Lundstram contract

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It wouldn’t surprise me one iota if it were true, and I don’t think it’s rumour spreading for rumour spreadings sake. If you look at who the tweeter tweets with, it’s not impossible that there is a factual basis.

As a generality, that’s the reality of modern top level football, and it’s something that we will need to adapt to rapidly, because wage inflation and resultant player retention, is one of, if not the, most important issues that we’ll face in the short term. I suspect that certain players will expect a tenfold wage increase (at least) from what they were on in L1.

Without stating the obvious, the strength of Lunny’s position is that in any negotiation with another club, they aren’t paying a transfer fee, so sticking another £20k a week on a deal over 3 yrs is still good value. That enables a team of the level of a Burnley to easily blow us out of the water wage wise.
 
I think the key word regards our players is “over achievement”.

Every single pundit, expert, neutral, fans of other clubs say we are over achieving.
What they mean is that using facts and logic.....most of our players are Championship standard who are having a flukey/ extraordinary few months.
Individually they aren’t anything special but the team is better than the sum of its parts.....the majority view is Wilder is a special manager turning average players into a fantastically well drilled, hardworking team where our players are all being played to their strengths,

Still think the jury is out regards the base of our level our players.
Are they all proven good standard PL players or players performing well above their levels?

I think we need to be very very careful thinking we’ve arrived and all of a sudden our league 1 players have turned in PL class players in record time.
They need to be given pay rises based on this years achievements but we still need to keep control and make salary increases performance related.

Take Mark Duffy.... all the facts and logic showed he was upper league 1 standard.
However for us he turned into a classy David Silva type player worthy of a big contract....if he had been younger he’d have received a big pay rise.
He goes to loan to Stoke...we’re convinced he‘ll be a great addition for Stoke....but their fans says he’s crap and he’s quickly reverted back down to league 1 standard.

I’ve said this before but it wouldn’t surprise me if Lunny turns into another Mark Duffy scenario.
He knows he’s living the dream and his agent sees a massive opportunity to earn a massive contract whilst his stock is so high.
I can see him signing for another club (like a West Ham) on £50K/week.....then he loses his desire and hardly plays....their fans can’t believe how average he is.
Lunny then ends his career at lower Championship level achieving very little in the game......apart from being a very wealthy man.

Another example is Leon Clarke....he’s been high league 1 standard all his career.
Then near the end of his contract with us he‘s brilliant and has a 6 month spell playing at upper Championship standard.
So we give him a big pay rise and contract extension......he’s now reverted back to his base league 1 level....so it looks like we’ve overpaid to keep him.
 
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Nicolaus_Copernicus said:
It wouldn’t surprise me one iota if it were true, and I don’t think it’s rumour spreading for rumour spreadings sake. If you look at who the tweeter tweets with, it’s not impossible that there is a factual basis.

As a generality, that’s the reality of modern top level football, and it’s something that we will need to adapt to rapidly, because wage inflation and resultant player retention, is one of, if not the, most important issues that we’ll face in the short term. I suspect that certain players will expect a tenfold wage increase (at least) from what they were on in L1.

Without stating the obvious, the strength of Lunny’s position is that in any negotiation with another club, they aren’t paying a transfer fee, so sticking another £20k a week on a deal over 3 yrs is still good value. That enables a team of the level of a Burnley to easily blow us out of the water wage wise.
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Why wouldn’t they be paying a transfer fee when we have an option on his contract?
 
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Whatever he's asking for we have the option of another year and probably paying him a fraction of what he's asking
I would guess that's why the negotiation is taking so long ,united hold all the cards and if the player signals his intention to leave will make a massive profit on a player who cost 400,000 pounds from.oxford and in my opinion would struggle to fit in most other teams in the prem and upper championship
I think the system fits him like a glove and if the worst comes to the worst we will make at least twenty times profit on him maybe as high as fourty times what we paid for him certainly enough for a squad player to replace him
 
BushBlade said:
Why wouldn’t they be paying a transfer fee when we have an option on his contract?
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Apologies, I'd not realised that we'd taken up the option. If we have then there's obviously a fee, albeit a reduced one.

He also appears to be represented by the same agency as Duffy; Wassermans.
 
My view on Lunny is that he’s a midfield version of Chris Bashsm.

