Baffling squad assembling

[Sean Thornton]

I suppose my view is that if you haven’t a possible solution then you don’t criticise. I fully accept that is not a view that the majority take.
It is so frustrating when either at work or when volunteering someone says you are doing it wrong, without being able to explain why nor to offer a solution.

You’re doing it wrong.

 

[Kenworthy’s Tash]

This club will not move on until Wilder and the accountant (who has inserted himself as the DoF) leave the club.

 

[Sean Thornton]

This club will not move on until Wilder and the accountant (who has inserted himself as the DoF) leave the club.

I don’t think he’s inserted himself so much as put a better lock on the door. Or more likely got someone else to put a better lock on the door.

 

[ZLB]

The tried it before and it didnt work brigade...

The owners absolutely half arsed it and irrespective of his shortcomings he had no backing whatsoever from the owners or the majority of the fanbase.

‘Brigade’ LOL

 

[Snowflake]

You’re doing it wrong.

Too late. After running a successful business for 40 years I have now retired !!

 

[ZLB]

No I'm alright. Why do you want stuff like this hidden away? Got some sort of hidden agenda petal? Are you on his payroll?

Petal? Don’t ever ever ever call me that again. There is a thread for anti Wilder stuff and you needed to start yet another one with the same tedious and boring crap.

 

[Keen Blade]

I do think Rosen wants to change that structure but he is likely aware it needs to be in a more subtle fashion. BUT PA also wanted to do similar and all he got back was arguments with Wilder.

I am not sure how anyone does it while Wilder is here and I have said the time to do it was under Hecky.

Very true , nothing will change till Wilder's out.

 

[Slim Man]

Petal? Don’t ever ever ever call me that again. There is a thread for anti Wilder stuff and you needed to start yet another one with the same tedious and boring crap.

Or what? What exactly are you going to do about it petal?

 

[Champagneblade]

I have always felt that in any walk of life if someone criticises the organisation they should put forward constructive proposals for improvement.
If that cannot be be done then it’s of little point in just complaining.

Same.

Sack Chris Wilder!

Oops. We ended up with Ruben Sellés.

Unfortunately when you sack a manager you need to replace them. You don’t have a choice to not, the decisions are inextricably linked. You can’t make the right decision to sack someone and then replace them with someone worse; it’s only the right decision if you arrive at a net improvement.

So, for me it should be something like:

If Chris has run out of time, then go and get Dave Challiner; that’s a solution. It also shows some theoretical accountability. It’s your man they went with and you can stand up and get lambasted if he fails. If that is the time, I’d considered this a reasonable suggestion; he’s a similar degree of lower league achievement that a young Wilder had.

However if your judgment is sack him with no suggestion then this doesn’t really add to the debate; it’s just half an idea.

I don’t line managerial changes and all the nonsense that goes with them. I hope Chris turns it around but there is no doubt he is now a man under pressure and some of his decisions are being rightly scrutinised.

Rightly or wrongly, his fingerprints on everything approach has given a free pass to multiple Boards to put better infrastructure in place. I don’t even mean a DoF as I just find this an unaccountable job, but better scouting overall,
Recruitment systems and more football people supporting the manager rather than Bettis just saying “not me Guv. I just do the accounts!”

 

[Nick Jansky]

I don’t even mean a DoF as I just find this an unaccountable job

I don’t understand this “unaccountable job” narrative when DoFs also get removed.

 

[dexter101]

Ok, here’s a constructive proposal. The owners could hire an experienced and respected football person on a consultancy basis to assist them to define the required criteria for a new manager and then lead a recruitment process.

Stop putting forward sensible ideas Nick! There is only 2 options in life. Wilder stays or wilder gets replaced with unknown manager with no due process. There is no other options!

I think the issue at the moment is determining the parameters of such a project.

Even if Wilder doesn't leave this season, next year should be the last. He has also spoken about time with family etc so I think its probably the correct time line for him too.

Football doesn't really allow for long term planning but if there is no money to play with, it should be a young up and coming coach who is good at bringing through youth players. Our academy is proven, we have good experience bringing in PL loans. You add some experienced heads and coach them to be better.

Maybe the next season or so are holding patterns until this can ve actioned.

 

[Keen Blade]

Same.

Sack Chris Wilder!

Oops. We ended up with Ruben Sellés.

