Bottom 6 taking shape

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I think we’ll pick up points against teams that no one expects us to. Hecky will try to make us difficult to beat and I think we are now better equipped to nick a last minute winner than the last time we were here.
Given our resources it’s not a bad strategy, goal difference could be a major factor come the end of the season
 
I don’t believe there is any doubt that McAtee will improve us.

We have signed players who are not exactly ‘oven ready’ for EPL football. The next 14 day break will hopefully correct that.

Other clubs will make progress too, but I am equally sure that a few will also underestimate us. Our support is a direct consequence of SUFC being crafty underdogs. We will enjoy that status and make fans happy.
 
Given the fixtures I'd say it's ourselves and Everton who've had the worst starts. Both Luton and Burnley are a game behind. Bournemouth have had some tough fixtures, Wolves have had two tough games. Both us and Everton have played fixtures that you have to get something from and on paper have probably had the easiest fixtures in the league. We have both only taken a point, off each other!

Whilst we haven't looked completely out of our depth, we could easily be a long way a drift by the end of the month.
 
Foody said:
Given the fixtures I'd say it's ourselves and Everton who've had the worst starts. Both Luton and Burnley are a game behind. Bournemouth have had some tough fixtures, Wolves have had two tough games. Both us and Everton have played fixtures that you have to get something from and on paper have probably had the easiest fixtures in the league. We have both only taken a point, off each other!

Whilst we haven't looked completely out of our depth, we could easily be a long way a drift by the end of the month.
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Not only do I think Burnley have a worse midfield and potentially attack than us now, the style of their football is leaving them open like a sieve.

So despite them having 1 game less i think they're in a worse shape then us (especially goal difference).

Luton will almost certainly go down, which means we just need one more of the possible candidates to have a shocker of a season for us to be safe.
 
jono_t2000 said:
Not only do I think Burnley have a worse midfield and potentially attack than us now, the style of their football is leaving them open like a sieve.

So despite them having 1 game less i think they're in a worse shape then us (especially goal difference).

Luton will almost certainly go down, which means we just need one more of the possible candidates to have a shocker of a season for us to be safe.
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Burnley have had a much tougher start than us. They're sticking to their gameplan regardless of opposition.
Never likely to wield good results against the big boys but might do against weaker teams.
They're a game behind us and that game is against Luton.
 
CaptainMorgans said:
Burnley have had a much tougher start than us. They're sticking to their gameplan regardless of opposition.
Never likely to wield good results against the big boys but might do against weaker teams.
They're a game behind us and that game is against Luton.
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Yep and I've already acknowledging that.

But I still rate our midfield better than theirs.

We were both after Souza, we won the race ✅

We gave them Berge and upgraded to Hamer ✅

Their other big outlay was on Trafford and is already starting to be criticized and showing and showing big step up from keeping for Bolton and U21 to premier league.

Just don't rate them and in fact feel we've closed the gap on them since promotion.

Be very surprised if we concede 5 against Spurs (probably jinxed it now lol) and goal difference could play an important part.
 
Constantly Optimistic... said:
I really don't see Luton or Burnley making much progress, so just one other to finish above. There is hope after two performances where we have improved each game, still more to come.
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Listened to Burnley v Spurs on the wireless Saturday afternoon.

Loads of praise for Burnley’s “style” but if you are going to keep limping to defeat what’s the point? I’d much rather us try to compete as we are rather than the manager use us as a shop window for his brand of football.

Kompany will walk in a month or two to save being sacked. Judging by what happened in the Prem last season they will get a big Sam type in, complete overhaul and probably still go down.
 
If you look through all the fixtures our relegation rivals also have a generally tough run up to November. My prediction is that there will be several teams detached by that point. We may havecenough to finish 17 th if you think about the Man City result and their performance against other teams. Going to be very tough and spirits need to stay high among supporterscand players over next period. This will be assisted by seeing we are adrift in a group not just with Luton.
 
I think (hope) that we might be able to get a few surpise results by keeping compact and playing on the counter attack.

