Outgoing? Max Lowe (not to Florist)

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Vass Borbokis said:
They've just done the exact same thing with Zinckernagel, he was on loan at Forest last year and was quite a key part of their side (45 apps).
Officially signed for Olympiacos today for 1.8 million.
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They can only have 2 premiership loans so signing players to Olympiacos gives them the option of more loans in their match-day squad. Clever business i suppose.
 

Millhousesblade1889 said:
They can only have 2 premiership loans so signing players to Olympiacos gives them the option of more loans in their match-day squad. Clever business i suppose.
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Access to more loan players makes a lot more sense than trying to ‘trick’ a team into selling a player cheaper than they value them at.
 
LJBlade said:
I’d also be extremely surprised if that’s what they’re trying. It makes no sense.
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Maybe but it’s reasonable to assume we’d ask for less from Olympiacos than a prem club as they have less incoming cash. However I agree given the links to Forest we won’t do on this occasion.
 
Yogi said:
Maybe but it’s reasonable to assume we’d ask for less from Olympiacos than a prem club as they have less incoming cash. However I agree given the links to Forest we won’t do on this occasion.
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I don’t think that’s reasonable at all. Why would you sell players cheaply just because the buying club can only afford to spend less? Happy to agree to disagree though 🙂
 
LJBlade said:
I don’t think that’s reasonable at all. Why would you sell players cheaply just because the buying club can only afford to spend less? Happy to agree to disagree though 🙂
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I think there’s a degree of a prem tax so we might have a fee we’d accept for a player but if the club or clubs interested were prem teams we might ask for a couple of million more because you know they’re flush with cash every year.
 
It's likely an FFP workaround: NTFC need to sign several players, and their total spend will be reduced if some of those players come on loan from Olympiacos.
 
Yogi said:
I think there’s a degree of a prem tax so we might have a fee we’d accept for a player but if the club or clubs interested were prem teams we might ask for a couple of million more because you know they’re flush with cash every year.
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I think if we want £Xm for him, that’s the price we do business at, whoever we sell him to. I could see the logic of selling him cheaper if the only other option was sell him to a direct rival but how could we genuinely accept say £3m from a Greek club but tell Forest we want £5m? Particularly if Lowe would prefer to move to Forest. We’d look like proper dicks and he’d be justified in downing tools and forcing a move.
 
Kanye said:
It's likely an FFP workaround: NTFC need to sign several players, and their total spend will be reduced if some of those players come on loan from Olympiacos.
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Doesn’t FFP apply in Greece? I thought it was imposed by UEFA or FIFA.
 
BushBlade said:
Doesn’t FFP apply in Greece? I thought it was imposed by UEFA or FIFA.
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Yes, of course, but Olympiacos and Forest would be regarded as entirely separate entities, with separate accounts, despite having the same owner.

Olympiacos have won the league 3 years running, and 8 out of the last 10 - they don't need to stretch the FFP rules in order to be successful, as they're a big fish in a not so competitive pond.

The owner can afford to use Olympiacos as a means to purchase players on behalf of Forest, and send them on loan to Nottingham, without doing too much harm to Olympiacos' dominance. (While conveniently circumventing Forest's need to use their transfer budget to acquire players.)

If Forest are able to consolidate in the PL, I'd expect the flow of players to gradually go the other way: with Forest using Olympiacos as a place to send players not quite yet up for PL football.

All conjecture of course, but that seems the most logical reason why Olympiacos are interested in players who were previously on loan at Forest.
 
BushBlade said:
I think if we want £Xm for him, that’s the price we do business at, whoever we sell him to. I could see the logic of selling him cheaper if the only other option was sell him to a direct rival but how could we genuinely accept say £3m from a Greek club but tell Forest we want £5m? Particularly if Lowe would prefer to move to Forest. We’d look like proper dicks and he’d be justified in downing tools and forcing a move.
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I suspect the opening negotiation position for us is considerably higher when it's a PL team on the other side, even if the acceptable figure remains the same, the target being to achieve more than our valuation. Particularly Forest, we'll remember what they did with Matty Cash.
 
There’s clearly some benefit to them doing it, and sounds very dodgy to me.

Id be inclined to stick an extra million on the Olympiacos price!
If their owner doesn’t want to pay the prices we want for him then he played for us. It really is that simple
 

I saw all I neeEd to see in the 2 games he played under Wilderrrr

Dont care if he was first choice for a promotion outfit and is wanted by the Greek champions he isn’t good enough

Id stick with Rhys-No end product-Davies
 
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FallowfieldBlade said:
I saw all I neeEd to see in the 2 games he played under Wilderrrr

Dont care if he was first choice for a promotion outfit and is wanted by the Greek champions he isn’t good enough

Id stick with Rhys-No end product-Davies
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No end product….the same person that begs for McBurnie to play every week who hasn’t scored a league goes for over a season
 
Seems like Forest are signing Omar Richards for €10m. Doesn't that rule out a move for Lowe?
 
Wizard said:
Seems like Forest are signing Omar Richards for €10m. Doesn't that rule out a move for Lowe?
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Yet they were quibbling over 5m for Lowe.

He's basically a Reading player. I don't see how he is worth the same as, never mind twice what Lowe is.

Similar age. He's played his English football for worse teams than Lowe has and at a lower level. I.e. Reading, only Championship.

He's got about as much claim as being a bone fide Bayern player as Ampadu has as being a Chelsea one.

I see they're all falling for the Rhian Brewster gambit in spunking 16m on Neco Williams, Liverpool's now 3rd choice right back. Another massively inflated fee just because he happens to have worn Liverpool's shirt when they had nobody else to pick.
 
Champagneblade said:
Yet they were quibbling over 5m for Lowe.

