Gary Neville in MNF

[Tom Bott]

It's a TLA

TLAR ? Too Little Against Racism.

At my age I struggle to keep up with all these acronyms.

PC is my favourite,though as we all know it is short for Paul Coutts.

Not personal computer or political correctness or police constable or the PlusCal algorithm.

 

[Sheffsteel]

Another point that I believe might be significant.

I have a season ticket on the Kop and every now and then witness our own fans dishing out extreme abuse.
Fortunately most players are too far away to hear it but Ive seen some of our fans almost burst a blood vessel screaming blue murder at anything and everything. The over reactive unstable behaviour is way over the top, sometime it looks like the abusers have mental health issues.

Jordan Rhodes received incredible abuse but when he scored he taunted the fans on the Kop.
2 wrongs don’t make a right, so should players be warned or fined when they cup their ears or taunt the crowd.

Anyhow I’ve hesrd the theory that some people go to matches to relief the pressure from their lives, like a safety valve.
They almost become different people. So it’s better than they scream and shout at the players on the pitch instead of
Keeping in their life frustrations and talking it out on their partners and family.

 

[Bannerman]

Not sure why there’s this big debate around sterling , players get abused shouted at all the time whether there white or black in any league from league one to the prem. I’m not even sure that the fans at Chelsea were been racist ? As it’s not clear at all that they are saying racist slurs.

There’s no doubt sterling gets rough treatment from the media but have other non black players had the same treatment yes they have. The majority of high profile footballer have had it that goes for everyone in the public figure whether that be pop stars/politicians etc.

No doubt the treatment of sterling leads to thick Oafs who where already racist targeting it him , But I don’t think the media’s treatment of him is racist at all

The point is that if someone is abusing a player about their ability, or about something that that player has actually done, then whilst it is perhaps objectionable it is abuse that can be directed at any player on the pitch.
It becomes unacceptable when - part or most - of the abuse is about the players ethnic background, not only has that player got no control over that it has absolutely sod all to do with anything other than racial hatred.

 

[Captain Obvious]

Racism is unacceptable, but it's also unacceptable to call something racist when it isn't, and it needs to be called out. The media articles have absolutely nothing to do with race, it's really that simple. Saying there are 'racial undertones' in a factually correct sports article, is quite frankly ridiculous, in my opinion.

 

[bromtom]

There are too many facets to this debate that it’s almost impossible to discuss.

First we need to agree what is racism
Racial abuse is unacceptable but what about other nasty violence threatening abuse. Is that OK?
What is good old banter and what is abuse
What if the targets groups have different tolerance level, some turn a blind eye whilst others are deeply offended.
If someone says a racist word then does that mean they are a racist?
Remember the John Terry incident using the N word on the pitch but apparently Terry has many black friends
And Ashley Cole backed him up saying in his experiences Terry is not a racist. I believe Terry isn’t but he’s a win at any cost type of player an will resort to using the N word if it riles that player helping his team to win.
What’s the dividing points between being passionate and creating a hostile atmosphere, then taking it too far.
Is it realistic to wipe out 100% of racism? When a few million people might go to matches each season.
Some people are very conservative and don’t like any change. If they have no black friends and have no desire to try to have black friends because they don’t like any people outside their comfort zone, does that make them a racist?
Are the people that voted for Brexit racist?

It’s a interesting subject to discuss but everyone has their own context and different definitions.

Many years ago I used to be totally against positive discrimination because perversely it’s still a form of discrimination.
However I now understand that for certain things there’s currently an unfair playing field.
Black players tend not to take their coaching badges because there a few role models.
And there are few role models because black players tend not to take their coaching badges.
So it becomes an endless cycle, therefore it needs something radical to break that cycle.

However I’m also uncomfortable with brainwashing with the massive need to be politically correct.
I’ve heard comments from people saying the Chelsea racial abusers should be banned for life, made to lose their job and even spend time in prison. Society seems to give glorify and give prestiege to violent people but anone who commits a racist act is almost seen as a paedophile.

If you call someone an N word you're probably racist on some level. Even in the heat of the moment, someone who isn't racist goes to the same insults, cunt, bastard, twat, wanker, or maybe a WAG or mother or something if you're nasty, to fetch the N-word out of your mind to me means you need to have a look at yourself.