Its going to be tough, but we all knew this and as long as we aren't more than +6pts adrift by January I think that has to be the aim
 
Weasel said:
I don't get the defeatism on here at times. We clearly have a squad with plenty of spirit and we are getting better and will continue to do so once Hecky and co have had time to bed in some players and work on tactics. I've no doubt the defence will start to tighten up. Yes we will get beat in a lot of games this season it I suspect that there will be aot games which we are right in and could go either way. With a bit of luck we will win some that we aren't expected to. Im hoping er get a few points out of the next run of games, I've certainly not written them off as impossible like some seemingly have. Hecky called it right when he said we go into every game looking to win it. So they should do too. We could be a tricky and dangerous opponent this season as it progresses and we are traditionally decent at the Lane. All to play for.
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Hear hear

Don’t forget as well Blades, we were one slip away from a point against the best team in the league/the world! And that wasnt even with our full strength team

If we can do that, we can do anything
 
jono_t2000 said:
Yep and I've already acknowledging that.

But I still rate our midfield better than theirs.

We were both after Souza, we won the race ✅

We gave them Berge and upgraded to Hamer ✅

Their other big outlay was on Trafford and is already starting to be criticized and showing and showing big step up from keeping for Bolton and U21 to premier league.

Just don't rate them and in fact feel we've closed the gap on them since promotion.

Be very surprised if we concede 5 against Spurs (probably jinxed it now lol) and goal difference could play an important part.
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Kompany is going to stick to his principles and play how they did last season. Admirable but suicide, he learnt that method from Pep, but Pep has Silva and De Brunye, Kompany has Dwight McNeill

I think for one of Spurs goals, Son wasnt offside as he started the run inside his own half for the thro ball, thats how high up they were

Also Kompany hasnt experienced a turbulent patch as a manager, must have thought 'its easy this management malarky' last season

They have now lost 3-0, 3-1 & 5-2 - he has neither the nous or personnel to play a deeper game, they are relying on Berge as a DM ffs, someone we know hasnt the physicality, temperament or energy to spoil a game.

Looking at them leave the pitch, they appeared to be dejected with a bit of resignation - whilst even in defeat we knew we were onto something and things would get better as we knew improvement would come as Hamer, Souza & Archer fit in, and with McB coming back

Luton seem to be relying on Ross Barkley for inspiration, who was shocking and couldnt be arsed Friday night, I mean hes gone from been bought by Chelsea as EPL holders, via Nice to Luton - one decent hit from Souza on Boxing day and he will become invisible

1 place left, Wolves will be around, as will Bournemouth - outside bet is Fulham - at Everton Silva managed 8th in his first season, then left in Dec as they were in relegation zone

He doesnt stick around when the going gets tough, and they have bought Alex Iwobi (17goals in 223 games) as Mitro replacement - can see a red card and ban for stropping at a VAR decision and him fuckin off for that big contract in Saudi, leaving them in real trouble
 
HarryHaslam said:
I think Everton will have too much and will pull away, possibly even Wolves.. so I think it’s a 4 way fight between us Luton Burnley Bournemouth. I fancy us to finish 4th bottom I really do.
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Bournemouth are better than both Wolves and Everton in terms of squad and manager. Just got a great point away at Brentford, were leading at Anfield, they're no mugs. They've had a really tough start.
 
This stage last season Leeds were 5th, Southampton 13th - both eventually relegated- Leicester were the only team who were in the bottom 3 at this stage and finished there.

Wolves had 2 points after 4 games (19th) and finished 13th.

Tottenham were flying in 3rd and finished 8th.
Villa in 15th finished 7th.

Understand people's concerns but plenty of time for things to change.
 

CaptainMorgans said:
Agree.

We've got some good players, I like some of our signings.
Souza does his job well, Hamer has shown a lot, Archer had a fantastic debut...

But we've just come out of a run of 4 games which included Palace (h), Forest (a) and Everton (h) and have 1 point to show for it.
It's hard to see us picking up any points in September and we need to find 10 wins from somewhere.

The standard of the lower half teams seems to have gone up since our last visit to the PL.
We don't look physically or athletically competitive alongside many of them (Palace, Forest, Bournemouth etc.)

We need Thomas and Trusty to drop into the XI after the international break and resolve our defensive issues.
We need one of McAtee or T Davies to come in for Norwood and make us more competitive and threatening from midfield.
I have a huge amount of respect for Robinson, Norwood, Basham etc. but the more they play the less likely we are to win games at this level.

We look good in moments, particularly with the ball, but we lack cohesion.
Without the ball, we're miles off it. Last season Ndiaye, McAtee and Berge were great at pressing from the front. This season that press is ineffective and we're played around far too easily, we're then scattered into sixes and sevens desperation defending crosses (badly) into our box.

