For the greater good of Sheffield Football is now the time to merge?

[norfolkblade]

That's a fair argument. Because you'd never hear any Blades slagging off their own players. Are you so convinced of your own inability to control yourself that you'd need to be in another section of the ground? Perhaps you need to consider anger management classes.

Why do you feel the need to provoke people all the time? Are you a closet pig?

 

[Bladesway]

Why do you feel the need to provoke people all the time? Are you a closet pig?

Funny because I didn't see it as anything other than a bit sarcastic and a bit of a laugh. Depends who you agree with I suppose. And his point is a good one. No one slags Blades players off better than Blades fans. I guarantee you people have said Evans is shite before at BDTBL.

 

[oldblade]

My god I wonder how fans of Newcastle United (a club that is the result of a merger, by the way) do when they are at work without a second club in the city.

I don't really think a nerger that occurred in the 19th century when football clubs in general were in thgeir infancy and had not got years and years of history and rivalry behind them is quite the same thing.

And Sheffield is almost double the size of Newcastle in terms of population, so should easily be able to support two clubs.

 

[Selly]

And Sheffield is almost double the size of Newcastle in terms of population, so should easily be able to support two clubs.

Whilst that is true, Sheffield also doesn`t have a city the size of Gateshead on the other side of the river to draw support from...

 

[Yossarian]

Why do you feel the need to provoke people all the time? Are you a closet pig?

Steady now.

 

[Highbury_Blade]

Whilst that is true, Sheffield also doesn`t have a city the size of Gateshead on the other side of the river to draw support from...

That's a very good point.

Whilst these aren't a direct comparison (in terms of sq miles), the Sheffield urban area is 640,720, whilst the Tyneside urban area is 879,996.

Even the Nottingham Urban Area is bigger than Sheffield

 

[mattbianco1]

That's a fair argument. Because you'd never hear any Blades slagging off their own players. Are you so convinced of your own inability to control yourself that you'd need to be in another section of the ground? Perhaps you need to consider anger management classes.

Different argument. A blade slagging a blades player off is a matter of opinion and a justified opinion (if they go to the games.) Everybody see's Montgomery different for example.

But, the scenario I gave you was one of a Wednesdayite slagging Evans off JUST BECAUSE he wore Red & White stripes before he played for 'Sheffield City FC.'

That's like saying Nyron Nosworthy is crap because he's black!!!

The argument just doesn't stand up and is just a way of provoking an argument / trouble.

I guarantee you people have said Evans is shite before at BDTBL.

Yeah they have. But if a pig told me he was shit, i'd jump right down his throat.

You need to check that your own house is in order before you slag mine off !

 

[Yossarian]

This is the worst argument against I've ever heard.

 

[Bladesway]

The "head" basis doesn't stand up either. It's a good idea to someone looking at bare stats from a considerable distance away. Probably a few parsecs.

I think the bare facts have fart all to do with where you live or anything like that. They would still make the same sense if I lived in Gleadless.

 

[JohnDenver]

I think the bare facts have fart all to do with where you live or anything like that. They would still make the same sense if I lived in Gleadless.

I didn't mean that geographically!

 

[oldblade]

That's a very good point.

Whilst these aren't a direct comparison (in terms of sq miles), the Sheffield urban area is 640,720, whilst the Tyneside urban area is 879,996.

Even the Nottingham Urban Area is bigger than Sheffield

But the populations of each town/city are smaller. Sheffield is in the top half dozen cities in England in terms of population, and certainly comparable to Liverpool and Manchester. There really is no reason why it cannot support two very large clubs.
It's only mismanagement that has prevented it.

 

[mattbianco1]

This is the worst argument against I've ever heard.

Please explain?

 

[oldblade]

Whilst that is true, Sheffield also doesn`t have a city the size of Gateshead on the other side of the river to draw support from...

Gateshead's population is only 75,000. Less than Rotherham or Chesterfield, and theirb football team is only one league lower.

 

[Bladesway]

Different argument. A blade slagging a blades player off is a matter of opinion and a justified opinion (if they go to the games.) Everybody see's Montgomery different for example.

But, the scenario I gave you was one of a Wednesdayite slagging Evans off JUST BECAUSE he wore Red & White stripes before he played for 'Sheffield City FC.'

