Could they hack it in the championship?

[robbiez666]

The signings of Mark Duffy and Leon Clarke have left me with mixed feelings..

On one hand, they were 2 of the best players in the league last year. Both are clearly capable of doing their jobs (and excelling) in L1.

One the other, they're both 30+ and have had the opportunity to show their worth in championship and frankly not taken it.

It got me wondering, which of the new signings (and the squad for that matter) would be able to make the step up?

I personally think:

George Long - potentially yes
John Brayford - yes
Chris Hussey - probably not
John Fleck - yes
Jack O'Connell - yes
Chris Basham - not based on what we've seen, but he has before.
Marc McNulty - probably not
Che Adams - potentially yes
Billy Sharp(captain) - yes
Matt Done - no
Jake Wright - no
Dominic Calvert-Lewin - potentially yes
Paul Coutts(Transfer Listed) - no
Stefan Scougall - probably not
Kieran Wallace(Transfer Listed) - no
Kieron Freeman(Transfer Listed) - no
James Wilson - probably not
Mark Duffy - probably not
Louis Reed - potentially yes, buy probably not
Ben Whiteman - potentially yes
Leon Clarke - probably not
James Wallace(Transfer Listed) - if he got fit, yes: so probably not
Martyn Woolford(Transfer Listed) - hahahahahaha

While I think Wilder's doing a great job addressing the problems, I can't hep but feel that if we were to be promoted, another cull would be needed to compete.

And before anyone says we should just worry about the division were in now and forget the championship: if our ambitions are promotion, then we should be preparing for promotion.

Agree with the point. I think it's a balance of bringing in potential/ability and also players to get us out this league.

Fleck and O'Connell fall into potential

Duffy, Clark, Wright and Wilson fall into the latter. (anyone know the contract lengths on these? 2,3,1 and 2?)

I think Brayford, Sharp, Adams and Done could also play at a higher level.

It was my issue with the Clark signing. Saddling us with a 3 year contract.

It's also my slight concern with the lack of movement in the loan market. League 1 is the division where it becomes vital to use your loan allocation.

We need to replace Basham as a priority and another CB. I would be looking at the loan market first, unless we sell Che and get some funds in.

 

[BushBlade]

I feel the below players are the ones who would play in the Championship and not be out of their depth, given the style of play can change slightly and there may be more time on the ball without getting hounded down.

Brayford
Fleck
Basham
Adams
Sharp
Reed
Possibly Done too

If you get time on the ball in the championship it's because you're good enough to make time. Take a bad first touch and they're all over you like a rash.

 

[8lade]

I know for a fact that Morgan and Geary had no chance of being good enough for the premiership.

 

[super_pig]

The signings of Mark Duffy and Leon Clarke have left me with mixed feelings..

On one hand, they were 2 of the best players in the league last year. Both are clearly capable of doing their jobs (and excelling) in L1.

One the other, they're both 30+ and have had the opportunity to show their worth in championship and frankly not taken it.

It got me wondering, which of the new signings (and the squad for that matter) would be able to make the step up?

I personally think:

George Long - potentially yes
John Brayford - yes
Chris Hussey - probably not
John Fleck - yes
Jack O'Connell - yes
Chris Basham - not based on what we've seen, but he has before.
Marc McNulty - probably not
Che Adams - potentially yes
Billy Sharp(captain) - yes
Matt Done - no
Jake Wright - no
Dominic Calvert-Lewin - potentially yes
Paul Coutts(Transfer Listed) - no
Stefan Scougall - probably not
Kieran Wallace(Transfer Listed) - no
Kieron Freeman(Transfer Listed) - no
James Wilson - probably not
Mark Duffy - probably not
Louis Reed - potentially yes, buy probably not
Ben Whiteman - potentially yes
Leon Clarke - probably not
James Wallace(Transfer Listed) - if he got fit, yes: so probably not
Martyn Woolford(Transfer Listed) - hahahahahaha

While I think Wilder's doing a great job addressing the problems, I can't hep but feel that if we were to be promoted, another cull would be needed to compete.

And before anyone says we should just worry about the division were in now and forget the championship: if our ambitions are promotion, then we should be preparing for promotion.

it doesn't matter mate. we're getting ahead of ourselves. just get the best players for this division and get out. then take it from there.

 

[IMABLADE]

The signings of Mark Duffy and Leon Clarke have left me with mixed feelings..

On one hand, they were 2 of the best players in the league last year. Both are clearly capable of doing their jobs (and excelling) in L1.

One the other, they're both 30+ and have had the opportunity to show their worth in championship and frankly not taken it.

It got me wondering, which of the new signings (and the squad for that matter) would be able to make the step up?

