to drive home but when game time comes they hide. It's a good job the fans are made of sterner stuff, fucking excellent support today again. Shame the ones wearing the shirt don't have the same level of commitment.
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We did look tired and lethargic, strange because we looked fine last week.
 
Nagima said:
If we believe the reports of a senior player approached Hecky before the season started saying the morale was on the floor, that is happening before the season starts. That is pretty fucked up even before we start getting hidings.

Winning creates momentum and positive energy where teams dig out results when the going gets tough. Losing consistently has the opposite effect. Togetherness disappears and some players say fuck this when the going gets tough.
Our biggest concern is once the rot has set in how do we turn that around next season. Let's just hope the correct deadwood is jettisoned.
Getting the mentality right throughout the club is the big challenge.
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Shows how mentally weak they were before a ball was kicked. Our mate Illy has left so we can't go on.
 
Bladesman said:
Shows how mentally weak they were before a ball was kicked. Our mate Illy has left so we can't go on.
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Is it not a bigger concern that months into the season, neither manage has managed to improve morale?

Shouldn’t we be wanting rid of those who can’t hack it rather than (some) constantly deriding the fact that 16 are out of contract. Surely it’s no surprise that both the players who aren’t good enough or are mentally weak need to be out?
 
If you're not strong enough as a team to hold the ball for more than 10 seconds without making a silly mistake - your're not good enough for this division - period.

I find it ridiculous that we have to resort to hoofball from the back. These players should be good enough to keep possession - and then they would not feel so knackered as they would not be chasing the ball for so long.

Its my one big problem with Wilder - he lets it happen.
 
Sean Thornton said:
Is it not a bigger concern that months into the season, neither manage has managed to improve morale?

Shouldn’t we be wanting rid of those who can’t hack it rather than (some) constantly deriding the fact that 16 are out of contract. Surely it’s no surprise that both the players who aren’t good enough or are mentally weak need to be out?
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Yep, I agree. Hecky, whilst a good football man and a nice bloke, doesn't come across as a leader of men. Wilder, sulky period apart, has proved over and over again that he's a decent motivator but with this squad, there's very little evidence that the players have the inner strength to buy into that.

If you could sack off 10 of this squad and replace them with half decent players but with a good attitude we'd be fine. Sounds simple, I just hope we go about doing it and doing it the right way.
 
Don't think its a mentality thing. We are overpowered every game and we can hardly string 3 passes together. Not sure how you can ever win a game with those two together
 
Maurice Maurice said:
It's noticeable that Robinson and Osborn have been out best players. Technically, probably way down the scale but they at least display some passion.
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You can train ball skills and do drills all you want, but you can’t train the mind

There’s a reason that Gary Neville had a better career than ravel Morrison

Players who give everything even though they aren’t the most gifted are some of the most appreciated by us - Whitehurst, booker, Morgan, geary, bash - were an easy bunch to please, just fuckin graft and show you give a fuck
 
This is the story of our season.

We aren’t fit enough for this division. We have some quality and can cope for 60 minutes and then we just collapse.

Will need addressing in summer.
 
Maurice Maurice said:
We ran out of lungs and legs half way through the first half today. We set off ok for about 10 minutes but as soon as they gained control it was game over. We were chasing shadows, making silly mistakes and our passing became woefully bad. Thankfully they were shite, they really were poor, and that helped us get to half time at 0 - 0.

Second half I thought we'd come out buzzing but no, same tired performance with no one wanting the ball, clueless when we did get it and it was pretty inevitable that their goal would come from us jogging and not running. We switched off and got caught out. Second goal, we're collectively thinking about the coach ride home by this point and forgot to defend. Terribly sloppy goal to give away but sums us up perfectly.