I don't think it's between as many as 6.
I think it's Luton, Burnley, us and Everton.
To be honest, I think Burnley and Everton will be stronger than in the long-run.
We don't have the squad depth and have too many injury prone players.

We missed a huge chance in these first four games.
We had a badly planned transfer window (see Palace starting XI) and didn't give ourselves a proper chance.
PH & co. did a fantastic job making us fairly competitive so quickly.
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Hecky clearly isn't keen on Trusty yet, doubt he'll be starting any time soon. If he'd rather bring on Basham for Egan and move around the defence than play Trusty in the middle, he's not ready yet.
 
Slim Man said:
Bournemouth are better than both Wolves and Everton in terms of squad and manager. Just got a great point away at Brentford, were leading at Anfield, they're no mugs. They've had a really tough start.
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They have a small stadium though, so they must be going down...
 
CaptainMorgans said:
Agree.

We've got some good players, I like some of our signings.
Souza does his job well, Hamer has shown a lot, Archer had a fantastic debut...

But we've just come out of a run of 4 games which included Palace (h), Forest (a) and Everton (h) and have 1 point to show for it.
It's hard to see us picking up any points in September and we need to find 10 wins from somewhere.

The standard of the lower half teams seems to have gone up since our last visit to the PL.
We don't look physically or athletically competitive alongside many of them (Palace, Forest, Bournemouth etc.)

We need Thomas and Trusty to drop into the XI after the international break and resolve our defensive issues.
We need one of McAtee or T Davies to come in for Norwood and make us more competitive and threatening from midfield.
I have a huge amount of respect for Robinson, Norwood, Basham etc. but the more they play the less likely we are to win games at this level.

We look good in moments, particularly with the ball, but we lack cohesion.
Without the ball, we're miles off it. Last season Ndiaye, McAtee and Berge were great at pressing from the front. This season that press is ineffective and we're played around far too easily, we're then scattered into sixes and sevens desperation defending crosses (badly) into our box.

I don't think it's between as many as 6.
I think it's Luton, Burnley, us and Everton.
To be honest, I think Burnley and Everton will be stronger than in the long-run.
We don't have the squad depth and have too many injury prone players.

We missed a huge chance in these first four games.
We had a badly planned transfer window (see Palace starting XI) and didn't give ourselves a proper chance.
PH & co. did a fantastic job making us fairly competitive so quickly
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We have a mountain to climb but a lot of my enjoyment at the Lane comes from watching our players give it their all and so far their attitude has been very good
 
Its clear and obvious to me that the media are loving Burnley's "style" because of Kompany. When he leaves - and he will - then watch them turn on them. Luton is the seasons "fairy story". We arent getting that much attention.

Burnleys style of play is not going to suite them in the PL against bigger teams - might work vs the lower table but continue getting smashed 5-1, 3-0 each week playing open football, your players confidence will drop.

Luton look poor but give them credit they are trying to keep it tight and nick it. They tried to play football a bit against Wet Spam and it didnt work. When they went more direct they caused them a few issues.

Everton got a good boost from the win v Donny. The new striker clearly gives them a focal point and it allows other players to come out of their shell. They are by no means going to pull away.

Bournemouth again, have the ability to cause problems but clearly defensively they look shaky. Brooks is there key man for me - can he stay fit?

I wouldnt rule out Wolves, Fulham and possibly another. Its a long season, teams do get injuries and form changes.

Personally, I think if we finish 17th, we should shout it proud and loud because I agree, the PL is a much more scarier animal than when we were last here.
 
Burnley - City, Villa, Spurs- 0pts hope for 1
Luton - Brighton, Chelsea, West Ham 0 pts no realistic hope for more.
Everton - Fulham, Villa, Wolves, Blades 1 pt hope for at least 5.
United - Palace, Forest, city, Everton 1pt hope for 5.
Bournemouth - West ham, Liverpool, Spurs, Brentford 2 pts about right.
Wolves - Man U , Brighton, Everton, Palace 3pts and robbed of 1 about right

So far Burnley and Luton have had tough starts where you wouldn't expect any more than the odd point anyway.
United and Everton are really struggling- hopefully another 2 weeks together and we'll see a new United.
 
steve26272 said:
Kompany is going to stick to his principles and play how they did last season. Admirable but suicide, he learnt that method from Pep, but Pep has Silva and De Brunye, Kompany has Dwight McNeill

I think for one of Spurs goals, Son wasnt offside as he started the run inside his own half for the thro ball, thats how high up they were

Also Kompany hasnt experienced a turbulent patch as a manager, must have thought 'its easy this management malarky' last season

They have now lost 3-0, 3-1 & 5-2 - he has neither the nous or personnel to play a deeper game, they are relying on Berge as a DM ffs, someone we know hasnt the physicality, temperament or energy to spoil a game.