That's like saying Nyron Nosworthy is crap because he's black!!!

The argument just doesn't stand up and is just a way of provoking an argument / trouble.



Yeah they have. But if a pig told me he was shit, i'd jump right down his throat.

You need to check that your own house is in order before you slag mine off !

My house is in order and Evans is still shit. Oh and I don't go any more. But my spidey sense tells me he is still shit.

 

[Highbury_Blade]

But the populations of each town/city are smaller. Sheffield is in the top half dozen cities in England in terms of population, and certainly comparable to Liverpool and Manchester. There really is no reason why it cannot support two very large clubs.
It's only mismanagement that has prevented it.

Greater Manchester urban area is nearly 2 million, compared to 700,000 for Sheffield. If you're only going by the population within the city boundaries, then London is the smallest city in the country! And the catchment area for Liverpool FC, and Manchester Utd is arguably worldwide

 

[raul]

Might it actually end up being driven by the FL?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/feb/15/football-league-greg-clarke-debt

 

[lenners]

Sheffield's one of the largest urban areas in the country, population of South Yorks is about 1.4m, then there's Chessy, north Derbyshire, north Notts etc.
Not sure who mentioned Nottingham but Sheffield is far bigger.

 

[Highbury_Blade]

Sheffield's one of the largest urban areas in the country, population of South Yorks is about 1.4m, then there's Chessy, north Derbyshire, north Notts etc.
Not sure who mentioned Nottingham but Sheffield is far bigger.

It was me,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_urban_areas_in_the_United_Kingdom

Data taken from the ONS census of 2001

 

[super_pig]

it isn't a question of population and how many fans you can get.. we could get 70k in a match and still be crap because both clubs are poorly run

 

[sheffielder]

I think the average spurs fan travels 35 miles to get to a home game. To us that would be like travelling just past Leeds.
People need to stop thinking just because there are 750k people in and around sheffield that you are going to get average crowds of over 30k with a merger.
Look at Leeds for a one club city.....

There needs to be a product for the consumer to buy

 

[lenners]

It was me,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_urban_areas_in_the_United_Kingdom

Data taken from the ONS census of 2001

If they're adding in Long Eaton, Sheffield would add in Chesterfield, Dronfield, Doncaster, Barnsley etc, etc.
Nottingham is nowhere near as big an urban area as Sheffield, reflected in the size of its football crowds.
A more reliable figure would be the metropolitan areas used for the likes of West Yorkshire in that list.

---------- Post added at 01:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:50 PM ----------

I think the average spurs fan travels 35 miles to get to a home game. To us that would be like travelling just past Leeds.
People need to stop thinking just because there are 750k people in and around sheffield that you are going to get average crowds of over 30k with a merger.
Look at Leeds for a one club city.....

There needs to be a product for the consumer to buy

Much bigger support for football in Sheffield than there ever has been in Leeds.

 

[super_pig]

Leeds is a rugby town.. but anyway.. it doesn't matter.. sheffielder is spot on with his assessment.. you could have 'no' teams in south yorks/n. derbys and still noone would go because it is 'crap'!

 

[Bladesway]

Leeds is a rugby town.. but anyway.. it doesn't matter.. sheffielder is spot on with his assessment.. you could have 'no' teams in south yorks/n. derbys and still noone would go because it is 'crap'!

What??????

 

[sheffielder]

Much bigger support for football in Sheffield than there ever has been in Leeds.[/QUOTE]


Which again tells you that when they could get 35-40k when in the championsleague it is the product which is king, not how many customers you have access to. Doubling your customer base doesn't guarentee your turnover will go up.

 

[lenners]

Much bigger support for football in Sheffield than there ever has been in Leeds.

Which again tells you that when they could get 35-40k when in the championsleague it is the product which is king, not how many customers you have access to. Doubling your customer base doesn't guarentee your turnover will go up.[/QUOTE]

Yes and a merged Sheffield team with gates of 40k is unlikely to struggle to get in the Prem.

 

[Grecian2000]

I've stayed away from this thread because I would hate the thought of any kind of merger (it would put the final nail in the coffin marked "completely pissed off with football" for me) BUT it is something that has crossed my mind more and more recently.

