Anyone else just happy at the moment?

[Hamburg Blade]

I just don’t see why people need to spout off when really there’s nothing to spout off about. Everything is great, we’re chasong promotion, a fan owning , managing and captaining the club. Good squad of players that care about the shirt.

If Madine signs because CW think he’ll do a job the great. I know everyone has own opinions and is entitled to them however I just question the reasons why and motive as we’re possibly in the best position we’ve been in for a long long time.

Aren't you just proving my point? Wilder thinks he'll do a great job (think that's what you're saying) so no one should "spout off about it"? Even if they have concerns? A bit cultish, in my opinion.

You admit everyone has their own opinions and most have said why they hold them, so I'm not sure why you're questioning the motives - as if there is some underlying, unspoken motive. If people have an opinion, it is reasonable that they'll use the relevant internet forum to make it known. I don't see the need to attack people for doing so.

 

[Almosthuman]

Aren't you just proving my point? Wilder thinks he'll do a great job (think that's what you're saying) so no one should "spout off about it"? Even if they have concerns? A bit cultish, in my opinion.

You admit everyone has their own opinions and most have said why they hold them, so I'm not sure why you're questioning the motives - as if there is some underlying, unspoken motive. If people have an opinion, it is reasonable that they'll use the relevant internet forum to make it known. I don't see the need to attack people for doing so.

Yeah I get what your saying but not all are as reasonable and articulate as your good self and a quick scout over the comments will see so many dramatic statements and meltdowns that it does question motives and the ability to back a managers choice.

And for the record I would join a Chris wilder cult in an instant if anyone fancies it?

 

[Bladesman]

Thing is someone with VASTLY More experience, with a brilliant record and a team in the top 3 believes differently. That should be enough right?

It is enough for you but not for me especially when you keep in mind our form did tail off last season rather dramatically. So I think we have a right to be concerned about Madine and the apparent lack of depth in the squad.

Lets hope it will be reyt but I certainly won't be clapping Madine win, lose or draw regardless of what Tufty thinks of him.

 

[Hamburg Blade]

I was referring to the crap from all the so-called "fans" - the latest self-inflicted meltdown based mainly on hatred for Gary Madine. It's as if they were desperate for the next story-line to get them out of the hole they dug for themselves over the Ched Evans story. Losing sleep over a reserve team line-up in a 3rd round once-revered FA cup competition down-graded to training ground status by the Premier League is just another symptom of modern-day youthful angst. Ditching "Facebook" and just leaving their Smartphones on permanent re-charge might help them get a grip on reality too maybe?

Aaaannnd... as if there was any doubt anything I've said was wrong....
So you're now only a fan if you agree with Wilder's decision to sign Madine.
All those unhappy with Madine signing are only making a fuss because they dug themselves into a hole - whatever that means - over Ched. Not because they're unhappy with the Madine signing then, no one comfortable with Ched but unhappy with Madine, or the other way round.
You're not a fan if you are unhappy at losing in the FA Cup, because, well, can't fathom that one... Premier League, or something (which we're apparently trying to get in to - are we not fans if we want to get into the PL?).
And although I'm thrilled at being referred to as "youthful", I don't have a Facebook account.

 

[Hamburg Blade]

Yeah I get what your saying but not all are as reasonable and articulate as your good self and a quick scout over the comments will see so many dramatic statements and meltdowns that it does question motives and the ability to back a managers choice.

And for the record I would join a Chris wilder cult in an instant if anyone fancies it?

I think, though, that we can all give a bit of leeway to a poster who's a bit miffed and has just vented on a football forum. There have been a few OTT posts - never going again, ripping up season tickets - and it would be quite easy to respond with "calm down, don't be silly" rather than some of the stuff that has been aimed at them. Most posts have been reasonable anyway - and it's not as if Wilder has a 100% track record on making good signings.
If the club / Wilder didn't want any of this, they should have steered clear, which I think is the biggest disappointment for me. I'm Wilder's fan, he's done marvels, but it's not like we haven't had a recent situation that was similar. Why do it again?