He's basically a Reading player. I don't see how he is worth the same as, never mind twice what Lowe is.

Similar age. He's played his English football for worse teams than Lowe has and at a lower level. I.e. Reading, only Championship.

He's got about as much claim as being a bone fide Bayern player as Ampadu has as being a Chelsea one.

I see they're all falling for the Rhian Brewster gambit in spunking 16m on Neco Williams, Liverpool's now 3rd choice right back. Another massively inflated fee just because he happens to have worn Liverpool's shirt when they had nobody else to pick.
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Liverpool fans can’t believe the price but some of these players look good for them because they are so incredibly well drilled into a system by Klopp. Outside of that they can look distinctly average. Williams is a very average defender and that is what he will be doing most of the time at Forest, defending .
 
Champagneblade said:
Yet they were quibbling over 5m for Lowe.

He's basically a Reading player. I don't see how he is worth the same as, never mind twice what Lowe is.

Similar age. He's played his English football for worse teams than Lowe has and at a lower level. I.e. Reading, only Championship.

He's got about as much claim as being a bone fide Bayern player as Ampadu has as being a Chelsea one.

I see they're all falling for the Rhian Brewster gambit in spunking 16m on Neco Williams, Liverpool's now 3rd choice right back. Another massively inflated fee just because he happens to have worn Liverpool's shirt when they had nobody else to pick.
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The striker they’ve signed looks good on paper but the Bundesliga seems to favour strikers. It can take them a while to get up to speed with the PL, look at Weghorst at Burnley. Great record in the Bundesliga.
 
CopenhagenBlade said:
Liverpool fans can’t believe the price but some of these players look good for them because they are so incredibly well drilled into a system by Klopp. Outside of that they can look distinctly average. Williams is a very average defender and that is what he will be doing most of the time at Forest, defending .
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Totally agree. Plus you surround yourself with enough World Class players and someone who can do the basics well enough won't look out of place.

So far on their recruitment I reckon:
  • Hendo slight upgrade on Samba if not too scarred by recent experience.
  • Williams quite a big come down from Spence who was arguably their main outlet.
  • Richards. No better than Lowe and twice the price.
  • the centre halves from France/Germany, potentially better than what they have but may take time. Will they get it?
  • no replacement for Garner yet
  • no replacement for Zinkenargal yet. Won't get MGW now more established clubs are in such as Everton and even Palace. Plus not clear what Wolves want to do.
  • Taiewo might be ok but not played a single first team game in England and will do well to give the presence Davis did. Scored 15 in 31 last year but patchy before that.

Spent 60-65m treading water from last season net/net and a big gap in the middle of the park still.

Giving it a bit of a go though. Expected for any team that's been out of it for so long, twice as long as we were.

Just shows how difficult it is. We own our players and we'd need plenty of investment still. You borrow half a team and you borrow well like Forest did and you'll be 100m down just getting to the level that got you up and there is no saying the team that only got you 4th in the Championship is enough to get you 17th in the Premier League.
 
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Champagneblade said:
Totally agree. Plus you surround yourself with enough World Class players and someone who can do the basics well enough won't look out of place.

So far on their recruitment I reckon:
  • Hendo slight upgrade on Samba if not too scarred by recent experience.
  • Williams quite a big come down from Spence who was arguably their main outlet.
  • Richards. No better than Lowe and twice the price.
  • the centre halves from France/Germany, potentially better than what they have but may take time. Will they get it?
  • no replacement for Garner yet
  • no replacement for Zinkenargal yet. Won't get MGW now more established clubs are in such as Everton and even Palace. Plus not clear what Wolves want to do.
  • Taiewo might be ok but not played a single first team game in England and will do well to give the presence Davis did. Scored 15 in 31 last year but patchy before that.

Spent 60-65m treading water from last season net/net and a big gap in the middle of the park still.

Giving it a bit of a go though. Expected for any team that's been out of it for so long, twice as long as we were.

Just shows how difficult it is. We own our players and we'd need plenty of investment still. You borrow half a team and you borrow well like Forest did and you'll be 100m down just getting to the level that got you up and there is no saying the team that only got you 4th in the Championship is enough to get you 17th in the Premier League.
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Henderson is a huge upgrade on Samba, as is Richards to Lowe. Let's not be silly.
The centre forward they've signed from the Bundesliga also looks the real deal and they got him at a good price.
Zinckernagel will come in via the Olympiakos back door, he's signed for them for £1.8m I believe.
Agree, a replacement needed for Garner but it's still very early in the window.
If they sign MGW they'll be building a very good young side.
 
CaptainMorgans said:
Henderson is a huge upgrade on Samba, as is Richards to Lowe. Let's not be silly.
The centre forward they've signed from the Bundesliga also looks the real deal and they got him at a good price.
Zinckernagel will come in via the Olympiakos back door, he's signed for them for £1.8m I believe.
Agree, a replacement needed for Garner but it's still very early in the window.
If they sign MGW they'll be building a very good young side.
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I don't think it is silly regarding Lowe/Richards. What makes you so confident on Richards? He's played for Reading and Bayern Reserves. As I mentioned he's started one senior league game all season. All about opinions but Lowe had a lot more worthwhile season.

Lowe's recent experience is Premier League bit part player and Championship promotion season. Richards is Championship struggle with Reading and Bayern's stiffs. I remember when he went there people were surprised. They're shipping him off in no time.

I'd almost agree on Hendo but he hasn't enhanced his rep with Man U. He's coming in after an unstable 2 years, whereas Samba is leaving on a high. It will be interesting how Hendo is. He's behind Rammers in the England reckoning and I never thought I'd be saying that!
 

They have spent a lot of money, but I wouldn't back them to finish 17th
 
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