Looking at them leave the pitch, they appeared to be dejected with a bit of resignation - whilst even in defeat we knew we were onto something and things would get better as we knew improvement would come as Hamer, Souza & Archer fit in, and with McB coming back
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Not McNeil, he's at Everton. We have Benson and Zaroury from last year, plus Koleosho, Redmond, Brunn Larsen, Odobert, as wingers. Tresor to come in, signed on deadline day, to play (probably) Tella's role.

I agree about the style of play. When we have the ball, we play too attacking - Spurs' first goal, as you say, we were so far forward that they just had to welly the ball forward and it was 2 on 2. You can't play like that in the PL, whether it's Spurs or Luton up against you. That's have to change. Last season we started the season letting in sloppy goals and blowing leads, and won only 4 of the first 12 - it improved a lot as time went by.

I don't think Berge will be in the team for long. Expect Brownhill to be back.
 
CrookesBlade said:
Listened to Burnley v Spurs on the wireless Saturday afternoon.

Loads of praise for Burnley’s “style” but if you are going to keep limping to defeat what’s the point? I’d much rather us try to compete as we are rather than the manager use us as a shop window for his brand of football.

Kompany will walk in a month or two to save being sacked. Judging by what happened in the Prem last season they will get a big Sam type in, complete overhaul and probably still go down.
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Norwich had lots of praise for their styl at the start of the 19/20 season
 
Weasel said:
I don't get the defeatism on here at times. We clearly have a squad with plenty of spirit and we are getting better and will continue to do so once Hecky and co have had time to bed in some players and work on tactics. I've no doubt the defence will start to tighten up. Yes we will get beat in a lot of games this season it I suspect that there will be aot games which we are right in and could go either way. With a bit of luck we will win some that we aren't expected to. Im hoping er get a few points out of the next run of games, I've certainly not written them off as impossible like some seemingly have. Hecky called it right when he said we go into every game looking to win it. So they should do too. We could be a tricky and dangerous opponent this season as it progresses and we are traditionally decent at the Lane. All to play for.
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I get where you're coming from but bedding in the new players isn't the issue. Archer, Souza, Hamer and arguably Thomas (albeit a short cameo), all look fine. It's the existing players who need to sort themselves out. Norwood not doing anything off the ball, Egan and Anel not communicating and both going for the same ball leaving players unmarked, Baldock not standing his ground and letting players get crosses in. These are players who know our formation, know our system, know what's expected of them, and all with the exception of Anel, have played in the Premier League before and tasted international football. The issues are the poor defending and this won't get addressed over the break wheh Baldock, Egan and Anel are away with their countries. They'll return ready to play for us again and due to not training with us, they'll probably keep making the same costly mistakes. And no, before anyone starts, I'm not excluding Larouci and Lowe from this. Lowe is just a garbage player full stop, the others have no excuses really.
 
Keen Blade said:
We have a mountain to climb but a lot of my enjoyment at the Lane comes from watching our players give it their all and so far their attitude has been very good
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I think that attitude to our players is more common than the knee jerk post match reactions on here. No one likes losing, but after time for reflection, most fans can see how much effort most players put in.
It’s the Blades way of doing things. The hard way makes it so much more worthwhile.
 
dsr-burnley said:
Not McNeil, he's at Everton. We have Benson and Zaroury from last year, plus Koleosho, Redmond, Brunn Larsen, Odobert, as wingers. Tresor to come in, signed on deadline day, to play (probably) Tella's role.

I agree about the style of play. When we have the ball, we play too attacking - Spurs' first goal, as you say, we were so far forward that they just had to welly the ball forward and it was 2 on 2. You can't play like that in the PL, whether it's Spurs or Luton up against you. That's have to change. Last season we started the season letting in sloppy goals and blowing leads, and won only 4 of the first 12 - it improved a lot as time went by.

I don't think Berge will be in the team for long. Expect Brownhill to be back.
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Apologies he did

If you get to 10/12 games in and your bottom by a few points, will they stick with VK?