 

[AWetFlannel]

I just don’t see why people need to spout off when really there’s nothing to spout off about. Everything is great, we’re chasong promotion, a fan owning , managing and captaining the club. Good squad of players that care about the shirt.

If Madine signs because CW think he’ll do a job the great. I know everyone has own opinions and is entitled to them however I just question the reasons why and motive as we’re possibly in the best position we’ve been in for a long long time.

Not sure loosing to Barnet was great; in case you didn't go, it was an awful performance.

Hamburg Blade has mentioned it, but the consistent denial that people actually believe and feel how they describe is irrational and scary.
'Trump supports don't like him or his policies, it's just because they...'
'ISIS don't actually kill people because of their religious interpretation, it must be because...'
If you are actually trying to understand someones opinion, it's more accurate to listen than assume some other purpose that fits your agenda.

 

[Blend-it-like-Harris]

Yes, I'm sure he found yesterday hilarious.

You're not a fan if you are unhappy at losing in the FA Cup, because, well, can't fathom that one... Premier League, or something (which we're apparently trying to get in to - are we not fans if we want to get into the PL?).

Getting promotion to the Premier League may well have something to do with CW's decision to field his Reserve team yesterday. For Barnet this game represented maybe one of the most important games in their history, and their players responded to the task of playing like a team determined to make their mark on their own piece of history. The only significance for us was the opportunity for CW to see which (if any) of his reserves might be worthy of inclusion in the match-day squad, and (more importantly) resting his over-stretched 11 (unchanged but for the enforced change re Basham) and avoiding injuries.
He probably concluded that Coutts was the only one currently worthy of a place in the squad. He possibly also concluded that Lundstram and Washington are never likely to be.

If I'd bothered to go to that reserve game I might have been a little less than happy right now, but the fact I didn't and CW can pick a full-strength 11 for the next match; that we don't have a key player injured (unlike the Wendy who went in with a full-strength team and now face a replay); that we are in with great chance of auto promotion; that our goal-difference has improved significantly in only 3 matches etc... means that - YES - I'm very happy!!

 

[davidblade]

How can we not be happy we’re sitting in the top 3.
Get a grip lads

 

[sheffielder]

Can you not be happy with your wife and have the odd blazing row anymore?

I blame Twitter

 

[Hamburg Blade]

Getting promotion to the Premier League may well have something to do with CW's decision to field his Reserve team yesterday. For Barnet this game represented maybe one of the most important games in their history, and their players responded to the task of playing like a team determined to make their mark on their own piece of history. The only significance for us was the opportunity for CW to see which (if any) of his reserves might be worthy of inclusion in the match-day squad, and (more importantly) resting his over-stretched 11 (unchanged but for the enforced change re Basham) and avoiding injuries.
He probably concluded that Coutts was the only one currently worthy of a place in the squad. He possibly also concluded that Lundstram and Washington are never likely to be.

If I'd bothered to go to that reserve game I might have been a little less than happy right now, but the fact I didn't and CW can pick a full-strength 11 for the next match; that we don't have a key player injured (unlike the Wendy who went in with a full-strength team and now face a replay); that we are in with great chance of auto promotion; that our goal-difference has improved significantly in only 3 matches etc... means that - YES - I'm very happy!!

I don't disagree with any of that, except the bit about "only significance", I think the game had more meaning than that. Despite that, there's nothing wrong with being unhappy at the defeat, nor in expecting more (from Wilder as well as the players).

 

[Chali 2na]

Why aren't people allowed to be happy with some things and not others? Are we only allowed to be happy when we accept everything without question? Wilder's Blades is in danger of becoming some sort of cult. "In Wilder we trust" and all that. Some of the vitriol directed at people who dare to criticise Madine's signing is evidence of a lurch to a new code of being a "proper Blade" that will only cause division in the long run. Posts claiming people's concerns are just "attention seeking" beggars belief.

It is a bit cultish, but football is by nature; it's probably what keeps the game interesting too, for many.

For what it's worth, I'm a fully paid up member of the cult: it would take something monumental for me to criticise Wilder; I feel he's more than earnt that good will.