To me when it comes to 'banter', take the piss out of the person for the things they do, your race shouldn't be in the equation. If they'd called him a flash twat that's banter, and a hundred people shouting that you're a cunt or whatever from 20 feet away is plenty hostile enough without actually racially abusing someone.

As for political correctness, whoever coined that phrase has a lot to answer for. Just going oooh political correctness gone mad, PC brigade blah blah blah, it's bollocks.

It's common decency. Don't be a fucking arsehole, don't racially abuse your own species. It's not a political issue.

Positive discrimination is also tripe in my opinion. There's equality and equity, minority groups need a hand to get up to the level of the priviliged in society, it's not a slight on the white males or whatever, it's trying to get people up off the floor after society has pushed them down for years.

As for banning people for life and them losing their jobs, banned from the ground definitely, it's in the terms when you get a ticket so why shouldn't they. And if you assualted someone but didn't really do them any lasting damage, got a fine and some community service, you'd probably lose your job. If you're stupid enough to racially abuse someone in public you deserve what you get.

And Brexit Probably a few racists that thought it meant all none English people would immediately leave haha, but a small percentage, probably a few more xenophobic people, and a lot of people that got brainwashed by a bus, and a fair few who genuinely thought it might be a good thing.

What we can all agree on I hope is that our government are shithouse and whatever good version of Brexit was out there has been well and truly lost.

 

[NotFallowfieldBlade]

The point is that if someone is abusing a player about their ability, or about something that that player has actually done, then whilst it is perhaps objectionable it is abuse that can be directed at any player on the pitch.
It becomes unacceptable when - part or most - of the abuse is about the players ethnic background, not only has that player got no control over that it has absolutely sod all to do with anything other than racial hatred.

I’m sorry where is the abuse towards sterling based on his ethnic background ?
Replace sterling with John terry ? And nobody would be saying anything ? Replace him with any player who is high profile in a match like that he would get pelters ?

Would any Wednesday player get shouted at when we play them they do , im sure Leeds players got abuse Saturday yes , is that racist no I’m sure a lot of the Leeds players were foreign.

Think that in certain quarters people look to find stories where they just aren’t there.

The bigger issue should be how the media treat footballers/people in the media spotlight in general not how there been racist

 

[NotFallowfieldBlade]

If you call someone an N word you're probably racist on some level. Even in the heat of the moment, someone who isn't racist goes to the same insults, cunt, bastard, twat, wanker, or maybe a WAG or mother or something if you're nasty, to fetch the N-word out of your mind to me means you need to have a look at yourself.

To me when it comes to 'banter', take the piss out of the person for the things they do, your race shouldn't be in the equation. If they'd called him a flash twat that's banter, and a hundred people shouting that you're a cunt or whatever from 20 feet away is plenty hostile enough without actually racially abusing someone.

As for political correctness, whoever coined that phrase has a lot to answer for. Just going oooh political correctness gone mad, PC brigade blah blah blah, it's bollocks.

It's common decency. Don't be a fucking arsehole, don't racially abuse your own species. It's not a political issue.

Positive discrimination is also tripe in my opinion. There's equality and equity, minority groups need a hand to get up to the level of the priviliged in society, it's not a slight on the white males or whatever, it's trying to get people up off the floor after society and pushed them down for years.

As for banning people for life and them losing their jobs, banned from the ground definitely, it's in the terms when you get a ticket so why shouldn't they. And if you assualted someone but didn't really do them any lasting damage, got a fine and some community service, you'd probably lose your job. If you're stupid enough to racially abuse someone in public you deserve what you get.

And Brexit Probably a few racists that thought it meant all none English people would immediately leave haha, but a small percentage, probably a few more xenophobic people, and a lot of people that got brainwashed by a bus, and a fair few who genuinely thought it might be a good thing.

What we can all agree on I hope is that our government are shithouse and whatever good version of Brexit was out there has been well and truly lost.

Did the Chelsea fans not call him a manc c u next Tuesday and not a black.....

 

[Davalon]

I'm all for tackling racism head on but it has to be across board totally and utterly, not just where it suits.

All these speaking up since Saturday had fuck all to say when Terry and Suarez were dishing it out.

One rule for one.

 

[NotFallowfieldBlade]

I'm all for tackling racism head on but it has to be across board totally and utterly, not just where it suits.