The players look mentally exhausted, and that affects the energy levels but for me, as a professional athlete that shows a real weakness of character. Winners step forward, they fight and they don't roll over. We have a squad that don't do that. They all laugh and joke and pose for the cameras at Shirecliffe, before climbing in their Premier League cars to drive home but when game time comes they hide. It's a good job the fans are made of sterner stuff, fucking excellent support today again. Shame the ones wearing the shirt don't have the same level of commitment.
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Must be just me but I thought we were more than holding our own up to Wilder's first sub at 57 minutes after that we just deteriorated imo
 
I think the main thing with mentality has been touched on by a few already. We're probably 20th in terms of team quality which, as the Premier league tries to stamp out any marginal gains that weaker teams benefit from, will show out in the end.

My concern is the capitulation after falling behind. There was 5 minutes between going behind today and the VAR disallowed goal. I haven't got examples but I feel some of the hammering have come after going 2 or 3 down within 10 minutes or so.

Surely even sunday league football tells you to keep it tight for 5 after a goal
 
Maurice Maurice said:
If you could sack off 10 of this squad and replace them with half decent players but with a good attitude we'd be fine. Sounds simple, I just hope we go about doing it and doing it the right way.
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Agreed with this, we are currently worse than a League 1 team playing a cup game against a PL team on an almost weekly basis. In that situation they have a team who are bang up for a game, we’ve not been bang up for a game all season.
 

Maurice Maurice said:
We ran out of lungs and legs half way through the first half today. We set off ok for about 10 minutes but as soon as they gained control it was game over. We were chasing shadows, making silly mistakes and our passing became woefully bad. Thankfully they were shite, they really were poor, and that helped us get to half time at 0 - 0.

Second half I thought we'd come out buzzing but no, same tired performance with no one wanting the ball, clueless when we did get it and it was pretty inevitable that their goal would come from us jogging and not running. We switched off and got caught out. Second goal, we're collectively thinking about the coach ride home by this point and forgot to defend. Terribly sloppy goal to give away but sums us up perfectly.

The players look mentally exhausted, and that affects the energy levels but for me, as a professional athlete that shows a real weakness of character. Winners step forward, they fight and they don't roll over. We have a squad that don't do that. They all laugh and joke and pose for the cameras at Shirecliffe, before climbing in their Premier League cars to drive home but when game time comes they hide. It's a good job the fans are made of sterner stuff, fucking excellent support today again. Shame the ones wearing the shirt don't have the same level of commitment.
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Don't want to derail the thread, but I think people are generally becoming more and more mentally weak.

I'm generalising of course but kids these days get too much too soon, and as a result don't understand the value of hard work, respect, discipline, and are soft as shit in the head.

Don't get me wrong I'm not speaking about real mental illnesses, which of course are very real and challenging, but I'm talking about a general reduction in the ability to be resilient.

I know I probably just sound like an old cunt looking back with rose tinted spectacles!
 
Sportbilly /Detroit Blade said:
I know I probably just sound like an old cunt looking back with rose tinted spectacles!
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Every generation will think this about subsequent generations but life for kids now is certainly different even to my generation (mid-80’s born). I’m sure my dad would say the same about my generation compared to his.

I’d hate being young now, social media, online dating and work prospects as well as housing and general cost of living for those starting out are shit. They have some things easy and the ‘lifer’ in terms of work will be few and far between.
 
You only need to look at recent games on this and we could have been well in it.

Wolves away, yes Larouci switched off but that is a game we should have won. We missed some excellent chances.

Bournemouth and Fulham were games any team worth their salt would have held on for.

That’s 7 points there for the taking without even trying.

Yesterday we should have got a point. Brereton-Diaz misses his big moment and then we get a fluke goal against. The second is Academic.

There is a fair argument that Chelsea should have been beaten too.

Teams that are not good enough probably all have similar hard luck stories but we could have been out of the bottom three with those games but in key moments we just don’t make the right decisions which is incredibly frustrating to watch.

I thought there was hope yesterday, even at half time. Win there, beat Burnley and sit there on 22 points with Everton and Forest still to play and a flaky Spurs last up.