That's not to say I'm not aware of Gary Madine's goal/conviction record, or that I missed the game yesterday - it's just I try and look at the bigger picture. Wilder's record in the transfer market has been fantastic IMO, probabaly the best I've seen from a United manager and I won't care much about missing the 4th round of the cup, if it gives us a better chance at promotion.

In short, Wilder is on course to exceed expectations for the 3rd year running, and is the best manager SUFC have had in my lifetime; he's earnt a bit of blind faith.

 

[Blend-it-like-Harris]

I don't disagree with any of that, except the bit about "only significance", I think the game had more meaning than that. Despite that, there's nothing wrong with being unhappy at the defeat, nor in expecting more (from Wilder as well as the players).

Fair comment, and I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on the added significance of the game that I've missed. I know those players (on paper at least) should have been good enough to beat Barnet, but psychology is a major factor in a footballer's performance levels and the place, the occasion and atmosphere would have been very different for both sets of players. Attacking an earily empty Kop in the 2nd half just reinforced what the players already knew - it was basically a training match or a Reserve game. OK - they should have been better motivated, but maybe Wilder should have provided some better practical means by which they could have been; that might have meant risking his 1st choice players though and he obviously wasn't too keen on that idea.
I'm not going to criticise CW for that - I'm glad we're not in the hat for the 4th round; the humiliation of our reserves losing to a tidy Barnet outfit I'll have to deal with in my own time.

 

[Hamburg Blade]

It is a bit cultish, but football is by nature; it's probably what keeps the game interesting too, for many.

For what it's worth, I'm a fully paid up member of the cult: it would take something monumental for me to criticise Wilder; I feel he's more than earnt that good will.

That's not to say I'm not aware of Gary Madine's goal/conviction record, or that I missed the game yesterday - it's just I try and look at the bigger picture. Wilder's record in the transfer market has been fantastic IMO, probabaly the best I've seen from a United manager and I won't care much about missing the 4th round of the cup, if it gives us a better chance at promotion.

In short, Wilder is on course to exceed expectations for the 3rd year running, and is the best manager SUFC have had in my lifetime; he's earnt a bit of blind faith.

There's a cult element about football, otherwise when a team played badly, it wouldn't have any fans. What I'm really refering to here, is the danger that there is a Wilder cult developing within the Blades community, which could split the fan base in the long term - because there are definitely hard times to come and if some won't accept criticism of Wilder there'll be agro between fans. We had it under Warnock and it wasn't pleasant to see.
I don't have any difficulty criticising him for stuff like Madine or a piss-poor cup day, but thinking he's a genius the rest of the time. That's surely got to be the normal way, hasn't it?
I'm also aware that I'm usually one of the last to call for a manager to be sacked, usually sticking up for (pretty crap) managers long after everyone else has given up on them - perhaps that's because I don't have an all-or-nothing stance.

 

[Chali 2na]

What I'm really refering to here, is the danger that there is a Wilder cult developing within the Blades community, which could split the fan base in the long term - because there are definitely hard times to come and if some won't accept criticism of Wilder there'll be agro between fans. We had it under Warnock and it wasn't pleasant to see.
I don't have any difficulty criticising him for stuff like Madine or a piss-poor cup day, but thinking he's a genius the rest of the time. That's surely got to be the normal way, hasn't it?

I'm not sure I see the dangers of a rift between fans that you describe - football fans are fickle, and when the bad times come around, the population of the Wilder cult will have diminished to the point where any "split" would be inconsequential.

I do personally have difficulty critiquing the Madine transfer or yesterday's result too; as I said, Wilder would have to do something monumental to loose my unconditional support - I won't sweat the small stuff, and both the above are very much small stuff in my opinion.

 

[Hamburg Blade]

Fair comment, and I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on the added significance of the game that I've missed. I know those players (on paper at least) should have been good enough to beat Barnet, but psychology is a major factor in a footballer's performance levels and the place, the occasion and atmosphere would have been very different for both sets of players. Attacking an earily empty Kop in the 2nd half just reinforced what the players already knew - it was basically a training match or a Reserve game. OK - they should have been better motivated, but maybe Wilder should have provided some better practical means by which they could have been; that might have meant risking his 1st choice players though and he obviously wasn't too keen on that idea.
I'm not going to criticise CW for that - I'm glad we're not in the hat for the 4th round; the humiliation of our reserves losing to a tidy Barnet outfit I'll have to deal with in my own time.