Unfortunately when you sack a manager you need to replace them. You don’t have a choice to not, the decisions are inextricably linked. You can’t make the right decision to sack someone and then replace them with someone worse; it’s only the right decision if you arrive at a net improvement.

So, for me it should be something like:

If Chris has run out of time, then go and get Dave Challiner; that’s a solution. It also shows some theoretical accountability. It’s your man they went with and you can stand up and get lambasted if he fails. If that is the time, I’d considered this a reasonable suggestion; he’s a similar degree of lower league achievement that a young Wilder had.

However if your judgment is sack him with no suggestion then this doesn’t really add to the debate; it’s just half an idea.

I don’t line managerial changes and all the nonsense that goes with them. I hope Chris turns it around but there is no doubt he is now a man under pressure and some of his decisions are being rightly scrutinised.

Rightly or wrongly, his fingerprints on everything approach has given a free pass to multiple Boards to put better infrastructure in place. I don’t even mean a DoF as I just find this an unaccountable job, but better scouting overall,
Recruitment systems and more football people supporting the manager rather than Bettis just saying “not me Guv. I just do the accounts!”

The reason for exasperation with Wilder is that he's been wrongly brought back not once but twice and the longer he stays the more his defects are exposed.
His fall from grace since he threw in the towel in 20/21 has run alongside the club's dramatic decline.
And we haven't hit bottom yet.

 

[metalblade]

Even Micky Adams had the nuts to admit years ago that running this club was too much for one man, today this is even more true, time for the owners to be looking at other options.
Listening to local radio this morning and Wilder was getting his excuses in early blah blah, 4 injured until after the break, Doherty just back from illness, other players struggling for fitness but playing on the only quote missing was Blackburn are a top team. Wilder is a dead man walking.

 

[Champagneblade]

I don’t understand this “unaccountable job” narrative when DoFs also get removed.

What I mean is DoF buys shit players, manager doesn’t get results.

He then has the opportunity to proffer that it was the manager who was at fault and the players were fine whilst the manager will insist the opposite. How do you differentiate or so you always sack both?

Look at Spurs in recent times. Can’t remember who it was that got the sack (manager) but when they sold Bale they bought a right load of shite. I think Eriksen at 11m was the pick of the bunch while they spaffed far more on Lamela and 29m on some Spanish flop.

I’m sure the manager got it in the neck but that was DoF driven.

So I suppose it all requires the two to be locked at the hip from day one. One slight misalignment and it gets complicated.

I do think however the recruitment should work far differently and maybe it does and on the surface it just looks this way. The Prince alluded to as much:

What about Hamza? He’s be alright. Did ok before. Ben might do a decent job, check if he’s interested.

Whereas it feels like it ought to be:

We need a left winger and a right back. Piss off Jamie, Mike and come back with a list of 5 or 6 of each affordable and interested from a few different countries and let’s compare them and work down that list.

I’m probably giving a bit of a disservice but just going by the end result I could have done our summer recruitment with about an hour on transfermarkt and limiting the filter to UK based. It’s a small pool.

BBD, Phillips, Choudhury, Riedewald - been here before - super easy.

Donovan - called my mate who used to work for me and asked what he could do for me - easy.

Kitching - local Yorkshire boy, called a manager I speak to a lot. Reasonable pick up but after spending ages on Souttar who had been here before - relatively easy.

Doherty - no idea if we had any prior links but a few Irish already in the team, well known player, no reported rivals for signature - easy to moderately easy.

Maybe I’m being facetious here but what skills do Allen and Hoyland bring to support this list? Little to no creativity at all. You just get the sense the fanbase is looking for excitement from somewhere and with plan vanilla recruitment like this, they aren’t getting it. It’s borderline lazy from those guys. What do they do all year?

 

[John Street West Terrace]

Defensively, it's a mess. The only option that covers up a midfield group who lack any athletes appears to be to defend the box with lots of players, encourage the opposition to throw crosses in. There's zero chance Wilder will do that in a home match so I think we might see better results away from home. I think we might take a PL style tonking at home at some point.

But for that more cautious approach to have any chance of working, there needs to be a real threat on the counter. That means BBD/Chong on one side, Donavan the other with a CF between them. 451/433 and CMs allowed to attempt forward passes that will have a relatively low success rate

I would like to see BBD down the middle again as part of a front two , he managed to score 6 goals in 14 games in a very poor side PL side that was also creating little in his first loan spell

 

[Carlton Blade]

I would like to see BBD down the middle again as part of a front two , he managed to score 6 goals in 14 games in a very poor side PL side was also creating little in his first loan spell

We need to be open to trying things, seeing what works. There needs to be a lot more tactical flexibility

 

[The Fox]

We need to be open to trying things, seeing what works. There needs to be a lot more tactical flexibility

I agree .