But simply not good enough to take the opportunity.
 
I'm not surprised morale is low.

When you see Doyle, Ndiaye and Berge walk out the door, and Traore, Slimane and Larouci walk in, you know you've got no chance.

This season is a direct legacy of last season, and a consequence of a chairman who simply hasn't enough money to run the club properly.

The top two divisions need the chairman to be putting in money to be successful. Our Chairman isnt doing that. He managed to stave off relegation last season, and this seasons cash has levelled up last seasons deficit.

Let's hope he sells the club to someone who can afford to run it ASAP.
 
Maurice Maurice said:
We ran out of lungs and legs half way through the first half today. We set off ok for about 10 minutes but as soon as they gained control it was game over. We were chasing shadows, making silly mistakes and our passing became woefully bad. Thankfully they were shite, they really were poor, and that helped us get to half time at 0 - 0.

Second half I thought we'd come out buzzing but no, same tired performance with no one wanting the ball, clueless when we did get it and it was pretty inevitable that their goal would come from us jogging and not running. We switched off and got caught out. Second goal, we're collectively thinking about the coach ride home by this point and forgot to defend. Terribly sloppy goal to give away but sums us up perfectly.

The players look mentally exhausted, and that affects the energy levels but for me, as a professional athlete that shows a real weakness of character. Winners step forward, they fight and they don't roll over. We have a squad that don't do that. They all laugh and joke and pose for the cameras at Shirecliffe, before climbing in their Premier League cars to drive home but when game time comes they hide. It's a good job the fans are made of sterner stuff, fucking excellent support today again. Shame the ones wearing the shirt don't have the same level of commitment.
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You are right ! 0-8 ,06, and many 5's
Do I need to go on!.
Good teams would be Shell shocked after a few of those.We started with a cobbled together team and premiership being like it is punished us unmercilly.
Looking at the latest news we can reset and go again next season.Blame the Prince all you want ! At least we come out of this with no transfer embargo and just docked 2 points.
Just think where we would be if we had failed to win promotion.:
Big debts with no money to pay off these clubs,
We would have been in dire straights with possible big points deductions ! with the debts still to be paid meaning we would have ended up with relegation to div 1
Frightening fact!.
We now have the chance to go again with a chairman thankful he just got his fingers burnt.
I've referred before to the bear hug the Prince gave Heckie after beating WBA! the more we see of the situation we were in the more one realises how close to disaster we were.
The big gamble the Prince took to keep Ndiah &Berge carried us through ! Just don't like thinking too much about what could have happened.
 
A squad not good enough for this league makes it a huge uphill battle to start with but throw in a ridiculous injury record and appalling fitness/conditioning, and you've no chance.

Without points deductions we'd almost be gone already.

The mentality of the players has been poor too often although it can't be easy knowing you aren't good enough collectively and your fate is pretty much sealed.

I've literally no idea what awaits us next season. So many questions and unknowns currently.
 
Davalon said:
A squad not good enough for this league makes it a huge uphill battle to start with but throw in a ridiculous injury record and appalling fitness/conditioning, and you've no chance.

Without points deductions we'd almost be gone already.

The mentality of the players has been poor too often although it can't be easy knowing you aren't good enough collectively and your fate is pretty much sealed.

I've literally no idea what awaits us next season. So many questions and unknowns currently.
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Think our mentality went after Newcastle and Tottenham. Think those 2 games really finished us. Getting done 8-0 to a decent Newcastle side showed we are a million miles away. Then the Burnley game showed us we were a 2 man team in Ndiaye and Berge.

It’s not about blaming Hecky / Board / Players / Recruitment. But the mentality was always going to be destroyed after those games.

Hopefully a lot will leave so the hangover will be less. But the last few games have given us slim hope for next season.

I believe our squad will be stronger next season than this season. Removing a lot of deadwood and moving players on allows us to replace with fresh ideas and be better than this season.
 