The significance for me is simply the chance to get to the next round, then maybe the one after.... The draws can throw up some great and memorable games, games where the players can test themselves against PL opposition. It gives the players a buzz, it's a reward for the fans, at the end of the day, being in the competitions is why the club exists.
It also gives the opportunity for competetive match time for fringe players, some of them clearly need it. All of these are positives, some are important, not to mention increased revenue. There are of course the negatives that everyone quotes, possible injuries, possible fatigue, and clearly we don't have enough depth to cover those fully, but overall I like to see a genuine attempt at a cup run.
Yes, on paper the team should have been good enough, but as I posted elsewhere, throwing 11 players onto the pitch who don't usually play together is likely to be chaos and I would have liked to have seen a more considered approach to it and a better back-up plan. (And more admission of responsibility from him after the match. I thought his comments were too harsh).

 

[Hamburg Blade]

I'm not sure I see the dangers of a rift between fans that you describe - football fans are fickle, and when the bad times come around, the population of the Wilder cult will have diminished to the point where any "split" would be inconsequential.

I do personally have difficulty critiquing the Madine transfer or yesterday's result too; as I said, Wilder would have to do something monumental to loose my unconditional support - I won't sweat the small stuff, and both the above are very much small stuff in my opinion.

Don't see the rift? Well I won't be talking to you again for a start, Wilderist.
Seriously though, I've found the whole "in Wilder we trust" a bit creepy and when things like this come up and people get slammed for daring to criticise, it makes me wonder what's going on. There was a lot of division under Warnock, with occasional punch ups in the stands, and I would have hoped the Wilder era would pull fans together. After the Ched saga and the fallout from it, the decision to sign Madine is a bit bewildering to me.

 

[Sean Thornton]

I'm not sure I see the dangers of a rift between fans that you describe - football fans are fickle, and when the bad times come around, the population of the Wilder cult will have diminished to the point where any "split" would be inconsequential.

I do personally have difficulty critiquing the Madine transfer or yesterday's result too; as I said, Wilder would have to do something monumental to loose my unconditional support - I won't sweat the small stuff, and both the above are very much small stuff in my opinion.

You should seek medical advice before loosening your support.......

 

[Harrisblade]

Don't see the rift? Well I won't be talking to you again for a start, Wilderist.
Seriously though, I've found the whole "in Wilder we trust" a bit creepy and when things like this come up and people get slammed for daring to criticise, it makes me wonder what's going on. There was a lot of division under Warnock, with occasional punch ups in the stands, and I would have hoped the Wilder era would pull fans together. After the Ched saga and the fallout from it, the decision to sign Madine is a bit bewildering to me.

Well if you want to try and second guess every thing Wilder does and says, despite what we saw in the video about transfer deadline day, you're very welcome, but remember most of the time you'll only see the end-product and never know what happens behind the scenes (or even in the last training session)

 

[Cruyff Turn]

OK, losing to Barnet. Not good on any level - bad performance, questionable attitude and a thoroughly embarrassing result – BUT…

1. Losing 0-6 to Arsenal’s kids

2. Boxing Day

3. Walsall in just about any season you care to mention, but especially 1981

4. Not being able to scrape together £500k for a young Diego Maradona

5. Missing out on Europe in 1975, then getting relegated the following year

6. Bryan Robson

7. Blades 1 Port Vale 3

8. Adrian Heath

9. The first 25 mins at Swindon [PO]

10. Huddersfield P O Final

11. 6 years of pub football

12. Tevezgate

13. David Weir

14. Some dodgy Chairmen/Owners over the years [allegedly]

15. Nigel Adkins and his geese flying backwards to keep the snow out of their faces

16. James Harper playing Traffic Cop

17. Higdon/Sammon/Guthrie/Marlon King – they just seem to blur into one

18. The unseen work of Dean Hammond

19. Countless crap full backs over the years

20. The half time Balti pies

In my humble opinion, all these far eclipse yesterday’s blip. Perhaps it just shows how far we have come in two and a half seasons that losing to Barnet seems like the end of the world as we know it. GET A GRIP!!!