All these speaking up since Saturday had fuck all to say when Terry and Suarez were dishing it out.

One rule for one.

Agreed Jamie carragher taking the moral high ground is a bit rich when he was the captain of a team wearing tshirts supporting a racist

 

[Bannerman]

Racism is unacceptable, but it's also unacceptable to call something racist when it isn't, and it needs to be called out. The media articles have absolutely nothing to do with race, it's really that simple. Saying there are 'racial undertones' in a factually correct sports article, is quite frankly ridiculous, in my opinion.

Fair enough, that is your opinion to which you are entitled. However, can you explain why two young players did exactly the same thing and one of them had a comment made about his lack of senior experience, while the other one simply had the fact that he had done a nice thing commented on?

The inference being that one of them hadn't really achieved anything, and yet was loaded enough to spend millions while the other one, who was in precisely the same situation could do as he wished with his money whether or not he'd achieved anything as yet.

It may seem trivial to anyone who hasn't had to deal with stereotyping all their life but I can understand why it would annoy.

 

[Freddy Dunning-Kruger]

I’ve heard comments from people saying the Chelsea racial abusers should be banned for life, made to lose their job and even spend time in prison.

I've read a newspaper article saying he has lost his job (and his season ticket) - and that he claims he said 'Manc' and not 'Black'.

 

[Bannerman]

I’m sorry where is the abuse towards sterling based on his ethnic background ?
Replace sterling with John terry ? And nobody would be saying anything ? Replace him with any player who is high profile in a match like that he would get pelters ?

Would any Wednesday player get shouted at when we play them they do , im sure Leeds players got abuse Saturday yes , is that racist no I’m sure a lot of the Leeds players were foreign.

Think that in certain quarters people look to find stories where they just aren’t there.

The bigger issue should be how the media treat footballers/people in the media spotlight in general not how there been racist

Have you ever heard anyone call John Terry an English cunt? Have you ever heard any Wednesday player being called an English twat? If you heard any Leeds player being abused and their ethnicity being included in that abuse then it was racist, if on the other hand their ethnicity was left out of it and only the fact that they played for that shower of tossers was included then it wasn't racist.

If in fact you have heard Terry or a Wednesday player being abused in that way then it was racist, but it doesn't happen does it?

 

[NotFallowfieldBlade]

Have you ever heard anyone call John Terry an English cunt? Have you ever heard any Wednesday player being called an English twat? If you heard any Leeds player being abused and their ethnicity being included in that abuse then it was racist, if on the other hand their ethnicity was left out of it and only the fact that they played for that shower of tossers was included then it wasn't racist.

If in fact you have heard Terry or a Wednesday player being abused in that way then it was racist, but it doesn't happen does it?

Raheem sterling was called a manc cunt not a black cunt the whole debate is flawed as he wasn’t even called a black cunt ?
This does not justify the abuse he gets.

The abuse of players happens at every single football match on a Saturday it happens at Bramall lane every home match .
The only reason it’s become a story is because it’s such a high profile player/match and was clearly caught on camera

 

[DifferentClass]

The reason there's a growing racism problem in football is simple- if people are told they're racist for, say, disliking black footballers on a strictly football level, they'll just go "oh, I must be racist then" and become racist. Look at the banana thrown on the pitch the other week- we are regressing back to the 80s and Vince Hilaire quitting football because of the abuse he got because so many football fans are fucking idiots.

 

[bromtom]

Raheem sterling was called a manc cunt not a black cunt the whole debate is flawed as he wasn’t even called a black cunt ?
This does not justify the abuse he gets.

The abuse of players happens at every single football match on a Saturday it happens at Bramall lane every home match .
The only reason it’s become a story is because it’s such a high profile player/match and was clearly caught on camera

I think I'd take Sterling's word over the accused to be honest.

He's hardly going to go "fair cop guv, I racially abused him"

For me from the shape of his mouth I'll go with Raheem but thankfully the abuser is a cretin and did it in front of a 4K camera, probably with a microphone near by, and the Police will have professional lip readers and stuff studying it.

 

[Houston_Blade]

Have you ever heard anyone call John Terry an English cunt?

People don't need to qualify the cuntiness of Terry with any other word, he's just a cunt, plain and simple.