For us, I think the Prince will want to stick with Hecky, as he knows hes sending him into a gun fight with a knife
problem here is the bell ends that spout shite, and will demand him be sacked as hes not good enough/proven/a yes man.
In the same way Everton fans will want Dyche out, then look for replacement that has a CV like............... Sean Dyche 🤣

Re Berge - from a Burnley perspective, when did you hear the rumour you wanted him?
All seemed a bit quick and out of the blue
My conspiracy theory is you wanted Hamer, we 'sold' you an International with PL experience, if you gave us clear run on Gus
If this is the case, thank your board, and tell them if they transfer me £100,000 Ill give them tips on how to not be gullible🫡

FYI - Berge is basically a poor man Odegard, yet your asking him to play the Rice role, which he quite simply isnt capable of

Nowt against Burnley, prefer you lot to be in the prem than entitled Everton - just dont finish above us
 
CrookesBlade said:
Listened to Burnley v Spurs on the wireless Saturday afternoon.

Loads of praise for Burnley’s “style” but if you are going to keep limping to defeat what’s the point? I’d much rather us try to compete as we are rather than the manager use us as a shop window for his brand of football.

Kompany will walk in a month or two to save being sacked. Judging by what happened in the Prem last season they will get a big Sam type in, complete overhaul and probably still go down.
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Burnley are shipping goals exactly how I thought they would, their style does not suit or can be played in the prem with the lack of quality they have, very very naive by Kompany.
 
Dkc said:
So you've already written us off from getting anything v West Ham and Arsenal away, and Man U and Newcastle at home?

Newcastle have lost three out of four and are only two points above us. Zero chance of drawing that game in front of the home fans? West Ham have started well, but have drawn with Bournemouth and struggled to beat Luton. And we were close to getting a draw v Man City, so why is that impossible v Man U and Arsenal?
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Newcastle have played 4 of last seasons top 7, (lost to 3 of this & last seasons top 6), generally their record against teams below that is scary. West Ham didn’t struggle at all against Luton… and they just won a European trophy. And if we’re shipping goals to Everton, a team that hadn’t even scored yet in the league, then where has this confidence we can take something from Arsenal or Man Utd come from? Bar the close scoreline we were played off the park against Palace and threw away a point or 3 against Forest who barely looked arsed. It’s a shit start to the season that looks like it’s going to rumble on for a fair few more games considering the opposition. The defence needs a rocket up the arse for a start.
 
I think a lot of people underestimate just how strong Florist were at home last season. I'd have been surprised to take anything from that, and we weren't far off a point. When we play them at the Lane it's a different kettle of fish, but they took a lot of scalps at the City Ground.
 
steve26272 said:
Apologies he did

If you get to 10/12 games in and your bottom by a few points, will they stick with VK?

For us, I think the Prince will want to stick with Hecky, as he knows hes sending him into a gun fight with a knife
problem here is the bell ends that spout shite, and will demand him be sacked as hes not good enough/proven/a yes man.
In the same way Everton fans will want Dyche out, then look for replacement that has a CV like............... Sean Dyche 🤣

Re Berge - from a Burnley perspective, when did you hear the rumour you wanted him?
All seemed a bit quick and out of the blue
My conspiracy theory is you wanted Hamer, we 'sold' you an International with PL experience, if you gave us clear run on Gus
If this is the case, thank your board, and tell them if they transfer me £100,000 Ill give them tips on how to not be gullible🫡

FYI - Berge is basically a poor man Odegard, yet your asking him to play the Rice role, which he quite simply isnt capable of

Nowt against Burnley, prefer you lot to be in the prem than entitled Everton - just dont finish above us
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After 12 games, they'll definitely stick with Kompany. After 13 games, the 13th being against Sheffield United, who knows? ;)

But then, Dyche got a new contract at the start of his last season and was sacked before the end. But Kompany got a 5-year contract this summer and the board seem well bought into his style, so I doubt he's in any danger till at least March.

As for Berge, I didn't hear any rumour that we wanted him until he signed. (I think I might have been out of the country then, but even so, there wasn't more than a few days.) I haven't yet seen anything to suggest your conspiracy theory is wrong.
 

FriethBlade said:
At present from the bottom up its Burnley, Luton, Everton , us, Bournemouth and Wolves with Fulham lurking close by.

I'll be pretty surprised if the three relegated clubs don't come from this group. On yesterday's performance I'm hopeful we can avoid taking one of the three spots.
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I think in reality it is between 4 = SU Burnley Luton and Bournemouth

the worst result for us at the weekend was Bournemouth's underserved draw
that point might just keep them up
 
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