Basham has been used as a centre half in a 2 and he‘s decent but not quite good enough (high league 1 standard)
Basham has been used as a right back and again he‘s decent but not quite good enough (high league 1 standard)
Bash has a fantastic engine and good allround game so he‘s been used as a midfielder, again decent but upper league 1 standard.
Wilder has recognised that Basham is Mr Versatile but instead of playing a player in a static position.
He plays Bash as a central defender (in a 3 so he has Egan covering his mistakes), then Bash is asked to cover Baldock’s mistakes when he’s caught out of position up field and finally Bash is also encouraged to push into midfield giving us extra numbers. So Bash looks a top player in our system.

I‘ve noticed that the big strength of Lunny is that (like Bash) he‘s really versatile and also has a great engine.
We’ve tried Lunny as a defensive midfielder, he‘s decent without the ball but not as good as Besic.
We’ve tried Lunny as an attacking midfielder...again he’s decent but not as good as Fleck.
The massive strength of Lundstram is his energy....he’s good (but not great) at everything..
Wilder asks him to play as defensive mid and attacking mid...all within the same match...Lunny is also capable of scoring goals too.
It’s the way he’s being used thats making him so effective....another point is Lunny has only performed well for 4 months......so the jury is still out for me.
Lets see how he performs in the 2nd half of this season....suspect he’ll often be sub....but he still needs to perform and show the right attitude.
 
Kozzy_is_my_Dad said:
I'd get it signed, Lunny. Chris has shown he won't hang about, and the Prince has shown that he'll spend to improve. We could be on to sumat special here and you'll want to be a part of it.
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I get the feeling that he's not that desperate.

Maybe him and his agent know better than us what other offers are available to him?

Wilder has already said that any player that wants to go for more than we are willing to pay can go with his blessing.
 
The only teams I can see who may be interested in Lundstram would be current bottom 6 and newly promoted teams for next season. He should take the offer but maybe get a European bonus inserted into it.
 
Nicolaus_Copernicus said:
Apologies, I'd not realised that we'd taken up the option. If we have then there's obviously a fee, albeit a reduced one.

He also appears to be represented by the same agency as Duffy; Wassermans.
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To be fair though didn't Duffys agent advise him against his stance with wilder that led to him being discarded like a used Jonny ?
 
Niceguyeddie said:
To be fair though didn't Duffys agent advise him against his stance with wilder that led to him being discarded like a used Jonny ?
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Not 100% sure, just flagging it.

I know that there was plenty of twitter/facebook chatter, but was the pressure Duffy's from family as opposed to his agent? I sometimes miss stuff :)
 
Niceguyeddie said:
To be fair though didn't Duffys agent advise him against his stance with wilder that led to him being discarded like a used Jonny ?
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Yeah Duffy rocked up in Wilders office without his agent and started making demands. It’s what took Chris by surprise at the time and pissed him off. I think Chris said as much in a RS interview at the time.
 
Can't blame Lunny for asking for more money. He's gone from a backup in the championship to a key player in the Prem. I'm sure that Newcastle, Villa or West Ham would be prepared to offer him more money. However, the signing of Berge should send a clear signal that Wilder won't bend over for anyone.
 
Rochdaleblade said:
Can't blame Lunny for asking for more money. He's gone from a backup in the championship to a key player in the Prem. I'm sure that Newcastle, Villa or West Ham would be prepared to offer him more money. However, the signing of Berge should send a clear signal that Wilder won't bend over for anyone.
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Wilder and Bettis have both said regularly and recently that we have a wage structure and that we will not break it, thereby putting the club in difficulties if we hit stormy waters.

If any player gets a bigger offer from elsewhere then we won't stand in their way if they want to go.

It's looking like Lundstram will be the first test of the policy but he certainly won't be last.

I'm confident that the current management will know who the players are that we are most likely to lose over money issues, and that they will have a plan to replace them within our budgets if and when it happens.

Prepare yourselves for other player departures in the future and put your faith in the management. As a fan that's all you can do.
 

Can someone remind me exactly how Duffy is doing since he informed Wilder that a couple of clubs were interested in him?

Is Duffy managing to hold down a first team position wherever he happens to be playing? Did his ploy of telling Wilder that other clubs were seriously interested in him work in Duffy's favour? Or has Mark realised that playing games with an experienced managed wasn't the most sensible thing he could have done?
 
itsinyerblood said:
Can someone remind me exactly how Duffy is doing since he informed Wilder that a couple of clubs were interested in him?

Is Duffy managing to hold down a first team position wherever he happens to be playing? Did his ploy of telling Wilder that other clubs were seriously interested in him work in Duffy's favour? Or has Mark realised that playing games with an experienced managed wasn't the most sensible thing he could have done?
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Doubt he would have played much if he'd stayed.