 

[coolhandluke]

Did anyone see the wonderfully insightful interview with Howard Holmes on Look North last night ? Brexit and Referees are to blame for the resurgence of racism in the game . I have to say that im in complete agreement .

 

[Scooter_mcgavin]

Both of those lads did what most of us would consider to be a good thing, so why the added " despite never having started a Pemier League match " in the report on the lad from a non white background?
It may seem minor to some people, but when a race and culture have been denigrated for centuries it is perfectly understandable that they will be sensitive to perceived insults and who can blame them?

Irrespective of their colour I completely agree with the story. I think it is a joke that a guy who nobody has heard of, nowhere near the first team and might never even kick a professional football (at the time of the story) can go and spend 2m+ on a property for their parents.

Phil Foden on the other hand has played first team football and is well known to be one of the next big things.

I'll throw in other players who are young with attitude:
Izzy Brown, Tammy Abraham, Marcus Rashford, Jesse Lindgard who all have no doubt made extravagant purchases.
Throw in media darlings such as Jadon Sancho... who happens to be black.

 

[Captain Obvious]

Fair enough, that is your opinion to which you are entitled. However, can you explain why two young players did exactly the same thing and one of them had a comment made about his lack of senior experience, while the other one simply had the fact that he had done a nice thing commented on?

The inference being that one of them hadn't really achieved anything, and yet was loaded enough to spend millions while the other one, who was in precisely the same situation could do as he wished with his money whether or not he'd achieved anything as yet.

It may seem trivial to anyone who hasn't had to deal with stereotyping all their life but I can understand why it would annoy.

Sure, Foden is seen as Man City's future star, the other guy no one has heard of (other than the supporters at WBA)...that's where the difference is, it's nothing to do with their race, it's more football ability. The fact that a player who has yet to make a name for himself in football can afford to buy himself a £2m mansion...if anything, it's just highlighting how clubs like ours are going to struggle, when players like this are earning so much money.

 

[Davalon]

Did anyone see the wonderfully insightful interview with Howard Holmes on Look North last night ? Brexit and Referees are to blame for the resurgence of racism in the game . I have to say that im in complete agreement .

What utter utter bollocks. I sit near Howard and will ask his reasons for that tripe.

 

[Davalon]

I fully expect to see any Unitedite abusing opposition players thoroughly policed by their own after reading so many fans utterly appalled by three or four fans shouting at Sterling, especially when it's yet to be proved that it was racist abuse.

Hypocrites everywhere.

 

[coolhandluke]

What utter utter bollocks. I sit near Howard and will ask his reasons for that tripe.

Did you see his ' interview ' last night ?

 

[Bannerman]

Sure, Foden is seen as Man City's future star, the other guy no one has heard of (other than the supporters at WBA)...that's where the difference is, it's nothing to do with their race, it's more football ability. The fact that a player who has yet to make a name for himself in football can afford to buy himself a £2m mansion...if anything, it's just highlighting how clubs like ours are going to struggle, when players like this are earning so much money.

You may be right about that particular story being nothing about race but you can understand the perception coming from another black player.

If they wanted to make a point about the ridiculous amounts of money being recieved by youngsters there are loads of examples, and yet they chose to single out a particular young lad and use what to most of us seems a really good thing to do to illustrate the point.

I'm pretty sure if they'd bothered they could have found some examples of young lads driving around in £100,000 cars.
That would have been a far better example of self indulgence than some lad looking out for his mum.

People may think that some black players are being oversensitive, but given what's been going on for years and what they've had to live with it is understandable.
It's easy to brush it off as something minor when it isn't you that's being insulted.

 

[Bannerman]

Raheem sterling was called a manc cunt not a black cunt the whole debate is flawed as he wasn’t even called a black cunt ?
This does not justify the abuse he gets.

The abuse of players happens at every single football match on a Saturday it happens at Bramall lane every home match .
The only reason it’s become a story is because it’s such a high profile player/match and was clearly caught on camera

Surprisingly for such an obvious gentleman the Chelsea fan appears to be lying.



Because it happens at every single football match doesn't make it acceptable. Why some grown adults feel the neccessity to shout obscene abuse at players is beyond me. I have no problem with swearing, I've been following the Blades since Hagan's era and let's be honest it's been difficult at times to keep a civil tongue, however, screaming insults at a particular individual is pathetic.

Perhaps Hal Cruttenden may have a point.

