Ben Whiteman

[I should coco]

I know the above is largely tongue in cheek

You've got me bang to rights and no mistake, but you'll never take me alive copper!

I don’t think one item of that list is believed to be true by even half the population of this board.

Seriously, I've been dismayed by the number of Anti-Jags on here who blame him for the defeat to Wigan. The numbers with a lack of understanding about high wage levels and the belief that transfer fees out should always be re-spent is also worrying.

I very rarely see one person arguing the toss against the entire board (except, maybe occasionally Barney or blade too long whilst trying to defend something they've said that was rather silly.

Rather silly? Come, come now, I don't know how you could possibly come to that conclusion (especially with the new model 'Positive Barney').

 

[JJBlade]

Whoa hoo there, just hold on. This 'I know my own mind' crap might be all right in some circles but not on here. There is a well established heritage of groupthink that among over things covers:

Simmo's penalty is still in outer space
Only transfer fees count (the money tree covers wages)
Billy Sharp doesn't do enough work
McCabe lines his own pockets
Jags deliberately gave away a penalty to leave the club
etc etc etc

Any departure from the above is heresy!

You'll be telling us next that the world isn't flat....

Yes it's all bollocks apart from the bit about Jags

Supporters money, TV deal, advertising, sponsorship, corporate entertainment pays quite a chunk of the wages as well as other things, it's not all done by our marvellous boardroom

 

[I should coco]

I don’t think one item of that list is believed to be true by even half the population of this board.

The numbers with a lack of understanding about high wage levels and the belief that transfer fees out should always be re-spent is also worrying.

Then, as if by magic, along comes:

Supporters money, TV deal, advertising, sponsorship, corporate entertainment pays quite a chunk of the wages as well as other things, it's not all done by our marvellous boardroom

Yes and that's why we make such a big profit every year, er.............

 

[markstag]

Do you rate CJ then? I seem to remember he was pretty quick with quick feet but could be a “headless chicken” and make poor decisions from the bits I saw and reports I read. Do you see him that way?

We had 4 clubs that put bids in for CJ in January. At start of the season thought he was shocking but ever since Evans has come in been like a new player. As you say Lacey, quick feet but he can't cross a ball to save his life, if he improves in final third think he will be a top player, after all he's only young.

 

[Kenilworth]

We had 4 clubs that put bids in for CJ in January. At start of the season thought he was shocking but ever since Evans has come in been like a new player. As you say Lacey, quick feet but he can't cross a ball to save his life, if he improves in final third think he will be a top player, after all he's only young.

So, Evans has got him wearing seductive underwear - is that, possibly, the secret?

 

[BushBlade]

So, Evans has got him wearing seductive underwear - is that, possibly, the secret?

Yes, Victoria's.

 

[Higgo's Belly]

It's not the point I'm making though. I'll decide who I like and dislike, I don't need anyone making shitty comments on my behalf.
The OP (meaning Opening Poster) came on here to thank us for loaning BW to them and to say what a good player he is.

If someone wants to reply by making churlish comments about their manager, that's up to them, but don't intimate we all think like that or try to speak on my behalf.

That's all.

I think you would be hard pushed to find more than a handful of Blades fans who do not dislike Evans. Have you forgotten about Evans reaction after our young lads beat Rotherham at the lane, displaying a total lack of class and arrogance after losing.

When I say that Blades fans dislike Evans, I accept that there will be the odd exception like yourself, however I think its a fair assumption to assume that Blades fans in general dislike the man. When I say Blades fans don't like him, I mean the majority not everybody, so I was not speaking on your behalf. I'm sure if I posted Blades fans hate Ainsworth, there may be somebody out there who disagreed, however I still think it would be fair to say Blades fans hate him, as I would be basing this judgement on the thoughts of the majority. I was talking about what I believe the majority think, not every individual supporter.

 

[BushBlade]

I think you would be hard pushed to find more than a handful of Blades fans who do not dislike Evans. Have you forgotten about Evans reaction after our young lads beat Rotherham at the lane, displaying a total lack of class and arrogance after losing.

