Deep financial trouble ahead

[Rodley]

Buying the club and assets off McWobbleGob and COVID putting us down by 20 to 30million quid won't have helped.

I get the impression that the money you get once promoted isn't enough to play with these days. Once you factor in increased wages, transfer fees, player bonuses and other overheads that come with being in the PL.

The Prem, like the Championship, or indeed most levels of the football league requires substantial subsidy from the Owner to compete / survive.

 

[Carlton Blade]

Next season is going to be very very tough, don’t expect anything going into next season. We are sailing very very close to the wind.

Income before sales next season will be £70m. Cost of finance around £7m or £8m, Amortisation on fees is pretty much covered by the Ndiaye/Berge sales, there are almost zero commitments on contracts to players currently so any additions to the wage base have to be signed off.

You're going to have to offer a little bit more than that

 

[adiosmiamigo]

But while there's moonlight and music and love and romance......let's face the music and dance

Angela Rippon flashing her pins in the distance,corrrr.

 

[dc_blade]

I’m more inclined to believe rifleman is full of shit.

My guess, and it is that we’ll have one of the top budgets in the championship next season. We’ve repaired the finances and are buying up land there’s no need to buy if we’re in big trouble.

The pigs will lose more players than us next season, and really are skint.

This is my expectation, too. In fact, my willingness to go easy on the owner for the shit show this season has been based on the idea that we were righting the ship after overspending the first time we were in the PL and we’d been on surer footing afterwards.

As Carlton Blade has pointed out, we should have a pretty substantial income next season relative to others in the division, even without investment from the owner.

If we’re still in trouble next season there’s something fishy going on.

 

[Wapping Blade]

Not really, because that will go towards covering losses etc.

How can getting rid of high wage contracts go to covering losses?

We will have a (hopefully lot) smaller cost base, whether that is sustainable or not is moot.

 

[Bell4]

Who knows? Knowsnowt knows. Unless of course Knowsnowt doesn't know. But then at least Knowsnowt will know that Knowsnowt knows nowt.

How the fk should we know

 

[Guesty]

Better deal there then, size-wise

Makes sense, since she does have baps, whereas Kiera ... not so much

Edit - beat me to it gbs

I remember her reaction to seeing her character poster from the film King Arthur - "Those aren't mine!"

 

[Stretch]

Not surprised to hear what Rifleman has said. I did not expect any money spent in the summer, it will be ‘out of contract’ players and loans I suspect. I also expect Archer(back to Villa) , Anel, de Souza, to be sold. And that is addition to all the players out of contract leaving.

This is a significant time for our club. My fear is that my old Dad (god rest his soul) will be right when he kept saying that the bragging rights in Sheffield football change constantly so enjoy it while you can! There is a chance that our neighbours will be right back at our heals for next season! Not looking forward to that one but given our current predicament!

Your Dad was right. I started watching us in the late 80s and despite them having the upper hand for a decent period into the early noughties, it has swung back and forth a few times since, and overall I would say it's about even stevens in terms of who has been on top the most. I am sure the same could be said before I started watching us too.

It will be interesting to see what happens next season, but they need to stay up first and that is in no way certain, or even highly likely at this stage. If they do then should be a competitive match up when we do meet them. But if we can build a team around the likes of Arblaster, Hamer and Brooks, then I can see us having far too much for them. As bad as we are at the moment, I look at their team and think 'fuck me, at least I don't have to watch that lot'. They have as much of a rebuild on their hands as we do.

 

[Numpty's Dusty Ruts.]

I see that Rifleman hasn't yet replied or expanded on his original post, which would seem to indicate bullshit alert!!

 

[georgebernardshaw]

I remember her reaction to seeing her character poster from the film King Arthur - "Those aren't mine!"

Trust me, they are…

 

[west_yorks_blade]

Trust me, they are…

Huge if true

Actually - small if true

 

[Nedski]

I see that Rifleman hasn't yet replied or expanded on his original post, which would seem to indicate bullshit alert!!

He's clearly learnt from the best Sunjihi

 

[Godbeblade]

I think the squad needs a refresh which, given that a lot of player are out of contract, will come next year.

That should take the outgoing wages down a bit. Only worry is if/when we start to underperform due to a new/young squad finding it's feet in the championship.

I'm expecting a bottom half of table finish next year which might not be terrible if we can get the finances in order... or play the hotel up front

 

[Sean Thornton]

He meant Kate Winslet

We know what he meant……..

 

[adiosmiamigo]

Angela Rippon flashing her pins in the distance,corrrr.

I suppose i would.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Income before sales next season will be £70m. Cost of finance around £7m or £8m, Amortisation on fees is pretty much covered by the Ndiaye/Berge sales, there are almost zero commitments on contracts to players currently so any additions to the wage base have to be signed off.

You're going to have to offer a little bit more than that

Amortisation isn’t a cash expenditure. Dore and the hotel will surely be eating up cash unless funded by loans therefore spreading the payments. The admin costs will probably be much the same as previously so cash flow depends mainly on sales cash in - unlikely all up front - and payments for wages/transfer fees out.

Plus championship football usually means losses which will require funding.

 

[Carlton Blade]

Amortisation isn’t a cash expenditure. Dore and the hotel will surely be eating up cash unless funded by loans therefore spreading the payments. The admin costs will probably be much the same as previously so cash flow depends mainly on sales cash in - unlikely all up front - and payments for wages/transfer fees out.

Plus championship football usually means losses which will require funding.

I'm just talking about the pluses and minuses in terms of the accounts. But for this next season, the outgoing cash payments for players are likely to be covered by the incoming payments for Berge/Ndiaye so should still be mostly a wash.