Not because both clubs are in desperate plight both playing wise and financially, although that appears to be the case. But I have a feeling that TV (or Sky if you prefer) and/or the corrupt individuals that rule the PL will see us heading in that direction eventually.
They aren't bothered about grass roots football, supporters of clubs that have existed for a hundred years and more, tradition etc., but they can see money making opportunities with their eyes closed.

When the breakaway occurs, be it European Super League or just the big clubs away from the rest with no inconvenience of relegation to make them fall off the gravy train, then all bets are off and "super clubs" of merged lesser clubs will be fast tracked into the mix. Depending on when this all happens (see Rugby League and Super League for a blueprint) then if neither Sheffield club is big enough, financially, to make the cut, then someone will put together the plan for the merged club to join the party.

I don't believe for a minute it would be in anyones best interest for this to happen at present but the future is TV money and people will sell their grandma for that as we know.
As my interest in football starts and stops at BDTBL, at least it would give me the final push to stop ploughing money into a game I long since started despising rather than loving.

 

[raul]

Do you know what, if just three people (Richards, Scudamore, Murdoch) worked something out as above and plonked enough cash on enough desks it would happen within five years.

 

[Highbury_Blade]

As my interest in football starts and stops at BDTBL, at least it would give me the final push to stop ploughing money into a game I long since started despising rather than loving.

Exactly the same as me (apart from the ploughing money part). If there were to be a merged Sheffield team, i would just stop watching football altogether.

 

[oldblade]

It was me,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_urban_areas_in_the_United_Kingdom

Data taken from the ONS census of 2001

Those population figures for the Greater Nottingham area include areas that could legitimately be said to be equally within the pull area for Derby County.

If that's the case, then there's no reason why we can't consider Dronfield, Chesterfield, Conisborough, Mexborough, Worksop etc to be within the draw area for both Sheffield clubs.

Not sure of the point I'm now making other than the fact that there is a large area for potential support in and around Sheffield and even if taken on it's own, the population of the city of Sheffield alone is large (the 5th largest in the UK) and easily large enough to support two (or more) football clubs. The success or failure of either is dependant on how well they are managed, rather than the available population.

---------- Post added at 06:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:19 PM ----------

Greater Manchester urban area is nearly 2 million, compared to 700,000 for Sheffield. If you're only going by the population within the city boundaries, then London is the smallest city in the country! And the catchment area for Liverpool FC, and Manchester Utd is arguably worldwide

That figure for Greater Manchester includes Bolton, Oldham, Rochdale, Stockport, Bury and Salford. That would be similar to Barnsley, Doncaster, and Chesterfield appearing as part of the Sheffield urban area population. They almost as close geographically to Sheffield as places like Bury, Rochdale and Bolton are to Manchester.

 

[Bladesway]

Exactly the same as me (apart from the ploughing money part). If there were to be a merged Sheffield team, i would just stop watching football altogether.

If you are going to the Lane currently then you already have.

---------- Post added at 08:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:27 PM ----------

I've stayed away from this thread because I would hate the thought of any kind of merger (it would put the final nail in the coffin marked "completely pissed off with football" for me) BUT it is something that has crossed my mind more and more recently.

Not because both clubs are in desperate plight both playing wise and financially, although that appears to be the case. But I have a feeling that TV (or Sky if you prefer) and/or the corrupt individuals that rule the PL will see us heading in that direction eventually.
They aren't bothered about grass roots football, supporters of clubs that have existed for a hundred years and more, tradition etc., but they can see money making opportunities with their eyes closed.

When the breakaway occurs, be it European Super League or just the big clubs away from the rest with no inconvenience of relegation to make them fall off the gravy train, then all bets are off and "super clubs" of merged lesser clubs will be fast tracked into the mix. Depending on when this all happens (see Rugby League and Super League for a blueprint) then if neither Sheffield club is big enough, financially, to make the cut, then someone will put together the plan for the merged club to join the party.

I don't believe for a minute it would be in anyones best interest for this to happen at present but the future is TV money and people will sell their grandma for that as we know.
As my interest in football starts and stops at BDTBL, at least it would give me the final push to stop ploughing money into a game I long since started despising rather than loving.

Kerching. That is exactly what and why it would happen and the following post mentions the people who would/could make it happen. Its a god awful thought but its real and we are right in the firing line.