When I say that Blades fans dislike Evans, I accept that there will be the odd exception like yourself, however I think its a fair assumption to assume that Blades fans in general dislike the man. When I say Blades fans don't like him, I mean the majority not everybody, so I was not speaking on your behalf. I'm sure if I posted Blades fans hate Ainsworth, there may be somebody out there who disagreed, however I still think it would be fair to say Blades fans hate him, as I would be basing this judgement on the thoughts of the majority. I was talking about what I believe the majority think, not every individual supporter.

Fair enough. I just wanted to make it clear I'm not one of those you're speaking on behalf of.

No, I haven't forgotten his reaction but I'm just not that bothered. I'd expect him to react badly to having a spanner thrown into his promotion campaign by a bunch of kids. It was embarrassing and humiliating for him. Piss funny for us though.

But why the need to bring it up? If you went on Wolves' board thanking them for EEL would you appreciate a response like 'yeah but Wilder's a cunt'?

 

[blade too long]

I know the above is largely tongue in cheek but I don’t think one item of that list is believed to be true by even half the population of this board. I suppose you could do a poll for each one asking everyone if they believe those statements to be true. But I don't think this fabled "group think" really exists on here. There's plenty of contrasting opinions on pretty much every subject. I very rarely see one person arguing the toss against the entire board (except, maybe occasionally Barney or blade too long whilst trying to defend something they've said that was rather silly.

whereas your always 100 percent spot on, titter titter

 

[Cerberus Blade]

I would like to thank your club for allowing us to have Ben on loan for the rest of the season, he certainly has a bright future in the game. His work rate and contribution to the team is second to none. Been one of the singings of the season for us and he can only get better. Also best of luck in your promotion push.

Top Stag!

Good luck too. I see slim boy Evans has got you going well? Be swapping places with Chesterfield next season!

 

[markstag]

Top Stag!

Good luck too. I see slim boy Evans has got you going well? Be swapping places with Chesterfield next season!

Thanks pal, Yeah possibly, although it would be nice to play the sheep shaggers lol.

 

[Ihadadream]

This thread does make me smile a little.

I am sure Young Whiteman has had various posts aimed at him for not being up to the job. All of a sudden he has been given a proper chance to show his worth and bingo..........
This is my issue a little that if a player is not quite ready at 20 years old a substantial following seem to think they are not good enough and not going to be good enough.
Players take all different amounts of time to be ready to play first team football consistently week in week out.

This is EELs first proper season in a first team week in week out and he is 23/24 years old.

Lets hope that we get promotion this season and we have the money to develop our young players for as long as it takes to get them ready for our own first team.

I just don't get why everyone is in such a rush to see lads of 18/19 playing first team football, yeah there is nothing better than seeing a Sheffield lad wear the shirt but also keep the shirt and not crumble under the pressure and weight of expectation that comes with it, surely they are still a young lad at 22/23? Why the rush

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I just don't get why everyone is in such a rush to see lads of 18/19 playing first team football, yeah there is nothing better than seeing a Sheffield lad wear the shirt but also keep the shirt and not crumble under the pressure and weight of expectation that comes with it, surely they are still a young lad at 22/23? Why the rush

Bang on pal, still waiting for my chance at 45. Another 10 years and i'm ready.

 

[Shalalalafenoughty]

I just don't get why everyone is in such a rush to see lads of 18/19 playing first team football, yeah there is nothing better than seeing a Sheffield lad wear the shirt but also keep the shirt and not crumble under the pressure and weight of expectation that comes with it, surely they are still a young lad at 22/23? Why the rush

That's one point of view. There's a contrary argument. I posted this a couple of years back when people were talking about "impact subs" and farming youngsters out on loan:

"I'm thankful that substitutes (and internet forums) didn't even exist when I started going otherwise I wonder how long it would have taken Mick Jones, Len Badger, Alan Birchenall and Alan Woodward to establish themselves as first team regulars. Mick Jones was four days short of his eighteenth birthday when he made his debut at Old Trafford in 1963 and within a month he'd scored four league goals in seven games. Len Badger made his league debut a week later at seventeen and was soon a regular. Alan Birchenall was just over a week past his nineteenth birthday when he made his debut in September 1964. Three days later he scored both our goals in a 2-0 win at Hillsborough and he went on to score seven more in our next ten league games. Woody was eighteen years and one month old when he made his first league start in October 1964. There were thirty one league games left and he played in twenty seven of them, scoring seven times."