Based on the outgoings and incomings of previous Championship seasons, I would thik that £70m income before any player sales could cover a £30m player wage bill plus a chunk of outsourcing fees to get deals over the line. Not a huge budget but certainly a competitive one (wage bill without promotion in 21/22 was £36m, with promotion bonuses added in 22/23 it was £48m)

 

[Bladesman]

Amortisation isn’t a cash expenditure. Dore and the hotel will surely be eating up cash unless funded by loans therefore spreading the payments. The admin costs will probably be much the same as previously so cash flow depends mainly on sales cash in - unlikely all up front - and payments for wages/transfer fees out.

Plus championship football usually means losses which will require funding.

PA is in a bunker in Rotherham counting the cash. Fucking snek Bettis sends wheelbarrows of cash there.

How many times do you need to be told this!

 

[originaltrueblade]

I know a friend of a friend

 

[Sean Thornton]

I'm just talking about the pluses and minuses in terms of the accounts. But for this next season, the outgoing cash payments for players are likely to be covered by the incoming payments for Berge/Ndiaye so should still be mostly a wash.

Based on the outgoings and incomings of previous Championship seasons, I would thik that £70m income before any player sales could cover a £30m player wage bill plus a chunk of outsourcing fees to get deals over the line. Not a huge budget but certainly a competitive one (wage bill without promotion in 21/22 was £36m, with promotion bonuses added in 22/23 it was £48m)

Admin £20m, wages say £30m, interest - your figure £7m plus loan and mortgage capital repayments of X don’t leave much left if you consider capital spending and transfer fees. It will be tight.

 

[itsinyerblood]

Worth recalling the thoughts of Chairman Abdullah, according to the least wealthy of the Saudi lineage, we are valued at £170 mil. Of course if that
estimation has changed then it would help if we could be told if it's increased or decreased. Not sure if the future's bleak or full of promise, but the fact that the most vital of footballing components, the ability to buy and strengthen via new recruits, appears non-negotiable and is thus handing our manager, whoever that might be, a situation that is at best compromised and at worst dire and damaging to this club's future.

 

[Carlton Blade]

Admin £20m, wages say £30m, interest - your figure £7m plus loan and mortgage capital repayments of X don’t leave much left if you consider capital spending and transfer fees. It will be tight.

Definitely. My only real point is that, unlike previous Championship seasons the club has total control of the wage bill. Apart from Davies, Brewster and maybe Trusty there aren't the toxic contracts that there were in the last 2 seasons in the Championship.

I have no idea if we'll be good. There's no excuse for going over budget when you actually have it in a position to be controlled

 

[Blade58]

Parachute payments and sales to finance the first two seasons back in the chumpionship (or L1 the second), then it could get interesting for the bog roll prince?

Have we actually got the whole of next seasons para payment to play with though?

I think it was around Jan? Not sure but didn’t PA take out another charge out against future income? If so, I can only think it’s against next seasons £45m para payment? What other future income could it be against if not?

Sean or other financial gurus might have a better idea and correct the bollox I’ve written above

 

[Rodley]

Admin £20m, wages say £30m, interest - your figure £7m plus loan and mortgage capital repayments of X don’t leave much left if you consider capital spending and transfer fees. It will be tight.

Yep. What do the parachute payments drop to in our second Champ season (if we don’t come back up)? Think we’ll be running on fumes by then.

 

[Balham Blade]

Yep. What do the parachute payments drop to in our second Champ season (if we don’t come back up)? Think we’ll be running on fumes by then.

£55m year 1, £45m year 2 IIRC

 

[Gimli]

Bring back Richard Cadette

 

[Valley Blade]

It's all well and good saying 'this player will be off the books, that player will be off the books'. But they'll need replacing otherwise we'll go into the new season with a squad of eight players, most of them kids. How do we replace all these players with no money? The transfer budget for this summer will be far less than last summer (and that amounted to nine tenths of f*ck all).

How does around £60m equate to " nine tenths of f*ck all" ?

 

[Valley Blade]

Not surprised to hear what Rifleman has said. I did not expect any money spent in the summer, it will be ‘out of contract’ players and loans I suspect. I also expect Archer(back to Villa) , Anel, de Souza, to be sold. And that is addition to all the players out of contract leaving.

This is a significant time for our club. My fear is that my old Dad (god rest his soul) will be right when he kept saying that the bragging rights in Sheffield football change constantly so enjoy it while you can! There is a chance that our neighbours will be right back at our heals for next season! Not looking forward to that one but given our current predicament!

And their predicament is far better than ours?

 

[Kenworthy’s Tash]

i think that’s common knowledge isn’t it?

I’ve not heard we’re in a financial mess, is there any credible sources that hints that we are?

 

[Champagneblade]

Thing is, perhaps the OP is true but that may well be if we hardly do anything to avoid it.

We will send back Archer. We will sell Anel and we will sell Souza.

Even modestly looking at it, that is possibly 20m and 9 back on Archer.

We will lose the wages of the above, plus Brereton-Diaz, McAtee, Larouci of the loans also.

It looks like we will say au revoir to Wes, Amissah, Davies, (sadly) Basham and Baldock and Norwood.

It must be in the balance for Egan and McBurnie too.

Aside from Brewster that hardly leaves anyone of note on big wages apart from perhaps Davies, who came with no fee.

We will also have younger players who may contribute well above their current wage - Osula, Arblaster, Brooks, Marsh etc.

We will be working from a more modest base but we will have hardly any who potentially are paid more than the value of what they contribute.