I personally think:

George Long - potentially yes
John Brayford - yes
Chris Hussey - probably not
John Fleck - yes
Jack O'Connell - yes
Chris Basham - not based on what we've seen, but he has before.
Marc McNulty - probably not
Che Adams - potentially yes
Billy Sharp(captain) - yes
Matt Done - no
Jake Wright - no
Dominic Calvert-Lewin - potentially yes
Paul Coutts(Transfer Listed) - no
Stefan Scougall - probably not
Kieran Wallace(Transfer Listed) - no
Kieron Freeman(Transfer Listed) - no
James Wilson - probably not
Mark Duffy - probably not
Louis Reed - potentially yes, buy probably not
Ben Whiteman - potentially yes
Leon Clarke - probably not
James Wallace(Transfer Listed) - if he got fit, yes: so probably not
Martyn Woolford(Transfer Listed) - hahahahahaha

While I think Wilder's doing a great job addressing the problems, I can't hep but feel that if we were to be promoted, another cull would be needed to compete.

And before anyone says we should just worry about the division were in now and forget the championship: if our ambitions are promotion, then we should be preparing for promotion.

Chris Hussey looks great I think he would easily make it to the next level

 

[Chali 2na]

Bristol City are far from the perfect example. Cotterill's 'preparations' for the championship resulted in him getting the sack. And they spent a few quid too.

Wolves did it but spent a lot of money doing so and we know that further substantial spending by our owners is not on the cards.

Fair enough about Bristol, though I think pretty much any other manager would have kept them up.

Other examples are Brentford, Charlton & I'd be willing to bet Wigan and Barnsley would stay up thanks to their recent recruitment.

The thing is that when we get promoted, our players become saleable assets to the teams that want to emulate us. With that in mind, it becomes far easier to move players on than if you finish 11th. As they are easier to move on, it frees up budget for the next onslaught of changes. If CW is as good as we hope at building teams, it SHOULD be a little easier for him to do so, bearing in mind the funds earmarked for a push for the Prem within the game changing investment available.

Good point mate. Though I remain slightly pessimistic about the game changing investment.

Interesting post and I'd be lying if I hadn't thought on similar lines about who would make the step up but I reckon we need to ask this question around next April if we're top of the League! Briefly though I reckon about half the forst team will be good enough to make the step up, but lets worry about that in 2017 - hopefully!

Yeah, our performance this season will be a better indicator of who could or couldn't make it in the CH.

it doesn't matter mate. we're getting ahead of ourselves. just get the best players for this division and get out. then take it from there.

(Again) Why can't we do both at the same time?

 

[BushBlade]

Fair enough about Bristol, though I think pretty much any other manager would have kept them up.

Other examples are Brentford, Charlton & I'd be willing to bet Wigan and Barnsley would stay up thanks to their recent recruitment.



Good point mate. Though I remain slightly pessimistic about the game changing investment.



Yeah, our performance this season will be a better indicator of who could or couldn't make it in the CH.



(Again) Why can't we do both at the same time?

Warburton and Powell did fantastic jobs but both clubs had new owners who were still willing to part with significant amounts of cash.

I haven't said we can't do it, I said in my original reply that we won't spend the money required.

I don't get your point about Barnsley and Wigan. Do you mean the recruitment they've made in the close season?

And again, the difference between the bottom half of the championship and the top of L1 isn't insurmountable. If we're good enough to go up then there's a good chance that, with a few sensible additions, we can stay up. Bear in mind we have a few contracts running out at the end of the season that will free up some wages and we'll be at least £5m better off, probably more, so we will have enough breathing space.

I'd be soiling to bet that if we go up, we stay up. But we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

 

[Chali 2na]

Warburton and Powell did fantastic jobs but both clubs had new owners who were still willing to part with significant amounts of cash.

I haven't said we can't do it, I said in my original reply that we won't spend the money required.

I don't get your point about Barnsley and Wigan. Do you mean the recruitment they've made in the close season?

And again, the difference between the bottom half of the championship and the top of L1 isn't insurmountable. If we're good enough to go up then there's a good chance that, with a few sensible additions, we can stay up. Bear in mind we have a few contracts running out at the end of the season that will free up some wages and we'll be at least £5m better off, probably more, so we will have enough breathing space.

I'd be soiling to bet that if we go up, we stay up. But we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

Ahh, this is where you and I differ fundamentally: I think (at least under clough) the money hasn't been an issue, and the problems lie where it's been spent. I think signings like Coutts, Brayford and Done show that money has been made available, only for it to be squandered.

My point about Barnsley and Wigan is that last year they bought up and coming players who (I believe) can improve and play a part in the CH.

 

[BushBlade]

Ahh, this is where you and I differ fundamentally: I think (at least under clough) the money hasn't been an issue, and the problems lie where it's been spent. I think signings like Coutts, Brayford and Done show that money has been made available, only for it to be squandered.

My point about Barnsley and Wigan is that last year they bought up and coming players who (I believe) can improve and play a part in the CH.

We don't differ in this respect though. I said in my first post we'd have been able to do it under Clough. I probably ought to have added we should have done it under Clough.

We had the money and we had a manager with a reputation for finding players on the cheap, with a good knowledge of the lower leagues. A manager known for building sides, albeit slowly. It should have been perfect. But we decided to do something else with the money and it didn't work.

And the Prince's 'game changing investment' has gone. He's just not rich enough to continue to spend like he did and KM feels like he's lost enough. So we are where we are and Wilder has to make the best of it.