Don't think his contract was ever going to be renewed.

He gambled and lost.

I think he badly mis-judged the situation but I can understand why he did it.
 
CornwallBlade said:
Agreed, if correct, we’ll struggle to keep hold of and motivate the better players
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It's not correct.

That's our wage bill from the 18/19 accounts divided by the number of first team players we have.

Absolute cobblers. They'll all have got a wage increase, and new players have come in on competitive lower end Prem wages.
 
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Maidenhead said:
Doubt he would have played much if he'd stayed.

Don't think his contract was ever going to be renewed.

He gambled and lost.

I think he badly mis-judged the situation but I can understand why he did it.
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Which makes all of this an even more nonsensical way for Duffy and/or his agent to have approached dealing with Wilder. Considering that the relationship Duffy had with Wilder was already a sour one, then to cross this line was surely something destined to end Duffy's career at United?

Wouldn't any interested club have approached United in the first place, rather than relying on the player to have initiated a potential move? Smacks of desperation and a possible over-estimation of the player's importance to this club?
 
itsinyerblood said:
Which makes all of this an even more nonsensical way for Duffy and/or his agent to have approached dealing with Wilder. Considering that the relationship Duffy had with Wilder was already a sour one, then to cross this line was surely something destined to end Duffy's career at United?

Wouldn't any interested club have approached United in the first place, rather than relying on the player to have initiated a potential move? Smacks of desperation and a possible over-estimation of the player's importance to this club?
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Completely agree with you.

I think Duffy completely overestimated his worth to the club.

Too much ego and too little understanding of his position.
 
Sheffsteel said:
Take Mark Duffy.... all the facts and logic showed he was upper league 1 standard.
However for us he turned into a classy David Silva type player worthy of a big contract....if he had been younger he’d have received a big pay rise.
He goes to loan to Stoke...we’re convinced he‘ll be a great addition for Stoke....but their fans says he’s crap and he’s quickly reverted back down to league 1 standard.
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Duffy was and always will be top league 1 bottom championship at best type player ....he got lucky with us With the coaching management and way we performed...David Silva classy type ..he isn’t and wasn’t ..he was ok ..just played in the right team at the right time
 
McGrath said:
Had Lundstram been sold in the summer (as many thought he would be). He'd have been lucky to end up at lower end Championship team, he might even have gone to a League One team. His wages would have been rubbish.

Now he's got his name about in the Premier League, he's nailed on to go to another Premier League team, probably on 10 times his wages.

Why would he hang about here to play second fiddle to Berge, when he's knows this is probably his best chance (and possibly only) to earn life changing money.
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So you reckon someone will offer Lunny £200K a week?

Really, you really think that?
 
If I was Lunny I would sign up. If he doesn't it will go pear shaped.
 
He's thoroughly replaceable as he isn't crucial to the function of the team (i.e. Norwood) and certainly nowhere near the same class of player as Fleck.

The clubs already going to trigger his extra year so if he's willing to gamble being stuck on championship wages against us finding a better midfielder by next summer I'd be well up for calling his bluff.
 
Duffy was an awkward bolshi scouser and I get the impression Lunny is a bit that way too. Hope JOC isn’t too. What we don’t know about the wage structure is whether the figures in the newspapers include bonuses. I am sure the players got a big bonus for winning promotion and will also be on a bonus for staying in the PL and finishing higher up than 17th.
 
Yewsman said:
Duffy was an awkward bolshi scouser and I get the impression Lunny is a bit that way too. Hope JOC isn’t too. What we don’t know about the wage structure is whether the figures in the newspapers include bonuses. I am sure the players got a big bonus for winning promotion and will also be on a bonus for staying in the PL and finishing higher up than 17th.
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Yer but it went well for Duffy didn’t it 😳
 
Anyone else feeling they are 'going off' Lunny with this contract unsigned?

If Fleck signed under the current wage structure, a player 10x more instrumental and important than Lunny, then what is keeping Lunny?

I do hope this 'Lord Lundstram' joke after the FPL got his position wrong hasn't somehow gone to his head and he thinks he's the absolute shit for some reason or other.

He's a decent player in the squad. He has admirably worked on his fitness and up to around game 20 had exceeded everyone's expectations of him.

His form has dropped a little since then. And yesterday's performance lacked, if not the work ethic, then the level of focus a player of his ability needs to be showing.

We don't do big time here, so if you're going to stay then stay and knuckle down. If not, then don't irritate the fanbase by asking for ludicrous amounts when you're looking for a transfer.
 

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