As I pointed out at the time, all these lads were playing and making an impact in the top flight of English football. We are currently in the third tier. We have an excellent midfield trio but one is in his thirties and another in his late twenties. Whiteman represents the future and he should be given a chance sooner rather than later. I'm very much in the "sink or swim" camp and I think he'll swim.

 

[larkymasher]

That's one point of view. There's a contrary argument. I posted this a couple of years back when people were talking about "impact subs" and farming youngsters out on loan:

"I'm thankful that substitutes (and internet forums) didn't even exist when I started going otherwise I wonder how long it would have taken Mick Jones, Len Badger, Alan Birchenall and Alan Woodward to establish themselves as first team regulars. Mick Jones was four days short of his eighteenth birthday when he made his debut at Old Trafford in 1963 and within a month he'd scored four league goals in seven games. Len Badger made his league debut a week later at seventeen and was soon a regular. Alan Birchenall was just over a week past his nineteenth birthday when he made his debut in September 1964. Three days later he scored both our goals in a 2-0 win at Hillsborough and he went on to score seven more in our next ten league games. Woody was eighteen years and one month old when he made his first league start in October 1964. There were thirty one league games left and he played in twenty seven of them, scoring seven times."

As I pointed out at the time, all these lads were playing and making an impact in the top flight of English football. We are currently in the third tier. We have an excellent midfield trio but one is in his thirties and another in his late twenties. Whiteman represents the future and he should be given a chance sooner rather than later. I'm very much in the "sink or swim" camp and I think he'll swim.

The reason clubs like SUFC and many others don't just chuck kids in is that the financial side of the game means clubs can't take risks with younger players. United certainly can't. Imagine a couple of youngsters chucked in for a few games and points are dropped. CW would get slaughtered.

Money is restricting to chances for young players. Clubs won't take a risk until they are totally sure a player is ready.

Chelsea have a policy that a first team player who plays week in week out must be 23 or over as they think that is when a player is mentally and physically ready. They go on loan here there and everywhere before they decide they are ready.

SUFC will not risk Slater, Semple, Hallam, Brooks until they get out of League one.

 

[Melton Blade]

I'm with you on this one. Looking at his goals for Mansfield (shots from edge of the box mostly) he would offer something different next season. Without getting too far ahead of ourselves - we are definitely playing well enough to finally make it out of League 1 - and I fear Billy doesn't have the legs to get us 20 goals in the Championship. We will need more goals from elsewhere in the team, particularly midfield runners.

 

[Ricky]

I just don't get why everyone is in such a rush to see lads of 18/19 playing first team football, yeah there is nothing better than seeing a Sheffield lad wear the shirt but also keep the shirt and not crumble under the pressure and weight of expectation that comes with it, surely they are still a young lad at 22/23? Why the rush

Because if you left it that late they'd inevitably leave and rightly so. Whether that's to go and sit in someone else's reserves for more money or to go and get first team football. Ramsdale's an example of this.

SUFC will not risk Slater, Semple, Hallam, Brooks until they get out of League one.

If we can't 'risk' any young players in L1, and we haven't the whole time we've been here, then we certainly won't in the Championship. Only if they're exceptionally good or as a last resort. There will be plenty who might be good enough who'll never get a chance to prove it. Which is a shame because our youngsters are still our best chance of attaining a big asset (provided we sort their fucking contracts out).

 

[BushBlade]

Because if you left it that late they'd inevitably leave and rightly so. Whether that's to go and sit in someone else's reserves for more money or to go and get first team football. Ramsdale's an example of this.




If we can't 'risk' any young players in L1, and we haven't the whole time we've been here, then we certainly won't in the Championship. Only if they're exceptionally good or as a last resort. There will be plenty who might be good enough who'll never get a chance to prove it. Which is a shame because our youngsters are still our best chance of attaining a big asset (provided we sort their fucking contracts out).