Two other observations whilst I am in the pulpit:

A] Yesterday, the second string played garbage, but it doesn’t mean they are all suddenly useless. 10 changes won’t happen in the league. One or two will come in to cover injuries/suspensions as needed but will be assimilated [seamlessly?] in to a better unit and WILL contribute.

B] Re Madine, probably not my first [or second or third] choice of target, but if yesterday showed us anything, it is that Clark and Washington have limitations. More cover in that area is clearly needed. Madine MIGHT just prove to be Hanson 2.0. Time will tell.

Sermon ends!

 

[bromtom]

I put it another thread yesterday but I talked to (and sat in front of) quite a lot of people yesterday and reaction was more "oo-er" with a nervous smile than outrage with most seeming to settle on the conclusion that if he comes he might fill a gap but he's a nob, though Wilder knows what he's doing.

I think the split is magnified by being online where arguments just cause people to get more and more extreme in their view even if they were pretty mildly irked originally.

It'll be interesting to see the real life reaction at QPR.

 

[Chali 2na]

Don't see the rift? Well I won't be talking to you again for a start, Wilderist.

Suits me, infidel.

Seriously though, I've found the whole "in Wilder we trust" a bit creepy and when things like this come up and people get slammed for daring to criticise, it makes me wonder what's going on. There was a lot of division under Warnock, with occasional punch ups in the stands, and I would have hoped the Wilder era would pull fans together. After the Ched saga and the fallout from it, the decision to sign Madine is a bit bewildering to me.

I guess we're just completely opposed on this then, as I actually find the "In Wilder we trust" sentiments to be refreshing - I've spent my whole life watching us lurch from one shit manager to the next, it's nice to see a manager worthy of that kind of faith.

I do understand your concern though, I just think this constant, reactionary bedwetting (not referring to you) everytime there's some bad news or a poor result is a bigger threat to our success than a potential rift down the line.

 

[Hamburg Blade]

Well if you want to try and second guess every thing Wilder does and says, despite what we saw in the video about transfer deadline day, you're very welcome, but remember most of the time you'll only see the end-product and never know what happens behind the scenes (or even in the last training session)

I'm not sure what you mean by me wanting to second guess everything Wilder does and says. Raising concerns and questioning decisions has got to be pretty normal for a football fan - on a football fans' forum. My point is, that doesn't seem to be acceptable any more regarding all things Wilder. There's nothing wrong with raising concerns but still being happy with things.
If people are getting the wrong end of the stick, shouldn't it be down to the club / Wilder to communicate better? They must know there's a bit of a shit storm going on, yet the reaction is to hold back on any kind of comment.
I'm guessing that in recent training sessions, all those picked for the game yesterday had been looking good, or they wouldn't have been picked. But something went wrong somewhere and I don't think it's good enough to just say "well, that's why they're not in the first team".

 

[Hamburg Blade]

Suits me, infidel.



I guess we're just completely opposed on this then, as I actually find the "In Wilder we trust" sentiments to be refreshing - I've spent my whole life watching us lurch from one shit manager to the next, it's nice to see a manager worthy of that kind of faith.

I do understand your concern though, I just think this constant, reactionary bedwetting (not referring to you) everytime there's some bad news or a poor result is a bigger threat to our success than a potential rift down the line.

Just taking it off at a bit of a tangent, do you really think that all the managers you've watched the Blades under have been shit? i.e. no middle ground or redeeming qualities?

 

[bromtom]

I'm almost certain that Wilder talked to the team before he talked to the press, the times he protects the team he probably goes in the dressing room, tells them they were fucking awful but says you know that, you need to do better but I'm going to give you a break in the interview. Yesterday he probably told them they were shit, they need to do better and I'm not going to cut you any slack whatsoever in the interview, and if that hurts you tough shit, prove me wrong.

I don't think the players picked up their phones and went round crying saying "look what Christopher said about me, he's so mean".

 

[Chali 2na]

Just taking it off at a bit of a tangent, do you really think that all the managers you've watched the Blades under have been shit? i.e. no middle ground or redeeming qualities?