 

[Westran]

I fully expect to see any Unitedite abusing opposition players thoroughly policed by their own after reading so many fans utterly appalled by three or four fans shouting at Sterling, especially when it's yet to be proved that it was racist abuse.

Hypocrites everywhere.

If I heard a United fan racially abusing a player I'd confront him in a second.

I find it quite interesting what lengths people will go to in arguing that whatever has happened isn't racist, when they have no proof either way. The argument in the press has moved on to the fact that racism is on the rise in society and football fans are just a reflection of that rise. This is fact. It isn't made up to suit an agenda.

If you think it is, go out and proove it, just saying that there isn't an issue and saying that black people who raise this as an issue are blaming others for their own failings really shows how fundamentally racist you are. (Davalon that's not directed at you, just the first line).

 

[FinchleyBlade]

No words can begin to describe how sick and tired I am of hearing the words 'racist' and 'racism'. I'm fatiguted out over the faux outrage of it all.

Compare the media (and the political left) reaction to alleged comments said to Sterling to the mass industrialised rape and grooming of young White English girls over decades in this country by Pakistani Muslim men, covered up by the media, police and authorities, and ask yourself why there is such a difference in tone and level of outrage from the media, politicians and TV personalities?

It was exactly the same with the video of the Syrian kid being bullied in Huddersfield. There was a far worse and more violent video last year of a White English kid being viciously attacked by two Pakistani teens in Bradford, where was the same coverage and outrage over that? Why such a huge difference in reporting? Where was the 100k raised for him or Twitter campaign to shame his attackers?

 

[Deleted member 875]

Because it happens at every single football match doesn't make it acceptable. Why some grown adults feel the neccessity to shout obscene abuse at players is beyond me. I have no problem with swearing, I've been following the Blades since Hagan's era and let's be honest it's been difficult at times to keep a civil tongue, however, screaming insults at a particular individual is pathetic.

]

Some food for thought there, Prehaps the next time Gareth Ainsworth makes an appearance in the away dug out, you will join me in some applause for his footballing achievements,

 

[stringer]

Fair enough, that is your opinion to which you are entitled. However, can you explain why two young players did exactly the same thing and one of them had a comment made about his lack of senior experience, while the other one simply had the fact that he had done a nice thing commented on?

The inference being that one of them hadn't really achieved anything, and yet was loaded enough to spend millions while the other one, who was in precisely the same situation could do as he wished with his money whether or not he'd achieved anything as yet.

It may seem trivial to anyone who hasn't had to deal with stereotyping all their life but I can understand why it would annoy.

The Tosin article was at a time when the issue of young players being vastly overpaid was a big talking point in the game. Also written by two different journalists, months apart, so bound to be written differently

 

[stringer]

No words can begin to describe how sick and tired I am of hearing the words 'racist' and 'racism'. I'm fatiguted out over the faux outrage of it all.

Compare the media (and the political left) reaction to alleged comments said to Sterling to the mass industrialised rape and grooming of young White English girls over decades in this country by Pakistani Muslim men, covered up by the media, police and authorities, and ask yourself why there is such a difference in tone and level of outrage from the media, politicians and TV personalities?

It was exactly the same with the video of the Syrian kid being bullied in Huddersfield. There was a far worse and more violent video last year of a White English kid being viciously attacked by two Pakistani teens in Bradford, where was the same coverage and outrage over that? Why such a huge difference in reporting? Where was the 100k raised for him or Twitter campaign to shame his attackers?

How do you believe the media have ‘covered up’ grooming gangs?

 

[Bannerman]

Some food for thought there, Prehaps the next time Gareth Ainsworth makes an appearance in the away dug out, you will join me in some applause for his footballing achievements,

If you can't tell the difference between abusing someone for a specific action which they deliberately committed and which effectively ruined the career of one of ours, and abusing someone over their race and/or team then your ability to understand simple concepts has to be questioned.

I was at Port Vale when Ainsworth smashed Danes cruciate and it was disgusting, Ainsworth is a full weight twat as is Andy Johnson who almost blinded George Santos when he was playing for Forest and I have no problem with Santo seeking revenge when we played West Brom.

On the other hand, while not happy about it I don't feel the same about the player who injured Coutts, I believe that that was pure clumsiness with no ill intent. Ainsworth and Johnson meant to harm and are both bastards.