If we're established in the championship then we'll have to take some risks to progress, either by using our youth team players or signing players from lower league or, don't laugh, abroad.

We can, at least, loan our kids to L1 clubs and if they do well, put them in our first team squad. The risk with that, of course, is that if they do very well, a PL club will make us an offer we can't refuse.

 

[BushBlade]

The reason clubs like SUFC and many others don't just chuck kids in is that the financial side of the game means clubs can't take risks with younger players. United certainly can't. Imagine a couple of youngsters chucked in for a few games and points are dropped. CW would get slaughtered.

Money is restricting to chances for young players. Clubs won't take a risk until they are totally sure a player is ready.

Chelsea have a policy that a first team player who plays week in week out must be 23 or over as they think that is when a player is mentally and physically ready. They go on loan here there and everywhere before they decide they are ready.

SUFC will not risk Slater, Semple, Hallam, Brooks until they get out of League one.

Chelsea aren't known for playing academy players in the first team though, whatever their policy. Man U obviously have a different policy which has served them well over the years.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Again though, I don't need representation and I don't want to be associated with the comments made.

Fair enough, the poster should have probably said “the majority of” or “lots of” or “he is generally unpopular with”.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

You've got me bang to rights and no mistake, but you'll never take me alive copper!



Seriously, I've been dismayed by the number of Anti-Jags on here who blame him for the defeat to Wigan. The numbers with a lack of understanding about high wage levels and the belief that transfer fees out should always be re-spent is also worrying.



Rather silly? Come, come now, I don't know how you could possibly come to that conclusion (especially with the new model 'Positive Barney').

In Barney’s defence, he’s not been at it for quite some time. In his own words, I think Adkins brought the worst out in him.


Indeed there are examples of people posting the comments you refer to. What I disagree with is that it exists in the form of “group-think” and that dissenting voices “better watch out”. I’d say the people posting those views are in the minority and are regularly challenged.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

We had 4 clubs that put bids in for CJ in January. At start of the season thought he was shocking but ever since Evans has come in been like a new player. As you say Lacey, quick feet but he can't cross a ball to save his life, if he improves in final third think he will be a top player, after all he's only young.

Sounds like the new Campbell-Ryce…..

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Yes, Victoria's.

I think he saw how well it worked when Wilder did it with Coutts…..

 

[1danewhitehouse]

whereas your always 100 percent spot on, titter titter

Nope. I’m sure I get as much wrong as the average poster. It’s just that one or two like yourself have an exceptional ability to go above and beyond normal standards in the ridiculousness of your posts such as the plentiful glaring factual inaccuracies.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

That's one point of view. There's a contrary argument. I posted this a couple of years back when people were talking about "impact subs" and farming youngsters out on loan:

"I'm thankful that substitutes (and internet forums) didn't even exist when I started going otherwise I wonder how long it would have taken Mick Jones, Len Badger, Alan Birchenall and Alan Woodward to establish themselves as first team regulars. Mick Jones was four days short of his eighteenth birthday when he made his debut at Old Trafford in 1963 and within a month he'd scored four league goals in seven games. Len Badger made his league debut a week later at seventeen and was soon a regular. Alan Birchenall was just over a week past his nineteenth birthday when he made his debut in September 1964. Three days later he scored both our goals in a 2-0 win at Hillsborough and he went on to score seven more in our next ten league games. Woody was eighteen years and one month old when he made his first league start in October 1964. There were thirty one league games left and he played in twenty seven of them, scoring seven times."

As I pointed out at the time, all these lads were playing and making an impact in the top flight of English football. We are currently in the third tier. We have an excellent midfield trio but one is in his thirties and another in his late twenties. Whiteman represents the future and he should be given a chance sooner rather than later. I'm very much in the "sink or swim" camp and I think he'll swim.

The counter-argument is that everyone was in the same boat then. Now, everyone has squads with experienced back up players. If we went without those and relied on the kids in case of injures, we might be disadvantaged.


When the Premier League brought out the 25 man squad rule, I think they were on the right lines but it was still too loose in my opinion. I would suggest something along the lines of


All League clubs be allowed to register a maximum of say 20 players over the age of 21 to play throughout a season.