 

[blade too long]

piggies and rotherham stayed up with a right eclectic mix of shit

I think our lads are more suited to the championship any way
its this league we need to work out

 

[Chali 2na]

We don't differ in this respect though. I said in my first post we'd have been able to do it under Clough. I probably ought to have added we should have done it under Clough.

We had the money and we had a manager with a reputation for finding players on the cheap, with a good knowledge of the lower leagues. A manager known for building sides, albeit slowly. It should have been perfect. But we decided to do something else with the money and it didn't work.

And the Prince's 'game changing investment' has gone. He's just not rich enough to continue to spend like he did and KM feels like he's lost enough. So we are where we are and Wilder has to make the best of it.

As much as I'm desperate to stay eternally positive, I find it hard to dispute any of the above.

I did always wonder how far the prince was willing to take us: he possibly saved us from relagation because we were signing the likes of Westlake, Jasper Johns and McGinty before his arrival.

 

[super_pig]

(Again) Why can't we do both at the same time?

we seem to be trying but it would appear that those kind of players of championship quality are already in the champ. or don't want to come here.. so we have to go for plan B.. just get out of this crappy division first.
there could be an argument that our problem is that many of our players are 'already' champ. quality but can't cut it in the more industrial league one on a weekly basis

 

[Chali 2na]

we seem to be trying but it would appear that those kind of players of championship quality are already in the champ. or don't want to come here.. so we have to go for plan B.. just get out of this crappy division first.
there could be an argument that our problem is that many of our players are 'already' champ. quality but can't cut it in the more industrial league one on a weekly basis

Any players in particular in mind mate?

 

[blade67]

The signings of Mark Duffy and Leon Clarke have left me with mixed feelings..

On one hand, they were 2 of the best players in the league last year. Both are clearly capable of doing their jobs (and excelling) in L1.

One the other, they're both 30+ and have had the opportunity to show their worth in championship and frankly not taken it.

It got me wondering, which of the new signings (and the squad for that matter) would be able to make the step up?

I personally think:

George Long - potentially yes
John Brayford - yes
Chris Hussey - probably not
John Fleck - yes
Jack O'Connell - yes
Chris Basham - not based on what we've seen, but he has before.
Marc McNulty - probably not
Che Adams - potentially yes
Billy Sharp(captain) - yes
Matt Done - no
Jake Wright - no
Dominic Calvert-Lewin - potentially yes
Paul Coutts(Transfer Listed) - no
Stefan Scougall - probably not
Kieran Wallace(Transfer Listed) - no
Kieron Freeman(Transfer Listed) - no
James Wilson - probably not
Mark Duffy - probably not
Louis Reed - potentially yes, buy probably not
Ben Whiteman - potentially yes
Leon Clarke - probably not
James Wallace(Transfer Listed) - if he got fit, yes: so probably not
Martyn Woolford(Transfer Listed) - hahahahahaha

While I think Wilder's doing a great job addressing the problems, I can't hep but feel that if we were to be promoted, another cull would be needed to compete.

And before anyone says we should just worry about the division were in now and forget the championship: if our ambitions are promotion, then we should be preparing for promotion.

It doesn't matter at all if they can hack it in the championship. The kind of game changing money coming our way if wilder gets us up is epic so we can just sign a new squad if needed.

 

[CarlMcBlade]

I think the "game changing" money would arrive once we're in championship. Unfortunately I think general view of the owners is that we should piss it outta league one without a brass razoo.

 

[Living In a Fantasy World]

Depends on how Wilder gets the team playing, imo success in football comes down to momentum. We shouldn't think so much about inviduals but as a team.

 

[BigBed]

NO.

 

[Trueblade]

I really don't think it matters, what's the point of having a championship squad if you can't get out of league 1. We have been allegedly signing these types of players over the last few years and it's got us nowhere.

We have shown this season we can get rid and assemble a new squad of necessary. Let's concentrate on trying to get out of this league, then look to the Championship if and when we manage to get there.

I think we are all really positive about this season, with Wilder and his no nonsense approach. But the truth is, until we get some games under our belt we have absolutely no idea how we are going to fare.

 

[Lord Eddard Muir]

Let's say we do get promoted, and let's say that does mean we need another clear-out to compete in the league above.

There'd be a crucial difference compared with this summer: the players we're looking to offload would be regulars in a promotion side, rather than a laughable bunch of overpaid crocks who've done nowt.

So we wouldn't have the problem we have now where no bugger wants to sign any of them. Should be plenty of takers in L1/L2 for any we want rid of in that situation.

 

[super_pig]

I really don't think it matters, what's the point of having a championship squad if you can't get out of league 1.

this ^^ ..we're always getting ahead of ourselves about what we'll be doing 'next year' IMO

 

[St Annington]

One of the crucial assumptions missing from most of the above posts, including the OP, is what you mean by 'hack it'. Finishing 4th bottom and staying up is different from mid-table comfort, which in turn is different again from top 6.

I also agree that when we get to the Championship, then game changing investment will be spent, so CW (or whoever the manager is) can sign a new squad if they so wish.

 

[CarlMcBlade]

Lets get a promotion season under our belts first.