Please someone point to the team that sells it's best player in pre season, loses 21 of 31, is often outclassed from minute one but knows will be on the backfoot from 65 minutes on when the opposition brings on at least 3 players who'd start for United and is full of players who have no idea where they'll be playing next season that has good morale and is mentally strong. Circumstances matter. Bad teams lose games and the mental scars accumulate.

21/22 team absolutely folded. Same players almost to a man from the 9th place season. Were they also weak?
 
I think it's a few things. Mentally the players were down before the season even started due to the sales and the 8-0 destroyed whatever was left of morale. We are also well out of our depth in terms of quality so we hardly ever have the ball, and when we do we usually give it away. This means we do more chasing than any team in the league. Then you have the fact that a lot of our players didn't have a pre season as they were either injured or brought in too late. Those that did have often been on the sidelines for months so fitness isn't where it should be at all.

It started before a ball had been kicked with morale and fitness and it's snowballed throughout the season thanks to the hammerings we've received and the injuries. We need a total reset akin to the one we had under Wilder in L1. He brought in JOC, Fleck, Duffy and Leon who all contributed on the pitch but were also strong characters.
 
Roygbiv said:
I think it's a few things. Mentally the players were down before the season even started due to the sales and the 8-0 destroyed whatever was left of morale. We are also well out of our depth in terms of quality so we hardly ever have the ball, and when we do we usually give it away. This means we do more chasing than any team in the league. Then you have the fact that a lot of our players didn't have a pre season as they were either injured or brought in too late. Those that did have often been on the sidelines for months so fitness isn't where it should be at all.

It started before a ball had been kicked with morale and fitness and it's snowballed throughout the season thanks to the hammerings we've received and the injuries. We need a total reset akin to the one we had under Wilder in L1. He brought in JOC, Fleck, Duffy and Leon who all contributed on the pitch but were also strong characters.
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Think it’s exactly that.

The next few signings we make need to be strong characters. They need to be the new set of players that are taking us to the next level and will be here for 3/4 years.

That means it’s not second options or cheap options.

We need a left sided centre midfielder for example we need someone in their prime or just coming into it. Someone who’s been around the block and knows what it takes to get towards the top of the division.

If we end up taking a loan as a luxury player then the other positions needs to be real leaders.

Wilder use to sign club captains, I think we are in desperate need of that approach again.
 
Certain players shouldn't have been signed and shouldn't be playing for us but there's no reason to think the pre existing players are mentally weak, they've proven otherwise. It'll be easier to judge the mentality when we're playing at the appropriate level. It'll still be a challenge mentally to bounce back so there's something to judge but it's a challenge far more within their control - so let's see. I expect us to be competitive in the top 6 from the start next season
 
steve26272 said:
You can train ball skills and do drills all you want, but you can’t train the mind

There’s a reason that Gary Neville had a better career than ravel Morrison

Players who give everything even though they aren’t the most gifted are some of the most appreciated by us - Whitehurst, booker, Morgan, geary, bash - were an easy bunch to please, just fuckin graft and show you give a fuck
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That is unless your name is Osborn. A player who always grafts, but still gets pelters for his efforts.
 
The fitness or should I say lack of fitness is the one for me that is unforgivable..we knew that we were gonna be playing sides technically better than us & would be out of possession for long periods of games if anything you’d expected us compensating this on this fitness side ? But we’re nowhere near ! What in fucks name did they do in pre-season ? And I think that’s reason we concede too many late goals
Mentally we are very fragile & that’s built up from the several hammerings we’ve had this season , theirs a distinct lack of leaders out there ( albeit Robbo ) and it shows as soon as we concede they all look at the floor & and walk back for the centre.
This coming pre season is going to be the biggest in years & we really do need to shift some of the deadwood and recruit to address our shortfalls .. is Wilder the man to do this .. i don’t know ? Get this wrong & god help us ⚔️
 

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