The fact is we've got what we've got .

Most wont become better players so we just have to work with what we have and organise in a way that works , no use moaning on about what we should have .

Its a challenge and not as simple as putting a formation and team on a team sheet .

Over to the manager and coaches for that one.

 

[sufc323]

We need to be open to trying things, seeing what works. There needs to be a lot more tactical flexibility

We have the wrong person in charge if that's what you're after.

 

[HeySethUTB]

I think wilder was rehired as a caretaker while the owners put systems in place.

 

[Nick Jansky]

What I mean is DoF buys shit players, manager doesn’t get results.

He then has the opportunity to proffer that it was the manager who was at fault and the players were fine whilst the manager will insist the opposite. How do you differentiate or so you always sack both?

Look at Spurs in recent times. Can’t remember who it was that got the sack (manager) but when they sold Bale they bought a right load of shite. I think Eriksen at 11m was the pick of the bunch while they spaffed far more on Lamela and 29m on some Spanish flop.

I’m sure the manager got it in the neck but that was DoF driven.

So I suppose it all requires the two to be locked at the hip from day one. One slight misalignment and it gets complicated.

I do think however the recruitment should work far differently and maybe it does and on the surface it just looks this way. The Prince alluded to as much:

What about Hamza? He’s be alright. Did ok before. Ben might do a decent job, check if he’s interested.

Whereas it feels like it ought to be:

We need a left winger and a right back. Piss off Jamie, Mike and come back with a list of 5 or 6 of each affordable and interested from a few different countries and let’s compare them and work down that list.

I’m probably giving a bit of a disservice but just going by the end result I could have done our summer recruitment with about an hour on transfermarkt and limiting the filter to UK based. It’s a small pool.

BBD, Phillips, Choudhury, Riedewald - been here before - super easy.

Donovan - called my mate who used to work for me and asked what he could do for me - easy.

Kitching - local Yorkshire boy, called a manager I speak to a lot. Reasonable pick up but after spending ages on Souttar who had been here before - relatively easy.

Doherty - no idea if we had any prior links but a few Irish already in the team, well known player, no reported rivals for signature - easy to moderately easy.

Maybe I’m being facetious here but what skills do Allen and Hoyland bring to support this list? Little to no creativity at all. You just get the sense the fanbase is looking for excitement from somewhere and with plan vanilla recruitment like this, they aren’t getting it. It’s borderline lazy from those guys. What do they do all year?

I don’t disagree with much of this, but will point out that it was announced yesterday that Edu is leaving the dog nonces following some shit transfer windows.

 

[Booker4]

I do think Rosen wants to change that structure but he is likely aware it needs to be in a more subtle fashion. BUT PA also wanted to do similar and all he got back was arguments with Wilder.

I am not sure how anyone does it while Wilder is here and I have said the time to do it was under Hecky.

Had the efforts to sign these other players worked then I think it would be a much better argument to Wilder. Retos, Zivkovic, Grbic, Traore, Larouchi, the dodgy dutch keeper, Bin Slimane, Zatterstrom, the Peruvian winger, Ukaki and Nwackchuku. It's a dreadful list. I've probably missed some others.

Yes there's some great foreign players out there, we definitely need to look into these markets but whenever we've done it we've made a total mess of it.

We no doubt need a bigger budget than currently available to buy the lines of Traore from Rangers like Norwich did.

It's frees and loans and that will have come from the board.

 

[bladesmanluke]

Why is he?

Do you currently see us staying up playing as we are?

I think we'll struggle, but that's the point. We could and likely will do a lot worse

 

[Champagneblade]

I don’t disagree with much of this, but will point out that it was announced yesterday that Edu is leaving the dog nonces following some shit transfer windows.

I like your thinking; he could probably still do a job for us in attacking midfield. Wasn’t he left footed as well?

 

[Big.Dane.w]

When he goes we absolutely MUST get rid of all his pals too, a new manager will have no chance of success while trying to work with people who look at the him as the guy who has upset the gravy train they’re all currently riding.