You're right, deep down, I don't think they've all been shit. (They have all been shit in comparison to Wilder though I suppose.)

Warnock - Mixed, generally good though.
Robson - Shit
Blackwell - Shit
Speed - Very poor
Adams - Shit
Wilson - Poor
Clough - Poor, would've been "Shit" if not for the cup runs
Adkins - Shit

 

[Iceybabey]

Too many death eaters about nowadays. Love to rear their heads when there's some negativity to sink their teeth into.

We're third in the league, which means we're in a very good position to go for the autos.

We lost to Barnet, terrible. But please can we now move on and get back to the support we've shown over the festive period.

 

[itsinyerblood]

Suits me, infidel.



I guess we're just completely opposed on this then, as I actually find the "In Wilder we trust" sentiments to be refreshing - I've spent my whole life watching us lurch from one shit manager to the next, it's nice to see a manager worthy of that kind of faith.

I do understand your concern though, I just think this constant, reactionary bedwetting (not referring to you) everytime there's some bad news or a poor result is a bigger threat to our success than a potential rift down the line.

Good points from both you and Hamburg Blade. I tend to side with your good self Chali, mostly because, should Wilder leave us in the not too distant future, I think we'd be in for a horror show in terms of who we'd attract as manager. Managerially, there aren't many good 'uns out there, and my gut feeling is that we might sink like a lead weight with a new incumbent.

We're like many clubs that begin to progress, and Charlton under Curbishley come to mind. Once they reached the heady heights of the Premiership, Charlton's fans began to forget the days when winning was a formality, and constant defeats saw the fans moan and groan, why I'm unsure, as the gulf in class between the Championship and the Prem was, as it is now, substantial. Without moneybags in control any promoted club is destined to struggle, so why fans complain at this state of affairs is puzzling. McCabe fell lucky the day Wilder and Knill were appointed, and given his pretty awful record of management appointments, I doubt that Kev would ever have such a winning result in future.

The point I'm making is that however poor yesterday's result was, and let's be honest, there are a few players who will do well to remain at United come the summer, we're doing fantastically well given the peanuts that Wilder is handed with each transfer window. By all means moan if it helps, but do not lose sight of the far more important picture outside of this one game.

 

[Hamburg Blade]

You're right, deep down, I don't think they've all been shit. (They have all been shit in comparison to Wilder though I suppose.)

Warnock - Mixed, generally good though.
Robson - Shit
Blackwell - Shit
Speed - Very poor
Adams - Shit
Wilson - Poor
Clough - Poor, would've been "Shit" if not for the cup runs
Adkins - Shit

Very harsh. Methinks your ratings would be a little higher if we hadn't found Wilder. I would up the ratings for Blackwell, Wilson and Clough. Easier for me to say when I've sat through fewer games, I know, but I think some of that list is "reverse nostalgia".

Edit: You forgot Weir. Probably best, however.

 

[Blade-on-Tyne]

I was referring to the crap from all the saso-called "fans" - the latest self-inflicted meltdown based mainly on hatred for Gary Madine. It's as if they were desperate for the next story-line to get them out of the hole they dug for themselves over the Ched Evans story. Losing sleep over a reserve team line-up in a 3rd round once-revered FA cup competition down-graded to training ground status by the Premier League is just another symptom of modern-day youthful angst. Ditching "Facebook" and just leaving their Smartphones on permanent re-charge might help them get a grip on reality too maybe?

You're right that we now seem to have adopted the Premier League attitude to the FA Cup by disrespecting lower league opponents.
Particularly sad as the Cup was the last competition of any significance that we have won.

 

[Booker4]

I'm as happy as Larry about our league form.

I am furious about yesterday's fiasco.

I think Madine is a cheap option but I'm not going to worry about him unless and until he takes game time away from strikers who are actually good.

I don't think Wilder will have brought in Madine to just sit on the bench though Revolution! He might not start every game granted but he will take pitch time up of others, otherwise why bring him in if he's worse than what we have! This is probably where you and I disagree though, because I think Madine's a decent player and he'll really add something to us.