Unlimited number of players under 21.


That would force clubs not to carry huge squads and would provide more first team opportunities to the better 18/19/20 year olds coming through at clubs. It would have meant we couldn’t go out and sign O’Shea and Carruthers and would have to rely on Whiteman and Brookes as cover. It would have also meant Scunny and Bolton couldn’t go and add the likes of Davies and Le Forndre to their ranks so we wouldn’t find ourselves disadvantaged.

 

[larkymasher]

Because if you left it that late they'd inevitably leave and rightly so. Whether that's to go and sit in someone else's reserves for more money or to go and get first team football. Ramsdale's an example of this.




If we can't 'risk' any young players in L1, and we haven't the whole time we've been here, then we certainly won't in the Championship. Only if they're exceptionally good or as a last resort. There will be plenty who might be good enough who'll never get a chance to prove it. Which is a shame because our youngsters are still our best chance of attaining a big asset (provided we sort their fucking contracts out).

I disagree a bit Ricky...... With the club desperate to get out L1, Wilder will not risk young players. When we are in mid table in the championship with little chance of going up or down, then we will see the introduction of younger players. I am convinced of this.

 

[larkymasher]

Because if you left it that late they'd inevitably leave and rightly so. Whether that's to go and sit in someone else's reserves for more money or to go and get first team football. Ramsdale's an example of this.




If we can't 'risk' any young players in L1, and we haven't the whole time we've been here, then we certainly won't in the Championship. Only if they're exceptionally good or as a last resort. There will be plenty who might be good enough who'll never get a chance to prove it. Which is a shame because our youngsters are still our best chance of attaining a big asset (provided we sort their fucking contracts out).

I disagree a bit Ricky...... With the club desperate to get out L1, Wilder will not risk young players. When we are in mid table in the championship with little chance of going up or down, then we will see the introduction of younger players. I am convinced of this.

 

[larkymasher]

Chelsea aren't known for playing academy players in the first team though, whatever their policy. Man U obviously have a different policy which has served them well over the years.

We also need to remember Bush that it is a lot easier for young players to progress in a first team made up of world class players. L1 youngsters are expected to show their stuff with L1 players.
Would our Jordan Hallam progress more with Hanson or Ibrahamivch next to him? you know what i mean.

 

[blade67]

In Barney’s defence, he’s not been at it for quite some time. In his own words, I think Adkins brought the worst out in him.

Barney's first few weeks on here special regardless of Adkins. His rant about being bannedcand needing to set up a 2nd account to complain about his treatment was brilliant, especially when Foxy explained that he was not banned but well on the way to it.

Definitely settled down though

 

[finlaytheblade]

We also need to remember Bush that it is a lot easier for young players to progress in a first team made up of world class players. L1 youngsters are expected to show their stuff with L1 players.
Would our Jordan Hallam progress more with Hanson or Ibrahamivch next to him? you know what i mean.

It's always easier to blood young players when you are in a mid table position.lf you look at our history and it's probably the same for most clubs !.
When going for promotion experienced players are the ones who do the business (one or two young players get thrown in but that's not done that often ).
Looking at our previouse promotions we always have an experienced squad.Warnock introduced a few by the time we got promotion
they had been in and around the team for a few years.
I like to think we can have a good season in the championship next season ( if we make it that is ) , the pressure will be off for one season as long as we stabilise which will give some young players the oportunity to show what they can do.A good start is necessary to do this but in my opinion we will take to the championship like a duck to water.The qualities we have are more suited to a higher league a few recruits allied to some promising young players will give us the platform to perform and have a good season. With the pressure off I think we can really thrive.
I said pressure off for one season because we are a very demanding set of fans and the pressure will be back on very quickly after a honeymoon season
Do we want it any other way ! for if you stand still you soon go backwoods and we all know what happens then.
Could be eX citing times ahead beating the pigs to the premiership don't think they will do it this season if they don't it's game on !! Bring it on !!
As Hallam joined Man Utd Larky and been loaned back to us ? If so that's disappointING as he is a real poacher and a brilliant t set piece taker.